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Thread: Will all people of the world mix creating one race in the future?

  1. #426
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vallicanus View Post
    My point is that the greening of the Sahara will be in non-African hands.
    So what, it will create jobs and food for locals anyway. I'm sure most soft-drinks (one example) in your country are in multinational corporations hands. It doesn't stop you to enjoy products or work for them and make money.

    SS African poverty will continue because population growth is outstripping economic growth.
    Even SS poverty is not that bad it used to be decades ago. There is slow but steady progress.
    And fertility rates are falling in many SS countries since 80s.
    https://www.google.ca/search?q=popul...x1AAmq5i9ZAAAA
    Be wary of people who tend to glorify the past, underestimate the present, and demonize the future.

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    You are too optimistic.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vallicanus View Post
    You are too optimistic.
    He isn't too optimistic, IMO it's realistic what LeBrok says.

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    Actually you made an excellent point about body and face features and sizes. This is if I understood you right.
    Some parts of our bodies don't "average" well, and in mixed societies we can observe a plethora of different facial features. Small nose, big nose, big lips, long face, round head, etc, etc. Except for a skin colour, skin colour tends to average more often than not. In this case we might end up with brownish society of a variety of facial features.
    My point stands that it all will resemble one race more than anything. People will be so mixed, even though sporting litany of various features, that all old race types stop existing never the less.

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    I think so!

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    1 members found this post helpful.
    How optimistic? With the migration we see globally -this have to be the future

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    Hopefully not.

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    it will not happen, when there will be symptoms of decline of some race there will be outcry and that race will do things to stay on float

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    Quote Originally Posted by amenhotep View Post
    it will not happen, when there will be symptoms of decline of some race there will be outcry and that race will do things to stay on float
    You mean that interracial marriages will be forbidden?

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    I'm the first person in my family since the reformation to have conjugal relations with a Roman Catholic. Baby steps. ;)

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    It is a strange question: will we all mix into a single standard?
    We started like that in the beginning of the human species, and later we got more variety to better survive into different environments.

    It is true that a good amount of population is today fully urbanized in almost a single metropolitan environment - so there there is not much need for variety, and maybe it will mix to the full extension.
    I still don't believe that that will be the future scenario: lactose intolerance is still around even millennia after the genes appeared. There is no reason to presuppose that such changes (as the tolerance to lactose) will never happen again.

    My personal bet is that the next source for a major change (as lactose tolerance was), will be the large use of antibiotics we have today.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bergin View Post
    It is a strange question: will we all mix into a single standard?
    We started like that in the beginning of the human species, and later we got more variety to better survive into different environments.

    It is true that a good amount of population is today fully urbanized in almost a single metropolitan environment - so there there is not much need for variety, and maybe it will mix to the full extension.
    I still don't believe that that will be the future scenario: lactose intolerance is still around even millennia after the genes appeared. There is no reason to presuppose that such changes (as the tolerance to lactose) will never happen again.

    My personal bet is that the next source for a major change (as lactose tolerance was), will be the large use of antibiotics we have today.
    I don't think there is a need for a single mixed "race". Unless, one can argue that when people are one race, the racism will stop, and it is a good thing for humankind.
    Following the trend of interracial marriages being more popular, people traveling, migrating and mixing more and more, one can come to the conclusion that, given enough time, all people will eventually be of mixed race. Just from statistical point of view predicting the future.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LeBrok View Post
    I don't think there is a need for a single mixed "race". Unless, one can argue that when people are one race, the racism will stop, and it is a good thing for humankind.
    Following the trend of interracial marriages being more popular, people traveling, migrating and mixing more and more, one can come to the conclusion that, given enough time, all people will eventually be of mixed race. Just from statistical point of view predicting the future.
    Hi LeBrok,

    In a 100% urban scenario, I agree with you completely. In big cities, from Europe and America, is already happening and it will increase. I think Asia and Africa are not following the same tendency. So I see it as a local effect and is logical to suppose that it will spread. But nature does like variety, so I don't know how natural it is.
    Still,

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bergin View Post
    Hi LeBrok,

    In a 100% urban scenario, I agree with you completely. In big cities, from Europe and America, is already happening and it will increase. I think Asia and Africa are not following the same tendency. So I see it as a local effect and is logical to suppose that it will spread.
    Yes, I think it will happen locally first.

    But nature does like variety, so I don't know how natural it is.
    Still,
    Right. However in the future, who will need natural selection when we have genetic manipulation, or even "designer" babies?

    We have few more questions to answer about humankind future, here:
    http://www.eupedia.com/forum/forums/243-Futurism

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    Quote Originally Posted by LeBrok View Post
    Yes, I think it will happen locally first.

