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Thread: The Armenians, fathers of the Etruscans.

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    The Armenians, fathers of the Etruscans.

    Many scholars see in Urartean art ( art from ancient Urartu) a striking similarity to Etruscan art and culture. It has also been suggested that Etruscan may have been an early Armenian dialect, or even, a proto-Armenian tongue, the archaic father of Armenian. It is interesting how similar Etruscan linguistic is similar to certain Armenian and even oddly enough, Albanian words. The " Armenian" race is said to have once spread from Armenia to Italy, where they where known as Phrygians, pelasgians ( and thus possibly sea people's by extension), Etruscans and thracians. There is an evident similarity between Etruscan statues and Assyrian ones, and Etruscan gods, if linked to the Lydian ones, which is easy to Do, start showing a surprising culture that worked its way anciently from the Euphrates and Tigris rivers to the Arno and Tiber of central Italy. Not to mention burial sites found in southern Etruria that are similar to ancient ones found in Armenia in particular.

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    I need to research more the Armenian connection, but speaking about Etruscan-Albanian(Pelasgian) connection, there is deffinitely something there. Autosomally, a lot of Albanians score close to Tuscany and they have 10-20% Caucasus component. Linguistically there have been a couple of books matching words from Etruscan to Albanian. And then there is the Lemnos Steele with Etruscan writing in Lemnos, speaking for an Etruscan-Pelasgian connection.

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    Urartu were not Indo-European, but Hurrian people. Modern Armenians speak an Indo-European language.

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    Also Y-DNA haplogroup J2 is not Armenian, but a West-Asian / (Paleo-)Caucasian marker. Hg. J2 created the greatest civilizations on earth, Caucasian Civilizations (Shulaveri-Shomu, Kura–Araxes, Trialeti, Maykop), Mesopotamian (Hassuna and Halaf) , Iranic (Aryan), Hellenic, Roman etc. Together with hg. R1b it's the most talented, gifted and inventive haplogroup. R1b is actually more adventurous of the two, while J2 is more creative one.

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    I never said it was "Armenian" it's northern Mesopotamian, Fertile Crescent gene. And thanks for the rest; we all know that. Hurrians may very well have been an ancestral non-indo European speaking ancestor of Hittites and the eventual Armenians by the way, as languages change over thousands of years due to many influences and are not necesserily indicative of genes. And the J2 created all those civilizations yes, but it only influenced in part the Hellenic ad roman civilizations, as overall these places had a nice assortment of other haplogroups as well ( R1b for Romans, E3b, I2a and others for the Greeks), different European and north-African influences. I'm trying to make a link between Armenians and the ancient Etruscans, not J2 as originating in Armenia. Everyone knows J2 originated near southeastern turkey/ north Syria/ northwestern Iraq. But being in the middle eastern sphere, Armenia is a J2 place as well, as many north-middle eastern countries are too.

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    I believe that J2 is not really from northern Mesopotamia, but a little bit up to north from the mountains. And as far as I know Etruscans were the founding fathers of the Romans (read not modern Italians)

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    Actually, what I'm trying to say is that the ancient Romans were MUCH more Near Eastern/West Asian than modern population of a country called Italy.

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    The original Romans "latins" where men of R1b U-152, the fathers of Romans where not Etruscans, that where a later Semitic-style middle eastern foreign element to Italy. They impeded on a R1b culture that had already been long set up in Italy. They where very European, as where their west European neighbours until they received migration and assimilated middle eastern people's into their ranks.

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    No, Semitic-style middle eastern lived in Italy before R1b and J2a arrived! Also, Romulus and Remus, central characters of Rome's foundation myth were Etruscans.

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    Hg. E , J1 and maybe T are Semitic-style Middle Eastern/Southwest Asian haplogroups. J2 is not Semitic.

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    Turks and Azeris and Lebanese are Semitic they all have J2 and J1 also, but Semites such as Jews are predominantly j2, there's also an intrusive invading E element in Semites that is correct, it was absorbed by them. There was a proto-European substratum across Italy long before the north-mesopotamians of the Neolithic and Greeks of j2 arrived.

