Is there any difference between Kosovo Albanians and Albanians from Albania?

[zanipolo]

Indeed, too bad, cause Tosks in autosomal are closiest to Greeks, E poplulation might not have K cause they are not IE speakers (IEuropeans) indicating a possible non Asian homeland but an african one or a levantine one,

yet you did not tell us which T subcalde, the Ethiopean one, go ahead give the origin of T?

I am tired of you guys, 40 years the same tricks,

there are basically 3 main T ree lines

T L445, L452, L455, L810, M184/Page34/USP9Y+3178, M272, Page129
• T* -
• T1 L206, L490, M193
• • T1* -
• • T1a M70/Page46, Page78
• • • T1a* -
• • • T1a1 L162/Page21, L299, L453, L454
• • • • T1a1* -
• • • • T1a1a L208/Page2, L905
• • • • • T1a1a* -
• • • • • T1a1a1 P77
• • • • • T1a1a2 P321
• • • • • • T1a1a2* -
• • • • • • T1a1a2a P317
• • • T1a2 L131
• • • • T1a2* -
• • • • T1a2a P322, P328
• • • • T1a2b L446
• • • T1a3 L1255

T1a1 is mostly iberia, africa, half italy, greece, asia minor levant and sudan

T1a2 is northern europe, eastern europe, half Italy , "old yuoslavia" , old thrace, north caucasus, east africa ( as it went to africa ) south africa

T1a3 is very new...kuwait and arabia

Becareful in internet because a lot of T1a1 was T1a2 up to august 2012

T1a2 was T1b was T3 was K2

T1a1 was T1a was T2 was K2

 

[Yetos]

-Look up e v-13, it has the highest density in albanian kosovars and it spreads from there throughout the balkans.
-e v-13 in the balkans is from the neolithic which means at least 10.000 yrs old, which is before the minoans and mychaneans, so before the greeks.
-The distribution of this hg in the area matches the distribution of albanians in the balkans, with mountaneous kosovo and north-east albania having the highest density, and lower areas where romans, greeks, slavs, and turks could get, having lower density.

-Mountanous north-east albania has always been autonomous during various occupations because of the shear difficulty of foreign armies to get to it.

Funny is n't it?

Big number density. wow what a word?


why you don't write a Thread about that,

Genetists who read you here I wonder what reaction they have.
so Y-Dna is a liguid that can not be transform and always goes from the high density to low density? Right?

is that you are telling us?


The second lesson I learn here is to behave polite,
and that is what I will do,


so with the most polite way, I think that you are wrong,

ask a genetist to explain you why,
I will not spend all my day answering your political propaganda,
which play tricks with numbers and not with gennetic laws,

search with gennetic laws and not with numbers,


yes mountain Albania aytonomous, Illyrian Celts, Pelasgians, Makedonians enter there, Visigoths enter there, Romans enter there, Slavs enter there, Thracians enter there,
stop your political propaganda, plz, you are speaking with grow humans and not with school boys.


and why is wrong, simply you are blinded with the high consentration of E Hg in kossovo so you used the laws of liquid mechanics to tell us that Greek E is from Albania,
you also tell us in another post that J2 is showing connection to Babylonia,

lets see if I follow your calculations and LOGIC

Crete has the biggest consentration of J2 in the world
so Babylonians India Kurds Albanian J2 all mediterrean is from crete,
that is a result following yor logic and calculations.

THAT HAPPENS WHEN WE USE YOUR LAW,
That is your prove is crap and means nothing, except the historical mistakes,

Part B

E hg neolithic in Balkans?
since when?
is that another claim of yours?
in what tomp it was found?

You wanted to be neolithic, cause fits you,

don't mess Iberian E which is Neolithic with Balcanic E,
among Iberia and Balkans the distance is Huge, and E did not found in any other neolithic tomp like Treilles etc so connection of Balcanic E with Iberian Neolithic is out of case since neither in Italy is found neither in France, neither in any Neolithic Tomp in Balkans,

maybe I am wrong to that but the oldest E in surround area is found in Konya Turkey estimate to about 2000 BC

 

[Eldritch]

Indeed, too bad, cause Tosks in autosomal are closiest to Greeks, E poplulation might not have K cause they are not IE speakers (IEuropeans) indicating a possible non Asian homeland but an african one or a levantine one,

yet you did not tell us which T subcalde, the Ethiopean one, go ahead give the origin of T?

I am tired of you guys, 40 years the same tricks,

Tosks closest in Autosomal to Greeks?
Do you have a study that proves it or it's just supposition.
It's not imporant the T clade in this case.

