Vlach haplogroups & deep ancestry?

The Aromuns,like all Vlachs and Romanians,had lived in "Bulgaria",Aromanian has Slavo-Bulgarian loans,plus the composite word "untulemnu"(oil),Romanian "untdelemn",literally "butter-of-wood", who is just a translation of the Bulgarian "darveno maslo".


The Aromuns(or at least their "Bessi" part) surely knew of Thessaloniki,preserving it in the form of Saruna(the rhotacization of Salona),they have also exclusively kept some southern-type vocabulary,hic(latin ficus),caroari(heat;latin calorem).
After the Slavic invasion/settlement the Latin speakers had withdrawn into the highlands forming scattered groups that had kept strong ties between each other through transhumance/pastoralism.
Kekaumenos view of Vlach's ancestors corresponds with this:they were "Dacians" and "Bessi", two geographically-separated communities.


The "Bessi"'s origin was diverse:from the citymen or farmers of Roman,Thracian and Thraco-Dardano-(and Macedonian?) origin ,who lived in towns like Scupi(Skopje), Naissus(Nis) and along the Upper Vardar or the Southern Morava valleys,
to the highland herdsmen of real Bessian stock,that had been Christianized by Nicetas of Remesiana .


The (southern part) of the "Dacians" dwelled along the Danube,especially in the lands situated east of Morava river,in eastern Serbia and north-western Bulgaria.They were of legionary tradition,the genetic base would have been the Roman soldiers detached along the Danube limes and,somehow coincidentally, the autochthonous Thraco-Dacians.




"Dacian" toponyms:


Latin-derived toponymy from the above-mentioned area:Timok(Timacus),Florentin(Florentiana),Archar(Ratiaria),Motru(Amutriam,Amutria),Ogosta(Augusta),Vidin-Budin(Bonomia),Cibrica(Cebrus).


Toponymy inherited from the Roman Age:Osam(Asamus),Vit(Utus),Lom(Almus),Iantra(Iatrus),Iskar(Oescus)


In the case of Motru,Archar and Ogosta,the terms initially designated settlements,which had been later abandoned by their inhabitants,but they didn't left the areas,passing them to the nearby rivers.


"Florentin BUL (Florentiana): possible fort (B-L, 227; Iv, 481; GMs, 28a)."




There are clear phonetical discrepancies between certain Latin elements of Romanian,Aromanian and Albanian,suggesting pre-Slavic differentiation,even if the Albanians had also received Latin influence of Romanian type before the arrival of the Slavs.


However,all the Vlachs dialects plus Romanian share a considerable higher number of innovations within Latin,than,let's say the entire Italian dialects.






"(d) The kw => p change in front of all vowels except a (a phenomenon of delabialization) in Vulgar Latin is seen in inscriptions and mentioned by grammars:
conda instead of quondam; coquens non cocens, etc. In front of a this phenomenon occurred in Sardinian and in East Latin only in the following words:


This phenomenon is not found in Albanian: Latin quattuor => Alb. katre, quadragesima => kreshme."


"Latin cl corresponds to Northern Rumanian ch: Lat. clavis => N.Rum. cheie.
Istrorumanian and Arumanian have the intermediary consonant group kl:
e.g., Arumanian klem. According to Densusianu,
this seems to have been the case in Balkan Romance when it was separated from Italian.
Italian has chiave, French cle."(Eastern Romance-Orbis Latinus)



"The disappearance of the
Late Roman and Early Byzantine urban centres in Dalmatia and Illyricum
was not related only to the arrival of the Slavs, but rather it was a process
that had already been taking place for at least 50 years (approximately),
since ca. 548 when the Slavs had made their first major incursion south of
the Danube River.21 Therefore, the economic decline of the cities in
Illyricum and Dalmatia was among the main reasons why these cities were
doomed to disappear.22 The last onslaught of invaders, which took place
during the first years of Heraclius’ reign, just dealt the final, fatal blow; it
was the closing act of a long, ongoing process. However, the rural population
did not entirely disappear.
To the contrary, the Romanized population survived the arrival of the Slavs,
and in a far greater number than was previously
thought.23 It was merely a shift of political power which marked
the profound changes in the former Praefectura Illyricum – from the
Romans/Byzantines to the Slavs.
"




