Kosovo Albanians Haplogroups?

[Yetos]

First of all, let me ask you this: where is the written historical evidence that pre-roman tribes and cultures of area of today Croatia, Bosnia and western Serbia called themselfs as "Illyrians"? Plz, show to me that kind of evidence where that tribes said that for themselfs, show me the proof where they considered themselfs as "ILLYRIANS". You know what is the real truth here?

Tribes of pre-roman area of today Croatia, Bosnia and parts of Serbia not only that they DIDN'T HAD SAME HAPLOGROUPS as THE REAL Illyrians from Epirus and areas of today Montenegro, BUT THEY WERE NOT ILLYRIANS in the first place.

There is no proof where you can claim that tribes of pre-roman Croatia (Liburnes, Delmati, Japodes, Desitijati, Brekues etc...) were "Illyrians", by who or what they were "Illyrians"? By Romans? Let me laugh at that, you know why? Because Romans did not care much how they will name borders of their provinces, means they didn't cared which tribes will be included into that name of Province, so they would name the province by name of the tribe they had great problems with, in this case - ILLYRIANS from EPIRUS (Teuta & company), means today area of Albania and parts of Montenegro (along with parts of Kosovo etc...)

Now, I will end with this: PEOPLE/TRIBES of PRE-ROMAN time in area of today Croatia, Bosnia and parts of Serbia HAD I2a2 haplogroup dominant back than like they have it dominant TODAY, and tribes of EPIRUS (today Albania) had E1b1b dominant back than as they have it today.

You must be asking yourself, how can this be the case with Croatians, Serbians and Bosnians if they are slavic by linguistic and background origin of their tribes, well, let me enlighten you: original Croats and Serbs were slavic tribes and carriers of R1a, they mixed with romanized population of today Croatia, Bosnia and Serbia on SUCH HIGH LEVEL, that today dominant haplogroup of this three countries IS HAPLOGROUP of people before Croats and Serbs CAME HERE, so in fact YOU COULD TELL that today Croats and Serbs (majority) are BY GENETIC, the autochthonous people of pre-croatian, and pre-serbian time, even though today they are Croats and Serbs, why? Because NATION has nothing to do with ethnic background, and not to mention genetic background. That's all.

Respect and take care, do not take this post as some kind of "attack" on you, I was writting this more for others than for you cheers

Illyrians is a termination given by Greeks to tribes North of Epirus, Not Epirus.
later Romans with their favorite techique named Illyria all Dinaric Alps territory but Pliny the elder gives clear terminology of difference among Illyria and Illyricum.
you are right, above a part of Montenegro there was never Illyria and even Illyrians never used that terminology since it is an exonym.
But later scientists found that Celts from Pannoni Basin moved west of Dinaric Alps to modern Albania, that is mentioned also in Herodotus, were Illyros went away from Thebes to stop Celt invasion,
what left of Illyros and celts created what Greeks call Illyrians and later Pliny names as Illyria proprie Dicti.
simply the misunderstanding (by ignorance or in purpose) is that modern scientists use terminology Illyrian or Illyro -Celts for that part of East Celts, and not to determine Illyrian Proprie populations

 

[Marko94]

No matter some extra nationalistic Albanians here are provoking to the degree of Stupidity,
I admit that you are right, Terminology Albanian is older than Ottoman empire entrance in Balkans.

about Muslim and Christians, is another story.

Yes, ok all know what is happened in Chameria, muslim use law for kill greek ortodox and albanian ortodox.
But is the history, now only for this we must hate us??

 

[Marko94]

Lexicons give clear terminology.
Metohja is the SLavic borrow of Greek work Mετοχια,
Is Like Holy mountain Athos, Jerusalem Meca etc, Means holy land dedicated to God (Gods)
Kossovo Kossova Kos Kossyfopedio Κοσσυφοπεδιο means land of the blackbirds word is almost same in Slavs and Greeks,
Kossyfas in Greek, Kos in Bulgarian etc
it is not the only common sound word, typical among IE or Neighbour countries,
want more words?

U think in byzantium empire the kosovo is called KOΣΣΥΦΟΠΕΔΙΟ.

 

[Yetos]

Yes, ok all know what is happened in Chameria, muslim use law for kill greek ortodox and albanian ortodox.
But is the history, now only for this we must hate us??

Don't put words in my mouth,

I just said is another story.

 

[Yetos]

U think in byzantium empire the kosovo is called KOΣΣΥΦΟΠΕΔΙΟ.

I just said that Kossovo Kossova Κοσσυφοπεδιο is the same word with same root.

I also explain what metohja is.

It is not what I believe, it is fact,

if as you say every 200 years someone is changing his history, then do not do it,

Κοσσυφοπεδιον as terminology was a metohi of Serbian Patriarch, and then something like a vakif. with a Greek name, Kossyfopedion
then after the battle of Kossovo the whole area named Kossovo after the battle.