 

[Yetos]

Tosks closest in Autosomal to Greeks?
Do you have a study that proves it or it's just supposition.
It's not imporant the T clade in this case.

sory I am trying to find where I founded that about Tosks and Greeks.
maybe I am wrong to that,
until I find it consider it as wrong and never told,

 

[kamani]

Funny is n't it?

Big number density. wow what a word?


why you don't write a Thread about that,

Genetists who read you here I wonder what reaction they have.
so Y-Dna is a liguid that can not be transform and always goes from the high density to low density? Right?

is that you are telling us?


The second lesson I learn here is to behave polite,
and that is what I will do,


so with the most polite way, I think that you are wrong,

ask a genetist to explain you why,
I will not spend all my day answering your political propaganda,
which play tricks with numbers and not with gennetic laws,

search with gennetic laws and not with numbers,


yes mountain Albania aytonomous, Illyrian Celts, Pelasgians, Makedonians enter there, Visigoths enter there, Romans enter there, Slavs enter there, Thracians enter there,
stop your political propaganda, plz, you are speaking with grow humans and not with school boys.


and why is wrong, simply you are blinded with the high consentration of E Hg in kossovo so you used the laws of liquid mechanics to tell us that Greek E is from Albania,
you also tell us in another post that J2 is showing connection to Babylonia,

lets see if I follow your calculations and LOGIC

Crete has the biggest consentration of J2 in the world
so Babylonians India Kurds Albanian J2 all mediterrean is from crete,
that is a result following yor logic and calculations.

THAT HAPPENS WHEN WE USE YOUR LAW,
That is your prove is crap and means nothing, except the historical mistakes,

Part B

E hg neolithic in Balkans?
since when?
is that another claim of yours?
in what tomp it was found?

You wanted to be neolithic, cause fits you,

don't mess Iberian E which is Neolithic with Balcanic E,
among Iberia and Balkans the distance is Huge, and E did not found in any other neolithic tomp like Treilles etc so connection of Balcanic E with Iberian Neolithic is out of case since neither in Italy is found neither in France, neither in any Neolithic Tomp in Balkans,

maybe I am wrong to that but the oldest E in surround area is found in Konya Turkey estimate to about 2000 BC

I think you have some false beliefs in your head and you get angry if somebody questions them.

The highest frequency of J2 is not in crete:
"The highest reported frequency of J2 ever was 87.4%, among Ingush in Malgobek."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplogroup_J2_(Y-DNA)

here is your law of mechanics...
The distribution and diversity of V13 are often thought to represent the introduction of early farming technologies,
during the Neolithic expansion, into Europe by way of the Balkans.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplogroup_E1b1b1a_(Y-DNA)#E1b1b1a1b_.28E-V13.29

I can tell you know nothing about the mountainous areas of albania. There are paths to many villages that
only goats and locals can get, let alone armies. Other than pelasgians and illyrians, none else has any
records to have set foot there. And these areas coincide with the greatest concentration of v-13, and pelasgians
are a reasonable candidate for v-13, being one of the first inhabitants of the area on record.

Anyways, I don't think I am learning anything from you and I am teaching you how to be polite...
so please do your research and come back with sources, not with more bs.

 

[Yetos]

I think you have some false beliefs in your head and you get angry if somebody questions them.

The highest frequency of J2 is not in crete:
"The highest reported frequency of J2 ever was 87.4%, among Ingush in Malgobek."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplogroup_J2_(Y-DNA)

here is your law of mechanics...
The distribution and diversity of V13 are often thought to represent the introduction of early farming technologies,
during the Neolithic expansion, into Europe by way of the Balkans.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplogroup_E1b1b1a_(Y-DNA)#E1b1b1a1b_.28E-V13.29

I can tell you know nothing about the mountainous areas of albania. There are paths to many villages that
only goats and locals can get, let alone armies. Other than pelasgians and illyrians, none else has any
records to have set foot there. And these areas coincide with the greatest concentration of v-13, and pelasgians
are a reasonable candidate for v-13, being one of the first inhabitants of the area on record.

Anyways, I don't think I am learning anything from you and I am teaching you how to be polite...
so please do your research and come back with sources, not with more bs.

Funny isn't it?
you play tricks, and I am the bad guy,
you use liquid mechanic laws and I have wrong beliefs in my head,


1.
ok Then your theories are wrongcause
the law that gives a mother land is the law of Diversity,
which in Albania is almost 0-1

2. you said and wiki
The distribution and diversity of V13 are often thought to represent the introduction of early farming technologies,
during the Neolithic expansion, into Europe by way of the Balkans.

it say thought, not proven
since Neolithic E has not found in Balkans but I think in Konya Turkey a bronze age one there is no scientific prove,
until today G2 I are known about early Neolithic and J with them or follow them.

and I ask now, do you have any scientific prove? not a thought a prove? about Neolithic in Balkans?

if E is so old 9000 years old how come until today has so little muttations?
how come in 9000 years show just 1 diversity in Albania and Bosnia population of E?