"The cities of the Praefectura Illyricum had been in the state of constant
decline since the mid-fifth century; see: P. Lemerle, Invasions et migrations
dans les Balkans depuis la fin de l’epoque romain jusqu’au VIII siècle, Revue
historique 211 (1954) 281; Zivkovic, Juzni Sloveni, 55-56. However, during
the rule of Justinian I (527 – 565), a number of fortresses and towns in what
is today modern Serbia were either rebuilt or constructed (after 540); Cf.
Procopii De aedif. IV, 4, 116.6-117.10; 122.15-129.4. "


"The population density in Dalmatia or the Praefectura Illyricum
was not equally distributed. Neither had the Roman population lived in all
of its different regions in equal numbers, nor did the Slavs settle in vast
numbers all the areas exposed to their arrival.
It can be assumed that the
survival of a long-standing name of some particular Roman settlement is a
proof that Roman population did persist in the area;79 on the other hand if
the name of the settlement became Slavic, the indigenous population must
have fled from the particular area"


"It is also evident that many terms related to the Christian rites in Serbian
(as well as in Croatian) derive from Latin:
oleum – ulje, acetum – ocat, arca – raka, paganus – paganin, altare – oltar,
sanctus – sveti, vinum – vino, crux – krst, calendae – koleda, compater –
kum, panis – panja.81 This terminology is the definite proof that there was
contact between the Slavs/Serbs and the indigenous population with their
Latin Christian rites in the Early Middle Ages;
this also proves the existence
of an earlier ecclesiastical organization (which was established in the
ninth century, if not before)"


"This would mean that the Slavs settled in the
cities or fortified places along the main Roman roads, taking control of the
most fertile and arable land."


"On the linguistic side of the matter, terms related to agriculture, which
were borrowed from the Slavs, make regular appearance in Hungarian,
Romanian, Albanian, and even Greek languages, while the Slavs adopted
the terminology for animal husbandry and products related to it from the
indigenous population."


"The Slavs (Croats, Serbs, and others) settled in the areas around the
main routes and in the most fertile areas of Dalmatia and Praefectura
Illyricum, by using the network of ancient Roman communications"





"The Fortifications of the Late Antiquity and Early Byzantine Period"(Serbia)


"The social crisis that struck the Roman Empire caused striking
pauperization of the population, while the continuous flood of settlers,
various peoples and looters made the difficult situation even worse. These
groups benefited from the proximity of the frontier and the well-branched
road network to reach their loot in the flatland settlements and towns. The
Hunnic wrath caused destrucion of some important towns, such as Singidunum,


Viminatium, Margum and Naissus. It took plenty of time for these towns
to recover. The horrible times were exacerbated by the natural disasters
that befell certain parts of the Empire. The catastrophic earthquake struck
Dardania in 518,548 followed by a plague epidemic that decimated the
population and weakened the defences of the Empire.549
Insecure times called for construction of fortifications. Some of
these fortified sites were regional centres with military crews and a still
functioning ecclesiastical organization. Besides these, the imperial
authorities strived to build smaller fortifications on important strategic
points along the roads, so as to defend and oversee the communication and
supply systems. These fortified sites also served as refuge centres that
provided safe haven to the populations fleeing the endangered lowland
settlements. Parallel to the construction of these fortifications, smaller
ones were built by rural communities, to provide them with safer
positions. Although their positions changed by moving into locations on
higher altitudes, they carried on with their economic activities on earlier
agricultural fields with a shift towards pastoralism.




These measures created a new defensive system, born out of
necessity and reflecting how weak the Empire had become. The aim was
to reduce the influx of refugees that sought shelters in the south, since the
refuges were built in every part of the Empire; but also put to a heavy test
the barbarians’ ability to lay siege and to maintain their supply chain; in
addition, the barbarians were rather unaccomplished besiegers of
fortifications, which by then had no riches left to loot. In any event, the
smaller hordes roaming the roads of the Empire did not even pose a threat
to the villagers any longer, unless they carried out sudden attacks. But the
remains of fire on some fortifications, together with numismatic material
and relevant archaeological horizons of hoards confirm that settlements
were played havoc with, and speak of volatile times.550 This concept,
adapted for the precarious sixth century, reached its culmination during
the reign of Justinian, as was corroborated by the writings of Procopius,
but also by the plentiful material finds from throughout the Empire."
(from Tibor Zivkovic,"The World of the Slavs")






It is possible that Kekaumenos' sources of inspiration were the authors of confusion;these sources could've referred to
events that happened during the rule of Simeon of Bulgaria,when Serbia and some parts of Greece(where the Vlachs live today) were included in Bulgaria.
If this thing didn't happened,he could've misinterpreted them.
And,of course,there's a third option,where everybody(or more than one) is guilty,distorting things,but we can only legitimize it by referring to Simeon I.



