Scots, how Celtic are they?

Forget about haplogroups. SW Scottish at Eurogenes have the following autosomal percentages, labels are arbitrary :

56.6 % North-Atlantic (peaks in Irish)
27.5 % Northern Euro (peaks in Swedes)
10.2% East-Euro Finnic (peaks in Finns)
4.4% Balto-Slavic (peaks in Lithuanians)

If North-Atlantic means Celtic, then it matches my estimate through haplogroups exactly. As for the rest, Germanic people are indeed an admixture of Northern European, East European and Balto-Slavic. Even the 8.5% of R1a is pretty close from 10% of East European.
 
If North-Atlantic means Celtic, then it matches my estimate through haplogroups exactly. As for the rest, Germanic people are indeed an admixture of Northern European, East European and Balto-Slavic. Even the 8.5% of R1a is pretty close from 10% of East European.
North-Atlantic has this ranking :

Irish 64.6
SW Scots 56.6
Cornwall 56.1
UK 44.2
Kent 41.6
Spain 39.3
France 37.6
Portugal 37
Austria 30
 
I also think that the North Atlantic cluster is what genetically matches better the Celts. Interesting to see Spain with more North Atlantic than France, and Portugal it's almost the same as France. I think that probably with more samples the French would become more Celtic in average, but it's also interesting to note there are several individuals in Spain with 56 % of North Atlantic, wich is very high considering the averages.
 
Hmm.. Maybe it's a good idea to make a difference between the Highlands and the Lowlands of Scotland.
The Lowlands are more influenced by Germanic tribes, while the Highlands stayed Celtic.
 
North-Atlantic has this ranking :

Irish 64.6
SW Scots 56.6
Cornwall 56.1
UK 44.2
Kent 41.6
Spain 39.3
France 37.6
Portugal 37
Austria 30

SW Scots is an interesting choice for a sample, and could help us understand the admixture we expect from Brythonic populations, as SW Scotland is the traditionally Brythonic bit. Not surprisingly, they seem to be closest to the (also Brythonic) Cornish using this dataset (are you using a different one, Wilhelm?):

Southeast Baltic/Northern European/North Atlantic/East or North Eurasian/Sub-Saharan African/Southern European/Western European
Irish: 2/27/52/0/0/1/18
SW Scots: 4/30/48/0/0/0/17
Cornish: 2/29/48/0/0/4/17
Kentish: 4/40/35/0/0/5/16
Dutch: 5/45/29/0/0/10/10

Although Celtic and Germanic peoples both seem to display high levels of both Northern European and North Atlantic components, it seems clear that, at least when looking at the British Isles, North Atlantic = more Celtic and Northern European = more Germanic. It's actually quite interesting how exact the match is between SW Scots and their fellow traditional Brythonic peoples in Cornwall, with the major difference being more Southern European influence in Cornwall.

Making a table from most to least Celtic using the above, we have: Irish > SW Scots = Cornish > Kentish > Dutch. Which is pretty much expected. I expect Northern Scots to be less similar to the Cornish and more similar to the Irish, who are close by to begin with.

SE Scotland may be a different story, though...
 
SW Scots is an interesting choice for a sample, and could help us understand the admixture we expect from Brythonic populations, as SW Scotland is the traditionally Brythonic bit. Not surprisingly, they seem to be closest to the (also Brythonic) Cornish using this dataset (are you using a different one, Wilhelm?):

Southeast Baltic/Northern European/North Atlantic/East or North Eurasian/Sub-Saharan African/Southern European/Western European
Irish: 2/27/52/0/0/1/18
SW Scots: 4/30/48/0/0/0/17
Cornish: 2/29/48/0/0/4/17
Kentish: 4/40/35/0/0/5/16
Dutch: 5/45/29/0/0/10/10
I was using the latest EU7c, yours is EU7b, but anyways the patterns are pretty much the same.
 
is G2a middle eastern or caucasian?

"Middle Eastern" is such a foggy term in my opinion. G2a probably originated in either Anatolia or the Caucasus, however. It's clear though that it did not originate in the Fertile Crescent or the Levante.
 
You might want to check FTDNA's Scotland Y-DNA Project. It is so far the largest and most detailed database for Scottish Y-DNA.

There are about 9% of Germanic haplogroup I1. The rest is less clear. Most of the R1a (8.5%) and I2b (4%) is probably Germanic too, although some of it might be Celtic. Haplogroup Q (0.5%) is surely of Scandinavian origin.

