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Thread: Did E1b1b cross directly from North Africa to Europe due to climate change ?

  1. #26
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    I think you are quite correct in your assumption that E1b1b is (partly, of course) Pre-Neolithic in Iberia, Maciamo. How else could one explain its high ocurrence in places such as Galicia, Asturias, Cantabria, and Castile&Leon (with 22%, 14%, 11% and 16% respectively)? Agriculture only arrived in the Late Neolithic (and in many if not most areas only with the arrival of megalithism), Muslim occupation was quite short (especially in the former 3) and Sephardic Jews were not very numerous (except in some areas of C&L). It is also worth noting that in N. Iberia, where E1b1b is high, I (the only other pre-Neolithic haplogroup) is low (and vice-versa).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pyrub View Post
    Sepharid Jews or "Spanish" Jews are well known to carry E1b1b and would explain why the Iberian peninsula shows high percentages of this haplogroup.

    It's not science fiction. It's a well known marker of Jews and would explain the high prevalence in Portugal, where the slave trade occurred and inbreeding possibly.
    Actually Italy is the country with more Sephardic influence if I remember well, so not "Spanish" at all. Jews were banned and expulsed from the Peninsula by the Catholic Kings in a substantial degree, and most of them went to Italy, Turkey, and other places. It's perfectly reported in the historical documents that after the expulsion, the Spanish society of the moment suffered a hard economic crisis due to this. That's what it's not science fiction.

    Also, if the Jewish influence was that huge, more West Asian and Southwest Asian should appear in autosomal results. Of course, it's not the case, so I'm afraid there's no significant connection between haplogroup E and the Sephardic presence in Spain.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Knovas View Post
    Actually Italy is the country with more Sephardic influence if I remember well, so not "Spanish" at all. Jews were banned and expulsed from the Peninsula by the Catholic Kings in a substantial degree, and most of them went to Italy, Turkey, and other places. It's perfectly reported in the historical documents that after the expulsion, the Spanish society of the moment suffered a hard economic crisis due to this. That's what it's not science fiction.

    Also, if the Jewish influence was that huge, more West Asian and Southwest Asian should appear in autosomal results. Of course, it's not the case, so I'm afraid there's no significant connection between haplogroup E and the Sephardic presence in Spain.
    Not to mention the fact that if there was a large Sephardic contribution, it would have been in places like Aragon and Cataluña, but they have only 5% and 3% E1b1b...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Knovas View Post
    Actually Italy is the country with more Sephardic influence if I remember well, so not "Spanish" at all. Jews were banned and expulsed from the Peninsula by the Catholic Kings in a substantial degree, and most of them went to Italy, Turkey, and other places. It's perfectly reported in the historical documents that after the expulsion, the Spanish society of the moment suffered a hard economic crisis due to this. That's what it's not science fiction.

    Also, if the Jewish influence was that huge, more West Asian and Southwest Asian should appear in autosomal results. Of course, it's not the case, so I'm afraid there's no significant connection between haplogroup E and the Sephardic presence in Spain.
    The spanish inquistion in around 1480 to remove non christians from Iberia, led to the Moriscos. basically jews and moors who where baptized christians so that they could remain in Iberia. The dna remained amid to a lesser percent.

    The jews that fled, went either to Portugal , but castilian pressure on Portugal forced these jews to move to antwerp or they went to Italy, usually tuscany or the duchy of Ferrara. The ones that wanted to go further went to Venice to be transported to the Levant or went to Poland via augsbug.
    Father's Mtdna H95a1
    Grandfather Mtdna T2b24
    Great Grandfather Mtdna T1a1e
    GMother paternal side YDna R1b-S8172
    Mother's YDna R1a-Z282

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    Quote Originally Posted by zanipolo View Post
    The spanish inquistion in around 1480 to remove non christians from Iberia, led to the Moriscos. basically jews and moors who where baptized christians so that they could remain in Iberia. The dna remained amid to a lesser percent.

    The jews that fled, went either to Portugal , but castilian pressure on Portugal forced these jews to move to antwerp or they went to Italy, usually tuscany or the duchy of Ferrara. The ones that wanted to go further went to Venice to be transported to the Levant or went to Poland via augsbug.
    And the Moriscos were also expelled in the beggining of the XVIIth century

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    Anyone can explain me something!!! If haplogroup E of Albania is let say 27% of male population, can't we suppose that aproximately that many women in percentage came from the same region of the world, where E male population came. My view is that if they came by land they took their women with them. How does it work? It may sound naive but I am not a genetist.

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