Alternatively,Kekaumenos mentions the north-eastern end of Serbia( the parts "along the Danube and Sava"), not Zeta,he or his sources knew something about
a far-northern Vlach homeland,these were the "Dacians", harder to be localized because they lived beyond "Bessi".



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Serbian_Kingdom_under_King_Constantine_Bodin-sr.svg


EDIT:

Apologies for the chaotic text,this is not intentional.

EDIT2:

clarification:"ch" corresponds to ALL the Romanian dialects

EDIT3:


Kekaumenos' text contains some errors,one of them surely big,but it's definitely not a reason to absolutize the conclusions ,
the "Bessi"'s location matches almost perfectly the archaeological reality,the fragmentation of this group("Dacians"-"Bessi")
was also recorded,the Danube remains a logical location,but it was not among Serbs.
 
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Vespasian disband legio IV at the same area, where before Romans defeated Makedonians,
Κυνος Κεφαλαι, and establish a town named ceasariana there.

what connection has that area with Bulgaria or Romania?

Aromani populations have many origins, not one,
and many dialects, not one,
plz name which tribe of Aromani has his origin in Bulgaria?
 
The Greek language had a heavy influence in the Balkans even during the Roman Empire;
therefore, the pillars Latinity must have been the forts and towns located along the Danube,where there was
an intensive and prolonged Roman activity.The second Balkanic core would have been also of strategic importance,
the Danube-Morava corridor,that could have been for the barbarians the easiest way to reach Greece and Asia Minor,
Athens or Constantinople.
According to the distribution of the inscriptions,the southermost area of Latin influence was the Upper Vardar valley(Scupi and Stobi).




These river valleys would have had,the most likely,much higher populations than the entire provinces where Latin was also used,for instance
the mountainous Dardania and Praevalitana(it is hard to believe that in these regions
the Latin-speakers were the majority).


The Albanians probably lived in the highlands of Dardania,but they were very involved in the above-mentioned areas,both
militarily and economically,enlisted as auxiliary troops or searching for a good bargain.


Map07.gif

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Balkans_6th_century.svg


It was about the medieval Bulgarian state,the Bulgarian Empire.


EDIT:

If the Albanians had orbited along these mechanisms,the autochthonous populations of the Danube,Morava and Vardar valleys
were INTEGRATED in it(thus, forming the Rumanii and Armanii),it is very wrong to call this process "acculturation",because
this isn't about the innocent and spontaneous frenzy caused by a happy polka.
 
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The great majority of the Romanian samples(both Y-DNA and mt-DNA) were taken from the cities(Constanta,Ploiesti,Piatra-Neamt, and Bucharest,the big sample).The only study that mentions counties is Martinez-Cruz 2012,but it doesn't necessarily mean that they
have used(only) villagers.

Most of mt-DNA comes from Bucharest("Genomul Uman").


This does not correspond to the demographical reality,the majority of the Romanians live in villages,not to mention that many countries had mostly sampled from the
rural environment(using the term "region").


I'm not saying we're Scandinavians(in the cities),but really,this is too much.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Y-DNA_haplogroups_in_European_populations


Despite the "myth",even the southeastern and eastern Romania has at least the same quantity of(quite depigmentated) Dinaric strain as the Slavic one,caused by both early ( Proto-Romanians) and
more or less recent events (involving transhumance).


The Nordic("Germanic") element(or most of it?) is probably not autochthonous("Goths") in the outer Carpathian Romanian populations(Wallachia and Moldova),it was spread through transhumance by the southern Transylvanian shepherds(Mocanii) coming from the "Saxon"
region located between Sibiu and Brasov. The "Saxons" were German-speaking communities with diverse background:many or most of them(despite the name ) had come from SW Germany,plus the Flemish and Wallon areas.
Of course,this element remains of secondary importance.