R1b is mixed Celtic and Germanic. Here is a small analysis.

Not all R1b members tested for subclades, but among those who did I counted 66 Germanic R1b1a2a1a1a, aka R1b-U106 (12.5%) and 470 predominantly Celtic R1b1a2a1a1b (87.5%). The latter includes :

- 60 Irish-Scottish R1b-M222 (12%)
- 31 purely Scottish R1b-S68 (6%)
- 31 Italo-Gaulish R1b-U152 (6%)
- 11 mostly Franco-Iberian R1b-SRY2627 (2%)

The others are undefined. There are 205 R1b-L21 (38%), which is the most common kind of R1b in Britain. It is found all along the Atlantic coast from Iberia to Norway, as well as in Germany. It could be just as well Celtic or Germanic. In the Netherlands and Scandinavia, L21 is found is approximately the same proportions as U106. So it is fair to assess that 12.5% of Scottish L21 is Germanic and 25.5% is Celtic.

Within R1b, 12.5% is Germanic R1b-U106 and 12.5% is Germanic R1b-L21. One fourth of R1b is Germanic, and three fourth Celtic. As 72.5% of Scots are R1b, it means that about 18% of all Scottish haplogroups are Germanic R1b.

The total for Germanic lineages (I1, I2b, Q, R1a and Germanic R1b) is therefore about 40%.

Middle Eastern haplogroups (G2a, J2, E1b1b, T), which account for 4.5% of Scottish lineages, might have come to Britain during the Neolithic, or through continental Celts, Romans and Germanic tribes. It's probably a bit of everything, though nobody knows in which proportion. Let's say that 2.5% is of Germanic origin to keep the proportions with average haplogroup frequencies in the Netherlands and Norway, the source countries of the Anglo-Saxons and Vikings in Scotland.

This gives us 42.5% of lineages of Germanic origin. The rest (57.5%) can be considered Celtic.

My bold. So if one is an L21+ Scot, is there anyway to determine whether one's Y-DNA is Germanic or Celt?:unsure:
 
The best option is to participate in admixture projects. As somebody noted above, Eurogenes gives a good idea about the Celtic background taking the North Atlantic cluster as reference.

It's the best you can do, since we can't know who was the first ancestor reflected in the Y-DNA marker (going back thousands of years ago).
 
No, it's a genetic project managed by Davidski (Polish). He uses the raw data provided, for example, at 23andme, and interprets your allele frequencies into different clusters. The same as Dodecad.

Here is the blog where the results appear (different analyses): http://bga101.blogspot.com/
 
so scotlands is more Germanic than England???????????
 
Scotland r1b u106 is 12% its 20% in England.i1 is 15 % in England and 9% scotland
 
I1 is Nordic/Scandinav not Germanic. R-S21 is Celtic of the Germanic variety; English, Germans, Austrians, Danes ; they're all more Germanic than the scots and certainly much more than the Irish. Now to answer the original question, how Celtic are the Scottish people, the answer is VERY Celtic, as their R1b percentages are about 75% if I'm not mistaken.
 
I1 is Nordic/Scandinav not Germanic.

What makes you think that? Especially in the context of Britain, there's a lot more continuity between most local I1 and continental I1 than there is with Scandinavian I1 (with the exception of genetic outliers like Orkney).

R-S21 is Celtic of the Germanic variety

What does this even mean?
 
sparkey,what do you think the difference is in the Germanic dna between scotland and England?
 
sparkey,what do you think the difference is in the Germanic dna between scotland and England?

One of the most detectable differences between Celtic and Germanic populations are their relative I1 frequencies (much higher in Germanic populations). So, taking the I1 ratio between the constituent countries should give us a pretty good idea of their relative Germanic input. For England : Scotland : Wales, we end up with something like a 6 : 4 : 3 ratio, so England is about 1.5 times as Germanic as Scotland, and about twice as Germanic as Wales. Of course, there are complexities. Scotland may be overstated there because it presumably has a higher North Germanic to West Germanic ratio, and North Germanic peoples have a higher internal I1 ratio. Wales may also be overstated there because they have a unique, apparently non-Germanic I1 subclade. But it's still probably a decent estimate.
 
Most frequently I1 indicates Viking presence. What does what I said even mean? R-S21 is part of the indo-European family (R1a,R1b) inside the indo-European family there is a group called Celtic, and inside the Celtic group there are Italo-celts and Germanics. R-S21 is found in Germanic countries (Germany,Austria,Denmark,England) where these people migrated.
 

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