Cruciani et Al gives 4-4,7 000 years in balkans, considering the E found in konya is about that time seems like Cruciani is correct, about the entrance at 2000 -2500 BC, Historically is probably either the Hettit entrance in minor Asia, either Akkado-Cypriot colonisation or Decline,

sory all the rest are thoughts and liguid mechanics law,

I try to keep calm my shelf.
no I don't get angry when someone ask,
I get angry cause you make numeral tricks, make your own laws as fits you,

anyway I am not teacher in genetics, to teach you,
but before even you ask how it works you make conclusions, and play tricks, just to create impression

 

[Dianatomia]

T in greeks was mostly restricted to the island chios and crete has it ( ionions and minoans ), corfu had it as well, but then that could be venetian

Well, since it is present in the islands via the minoan (and Ionian) connection it is logical that it should be found in other Greeks as well. Keep in mind that most of the original population of Chios was wiped out by the Turks. The ones who now inhabit the island are Greeks from Asia minor.

I would like to see some more research on South and North Albanians. See if T is present in low rates in the South and is indeed absent in the north. That could indicate something concerning the difference between Kosovo Albanians and Albanians.

What I would love to see is a general research of Gheghs, Tosks, Greeks and South Italians. Based on all the data we have, I think that Gheghs will not cluster with the other three groups.

 

[kamani]

Funny isn't it?
you play tricks, and I am the bad guy,
you use liquid mechanic laws and I have wrong beliefs in my head,


1.
ok Then your theories are wrongcause
the law that gives a mother land is the law of Diversity,
which in Albania is almost 0-1

2. you said and wiki
The distribution and diversity of V13 are often thought to represent the introduction of early farming technologies,
during the Neolithic expansion, into Europe by way of the Balkans.

it say thought, not proven
since Neolithic E has not found in Balkans but I think in Konya Turkey a bronze age one there is no scientific prove,
until today G2 I are known about early Neolithic and J with them or follow them.

and I ask now, do you have any scientific prove? not a thought a prove? about Neolithic in Balkans?

if E is so old 9000 years old how come until today has so little muttations?
how come in 9000 years show just 1 diversity in Albania and Bosnia population of E?

Cruciani et Al gives 4-4,7 000 years in balkans, considering the E found in konya is about that time seems like Cruciani is correct, about the entrance at 2000 -2500 BC, Historically is probably either the Hettit entrance in minor Asia, either Akkado-Cypriot colonisation or Decline,

sory all the rest are thoughts and liguid mechanics law,

I try to keep calm my shelf.
no I don't get angry when someone ask,
I get angry cause you make numeral tricks, make your own laws as fits you,

anyway I am not teacher in genetics, to teach you,
but before even you ask how it works you make conclusions, and play tricks, just to create impression

There is evidence that european V-13 is neolithic. They have found V-13 in Spain, at least 7.000 years old. (Lacan et al) So here you are again getting caught lying

.
Here is the map of v-13 in the world. Unless you're blind, you cannot deny that current albanians own this hg.

and why are you in this posting trying to talk down albanians and kosovars anyway? I thought greeks believe to be better than albanians...

 

[Eldritch]

Well, since it is present in the islands via the minoan (and Ionian) connection it is logical that it should be found in other Greeks as well. Keep in mind that most of the original population of Chios was wiped out by the Turks. The ones who now inhabit the island are Greeks from Asia minor.

I would like to see some more research on South and North Albanians. See if T is present in low rates in the South and is indeed absent in the north. That could indicate something concerning the difference between Kosovo Albanians and Albanians.

What I would love to see is a general research of Gheghs, Tosks, Greeks and South Italians. Based on all the data we have, I think that Gheghs will not cluster with the other three groups.

What's the all data we have?
Actually if we go by Y-DNA Ghegs are far more closer to Greeks and South Italians so i don't know what you're trying to say.

 

[zanipolo]

Well, since it is present in the islands via the minoan (and Ionian) connection it is logical that it should be found in other Greeks as well. Keep in mind that most of the original population of Chios was wiped out by the Turks. The ones who now inhabit the island are Greeks from Asia minor.