Kossyfopedion was just a field outside today Pristina, after that become synonyme of the wider area,

before the battle, no one knew the territory with that name.

vakif and metohja is almost the same,
Kossyfopedion was the name one of them.

As for Kossovo solution I agree with what Georgievski (VMRO) of FYroM wrote, after the discussion with Jaferi (Tzaferi) of DPA, Serbian Tzintzic (somethink like that, i have the book translated) and USA Albright.
the solution given is not vital, an exchange of lands and population would be a better solution.

 

[Yaan]

OMG AGAIN.
Stop with this fake dream about albanian enter in balkan with empire ottoman maked by slavs*
Albanian stay in balkan in 1200 and is dimostred by Charles 1 of Naples.
In 1246 conquest Durazzo and a little bit of albanian coast.
Charles 1 of Naples moved Arbaresh (in this time caleed arbaresh) in italy for be farmer.
Arbaresh of south builded church ortodox and Arbaresh of north use church catholic, but never builded church catholic (in this time).
In 1400 and old, so many arbaresh begin to build church Catholic and Ortodox.
Is just a dream of slavs, stop plis.
And stop with this "muslim kill christian".
The change of religion is caused for taxes in empire ottoman, not because albanian enter in ottoman empire.

Better read and learn before u write something!!Where did I said that Albanians entered Balkan in Ottoman time? They did not, but they did entered Western Macedonia and Kosovo in the Ottoman time.
Albanians become Muslim only to be able to do their mafia thing, which they do since the down of time, but this is not the topic here, we speak about genes. R1b-L23,E-V13 and J2b2 are Balkan genes.R1b-L23 has nothing to do with Celtic people, so the fake dream of Albanians to feel Western European is crushed into pieces, lets not argue about stupid things.

 

[Yaan]

Which R1a, there are so many types that has absolutelty nothing to do with each other. R1a-M458 and R1a- Z280 has nothing to do with Thrachians and entered with Slavs. The Thrachins were of course mostly E-V13,J2b2 and R1b-L23 people but they may have had some R1a- M198 also called Old European, u r right about this, but u should not R1a means nothing, u should say which subtype u mean ) There is Slavic, Paki, Mongolian, Viking, Old European etc

 

[Marko94]

Don't put words in my mouth,

I just said is another story.

Ok, this another story is other.

I just said that Kossovo Kossova Κοσσυφοπεδιο is the same word with same root.

I also explain what metohja is.

It is not what I believe, it is fact,

if as you say every 200 years someone is changing his history, then do not do it,

Κοσσυφοπεδιον as terminology was a metohi of Serbian Patriarch, and then something like a vakif. with a Greek name, Kossyfopedion
then after the battle of Kossovo the whole area named Kossovo after the battle.

Kossyfopedion was just a field outside today Pristina, after that become synonyme of the wider area,

before the battle, no one knew the territory with that name.

vakif and metohja is almost the same,
Kossyfopedion was the name one of them.

As for Kossovo solution I agree with what Georgievski (VMRO) of FYroM wrote, after the discussion with Jaferi (Tzaferi) of DPA, Serbian Tzintzic (somethink like that, i have the book translated) and USA Albright.
the solution given is not vital, an exchange of lands and population would be a better solution.

Event for change history is don't caused by "normal" albanian.
I'm not aware of what is happening now in the Balkans, but I'm sure that hatred will remain.
However, after these pacts also republika srpsk, novi sad and Sanjak want independence.

 

[Marko94]

Better read and learn before u write something!!Where did I said that Albanians entered Balkan in Ottoman time? They did not, but they did entered Western Macedonia and Kosovo in the Ottoman time.
Albanians become Muslim only to be able to do their mafia thing, which they do since the down of time, but this is not the topic here, we speak about genes. R1b-L23,E-V13 and J2b2 are Balkan genes.R1b-L23 has nothing to do with Celtic people, so the fake dream of Albanians to feel Western European is crushed into pieces, lets not argue about stupid things.

Mhhh, i think u are just a stupid.
The change of religon is contribuided by ottoman empire, u say "albanian make mafia".
But is just a fake, go in italy, in italy russian and ukrainian are wors of albanian mafia or italian mafia.
Albanian of today are only angry for governament, past and many things.
In other topic, many people confirmed e-v13 enter in neolithc in europe.
According to "utent of forum", kosovo is center of gene for Albanian.
For me don't interest enter in UE or european feel.
U have origin in vodkaland and we in africa.
A no srry u can descendent from turkey.