    Right. However in the future, who will need natural selection when we have genetic manipulation, or even "designer" babies?

    We have few more questions to answer about humankind future, here:
    http://www.eupedia.com/forum/forums/243-Futurism
    In other words Brave New World.

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    1 members found this post helpful.
    if there won't be any natural selection and natural borders in the future then it is only logical that humans will merge into one race. mixing is currently happening way too fast and there is no way that a new ethnicity could form.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ailchu View Post
    if there won't be any natural selection and natural borders in the future then it is only logical that humans will merge into one race. mixing is currently happening way too fast and there is no way that a new ethnicity could form.
    There still is natural selection, like kids loving people will always have more kids - others won't have any, but this is equal for all the races, so moot point.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ailchu View Post
    if there won't be any natural selection and natural borders in the future then it is only logical that humans will merge into one race
    Even with no borders there will never be a "single one race."

    Even if a global state, something like the UN with absolute sovereignty, intentionally wanted to create "one single race" through eugenic programs they wouldn't be able to.

    Think about dog breeds. You cannot create one single Dog Breed by intermixing them all. The order you breed all the breeds, the sex of the respective breeds, produce
    different results.

    It's a categorically flawed idea based on a very Aristotelian idea of general and particular that does not correlate to how an individual reproduces.

    If ever there is one standardized mulatto race produced, it would then have to be sustained by military force otherwise asymmetrical
    developments in clusters would begin straight away.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Johane Derite View Post
    If ever there is one standardized mulatto race produced, it would then have to be sustained by military force otherwise asymmetrical
    developments in clusters would begin straight away.
    What?!!! If one is right the other must be wrong. Believe it or not, Albanians are a construct of at least 3 different races of the past, mesolithic and neolithic. I dare you to find one unmixed Albanian. Can't find? This is how it is going to be with the whole world in distant future.

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    2 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by LeBrok View Post
    What?!!! If one is right the other must be wrong. Believe it or not, Albanians are a construct of at least 3 different races of the past, mesolithic and neolithic. I dare you to find one unmixed Albanian. Can't find? This is how it is going to be with the whole world in distant future.
    Firstly i don't think Albanians are "unmixed."
    I don't even understand what this means empirically/biologically and I don't understand where you got the impression that I was saying that.


    Also Mesolithic/neolithic and the other 3rd race you didn't mention weren't pure unmixed races anyway.

    What I was saying was that its an empirically and biologically incoherent idea that you can just mix individuals from all of the worlds ethnicities to create a single race.
    The concept is flawed. There are thousands of factors.

    By this: "If ever there is one standardized mulatto race produced,"

    I meant that even in the impossible scenario that some government literally populates the world with 1 male and 1 female clone a billion times over (so that everyone is the
    same genetically, same race), it will nonetheless require military repression and banning of voluntary reproduction otherwise clusters would develop assymnetrically in different
    regions thus one "race" or "ethnicity" not being possible. The point of this comment was to say that even if it was possible it would need eternal maintanence otherwise assymetrical
    mutation events in different individuals would undermine the "one race" over time anyway.

    Just now we have a thread about how "fathers pass on 4 times as much genetic mutation as mothers."
    This means that if you wanted to create a "new race or ethnicity" lets say randomly Albanians + Japanese. If you had two sample populations to experiment with of 10,000
    participants each (5,000 Alb men and women and 5,000 Jap men and women) you would produce in my opinion 2 very different ethnicities in the
    Alb Men Jap Women group compared to the Jap Men Alb Women group.

    My point is genes are chaotic and dynamic and there will never reach a point of stasis where suddenly we are one race.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Johane Derite View Post
    Firstly i don't think Albanians are "unmixed."
    I don't even understand what this means empirically/biologically and I don't understand where you got the impression that I was saying that.


    Also Mesolithic/neolithic and the other 3rd race you didn't mention weren't pure unmixed races anyway.

    What I was saying was that its an empirically and biologically incoherent idea that you can just mix individuals from all of the worlds ethnicities to create a single race.
    The concept is flawed. There are thousands of factors.

    By this: "If ever there is one standardized mulatto race produced,"

    I meant that even in the impossible scenario that some government literally populates the world with 1 male and 1 female clone a billion times over (so that everyone is the
    same genetically, same race), it will nonetheless require military repression and banning of voluntary reproduction otherwise clusters would develop assymnetrically in different
    regions thus one "race" or "ethnicity" not being possible. The point of this comment was to say that even if it was possible it would need eternal maintanence otherwise assymetrical
    mutation events in different individuals would undermine the "one race" over time anyway.

