Distribution of G2a in Italy (Boattini et al.)

[bigsnake49]

You amaze me. Where the heck do you find Georgian women in New York, or anywhere in the U.S.???

He can find them in Athens. Lots of Georgian people emigrated to Greece under false papers pretending to be Pontic Greeks.

I know at least one Georgian woman in New York, our seat mate on the plane to Athens.

[Angela]

He can find them in Athens. Lots of Georgian people emigrated to Greece under false papers pretending to be Pontic Greeks.

I know at least one Georgian woman in New York, our seat mate on the plane to Athens.

Well, I know one too: she was my first nanny, via Russia, who came here with her Russian husband. Neither the marriage nor later the job worked out.That doesn't mean there are hundreds running around for him to form an opinion,.

Plus, all I know of him is that he's from New York with a French name.

Maybe if people put ethnicity as well as location, we'd have a better idea of the person and his or her experiences.

[dominique_nuit]

Don't worry, I will eventually post on the Italian diaspora thread. But in NYC, there are literally people from everywhere. So yes, I have in fact dated a few Georgian women. And they are magnetic. But I remain a bachelor who will probably die a lonely old man

[G2ian]

There's more than a hundred thousand of us around northeast US. One of the biggest Georgian diasporas is around New York. heck go to Brooklyn or Queens and you'll see ton of Georgian bakeries and restaurants.

[Angela]

There's more than a hundred thousand of us around northeast US. One of the biggest Georgian diasporas is around New York. heck go to Brooklyn or Queens and you'll see ton of Georgian bakeries and restaurants.

Good to know.

https://www.google.com/search?q=Geor...E,lf:1,lf_ui:9

I'm definitely going to check them out.

[Tutkun Arnaut]

Good to know.

https://www.google.com/search?q=Geor...E,lf:1,lf_ui:9

I'm definitely going to check them out.

there are few Georgians in NY city. most of them stick with Russians. I don't think there are many of them since they are not mentioned any where. I personally have known two young brothers. One was dark Gypsy like., the other one was light Nordic like. I never seen to brothers with a such racial contrast. I even asked them about that and they had the view that Georgians were once a blond nation but the long presence of Turkey in their country changed that. That's the popular view all over the Balkans that Turkey is to blame for their darkening but obviously DNA tells us that is not the case

[G2ian]

there are few Georgians in NY city. most of them stick with Russians. I don't think there are many of them since they are not mentioned any where. I personally have known two young brothers. One was dark Gypsy like., the other one was light Nordic like. I never seen to brothers with a such racial contrast. I even asked them about that and they had the view that Georgians were once a blond nation but the long presence of Turkey in their country changed that. That's the popular view all over the Balkans that Turkey is to blame for their darkening but obviously DNA tells us that is not the case

We tend to keep to ourselves, if you met me on the street you'd never know I wasn't a New Yorker, but every day when I walk around Manhattan I hear someone pass by speaking Georgian so we're not that few just not easy to recognize.


It's exactly the same with me and my siblings. Actually very common in Georgia. Lots of people in the western parts trend towards Blonde, Blue/Green/Grey eyes and very light skin, especially those from the mountains.

It's also one reason why Georgians have very hard time grasping the racial distaste based on skin color between Mediterraneans and northerners, light/dark types, because here you get vast spectrum of skin and eye colors just within the families let alone in the country.

I don't know about historically white/dark. The theory probably comes from the fact that most of the light skinned people come from Caucasus mountains who are thought to be the oldest inhabitants of Georgia and closer you get to south the darker the skin gets. I don't know what deductions we can make based on that but that's what people believe. Also I don't believe Turks had anything to do with it. If anything there's more genetic drift from Caucasus into Anatolia rather than vice versa.


EDIT: Actually now that I thought about it. Mountain Caucasians weren't allowed to marry someone from their or related villages so they used to go kidnap wives from all over the northern steppe... If we were originally dark skinned we might've stolen some light skinned women and gotten lighter, ... sorry about that

mtdna map of Caucasus would be interesting actually.

[Angela]

there are few Georgians in NY city. most of them stick with Russians. I don't think there are many of them since they are not mentioned any where. I personally have known two young brothers. One was dark Gypsy like., the other one was light Nordic like. I never seen to brothers with a such racial contrast. I even asked them about that and they had the view that Georgians were once a blond nation but the long presence of Turkey in their country changed that. That's the popular view all over the Balkans that Turkey is to blame for their darkening but obviously DNA tells us that is not the case

Well, let's assume there are 50,000 (100,000 in the greater Northeast) of them in the greater New York Metropolitan area. In a population of over 20 MILLION they're not going to make much of a splash.