http://www.dgt.uns.ac.rs/pannonica/papers/volume_13_4_3.pdf
 
@ mihaitzero,

the headquarters of Roman Legion was today NIS, Serbia,
why? cause it is the center and the crossroad of 2 heavy traffic roads,
Egnatia Road, and the aquatic road Thessaloniki-Belingrad, via rivers from Aegean to Istros

but At borders Thessaly-Makedonia a Legion has disband, and we see Latin Speaking villages nearby,
also around old Makedonian capital we know Romans settle a quard, oh and we also see a core of few Latin speaking villages, there,
Following Egnatia road West, we know it was protected by Roman legions, oh another 2-3 cores of Latin speaking tribes,

Thessaloniki was East Rome, second city with power after Rome before Nova Roma, and east of the city we know Roman did not settle quards, but created villas to produce wine,
oh a small core exists there also,

etc etc
 
Yetos,it's inevitable to misunderstand somebody,but we can surely avoid to make it a fashion.
You're familiar with the very curious persons,I know Mihaitzateo,he's part of the same category,so I would be careful, if I was you.
Holding the shields up could be a solution,but it is a matter of timing as well.
This is not about you,the insinuations are only allowed when you try to be(with) a girl.
I can't say the same thing about mocking people.

EDIT:

Mihaitzatheo is either Gyms or they work in tandem,I know their operas very well.


generally addressing

I understand your concerns ,but you had started and you don't seem very eager to
get out from my computer,as I said,regardless of the circumstances, I won't let you justify these actions.
You should all know that my understanding and patience have a limit.
 
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Septecasae(Seven Houses) surely presents typical Romanian forms,"septe" is the older non-literary form of "sapte".
This placename was also located "along the Danube", in the Diocesis Aquensis area.


"Mareburgou" and "Septecasae" are probably the most obvious Romanian toponims from the list of Procopius.

http://www.loebclassics.com/view/procopius-buildings/1940/pb_LCL343.265.xml


EDIT: Aquensis is located in Dacia Ripensis,roughly the area near Aquis and Ratiaria.
Kekaumenos could've mixed up Diocese of Dacia,"where now the Serbs live",with Dacia Ripensis,"along the Danube","in inhospitable places"(mountains).
The only "inhospitable places" located "along the Danube" are E Serbia,east of Morava river,SW Romania,north of the Iron Gates,and NW Bulgaria.
The "Dacians"(or their southern part) who lived "along the Danube" in "inhospitable places" could have only come from the Danube lowlands, after the Avar and Slavic campaigns/settling.
 
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The Greek language had a heavy influence in the Balkans even during the Roman Empire;
therefore, the pillars Latinity must have been the forts and towns located along the Danube,where there was
an intensive and prolonged Roman activity.The second Balkanic core would have been also of strategic importance,
the Danube-Morava corridor,that could have been for the barbarians the easiest way to reach Greece and Asia Minor,
Athens or Constantinople.
.

Athens meaned nothing that time,
Thessaloniki was second Rome, and Achaia was capital south Greece

Legion masters interested on taxating the merchants,
so they settle next to every big, heavy traffic merchant road,
at that time there were 2, Egnatia, and Thessaloniki-Istros,

may I inform you that Nis had more legionairies than Rome,

Legio V scythica is the main reason for latinisation of Romania
 
They are not pure Arbanon. Before they left to Italy they had been living for 300 years in Morea (Peloponeses)
They resisted Turkish occupation of Morea until they were decimated by the Turks. Turkey was way superior in numerical terms, cut their olive trees, burned their crops, eat their livestock and the Arbereshe were left with two alternatives; Die or Go to Italy. Today in Arbereshe settlements of Italy Arbereshe are the majority but there minorities living there too.

they are pure Arbanoi,

they served general Maniakis, and they came to today Albania from Italy, they revolt against Con/polis, they lost their leader and moved to Korone, from there they moved to Italy back, due to Barbaros, Turkish admiral,
THEY ARE THE ONES WHO REVOLT AGAINST CON/POLIS, AND THEY NAME THE CENTRAL VILLAGE MANIAKI to Honour their General.
 
Yetos,it's inevitable to misunderstand somebody,but we can surely avoid to make it a fashion.
You're familiar with the very curious persons,I know Mihaitzateo,he's part of the same category,so I would be careful, if I was you.
Holding the shields up could be a solution,but it is a matter of timing as well.
This is not about you,the insinuations are only allowed when you try to be(with) a girl.
I can't say the same thing about mocking people.


sorry you are right,
I should have wrote @ Diurpaneus
 
they are pure Arbanoi,

they served general Maniakis, and they came to today Albania from Italy, they revolt against Con/polis, they lost their leader and moved to Korone, from there they moved to Italy back, due to Barbaros, Turkish admiral,
THEY ARE THE ONES WHO REVOLT AGAINST CON/POLIS, AND THEY NAME THE CENTRAL VILLAGE MANIAKI to Honour their General.