 

[Yaan]

1. Do not call me stupid little boy or u will be reported
2. Kosovo was populated by Albanians after the Ottoman conquest of Europe
3. No I did not originate in Vodkaland and u do not originate in Africa , I am Balkan Slav and u r Italian and Albanian
4. Maybe learn some English and something about genetics, and do not be ashamed that Albanians are Muslims I am not ashamed we are Christians

 

[Marko94]

1. Do not call me stupid little boy or u will be reported
2. Kosovo was populated by Albanians after the Ottoman conquest of Europe
3. No I did not originate in Vodkaland and u do not originate in Africa , I am Balkan Slav and u r Italian and Albanian
4. Maybe learn some English and something about genetics, and do not be ashamed that Albanians are Muslims I am not ashamed we are Christians

I think u don't know.
But the term of slavs in italy have significated slaves or gypse.
Is confirmed u are stupid, u say "albanian enter with empire ottoman", and i have shut up you.
U not accept shut up?
In kosovo stay albanian before of ottoman, Skanderbeu before of death he wil go in kosovo ( or center of balkan) for called other arbaresh or make a crusades and go in greece for free them. This is write all by vatican and confirmed by vatican.
Ok, now u "must" report me.
And albanian are much more Christian than you, i remember pope arbaresh, Pope Clement XI.

 

[Yaan]

1. No u did not shut me up, coz I said entered Kosovo and u said noting
2. Nobody cares what Italians say about Slavs, Slav come from Slovo(the people that can talk) we call the Germanics Nemci(the numb one)
3. Bulgarian were Christian before such country as Albania existed

 

[albanopolis]

1. No u did not shut me up, coz I said entered Kosovo and u said noting
2. Nobody cares what Italians say about Slavs, Slav come from Slovo(the people that can talk) we call the Germanics Nemci(the numb one)
3. Bulgarian were Christian before such country as Albania existed

Go easy my friend!
Kostandine the Great an(Illyrian) Albanian from Nisus signed a law that made christianity a religion.
How come you were christian before the one who invented it?
When Albanians were christians Bugars were a Mongol tribe, later they mixed with slavs.
Get your facts right when yu debate,.!!

 

[Yaan]

1. Konstantin was not Albanian, he was Roman, Nish is city populated by Bulgarians and Serbs in the past and only Serbs now, r u crazy, there was no Albanian state before 20th century
2. Show we one genetic or linguistic proof that we were even Mongols, we are mixture of Thrchains and Slavs, language and genes prove me right and u wrong
3. Learn history nobody ever claim Bulgars were Mongols, some Russians historians in 19th century claimed Turkic
4. If we are Mongols Turkic then u are Azeris, coz there was a state called Albania there
5. Bulgaria official exist as country since 681 and we are Christians since late 9 century
So maybe in the bar with the other Albanians somebody believes u stories, but not here
All the best

 

[zanipolo]

First of all, let me ask you this: where is the written historical evidence that pre-roman tribes and cultures of area of today Croatia, Bosnia and western Serbia called themselfs as "Illyrians"? Plz, show to me that kind of evidence where that tribes said that for themselfs, show me the proof where they considered themselfs as "ILLYRIANS". You know what is the real truth here?

Tribes of pre-roman area of today Croatia, Bosnia and parts of Serbia not only that they DIDN'T HAD SAME HAPLOGROUPS as THE REAL Illyrians from Epirus and areas of today Montenegro, BUT THEY WERE NOT ILLYRIANS in the first place.

There is no proof where you can claim that tribes of pre-roman Croatia (Liburnes, Delmati, Japodes, Desitijati, Brekues etc...) were "Illyrians", by who or what they were "Illyrians"? By Romans? Let me laugh at that, you know why? Because Romans did not care much how they will name borders of their provinces, means they didn't cared which tribes will be included into that name of Province, so they would name the province by name of the tribe they had great problems with, in this case - ILLYRIANS from EPIRUS (Teuta & company), means today area of Albania and parts of Montenegro (along with parts of Kosovo etc...)

Now, I will end with this: PEOPLE/TRIBES of PRE-ROMAN time in area of today Croatia, Bosnia and parts of Serbia HAD I2a2 haplogroup dominant back than like they have it dominant TODAY, and tribes of EPIRUS (today Albania) had E1b1b dominant back than as they have it today.

You must be asking yourself, how can this be the case with Croatians, Serbians and Bosnians if they are slavic by linguistic and background origin of their tribes, well, let me enlighten you: original Croats and Serbs were slavic tribes and carriers of R1a, they mixed with romanized population of today Croatia, Bosnia and Serbia on SUCH HIGH LEVEL, that today dominant haplogroup of this three countries IS HAPLOGROUP of people before Croats and Serbs CAME HERE, so in fact YOU COULD TELL that today Croats and Serbs (majority) are BY GENETIC, the autochthonous people of pre-croatian, and pre-serbian time, even though today they are Croats and Serbs, why? Because NATION has nothing to do with ethnic background, and not to mention genetic background. That's all.