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    Myths are just that; myths. The first Italians where a European composition , then came Neolithic J2.

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    Quote Originally Posted by adamo View Post
    Turks and Azeris and Lebanese are Semitic they all have J2 and J1 also, but Semites such as Jews are predominantly j2, there's also an intrusive invading E element in Semites that is correct, it was absorbed by them. There was a proto-European substratum across Italy long before the north-mesopotamians of the Neolithic and Greeks of j2 arrived.
    Turks and Azeris ae nor Semitic,

    there is no Semitic J2
    only J1 is consider Semitic, but still J1 is consider 'made in' Caucasus, that went far south and become Semitic
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    Well there's J1 in turks and Azeris either way so their Semitic anyways, fine J2 is Mesopotamian whatever

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    Original Turks areTurco-Mongoloid from the beautiful Altai mountains, Central Asia. Nothing to do with the Semites.

    Arabs are Semitic and the Arabian homeland is the Arabian Peninsula. If you look at that area There is very very little J2. People in the Levant are Semitic and the major haplogroups they carry are E and J1.

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    Well I'm referring to ANATOLIANS you know? Modern-day Turks? They have Mesopotamian J2. Not to mention your little "Levantine Lebanese" with their 30-35% J2 AND Jews have j2 also.

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    Quote Originally Posted by adamo View Post
    Myths are just that; myths. The first Italians where a European composition , then came Neolithic J2.
    I was talking about the birth, foundation of the Romans. And it starts with the Etruscans. Etruscans were 'Anatolian' and not Armenian. I believe that Etruscans were closer to the ancient Greeks than to Urartu. The epos of the Roman Empire starts with the Etruscans.

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    Not to mention 15-30% of Syrians ( although j1 is bigger there), but J2 is characteristically Mesopotamian.

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    The original Romans where latins, that would later spread their tongue across France, Iberia and Romania. They where R1b men, not J2. They where in Italy long before the Neolithic arrival of j2 people to Italy. The foundation of the latins/Romans starts with the Etruscans. No, it starts with the Romans who where a separate people from the invading Etruscans, as we all know, regardless of myth.

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    Quote Originally Posted by adamo View Post
    Well I'm referring to ANATOLIANS you know? Modern-day Turks? They have Mesopotamian J2. Not to mention your little "Levantine Lebanese" with their 30-35% J2 AND Jews have j2 also.
    What the hell are you talking about. Jews have also R1a, R1b, G. Are ALL this haplogroups also Semitic? The fact is that the dominant markers of the Semites are hg. J1 (Arabs in Arabian peninsula) and hg. E (Semites in the Levant).

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    I didn't say they where predominantly J2, I said those nations have some, and J2 is actually the biggest hg of Turks and Lebanese.

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    Quote Originally Posted by adamo View Post
    The original Romans where latins, that would later spread their tongue across France, Iberia and Romania. They where R1b men, not J2. They where in Italy long before the Neolithic arrival of j2 people to Italy.
    No, original Indo-European modern-day 'Italians' wereLatin. And YES, Latin IS related to R1b. But I’m talking about the Romans andnot Italians. After J2 Etruscans founded theRoman civilization and by expanding they mixed with Latin (Indo-European) R1bfolks and some other native Europeans. Original Romans were more ‘Near Eastern’than modern-day Italians.

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    The Etruscans allied themselves with the Carthaginians as their interests collided with those of the Greeks.

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    No. The original expanding Romans where the R1b men themselves; they often collided with italiotes from other provinces that where more middle eastern in origin such as the three fractions of the iapygians civilization for example,they subdued and then allied themselves to the Etruscans, but where no Etruscans themselves.

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    Quote Originally Posted by adamo View Post
    I didn't say they where predominantly J2, I said those nations have some, and J2 is actually the biggest hg of Turks and Lebanese.
    Yes, but races in the Caucasus have MUCH more J2. J2 is NOT from the Levant and original Semites are not from the Caucasus, man. Original J2 IS Paleo-Caucasian, while original Arabs/Semites are from Arabian Peninsula. The second biggenst hg. in Turks is R1b. IS R1b Turkish (Turco-Mongoloid) then??

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