Are you serious?
 
@diurpaneus

2000px-Balkans_6th_century.svg.png



you can see the 2 roads
1 Via Egnatia
2 the river road Axios-Morava to Istros,

around these 2 roads many different aromani tribes were developed,
except Ceasarea and Pharsalos were Vespasian disband the IV legion

via militaris, the known road among Nis and Nova Roma, the road of Nova Roma praitors
Nis was the strategical point, there meet the 4 and the 5 legions into 1 head quarter
as you see different parts create different Aromani tribes,
like in Albania,
2 parts
1) from Vitolium Bitola Monasterion to Apollonia create MoschoVlachs,
2) the road to Dyrrachium create the ArvantoVlachs

while in Makedonia we see
1 part from Thessaloniki to Edessa was holded by Greeks, the Rumluk
2) part from Edessa to Florina was helded by another aromanian tribe, the Nymfaion Vlachs the Neveska Vlachs
3) little bit south is Naoussa and Beroia, they hold the passages to West Makedonia and Ioannina

chalkidiki
most of the road from Thessaloniki to Phillipi was hold by Greeks,
But Romans grew villas at mountain Chalkidiki and grew grapes and produce wine, so at east parts of chalkidiki from Arnaia to Asprovalta and rentina we see Aromani of anothert tribe,
there was also latinisation of locals there due to Villas

Thessaly,
the area is out of merchant roads,
but land was given to Legionairies, by Vespasian,
Turks name them kutsuk vlachs,
they have significant gaulish and germanic characteristicks at both language and looking, their wives were prisoners of war
ceasareana pharsallos deskate etc belong to that group, and live almost 2 milleniums there,

as you see, except Thessaly, the rest were caravan protectors,
Legions job was to protect them, and took good money for that,
later when Turks occupied the land they transform to champions (tsompan=champion=protector)
and drive from secret passages the mules, and had sheeps for coverage.
 
The Aromuns,Romanians and Albanians share the word for fairy,"zana",from latin Diana.
Additionally,Romanian has also preserved Sanziana, from Sancta Diana.



"Both the Romanian words for "fairy" Zânǎ[55] and Sânzianǎ, the Leonese and Portuguese word for "water nymph" xana, and the Spanish word for "shooting target" and "morning call" (diana) seem to come from the name of Diana."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diana_(mythology)


https://books.google.ro/books?id=3J...v=onepage&q=diana worship roman dacia&f=false


"The connection is simply by attaching the epithet Augustus to the gods,
and that means the fact that so is defined a sphere of powers. In Dacia most of them were roman deities:
Diana in 15 cases, Minerva, Mercurius and Hercules in 6, Mars in 4, Apollo and Liber Pater in three times."

https://www.google.ro/url?sa=t&rct=...AN.pdf&usg=AFQjCNFeRFLTVBX-43_1r16mMZwL1v0Kpg


"Votives to Venus are rare, with recent finds limited to the shrine of the Julio-Claudians at Narona (RIV.37),
but Diana was widely worshipped among the hills and forests of the central Balkans, and recent finds include a shrine at Montana (Mi.4),
in association with her twin Apollo, and in the guise of Diana Augusta at Timacum Minus (RV.45)."

from J.J. Wilkes,"Roman Danube Survey"

RomanDanubeSurvey.jpg

http://archaeologyinbulgaria.com/20...ent-roman-city-novae-near-bulgarias-svishtov/

http://danube.travel/activities/Diana-Djerdap-Region.l-114.45.html


http://bulgariatravel.org/en/object/109/Antichna_krepost_Montana


http://archaeologyinbulgaria.com/20...bulgarias-archar-had-temple-of-goddess-diana/


about JJ Wilkes's remark:


The Danube area has many forests too.And let's not forget the etymology of Romanian "padure",Albanian"pyll":from Latin "paludem",a swamp.(really,don't overinterpret)

http://www.icpdr.org/main/publications/ten-years-green-corridor

"It is calculated that over the past couple of centuries, some 80% of the Danube’s original floodplains, including important wetland areas, have been lost mostly due to drainage for agriculture and industry as well as flood prevention and navigation."

https://books.google.ro/books?id=nC...be floodplain forests serbia bulgaria&f=false
 
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Imagine the Eastern-Roman cityman,he wasn't so lucky to buy the wanted fresh food,exposing himself to an inevitable situation.It is a sudden event and there are really few solutions for it
in a city,that's why he definitely needs a word to express his misery.