I would like to see some more research on South and North Albanians. See if T is present in low rates in the South and is indeed absent in the north. That could indicate something concerning the difference between Kosovo Albanians and Albanians.

What I would love to see is a general research of Gheghs, Tosks, Greeks and South Italians. Based on all the data we have, I think that Gheghs will not cluster with the other three groups.

There is no T in albania , only its parent marker K for the tosks

 

[Yetos]

There is evidence that european V-13 is neolithic. They have found V-13 in Spain, at least 7.000 years old. (Lacan et al) So here you are again getting caught lying

View attachment 5774.
Here is the map of v-13 in the world. Unless you're blind, you cannot deny that current albanians own this hg.

and why are you in this posting trying to talk down albanians and kosovars anyway? I thought greeks believe to be better than albanians...

Funny isn't it,

It fits your political,

1.)
The lack of E-V13 in all Neolithic tomps in Europe except Spain is Evidence that Albanian E has nothing to do with Neolithjic E of Spain,

2) The diversities in Albanian population are so little to say that E is identical to Albanian population
Instead Greece has more Diversities than Kossovo, in fact The highest local peak is Bosnia first, Greece secons, Kossovo 3rd.

3) graphics means nothing but diversity does,

the oldest close to Balkans E is the Konya E estimated about 2000 - 2500 BC
which is time line of both Cruciani et Al (4-4,7 KY) and Dienekes.

Until today no connection is found from arcahoiologists to claim that neolithic Spanish E reach Balkans, it is not in all Neolithic in France and Italy and North Balkans,
instead the connection with Cyprus and Levant is obvious.

why you posting since you are Canadian, and why you make Greek Babylonians?

Before you show us that graphic, tell us from where that E came?.

 

[Yetos]

What's the all data we have?
Actually if we go by Y-DNA Ghegs are far more closer to Greeks and South Italians so i don't know what you're trying to say.

no offense but to claim that you mention according patriarchical.
according matriarchical
according autosomal

if we consider the sum of E Y-DNA yes you hasve a point, there is a connection in a % of patriarchical

 

[kamani]

Funny isn't it,

It fits your political,

1.)
The lack of E-V13 in all Neolithic tomps in Europe except Spain is Evidence that Albanian E has nothing to do with Neolithjic E of Spain,

2) The diversities in Albanian population are so little to say that E is identical to Albanian population
Instead Greece has more Diversities than Kossovo, in fact The highest local peak is Bosnia first, Greece secons, Kossovo 3rd.

3) graphics means nothing but diversity does,

the oldest close to Balkans E is the Konya E estimated about 2000 - 2500 BC
which is time line of both Cruciani et Al (4-4,7 KY) and Dienekes.

Until today no connection is found from arcahoiologists to claim that neolithic Spanish E reach Balkans, it is not in all Neolithic in France and Italy and North Balkans,
instead the connection with Cyprus and Levant is obvious.

why you posting since you are Canadian, and why you make Greek Babylonians?

Before you show us that graphic, tell us from where that E came?.

Those questions are answered in my previous posts and in the links that I gave you. I am not going to repeat myself to no end. If you don't understand, I'm sorry..

 

[Beast]

Only similarities between Serbs and Albanians is that Serbs also are high in E.. a haplogroup that seems to be more common among Kosovar Albanians than any other group in the Balkans. While Kosovar Albanians lack haplogroups like R1a and I2a, common among south Slavs.

I don't know about J2 in Serbs? but it's high in Albanians tested... I think this haplogroup came from the Caucasus. but I also think haplogroup E came from the Caucasus rather directly from Africa.

Historians linked Pelasgian language with Albanian and Armenian. Historians also linked Pelasgian culture with Georgian culture and similar to Albanians.. But these things are just ignored. It is believed the Pelasgians came from Caucasus. Marin Barleti, historian from 15th century wrote that ancestors of Albanians at some point in time lived in the Caucasus mountains, Georgia, Colchis. immigrated to europe, in the hills of rome and then to Greece (Greek Macedonia, and Peloponnese). these things fit with the Pelasgian theory.

It is well known Pelasgians were a group of people that lived in Greece before Greeks, and were often cited as speaking a non-greek language.

 

[Yetos]

Those questions are answered in my previous posts and in the links that I gave you. I am not going to repeat myself to no end. If you don't understand, I'm sorry..

Sory I did not put questions,

I just answer yours and your imaginary theories,

Only similarities between Serbs and Albanians is that Serbs also are high in E.. a haplogroup that seems to be more common among Kosovar Albanians than any other group in the Balkans. While Kosovar Albanians lack haplogroups like R1a and I2a, common among south Slavs.

