Are Austrians the same as Germans ??

[Ike]

Oderzo, From the mid-9th century BC the Veneti occupied site and gave it its name. Etymologically, "-terg-" in Opitergium stems from a Venetic root word indicating a market (q.v. Tergeste, the old name of Trieste). The location of Oderzo on the Venetian plain made it ideal as a center for trade.

So, why would Russian say torg- (trade, commerce) if it came from Venetian? It is not plausible that they've got it from Slovenes after Proto-Slavic diverted into branches. Your theory would imply that Proto-Slavic speaking population lived near Venetians, probably somewhere in the Balkans. That's the only way I see Russians getting that word.

Anyway, it's all futile, because we have not enough knowledge of Venetian, so any claims are just speculations. Better to leave it aside for now...

 

[Sile]

was not this thread dedied to Austrians and Germans at first?

yes , but some people want to make east Austria a slavic foothold .

IMO for east Austria .....late bronze -age
Illyrians
Celtics
Romans
Lombards
Rugii
Avars...........goths and all other invaders in the barbarian invasions
Bavarians

 

[Vedun]

hahaha "Sile", you are a racist and slavophobe. Yes, you are a racist.
Besides, majority of Austrians are descendants of Karantanians, hence they are Slavic in origin also
Oh, I should remind you about Berlin, which was originally also a Slavic city, called Berlog or Berlo, the same with Meckleburg, called Mikulin Bor, BraniBor became Brandenburg, Lipsk became Leipzig, Drozdiany became Dresden, Dobresol became Galle, Vedegosh as Volgast, etc, etc

Live with that... :*

 

[Vedun]

Austria in 6th-10th century... "AD"
View attachment 6461

 

[Ike]

You can't talk like that Vedun. Although there are good indications that those area were Slavic at some time, there is no Slavic exclusivity on R1a and we don't know if at some point, especially in Venetian times which should be at least 1000 years earlier the period you mentioned, Slavic people were anywhere near central Europe.

 

[Nobody1]

Besides, majority of Austrians are descendants of Karantanians, hence they are Slavic in origin also
Oh, I should remind you about Berlin, which was originally also a Slavic city, called Berlog or Berlo, the same with Meckleburg, called Mikulin Bor, BraniBor became Brandenburg, Lipsk became Leipzig, Drozdiany became Dresden, Dobresol became Galle, Vedegosh as Volgast, etc, etc

View attachment 6460

It depends which R1a clade you pinpoint with/to the Slavs;
R1a was already west of the Elbe (Eulau) during the Chalcolithic times (Corded-ware) and even a bit further west during the Bronze-age (Lichtenstein/west Harz) Urnfield; Thus R1a already spread west with other complexes much earlier; The Slavs that reached the Elbe (i.e. east of the Elbe and Saxon limes) were known as the Polabian Slavs (Obotrites/Veleti[WILZEN]/Sorbs); Polabian stemming from the Slavic etymology of the Elbe/Albis river (Łaba); The Sorbs in the Lausitz still exist as such as a Slavic people; However while Polabian, Kashubian and Polish are collective Lechitic (Lechisch) languages Sorbish diverges from these; What is also interesting are the accounts of Adam von Bremen;

Adam von Bremen - Book II/XVIII
Sclavanien also, eine sehr ausgedehnte Landschaft Germaniens, wird von den Winulern bewohnt, welche einst Wandalen hießen. Es soll zehnmal so groß sein wie unser Sachsen,

Adam von Bremen does not use the term Wenden/Winden he collectively uses the term Winuler (for all Slavs) and clearly states that these Winuler stem from the Wandalen(Vandals); We also find amongst the Obotrite (Polabian) Slavs the Warnen which used to be an old Germanic peoples of the same vicinity (Ptolemy II/X) and who Plinius (IV/XXVIII) associated with the Vandals; In Austria the Slavs (Karintanen) reached as far west as the Pustertal - practically the range of the Hohe Tauern was the most western area; The Bajuwaren and Karintanen clashed in that area (Pustertal) as early as the 6th century (Paul the Deacon IV/VII-X); Keeping in mind that many people of modern Austria are also from internal KuK migrations (vielvölker staat - 18th/19th cen.) from Bohemia and the Balkans not all Austrians who have Slavic roots trace them to the original Karintanen;

