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Thread: Map of J2b and it's two major clades

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    Quote Originally Posted by DejaVu View Post
    Thx to United Kingdom (your country), USA and many other for messing it up in the Balkans. Creating artificial states that never existed before. Divide and Conquer as the Roman Empire.
    I live in the UK but I am not from the UK. I am from the Balkans, just like you. I care about the region as much as you do.

    And states are artificial creations anyway. No nation has existed since the beginning of time. But in any case, which nations in the Balkans are artificial and which are non-artificial?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Boss View Post
    This reminds me how the Balkans is the most messed up region in Europe...
    They go nuts when they are reminded of Albanian Christians. It ruins their day for some reason.

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    [QUOTE=adamo;406201]I understand, I'm referring to the modern Turkish people from Asia Minor (Anatolia) so my initial comments withstand I suppose, J2a is more common in Italians, Cretans, ANATOLIANS, Iranians, Lebanese etc... Overall J2b (M-12 in particular) are more frequent in the southern Balkans and may originate there ( the J2B subclade) Greece+AlbaniaAlbania[/QUOare there some reliable figures or survey about j2b1 m205?

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    are there some reliable figures or survey about j2b1 m205?

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    Quote Originally Posted by lugdunum View Post
    are there some reliable figures or survey about j2b1 m205?
    j2b1.jpg

    J2b1 map from semargl.me. http://www.semargl.me/en/dna/ydna/hg-maps/

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    thanks for the maps. It seems it uses ftdna data.
    so it is very different from the map of gentis.ru map for which we don't know if it is based on a survey.
    Watching ftdna data we show that j2b1 m205 is essentially situated in south of europe plus west france, UK and Turkey. Its origin may be situated in the south balkans and part of greece like past surveys seem to suggest. How it spread in europe ? neolitic farmers, greek merchants, greek colonies, phoenicians, roman armies, slaves, babarian people. The were so many spreading vectors and all ancient tribes were a "melting pot".
    We can build up therories but we have to use data we can rely on
    are there surveys with archeological evidences of j2b1 m205?

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    j2b1m205

    go to the website biomedcentral

    Phylogenetic relationships and Y-chromosome haplogroup absolute and relative frequencies in the following various populations: Anatolian Greeks, mainland Greeks, four regions in Turkey and Provence near known Neolithic settlements.King et al. BMC Evolutionary Biology 2011 11:69 doi:10.1186/1471-2148-11-69


    according to this survey j2b1 m205 was present in Sesklo ( thessalia Greece) and Phokaia (anvient greek city on the western coast of anatolia)

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    Quote Originally Posted by DejaVu View Post
    Shqiptars or Modern Albanians have nothing to do with Georgia Kastriot or the flag he used. Georgia Kastriot is from the mijak tribe = Macedonian. He did not fight for Albania only for christianity. Language he spoke is the same as todays ethnic macedonians (he did not speak albanian or shqip at all). Modern Albanians are using the wrong flag that have nothing in common with them. Just a borrowed or stolen flag, because they got no history in balkans. Shqiptars (Modern Albanians) are partially from ottoman admixture with local inhabitants (many turks are albanians today in the balkans).
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mijaks
    I find this funny! Scanderbeg did not speak Albanian? But how on earth he comunicated with them. His army was made only by Albanians. Not a single Macedonian. You mean we have taken someones flag? Reason that Scanderbeg waved that flag and weared that helmet was because he beleived Pirro of Epirus South was his forefather. Thre is not such a thing as ethnic Macedonian. There is ethnic Bullgarians or Titos macedonians.

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    Quote Originally Posted by albanopolis View Post
    I find this funny! Scanderbeg did not speak Albanian? But how on earth he comunicated with them. His army was made only by Albanians. Not a single Macedonian. You mean we have taken someones flag? Reason that Scanderbeg waved that flag and weared that helmet was because he beleived Pirro of Epirus South was his forefather. Thre is not such a thing as ethnic Macedonian. There is ethnic Bullgarians or Titos macedonians.
    I think except Kastrioti, you must also search the family tree of Aryanit, he was a slav from Fyrom.
    ΟΘΕΝ ΑΙΔΩΣ OY EINAI
    ΑΤΗ ΛΑΜΒΑΝΕΙΝ ΑΥΤΟΙΣ
    ΥΒΡΙΣ ΓΕΝΝΑΤΑΙ
    ΝΕΜΕΣΙΣ ΚΑΙ ΤΙΣΗ ΑΚΟΛΟΥΘΟΥΣΙ ΔΕ

    When there is no shame
    Divine blindness conquers them
    Hybris (abuse, opprombium) is born
    Nemesis and punishment follows.

    Εχε υπομονη Ηρωα
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    Quote Originally Posted by albanopolis View Post
    I find this funny! Scanderbeg did not speak Albanian? But how on earth he comunicated with them. His army was made only by Albanians. Not a single Macedonian. You mean we have taken someones flag? Reason that Scanderbeg waved that flag and weared that helmet was because he beleived Pirro of Epirus South was his forefather. Thre is not such a thing as ethnic Macedonian. There is ethnic Bullgarians or Titos macedonians.
    are you saying that the epirotes and albanians are the same people?
    Father's Mtdna H95a1
    Grandfather Mtdna T2b24
    Great Grandfather Mtdna T1a1e
    GMother paternal side YDna R1b-S8172
    Mother's YDna R1a-Z282

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    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by zanipolo View Post
    are you saying that the epirotes and albanians are the same people?
    Epirotes and Albanians are not the same people but Epirotes are an integral part of the Albanian nation today, let us not forget the process and the evolution of nations. Gjergj Kastrioti has brought together Arben and Epir. They spoke similar language with their distinctive differences, and in the long run the Arben (Gheg) have influenced the Epir dialect/language (Tosk) but after standardization is the other way round. So it was give and take on both sides only because they felt akin to one another. The first written documents of old Albanian were Gheg. The Kastriotis were in the middle of these two distinct divisions (middle pre-Albania) and that is why Scanderbeg could bring together the then two distinct groups into what was to become known as modern Albanians. You can see this even today when you travel from Montenegro (where Albanians are)through Kosovo, Macedonia (where Albanians are) and all the way to the south Albania, you can feel the history and realize how did this happen. Those Epirotes simply did not feel akin to Greeks and Arben (Arbër) did not feel akin to Slavs. Tosk and Gheg may have a lot of differences but their language was common (they coudl understand each other without translation) even before Scanderbeg, that is why they stick together and feel as part of the whole Albanian nation.

