Alexander the Great Statue in Skopje

LeBrok said:
Why Greeks can't share a hero. Can't Alexander the Great be a hero of two nations? I think Alexander would be ecstatic himself!
What if Egyptians would erect a statue of Alexander in Alexandria? You would take it as provocation too?
I think Alexander the Great would love to have his statues all over the middle east and Balkans. Would you still go against a wish and ambitions of Alexander?

Why Alexander can't be a key stone, a stepping stone for a friendship of two or more nations. You would have a chance to build a future with your neighbors. You would find something that binds the nations together and work together. It would be easier to make friends and not enemies. Use it as a building block, make friends.

I'm polish, and I don't mind sharing Copernicus with Germans. He was a Polish citizen, had German mother and Polish father. He was raised by German uncle, and wrote scientific papers in Latin and German, but not in Polish.
Surely, the nationalistic part of me would love to declare him only polish as he was a polish citizen, but I know that the best benefits for Germans and Polish people will be if we share him together in name of good neighborly relationship. And why not? What harm will come from it?
I'm sharing my greatest hero, how about you?
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This is not at all what it is about, if it was just about this it wouldn't have been going on 20 years. This is about Bulgaria losing the second balkan war, to sum it up. I don't want to go over it all again becase we spent to much wasted time on this subject already.

edit - this wikipedia page sums up the background to this "macedonian question" quite nicely, if you are still confused about the issue take the time to read it;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographic_history_of_Macedonia
 
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Vallicanus said:
This statue is clear anti-Greek provocation.

Alexander was Macedonian Greek not a Macedonian Slav.
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Alex the Great was a Macedonian not a hellinas. Greek is a modern term. Had he been an Hellinas the matter was settled long a go. But he was not hellinas. Ancient greek writters said that. A number of English and German historians who wrote about Alex claim that Alex's mother Olimpia and grandmother Eurudice were Illyrian stock. I have read myself their books. There are a number of them. We Albanians cliam Illyrian ancesrtry. Having said that it means that by blood he was 75% Illyrian. Its recorded in history books that when they were trying to kill him to take the throne he found refuge in Illyria where his uncles were. Culturally though he was hellinas. He was educated with hellinas philosophy and whatever Hellas had to offer. Don't forget he conquered Hellas. Had he been Hellinas why would need to conquer it? Macedonia ceased being Macedonia around 4 th centuary a.d. That means if in Alexander times he was speaking Macedonian as his mother tounge he also was speaking Hellinas as a mean of higher education. In the 4th centuary ancient Macedonia was completly Hellenised, the lost their laguage. So you either to my opinion have no right to claim Alex as hellinas when he was not. Albanians have claimed it because Alex of Emadhia had mother and grandmother Illyrian but I don't think he belongs to us, since he sided with Greek culture. Macedonian Slavs have no connection at all with him. Their effort to claim him is laughable. Albanians in Emadhia have made this position clear but since they are enjoying the present greek macedonian show, they are stayin quiet. It could be that a small portion of today's Macedonians have blood connection with ancient people of Macedonia, but so are the Greeks. The bottom line: Alexander was not hellinas. He was educated with greek culture ,and fought to spread greek culture and was fond of it. At this point greeks are right. Slac Macedonians have no right to claim him whatsoever. Greeks of present day Macedonia in greece are the desendants of Alexander, so they can claim him as their own, but not the greeks of Crete, Athens, peloponesus. They are the decendents of Alex as much as Nigerians are.
 