I don't know about J2 in Serbs? but it's high in Albanians tested... I think this haplogroup came from the Caucasus. but I also think haplogroup E came from the Caucasus rather directly from Africa.

Historians linked Pelasgian language with Albanian and Armenian. Historians also linked Pelasgian culture with Georgian culture and similar to Albanians.. But these things are just ignored. It is believed the Pelasgians came from Caucasus. Marin Barleti, historian from 15th century wrote that ancestors of Albanians at some point in time lived in the Caucasus mountains, Georgia, Colchis. immigrated to europe, in the hills of rome and then to Greece (Greek Macedonia, and Peloponnese). these things fit with the Pelasgian theory.

It is well known Pelasgians were a group of people that lived in Greece before Greeks, and were often cited as speaking a non-greek language.

wow, they lived in Greece, and Historians say that spoke a non IE language, the Etruscan language,
I wonder how much E Hg Etruscans have?

Now so they lived in Greece, and they Left. to where to Albania?
the only who Left to Albania were the Kadmeians (Herodotus)
Thyrrenians left to Italy (Thoukidides)

and they left E behind them?

then how come your post #68 works?

There is evidence that european V-13 is neolithic. They have found V-13 in Spain, at least 7.000 years old. (Lacan et al) So here you are again getting caught lying

View attachment 5774.
Here is the map of v-13 in the world. Unless you're blind, you cannot deny that current albanians own this hg.

and why are you in this posting trying to talk down albanians and kosovars anyway? I thought greeks believe to be better than albanians...

I wonder how your model works?
so Kossovars E HG

1) is Neolithic from Spain
2) came from Caucasus
3) it is Pelasgian, means either Hattian (G people Sardinia) probably the ones named Etruscan and Greeks name Thyrrenoi, either Kadmeian (cyprus phillistines=Falisti=Pelasgii=palestinians) a non IE language,
but both Kadmeians and Etruscans had written speech, !!!!!
4) lived in Greece before Albania but is not Connected with later Greek ethnogenesis,
they all left to mountains of Kossovo, and return as Albanians and they spread in Balkans having almost 0-1 diversity.
5) they also went to Rome where they name the white mountains Mont Albani, and then they went to Greece, so Greeks moved to Greece after Albanians build Rome?
6) Ancient writers also say that Pelasgians homeland was Smyrna area, did they also moved there?

I wonder how an 'isolated'? population, is Neolithic, with out trails of its landwalk to the mountains, from Spain and not from a landwalk though Anatolia, or a sea travel from its homeland?

how in his 'primary'? land gave no diversity, while in its late movements south as it spread gave diversities?

Besides I don't lie, and plz don't tell me lier
I just say what Cruciani et Al say 4-4,7 KY
which fits with Dienekes analysis and the E-V13 found in Konya-Turkey
and also combines that from Spain to Albania there is no arcahological trace so to explain that they came at Neolithic era from Spain
maybe I am wrong, but
the older the area of a Hg existance the more possible to give mutations,

 

[Yetos]

Sory it drops from connection and I repeated the previous post

 

[Yetos]

There is evidence that european V-13 is neolithic. They have found V-13 in Spain, at least 7.000 years old. (Lacan et al) So here you are again getting caught lying

View attachment 5774.
Here is the map of v-13 in the world. Unless you're blind, you cannot deny that current albanians own this hg.

and why are you in this posting trying to talk down albanians and kosovars anyway? I thought greeks believe to be better than albanians...

Nope E-V13 of Albania is Paleolithic in Europe,
It was found in Egypt and Levant which is closer to Balkans, before 15 000 years,

Even in your map there is a grey zone from Spain to Balkans, while exist in Portugal, I really wonder why?
maybe Paleolithic Humans had airplanes to travel.

 

[oriental]

Those blank areas are where the R1b people wiped out the E-V13 and G2 people in their conquest of France and Spain

 

[Ivan]

Those blank areas are where the R1b people wiped out the E-V13 and G2 people in their conquest of France and Spain

Maybe,

Congratulations to R1b for their victorious conquest.
I think they can be also credited for much of cultural advancements that helped shape Europe and subsequently, the world of today.

 

[oriental]

Life is not fair. Hg N-O-P-R people were born later thus had to occupy cold Central Asia. The less able died in the cold. The survivors were toughened and made smarter. So they moved north (Siberia) east (China) and west (Anatolia then up the Danube) and even south to India. They had it tough. The R1b that took over Europe did not eliminate all the E and G as the Sea People had advanced weapons who could fight off the R1b people on the coastal areas of southern Europe. The Sea People were E, G and I people.