    Honestly I cannot believe the claims similar to DeJavu since they are childish and just a wishful thinking.

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    Weren't the Toshk Albanians an armeniid race of J2 men similar to Tuscans/Etruscans? Where they in link to the 20% of Albanians that are J2 or is that false?

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    Quote Originally Posted by adamo View Post
    Weren't the Toshk Albanians an armeniid race of J2 men similar to Tuscans/Etruscans? Where they in link to the 20% of Albanians that are J2 or is that false?
    Tosk are the Albanians in the southern half of the country; gheg are the ones in the northern half. So tosk-tuscan is just a name-match coincidence maybe.
    J2 is spread evenly in Albania and Kosovo.

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    I know,Geghs north, toshks are south. But I'm saying a link like dyrrachium, a Trojan colony on coastal Albania. Maybe there's a link between toshks and Tuscans, as the 2 most similar languages to ancient Etruscan are Armenian and Albanian.

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    Quote Originally Posted by adamo View Post
    I know,Geghs north, toshks are south. But I'm saying a link like dyrrachium, a Trojan colony on coastal Albania. Maybe there's a link between toshks and Tuscans, as the 2 most similar languages to ancient Etruscan are Armenian and Albanian.
    Quite interesting theory since I attached my family coat of arms before which is displaying an Albanian flag, and my only matches (2) are from Armenia.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BakodiP View Post
    Quite interesting theory since I attached my family coat of arms before which is displaying an Albanian flag, and my only matches (2) are from Armenia.
    your COA is not the albanian symbol its the byzantine eagle , also used by the HRE when sigsmund was emperor. Sigsmund of Hungary

    same as this guy's COA
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercurio_Bua

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    Quote Originally Posted by zanipolo View Post
    your COA is not the albanian symbol its the byzantine eagle , also used by the HRE when sigsmund was emperor. Sigsmund of Hungary

    same as this guy's COA
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercurio_Bua
    Even this guy is Albanian:
    Born in Nafplion in the Peloponnese Bua was a member of Albanian or Arvanitian Bua and Arianiti families.
    So 2-headed black eagle on red is Albanian (2-headed eagle as a concept is borrowed from Byzantium).

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    Quote Originally Posted by zanipolo View Post
    are you saying that the epirotes and albanians are the same people?
    I am not saying it. I know that for a fact. I am from there, and albanian. South albania in roman times was called Epiros. Get over it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Boss View Post
    This reminds me how the Balkans is the most messed up region in Europe...
    I don't think he is serious. He just trying to complicate the debate. There are doezens of books written by foreign writters about Scanderbeg and Albanian flag. No one has cast doubt in their authencity.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kamani View Post
    Even this guy is Albanian:
    Born in Nafplion in the Peloponnese Bua was a member of Albanian or Arvanitian Bua and Arianiti families.
    So 2-headed black eagle on red is Albanian (2-headed eagle as a concept is borrowed from Byzantium).
    Bua family Arvanites?

    yes and mercedes is a turtle.

    search better,

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    Quote Originally Posted by albanopolis View Post
    I don't think he is serious. He just trying to complicate the debate. There are doezens of books written by foreign writters about Scanderbeg and Albanian flag. No one has cast doubt in their authencity.
    only the ones who spoke about Kastrioti say a lot of different things, than the one you claim,

    there are many posts, written here,
    and many authors names, are given, that lived in the same time,

    the ones who read, they know,

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    Quote Originally Posted by albanopolis View Post
    I am not saying it. I know that for a fact. I am from there, and albanian. South albania in roman times was called Epiros. Get over it.
    Epirus and Epirus Nova, habited by who, and colonised by who?

    and what about Illyricum,

    since you are from there you know that south Albania in roman times was Makedonia and Epirus,


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    Colonised by nobody. Inhabited by Albanians. Greek colonies were expelled as soon as they formed. Only in Macedonia Greeks managed to have a foothold and finaly helenising it. It did minimal damage to Albanian Epiros. It left 4% of Greek vocabulary. But that was it. Slavs, some of them in Eupedia forums think they are Germanics and not Russian (strange ,no?), use the fact that Albanian language has borrowed very few Greek words, as a proof that Albanians have not been in Ballkans at all.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post
    only the ones who spoke about Kastrioti say a lot of different things, than the one you claim,

    there are many posts, written here,
    and many authors names, are given, that lived in the same time,

    the ones who read, they know,
    Know what? Scanderbeg was Slav Macedonian? Ha,ha, ha.. What kind of joke is this?

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    Quote Originally Posted by albanopolis View Post
    I am not saying it. I know that for a fact. I am from there, and albanian. South albania in roman times was called Epiros. Get over it.
    get over it? ...listen retard, I asked you to confirm your thoughts, that's all, don't go insulting me, propio un mona!.

    IF the Romans found any albanians, they would have noted this in there books, but they did not, they only noted for the area, epirotes, macedonians and dardanians . They searched under every rock in the balkans looking for minerals to mine they found and noted all the tribes and peoples.

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