[Emal]

Hi, I'm from Sardinian family Y-dna my haplogroupY is G2a cts7045

[Emal]

the Etruscans have no historical origin from Anatolia, enough with this error based on Herodotus

[dominique_nuit]

Hi, I'm from Sardinian family Y-dna my haplogroupY is G2a cts7045

That's pretty damn close to me. I'm PF6863, paternal grandparents from Vibo Valentia province of Calabria. Where in Sardinia is your family from?

We're both PF3345 ----> CTS342 ---> Z1903

My impression is that we expanded with Bell Beaker peoples, moving from Baden up into France and then down into Iberia, the Western Mediterranean islands, and the west coast of Italy.

Sadly we don't seem to be represented among the original Romans. We belonged either to (1) Italic tribes that weren't Latin or close kin of the Latins; or (2) we expanded through the West Mediterranean just ahead of the main body of Indo-European speakers, that is, we arrived circa 2200 BCE, the Italics arrived circa 1800 BCE and quickly absorbed us

Hopefully others here will correct me if I'm wrong.

[dominique_nuit]

Emal, so far as I can tell, all Italian Z1903 reported on YFull is from Cagliari, Sardinia, except for a few specimens from Late Imperial Rome

However, Fernandes (2019) found Z1903 in Late Bronze Age Sicily — the Trapani area — with no Steppe admixture.

A commentator at Anthrogenica said, “Also pretty exciting is that the G subclade of Bronze Age-Iron Age Sicilians seems to be Z1903 which is crazy because before the Iberian paper which has 1 sample in CHL it has only been found in Bulgaria CHL, and we have a specific branch of Z1903 which is Z3428 in these samples.

https://www.yfull.com/tree/G-Z3428/

Z1903 was also found in one Tiszapolgar and in two Baden samples from Lipson 2017:

I2354 4500-4000 BC Pusztataskony-Ledence I. Hungary Tiszapolgar_ECA G2a2b2a1a1c1a L30>P303>L140>CTS342>Z724>Z1903
I2369 3367-3103 BC Budakalász-Luppa csárda Hungary Baden_LCA G2a2b2a1a1c1a L30>P303>L140>CTS342>Z724>Z1903
I2368 3300-2850 BC iBudakalász-Luppa csárda Hungary Baden_LCA G2a2b2a1a1c1a L30>P303>L140>CTS342>Z724>Z1903

And here at Eupedia, Markod said, “The most interesting find to me are the LBA Sicilians from Trapani whom I would consider to be speakers of Indo-European. They have very little if any Caucasus admixture, and no steppe admixture. They cannot be Neolithic holdovers either since they carry Bronze Age TMRCA G2a-Z1903, one of them with a subclade specific to present day Scandinavia.

I'm pretty sure these are Balkaners. Ultimately from Chalcolithic Bulgaria, perhaps by way of Baden-Boleraz.”

However, the now banned Pip once proposed interesting theory of CTS342 and L497 expanding west in tandem with R1b-U152. So who knows, maybe his theory was true of L497, but not Z1903? Maybe Z1903 took an independent route into the West Mediterranean ahead of the proto-Italo-Celts?

[Emal]

That's pretty damn close to me. I'm PF6863, paternal grandparents from Vibo Valentia province of Calabria. Where in Sardinia is your family from?

We're both PF3345 ----> CTS342 ---> Z1903

My impression is that we expanded with Bell Beaker peoples, moving from Baden up into France and then down into Iberia, the Western Mediterranean islands, and the west coast of Italy.

Sadly we don't seem to be represented among the original Romans. We belonged either to (1) Italic tribes that weren't Latin or close kin of the Latins; or (2) we expanded through the West Mediterranean just ahead of the main body of Indo-European speakers, that is, we arrived circa 2200 BCE, the Italics arrived circa 1800 BCE and quickly absorbed us

Hopefully others here will correct me if I'm wrong.

thanks for the information ... ahahaha curious I'm Sardinian on my father's side, his family is from the province of Cagliari. Instead my mother and her family are from Calabria. However I had noticed that among the ancient Romans there were not many traces, on Mytrueancestry I mainly deep dives with Mycenaean and Minoans (I assume from my mother who comes from the province of Crotone the ancient Greek Kroton) and then Carthaginians (from my father Sardinia was Phoenician colony), and then many samples of Rome so in my opinion it's difficult to say whether they are slaves, or Roman citizens.