Deep in the mountains,the cheese-eating shepherd had far less concerns about this kind of disturbance:there were very slim chances to happen
and he could've found an intimate space very easily.




The word never reached the Albanians,suggesting that it was a matter of environment.
His structure too is complex:conforio,from con + forio(foria),it seems to be an urban term.

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/conforio


https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/cufuri

This also looks urbanish,but if you add the right prefix,you'll instantly feel better.

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/dezmierda

NOTE:more advanced (Latin) structures,such as compound words,had miraculously escaped from Albanian.

EDIT:

Most of my suppositions had been instantly generated(based on few reading),because,without a doubt, it is the creativity that really matters to me.
I'm sure that many of them are indeed inspiring.(no irony here)

EDIT2:

Dezmierda automatically implies nursing,an activity that couldn't have involved(or thrived in) the traditional pastoral communities.

https://books.google.ro/books?id=1a...page&q=child nursing byzantine empire&f=false


https://books.google.ro/books?id=yx...page&q=child nursing byzantine empire&f=false

EDIT3:

The semantic change/connection "tush cleaning"(technical touch)-->"caress"(affectionate touch) indicates a technical/practical affection.

EDIT4:

Unfortunately these two words were objectively selected.
 
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hypothesis




The two words that designated the church(building) in Latin were ecclesia and basilica.


Ecclesia referred to the "Christian community" ,the ecclesiastical organization and Church affiliation,
while basilica, initially a non-religious concept,meant a large building that was suitable for gathering lots of believers.


"kishe f, pl. kisha ‘church’. Another variant is qishe. Borrowed from Lat
ecclesia"(Orel)




The preservation of kishe testify that the Albanians and the entire ecclesiastical structure of their area
had developed in much safer conditions.The Romanians and the Aromanians were very exposed to the relentless
invasions ,thus the ecclesiastical ties were heavily disrupted and they only kept the derived terms
from basilica(biserica,basearica),meaning that they could have gathered only in large buildings inside
the fortified cities and fortifications that became completely isolated.
 
I'm not saying we're Scandinavians(in the cities)

I was making the average,because the cities too have lots of blondes,
but they are proportionally fewer than those from the villages.
The brunettes,regardless of their skin colour, usually display
the typical Romanian traits(Dinaric and Dinaro-Slav) as
their main features as well.


Blondeness/depigmentation(I don't overrate it) is uniformly diffused
,without being conditioned by the ethnic or social barriers,a
normal DNA analysis would simply reflect the reality.


Gipsy children from Wallachia:

646x404.jpg
 
hypothesis




The two words that designated the church(building) in Latin were ecclesia and basilica.


Ecclesia referred to the "Christian community" ,the ecclesiastical organization and Church affiliation,
while basilica, initially a non-religious concept,meant a large building that was suitable for gathering lots of believers.


"kishe f, pl. kisha ‘church’. Another variant is qishe. Borrowed from Lat
ecclesia"(Orel)




The preservation of kishe testify that the Albanians and the entire ecclesiastical structure of their area
had developed in much safer conditions.The Romanians and the Aromanians were very exposed to the relentless
invasions ,thus the ecclesiastical ties were heavily disrupted and they only kept the derived terms
from basilica(biserica,basearica),meaning that they could have gathered only in large buildings inside
the fortified cities and fortifications that became completely isolated.


both ecclesia and basilica are Greek words

Εκκλησια Βασιλικη,

first means the 'call' the 'gathering' from εκ+καλω = εκ κλησις
second means Royal βασιλευς = king rois Βασιλικη is the royal building AND AN ARCHITECTURE RYTHM

Βασιλικη was the name of the Roman court/judge building or town hall, that architecture style was used by early Cristians,


The Greek word Ekklesia literally "called out" or "called forth"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_Church

The Latin word basilica (derived from Greek βασιλικὴ στοά, Royal Stoa,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basilica


the pure architecture style sprunks from Neopythagoreian school with 3 κλιτη naves (τρικλiτος βασιλικη)
but Romans expand it to bigger scale, and made 5 κλιτη/naves 7 etc


early christian building did had something different,
in they ram down the old temples and made them churches,
if build a new they had 2 architectural rythms/styles
Βασιλικη and Ροτοντα
ροτοντα is Roman/latin word rotundus, are the circle buildings,
Rotonda/Rotunda is the style of Pantheon at Rome
or Temple of Zeus of Galerius at Thessaloniki (ροτοντα Θεσσαλονικης), which christians turn it to st George

Ac.galerius2.jpg
 
Without a doubt the main Vlach haplogroups were I2a
(it doesn't matter if it is inherited or not) and E-V13.