    Just now we have a thread about how "fathers pass on 4 times as much genetic mutation as mothers."
    This means that if you wanted to create a "new race or ethnicity" lets say randomly Albanians + Japanese. If you had two sample populations to experiment with of 10,000
    participants each (5,000 Alb men and women and 5,000 Jap men and women) you would produce in my opinion 2 very different ethnicities in the
    Alb Men Jap Women group compared to the Jap Men Alb Women group.

    My point is genes are chaotic and dynamic and there will never reach a point of stasis where suddenly we are one race.
    Unless there is some catastrophic event which causes everyone to migrate to a single location .

    I'm not trying to sound like an ass but if millions of European women migrated to Africa, natural selection would be in their favour , there are only 2 barriers between ethnic groups that keeps them from mixing and that is the language & cultural barrier.

    During the 19 century Latin America made plans to reduce (ethnically cleanse) the African/negro population through​ inter-mixing, the politicians of Latin America advised the United States to do the same but instead the US freed their slaves.

    From what I can remember the Latin American politicians saw their plans as being successful saying that the US will regret their actions or something like that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Johane Derite View Post
    Firstly i don't think Albanians are "unmixed."
    I don't even understand what this means empirically/biologically and I don't understand where you got the impression that I was saying that.


    Also Mesolithic/neolithic and the other 3rd race you didn't mention weren't pure unmixed races anyway.

    There you go. You can't recognize separate races Albanians are made of, and just after few thousand years. They are well mixed in then. This is what will happen to the whole world given few thousand years.

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    Forget races ​(sub-species) we're already a mixed-species. A composite of hominids. Homo sapiens mixed with Neanderthal, and/or denosivan, and/or Homo Erectus, and probably few others depending on where the person is from.

    But I think that even if the scenario happened where all sub-species of humanity mixed, evolution would once again separate them into something new. It will happen once we start to colonize other planets; adapting to new environments. One thing that would make us radically different would be adapting to different gravity, lengths of days/nights/seasons/years. What would these new environments do to the food we raise and consume? In the past that has shaped our physiology. How would plants and animals also raised in these alien planets affect our bodies? What kind of new pathogens would emerge, and how would our bodies adapt to that? I think it is fascinating to contemplate these different situations.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LeBrok View Post
    There you go. You can't recognize separate races Albanians are made of, and just after few thousand years. They are well mixed in then. This is what will happen to the whole world given few thousand years.

    Except I recognise many different phenotypical tendencies or clusters in the albanian population. They are not one homogenous phenotype.
    No terminology or serious research has been done in this regard but there are within the albanian population severy different "races"
    that it is very easy to recognize. ( dinaric,med etc etc)

    I never said albanians are one homogenous race. They are united by a shared history and language yet its very apparent that there exist all sorts of tendencies there.
    The height difference between north and south alone is super apparent.





    Why would it happen in a few thousand years? You think once (if we survive) we colonize other planets this wont lead to even more isolated ethnicities being created? Why has the internet produced a thousand new genres of music and niche interests rather than one blended mono genre. The blended mono genre is artificially produced through big labels and to survive it
    has to update itself by parasitising the authenticity of the niches that form autonomously. So it will be with the multiplicity of difference when it comes to genes. Its way to chaotic to stabilize.
    New ethnicities will be created, old ones will possibly even be conserved or even resurrected with genetically engineered embryos etc

    I have read no actual argument as to how it would happen on a planetary scale. Without intentional engineering i am 100% skeptic

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    Quote Originally Posted by Johane Derite View Post
    Except I recognise many different phenotypical tendencies or clusters in the albanian population. They are not one homogenous phenotype.
    No terminology or serious research has been done in this regard but there are within the albanian population severy different "races"
    that it is very easy to recognize. ( dinaric,med etc etc)
    phenotypes can persist after mixing, no problem with that. Notice that there is mixture of variety of phenotypes through Albania, but you don't have three distinct groups you can recognize, EEF, WHG and EHG.

    I never said albanians are one homogenous race. They are united by a shared history and language yet its very apparent that there exist all sorts of tendencies there.
    The height difference between north and south alone is super apparent.
    Yes, I can see genetic differences between Gheg and Tosk. It might have happen when part of Albanians got mixed with some newcomers, or other group close by got Albanised. Regardless, both are mixed of 3 ancestral main groups (plus extras) just in a bit different proportions. Same race anyway. Some differences could have also arisen in bottlenecking and separation in mountains.

    Point is that world is now better connected, people travel around the world, mingle extensively, and it is just the beginning of connected global village. There is no secluded place on earth anymore for people to evolve into a different yet race. Well, unless we keep Amazon Tribes in strikt reserves forever, and some religious sects choose to do so too.




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