albanopolis said:
Alex the Great was a Macedonian not a hellinas. Greek is a modern term. Had he been an Hellinas the matter was settled long a go. But he was not hellinas. Ancient greek writters said that. A number of English and German historians who wrote about Alex claim that Alex's mother Olimpia and grandmother Eurudice were Illyrian stock. I have read myself their books. There are a number of them. We Albanians cliam Illyrian ancesrtry. Having said that it means that by blood he was 75% Illyrian. Its recorded in history books that when they were trying to kill him to take the throne he found refuge in Illyria where his uncles were. Culturally though he was hellinas. He was educated with hellinas philosophy and whatever Hellas had to offer. Don't forget he conquered Hellas. Had he been Hellinas why would need to conquer it? Macedonia ceased being Macedonia around 4 th centuary a.d. That means if in Alexander times he was speaking Macedonian as his mother tounge he also was speaking Hellinas as a mean of higher education. In the 4th centuary ancient Macedonia was completly Hellenised, the lost their laguage. So you either to my opinion have no right to claim Alex as hellinas when he was not. Albanians have claimed it because Alex of Emadhia had mother and grandmother Illyrian but I don't think he belongs to us, since he sided with Greek culture. Macedonian Slavs have no connection at all with him. Their effort to claim him is laughable. Albanians in Emadhia have made this position clear but since they are enjoying the present greek macedonian show, they are stayin quiet. It could be that a small portion of today's Macedonians have blood connection with ancient people of Macedonia, but so are the Greeks. The bottom line: Alexander was not hellinas. He was educated with greek culture ,and fought to spread greek culture and was fond of it. At this point greeks are right. Slac Macedonians have no right to claim him whatsoever. Greeks of present day Macedonia in greece are the desendants of Alexander, so they can claim him as their own, but not the greeks of Crete, Athens, peloponesus. They are the decendents of Alex as much as Nigerians are.
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Can we stop with the propaganda, I dont know what we are trying to accomplish with this, what does it matter if Alexander was from Greece or where ever. Is anybody else tired of people going on about this, maybe its just me.
Arguing about Alexander is like a regional pastime for Balkans, and just arguing in general.
 
Anthro-inclined said:
Can we stop with the propaganda, I dont know what we are trying to accomplish with this, what does it matter if Alexander was from Greece or where ever. Is anybody else tired of people going on about this, maybe its just me.
Arguing about Alexander is like a regional pastime for Balkans, and just arguing in general.
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You are right about it. It would not make any difference now where he was from. My tirade was to explain that Macedonian and Greek( hellen) in not equivalent. Macedonians are hellenized people. Greek historians wrote that. Thats the place where we read history. Albanians did not write any history so we rely in Greek or Roman sources. Alexander's statue in Skopje is funny. Pella is where that should be.
 
albanopolis said:
You are right about it. It would not make any difference now where he was from. My tirade was to explain that Macedonian and Greek( hellen) in not equivalent. Macedonians are hellenized people. Greek historians wrote that. Thats the place where we read history. Albanians did not write any history so we rely in Greek or Roman sources. Alexander's statue in Skopje is funny. Pella is where that should be.
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Yes I agree with you, alexanders origin is in macedonia greece not FYROM. But if they want a statue in skopje, thats fine, they feel he is part of their history, and if that makes them content, then I say let them have it, it shouldnt really matter to us. None the less I feel that you are right in saying that the statue should be in pella.
 
Anthro-inclined said:
Yes I agree with you, alexanders origin is in macedonia greece not FYROM. But if they want a statue in skopje, thats fine, they feel he is part of their history, and if that makes them content, then I say let them have it, it shouldnt really matter to us. None the less I feel that you are right in saying that the statue should be in pella.[/QUO Its not that they love Alexander and his Empire. They want to create a national identity which they lack.( Actually they are a mixture of Bullgarians and serbs). But Alexander will not make the trick to give them the identity. 30 % of macedonia's population is Albanian and another 20% Gypsy, Turkish, Torbeshi and many more. So for half of the population Alexander is an intruder not a hero. Anyway their bussines. But I am amazed with their courage in the age of internet.
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Anthro-inclined said:
Yes I agree with you, alexanders origin is in macedonia greece not FYROM. But if they want a statue in skopje, thats fine, they feel he is part of their history, and if that makes them content, then I say let them have it, it shouldnt really matter to us. None the less I feel that you are right in saying that the statue should be in pella.
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Its not that they love Alexander and his Empire. They want to create a national identity which they lack.( Actually they are a mixture of Bullgarians and serbs). But Alexander will not make the trick to give them the identity. 30 % of macedonia's population is Albanian and another 20% Gypsy, Turkish, Torbeshi and many more. So for half of the population Alexander is an intruder not a hero. Anyway their bussines. But I am amazed with their courage in the age of internet.
 
Vallicanus said:
This statue is clear anti-Greek provocation.