 

[FrankN]

What is also interesting are the accounts of Adam von Bremen;

Adam von Bremen - Book II/XVIII
Sclavanien also, eine sehr ausgedehnte Landschaft Germaniens, wird von den Winulern bewohnt, welche einst Wandalen hießen. Es soll zehnmal so groß sein wie unser Sachsen,

Adam von Bremen does not use the term Wenden/Winden he collectively uses the term Winuler (for all Slavs) and clearly states that these Winuler stem from the Wandalen(Vandals); We also find amongst the Obotrite (Polabian) Slavs the Warnen which used to be an old Germanic peoples of the same vicinity (Ptolemy II/X) and who Plinius (IV/XXVIII) associated with the Vandals;

Be careful here. Along the same lines, you may link the Rugii, who settled Lower Austria in the 5th century AD, to the Obotrite Rujani (Rani) that settled in the old Rugii homeland around the island of Rügen. There is, however, archeological evidence that parts of Rugen and its hinterland remained continuously settled during the migration period, and immigrating Slavs only settled in previously unsettled areas. As such, it is now mostly believed that the Obotrite Rujani took over their name from those East Germanic Rugii that had remained in their homeland.
There are multiple signs of Germanic-Slavic coexistence east of the Limes Saxonia. Not far from where I live, e.g., there is a village called "Schlamersdorf" - obviously a German name given to a Slavic settlement. Next to it is "Nehms" - obviously a Slavic name for a German settlement.

 

[Sile]

hahaha "Sile", you are a racist and slavophobe. Yes, you are a racist.
Besides, majority of Austrians are descendants of Karantanians, hence they are Slavic in origin also
Oh, I should remind you about Berlin, which was originally also a Slavic city, called Berlog or Berlo, the same with Meckleburg, called Mikulin Bor, BraniBor became Brandenburg, Lipsk became Leipzig, Drozdiany became Dresden, Dobresol became Galle, Vedegosh as Volgast, etc, etc

Live with that... :*

View attachment 6460

I am no racist as I have many slavic friends, you are the one who has racial issues by even stating R1a is slavic.....is this your intension?
I remind you, NO haplotype belongs to any race and only , just only a small subclade of a haplotype might belong to a race..............but thats a big maybe

 

[Nobody1]

Be careful here. Along the same lines, you may link the Rugii, who settled Lower Austria in the 5th century AD, to the Obotrite Rujani (Rani) that settled in the old Rugii homeland around the island of Rügen. There is, however, archeological evidence that parts of Rugen and its hinterland remained continuously settled during the migration period, and immigrating Slavs only settled in previously unsettled areas. As such, it is now mostly believed that the Obotrite Rujani took over their name from those East Germanic Rugii that had remained in their homeland.
There are multiple signs of Germanic-Slavic coexistence east of the Limes Saxonia. Not far from where I live, e.g., there is a village called "Schlamersdorf" - obviously a German name given to a Slavic settlement. Next to it is "Nehms" - obviously a Slavic name for a German settlement.

Well that was exactly my point with the Warnen and Winuler in that the Polabian Slavs still have retained many Germanic (east) elements/peoples; Also maybe in Helvekonen and Heveller; The way i see it is that the Polabian Slavs were an upmost Slavic people with some Germanic elements absorbed/remained and the Polabian Slavs must have been a major force for the Germanic (Saxon) expansion began with the Ottonian dynasty but only ended in the 12th century and the Sorbs in the Lausitz are still today a Slavic people; The Sachsenspiegel (13th century) also still has several passages concerning the Wenden;

 

[Sile]

As titled, since austria only formed in 998AD from bavarian people, then the answer is very simple ........type of germans. Are they the same as "pure" germans, no ..............are bavarians the same as germans?......what is a true german ( its epicenter) since Germany only formed in the 19th century

I agree eastern Austria accepted many other races, Vienna was very cosmopolitan