Respect and take care, do not take this post as some kind of "attack" on you, I was writting this more for others than for you cheers

I said they did not call themselves illyrian, the term illyrian is a geographical term, same as iberian, italian, british, scandinavian etc
Even the term thracian is geographical which is why historians with some brains further refine them to getae, dacians, triballi, bessi, moesians etc.

So to be clear, there are NO people actually called Illyrian.

These "illyrians" where around centuries before the slavic people entered the balkans. By the time the slavs entered, the "illyrians where already firstly celtinized and then romanized. They did not exist after 50AD

 

[kamani]

It is kind of hard to get people to accept stories that go against their interest, even if they're true. That's why in the Balkans everybody beats their own drum from their own mountain top. Every attempt to unite these people fails miserably, like Jugoslavia for example.

 

[Marko94]

1. No u did not shut me up, coz I said entered Kosovo and u said noting
2. Nobody cares what Italians say about Slavs, Slav come from Slovo(the people that can talk) we call the Germanics Nemci(the numb one)
3. Bulgarian were Christian before such country as Albania existed

Ahaha, so funny.
I don't answer because is so stupid.
I shut up u again with Skanderbeu and crusades.

1. Konstantin was not Albanian, he was Roman, Nish is city populated by Bulgarians and Serbs in the past and only Serbs now, r u crazy, there was no Albanian state before 20th century
2. Show we one genetic or linguistic proof that we were even Mongols, we are mixture of Thrchains and Slavs, language and genes prove me right and u wrong
3. Learn history nobody ever claim Bulgars were Mongols, some Russians historians in 19th century claimed Turkic
4. If we are Mongols Turkic then u are Azeris, coz there was a state called Albania there
5. Bulgaria official exist as country since 681 and we are Christians since late 9 century
So maybe in the bar with the other Albanians somebody believes u stories, but not here
All the best

1)Kostantino was illyrian, not roman, i think u don't know who are roman and illyrian.
U came in europe in 300, he is born in 274 and now answer to me how he is slavs??
2)LOL, in other post people say u descendent from tribe turk, LOL.
3)Yea, before of 2000 nothing contrasted albanian are descendent of illyrian, but today is discord.
4)Now see the map.

If u can see, with albania look iberia.
Now, iberia caucasic has nothing to do with the iberia european (spanish).
Name Albania (used for we) for arbaresh and historican italian think born in 1600 or 1700, maked by italian. Alba=tentum--nia=place.
And if we are causic, why in my language have Latin,Illyrian or traco-dacio-greek(doric words)-slavs and nothing words caucasic.
Slavs are so many because when enter in europe, your family is compose with 10-15 sons.
5)Not is correct, u forget empire ottoman.

 

[Yetos]

Ok, this another story is other.


Event for change history is don't caused by "normal" albanian.
I'm not aware of what is happening now in the Balkans, but I'm sure that hatred will remain.
However, after these pacts also republika srpsk, novi sad and Sanjak want independence.

it is a right of populations to unite, and to divorse,
when ex-almighty Yugoslavia the 2nd biggest in 3rd world BOOM, there were areas and populations like Slovenia and Fyrom where the blood was less than a weekend's car accidents.
while in Bosna and Kossovo was enough, too much,
and I have to agree with you, hatred is a big problem, and many people earn by selling it.
and many suffer by believing them.

 

[Yetos]

Go easy my friend!
Kostandine the Great an(Illyrian) Albanian from Nisus signed a law that made christianity a religion.
How come you were christian before the one who invented it?
When Albanians were christians Bugars were a Mongol tribe, later they mixed with slavs.
Get your facts right when yu debate,.!!

SINCE WHEN?
NIS WAS A ROMAN CITY, WHERE FLAVIANS SETTLE.
CONSTANTINE WAS FLAVIAN.
I wonder did ever heard of Flavian Dynasty and their Legions?

 

[Yetos]

I said they did not call themselves illyrian, the term illyrian is a geographical term, same as iberian, italian, british, scandinavian etc
Even the term thracian is geographical which is why historians with some brains further refine them to getae, dacians, triballi, bessi, moesians etc.

So to be clear, there are NO people actually called Illyrian.

These "illyrians" where around centuries before the slavic people entered the balkans. By the time the slavs entered, the "illyrians where already firstly celtinized and then romanized. They did not exist after 50AD

Sorry zani, I think is mostly like a wider trbal/ethnic family. Like with Germans we mean Deutsch, but we could also mean Dutch Austrians Goths Dans etc,
with Slavs we could mean Polish Slovaks Croats etc.
Getai Dacians triballi Odrysse Paeoni etc is like Goths Deutsch Dutch etc today.

But I agree that Illyrian was an exonyme used by Greeks to describe some tribes/nations above Epiros, and then used by Romans as Geografical division-State terms.
so in some geographers we can see that triballi lived in Illyricum, but we know that they were not Illyrians