I2a scores 30% in the Moravian Vlach lineages and 40%
in the Serbs from Bosnia,a population with significant
Vlach background.The Vlachs that settled in Bosnia
came from Serbia,it is possible that the northen
groups of Vlachs had more I2a than the southern ones.


IF I2a was initially Slavic-only,it had spreaded into Croatian,
Serbian and Romanian-Vlach Dinarics,without consistently
altering the original phenotype or,in the case of Vlachs,
their ethnicity.


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3131682/figure/F2/


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3131682/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Y-DNA_haplogroups_in_European_populations


http://www.farsarotul.org/nl16_1.htm
 
The definitons of ecclesia and basilica are not mine,I took them
from two studies, a Romanian and a French one,they only referred
to the meanings of the two words in the 4th-6th centuries Roman Empires
,because it was important to do so from the perspective of the
development of the derived words in Romance languages.


The words were indeed borrowed from Greek,but they had entered into Latin
differently:yes,basilica was also used by the Romans prior to Christianity,
while ecclesia had spreaded with it from the Eastern/Greek part of the Empire.


Albanian kishe comes from Latin ecclesia,because Latin "cl" becomes [k] in Italian,Romanian and Albanian,
written as "k" in Albanian and "ch" in Romanian and Italian.
Italian had also preserved the word in a very similar form:chiesa.




keshyre f, pl. keshyre ‘mountain path, path in the ravine’. Borrowed from
Lat clausura, clüsüra ‘lock, bar, bolt; castle, fort’(Orel,"Albanian Dictionary")




"Latin cl corresponds to Northern Rumanian* ch: Lat. clavis => N.Rum. cheie.
Istrorumanian and Arumanian have the intermediary consonant group kl: e.g.,
Arumanian klem. According to Densusianu, this seems to have been the case
in Balkan Romance when it was separated from Italian. Italian has chiave, French cle."


*Northern Rumanian means Northern Vlach,which is Rumanian.


My first theory implied that the Romanians/Aromanians too had initailly
a word that came from ecclesia.(But, since I obviously can afford to anticipate things,
there would probably be others.)


Ultimately,the presence of the derived term from ecclesia only in Albanian,
can testify the differention between them and the Romanians/Aromanians.
 
hypothesis




The two words that designated the church(building) in Latin were ecclesia and basilica.


Ecclesia referred to the "Christian community" ,the ecclesiastical organization and Church affiliation,
while basilica, initially a non-religious concept,meant a large building that was suitable for gathering lots of believers.


"kishe f, pl. kisha ‘church’. Another variant is qishe. Borrowed from Lat
ecclesia"(Orel)




The preservation of kishe testify that the Albanians and the entire ecclesiastical structure of their area
had developed in much safer conditions.The Romanians and the Aromanians were very exposed to the relentless
invasions ,thus the ecclesiastical ties were heavily disrupted and they only kept the derived terms
from basilica(biserica,basearica),meaning that they could have gathered only in large buildings inside
the fortified cities and fortifications that became completely isolated.

That's interesting. Have you heard of this group Diurpaneus?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pannonian_Romance
When I was looking over the Migration period and especially demographic changes, I found this little insert in Wikipedia. They were hypothesized to be Vulgar Latin speakers (there aren't enough sources to say for certain it seems) living in Pannonia even during the Hunnic and Avar times, surviving by mainly living in fortified settlements. It seems only the western part of Pannonia was extensively colonized by the Romans though. The Great Hungarian Plain didn't seem to be bothered extensively with though (by Romans) and was always important for the steppe nomads.
From the wiki page: base.jpg
This is thought to be remains of a church used by them. Pretty small if you ask me though.
Could they have connections or contributed to the ethnogenesis of Vlach and Romanians?
 

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