Alexander was Macedonian Greek not a Macedonian Slav.
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everyone with a working brain knows that he was not slav
but to say someone is macodonian greek that is a contradicition itself
the greek nation was formed 200 years ago
the macdonians are pelasgian which means pre-hellenic so before the greeks ancesotrs the hellens
the macedonians are illyro-pelasgian same as their dardanian brothers
 
macedonia-and-greece-the-struggle-to-define-a-new-balkan-nation.jpg


ThenationsofRussiaandTurkey1a.jpg
 
albanopolis said:
Its not that they love Alexander and his Empire. They want to create a national identity which they lack.( Actually they are a mixture of Bullgarians and serbs). But Alexander will not make the trick to give them the identity. 30 % of macedonia's population is Albanian and another 20% Gypsy, Turkish, Torbeshi and many more. So for half of the population Alexander is an intruder not a hero. Anyway their bussines. But I am amazed with their courage in the age of internet.
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You lack the knowledge on Macedonians and the demographics of the Republic of Macedonia. First of All: the Slavs of Macedonia are historically, genetically, linguistically and culturally Bulgarians by ethnicity. Prior to the 1940's, the majority of our intellectuals and revolutionaries considered themselves Bulgarians with a very strong regional identity (Macedonian). The comintern changed all this.

Demographically, Macedonia is predominately Macedonian with 64.2%, followed by Albanians who are 25.2%. Roma (gypsies) are only 2.7%.

Get your facts right.
 
Mijak said:
You lack the knowledge on Macedonians and the demographics of the Republic of Macedonia. First of All: the Slavs of Macedonia are historically, genetically, linguistically and culturally Bulgarians by ethnicity. Prior to the 1940's, the majority of our intellectuals and revolutionaries considered themselves Bulgarians with a very strong regional identity (Macedonian). The comintern changed all this.

Demographically, Macedonia is predominately Macedonian with 64.2%, followed by Albanians who are 25.2%. Roma (gypsies) are only 2.7%.

Get your facts right.
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What about Turks, Serbs, Vlahs, Torbeshi?
 
bad handling
 
Mijak said:
Well, Turks are like 3%, the others are each below 2%.
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Anyway, the topic was about Alexander's statue. Many, are confused if, that statue belong there. The historians say that Ancient Macedonians were an ethnic group related to Thracians and Illyrians. They were helenized fully at 4 centuary ad. So, culturaly at least they were Greeks. So Greeks at least have some grounds of claiming him. By blood though he was 3/4 Illyian. Why today Macedonians claim him?
 
Athelti Albanoi said:
hahahahah none of the authors is albanian
go here see the authors: http://alexanderthegreat.wordpress.com/

reality is not propaganda
alexander was illyrian-macedonian

macedonians are older than hellens so its completly unlogical to call him greek
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Sorry, Makedonians are from he part of Γηραιοι, Δωριεις, the one that Homer named as Γραιοι Greii from Achileus and Hercules,
they share enough G2 Hg even today, and a good R1a expanded even to South Italy and Black sea.
the rest is just another boring propganada of yours,

GO TO YOUTUBE AND POST YOUR FANTASTIC STORIES.
THERE YOU WILL FIND FOLLOWERS.
HERE YOU JUST MAKE NOISE.
 
Yetos said:
Sorry, Makedonians are from he part of Γηραιοι, Δωριεις, the one that Homer named as Γραιοι Greii from Achileus and Hercules,
they share enough G2 Hg even today, and a good R1a expanded even to South Italy and Black sea.
the rest is just another boring propganada of yours,

GO TO YOUTUBE AND POST YOUR FANTASTIC STORIES.
THERE YOU WILL FIND FOLLOWERS.
HERE YOU JUST MAKE NOISE.
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i can not read the greek script
and how the hack you wanne know the haplogroups of the ancient macedonians hahaha
this comes not from me the macedonians are a pelasgian tribe pre-hellenic which were considered as barbars by the new formed hellens

http://books.google.de/books?id=L6x...Ag#v=onepage&q=macedonians barbarians&f=false


you are the only on complaining like a child this is a seriouse historical discussion so dont spam
 
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