Where did haplogroup T first originate

[Sile]

yhrd.org site

T-L131 or now called T1a2 ..................this is a scientific site, no public allowed



The Japanese and korean are from the Ainu japanese group, who originated from the caucasus 12000 apprx years ago

[Sile]

yhrd.org site

T-L131 or now called T1a2 ..................this is a scientific site, no public allowed



The Japanese and korean are from the Ainu japanese group, who originated from the caucasus 12000 apprx years ago

this marker in Japan might actually be from portuguese and galician sailors from 1550 onwards mixing with japanese hospitality

[Alpenjager]

Blue = 0 samples
Red = At least 1 sample

There are 0 T-L131 samples in yhrd sadly.

[Sile]

Blue = 0 samples
Red = At least 1 sample

There are 0 T-L131 samples in yhrd sadly.

yes , you are correct...when I search for just T i get ( see below in Red )

[Fatherland]

yhrd.org site

T-L131 or now called T1a2 ..................this is a scientific site, no public allowed



The Japanese and korean are from the Ainu japanese group, who originated from the caucasus 12000 apprx years ago

The Ainu from Caucasus?? That's clearly a joke.

[Fustan]

In Africa.

[Bergin]

Is there any ancient DNA finding regarding the T haplogroup?

[Sile]

Is there any ancient DNA finding regarding the T haplogroup?

4 thaat I can recall aged between 5000 to 6000BC

2 in karlsdorf germany and 2 in Bulgaria on the danube river

[Fatherland]

In Somalia or even deeper in Central Africa.

[Salento]

The Arabs Slave Traders introduce T to Somalia and the Horn of Africa.

[Alpenjager]

This is not correct Salento. Haplogroup T migration into Horn of Africa is most Ancient than Arab arrival. Haplogroup T is found among Dirs and Dirs are the most indisputable descendants of Saamale, the father of all truth Somalis. So T1a1a-L208 in Horn of Africa could belong to Neolithic or Bronze Age lineage There are some calulations about this arrival and E1b and T1a have different times of arrival and demographic explosion into the Horn

[Salento]

T1a or M70 From Genographic:
Branch: M70
Age: 19,250 – 33,750 Years Ago.
Location of Origin: West Asia.

This step in your paternal ancestors’ journey took place in the fertile climate of West Asia during the Upper Paleolithic. Early members of this lineage were hunter-gatherers who took part in Emirian culture and other advances in weapon technology. From West Asia, this lineage spread outward to North Africa, South Asia, and Europe.

Today, it is a significant part of the male lineages in West Asia. It is around 21 percent of male lineages in Jordan. It and several of its subtypes are present in Jewish Diaspora groups such as Iraqi Jews and Kurdish Jews.

In North Africa, it is 6 to 7 percent of the Egyptian male population and about 7 percent of the Ethiopian male population. In South Asia, it is 53 percent of Bauris male lineages and 7 to 11 percent of Gond male lineages. In Europe, this branch contributes to between 5 and 17 percent of Sicilian male lineages. It is about 5 percent of male lineages in mainland Italy. It varies between 3 and 24 percent of male lineages in Germany.

[Salento]

From 23andme
Attachment 9070

[Alpenjager]

This is not too much reliable, 23andMe have too outdated Y-DNA sources. You can do your own research and predictions using my T-M184 phylogenetic tree work: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/F...-M184_tree.png

[Salento]

This is not too much reliable, 23andMe have too outdated Y-DNA sources. You can do your own research and predictions using my T-M184 phylogenetic tree work: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/F...-M184_tree.png

Thanks really cool.. 23andme Updated the Y Presentation (not the data, as for your Info) 2-3 weeks ago, and it shows that some members of T once in SW Asia, Migrated to Europe, Asia, and others went back to North Africa, and around the Horn of Africa.

[Fustan]

In Somalia or even deeper in Central Africa.

This is my theory also.

[Alpenjager]

This is my theory also.

Africa is out of any possibility. Only one or two branches of the whole T1a reached the Horn and Central Africa.

The two main possibilities are 1-Around Black Sea and 2- Around Caspian Sea. Between these two possibilites "Around Black Sea" is winning by far. But WHERE in the Black Sea is the big question.

Actually, we have ancient T1a1a-L208 samples deep in Europe between 7050-7600 yBP. The most ancient sample of 7600yBP found in the Danube carried around 35% Balkan HG atDNA.
7600yBP are just ~1000 years since the Birth of the main T1a1a-L208 branch T1a1a1-CTS11451. This means that both of the son branches belonging to T1a1a-L208 have been originated not too far from the Danube.

An example, the R1b-M269 carriers with ~1300 years (+300 years) of distance between them and their Steppe R1b-Z2103 brother found in Yamnaya, thinks this is enough to claim a "Kurgan origin". So, if they are wrong then we are less wrong and if they are right then we are more right.

[Fatherland]

yDNA T is from Africa, then it spread at the same time to India and Saudi Arabia:

In Iberia is due to Morish conquest, noone from North Africa has been tested. But if they would have been tested, it would show high frequencies, especially across Morocco since I know two Moroccans and they both have T haplogroup:

[Alpenjager]

This map is my own work and I can sure you this only show MODERN FREQUENCY not origin. Frequency never could be used for origin prediction without DIVERSITY support. For origin please go to my other work: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...-M184_tree.png

[zanipolo]

alpenjager

You are confusing people who view the wiki T-M184 site by placing the years of origin directly under the map

[Alpenjager]

Zanipolo, This is standard between haplogroup tables in wikipedia, I have not edited it nor created.

[Azzurro]

Africa is out of any possibility. Only one or two branches of the whole T1a reached the Horn and Central Africa.

The two main possibilities are 1-Around Black Sea and 2- Around Caspian Sea. Between these two possibilites "Around Black Sea" is winning by far. But WHERE in the Black Sea is the big question.

Actually, we have ancient T1a1a-L208 samples deep in Europe between 7050-7600 yBP. The most ancient sample of 7600yBP found in the Danube carried around 35% Balkan HG atDNA.
7600yBP are just ~1000 years since the Birth of the main T1a1a-L208 branch T1a1a1-CTS11451. This means that both of the son branches belonging to T1a1a-L208 have been originated not too far from the Danube.

An example, the R1b-M269 carriers with ~1300 years (+300 years) of distance between them and their Steppe R1b-Z2103 brother found in Yamnaya, thinks this is enough to claim a "Kurgan origin". So, if they are wrong then we are less wrong and if they are right then we are more right.

I think your reasoning makes sense, that is a pretty big find that there was T-L208 in Neolithic Europe, I think the Black Sea option makes more sense as well out of the two possibilities and as to where somewhere in Eastern Turkey, as it seems the highest diversity of T is found in the Fertile crescent that makes sense, also L seems to be found in decent numbers in Armenians and other Caucasus related people.

[Sile]

T haplogroup ftom tepe- hissar

I2512 T T-CTS5035 T-M184

I2514 T1a T-PF7481 T-M70

[Alpenjager]

T haplogroup ftom tepe- hissar

I2512 T T-CTS5035 T-M184

I2514 T1a T-PF7481 T-M70

I2514

T-M184 (xT1a1, T1a2, T1a3b1, T1a3b2a1) (xT1a derived=ancestral)

Most probably T2, orT1b and less probably T1a3.

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I2512

T-M184 (xT1a1, T1a2b)

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I1781

T-M184 (xT1a1, T1a2a1, T1a3b2a1)

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These T seems to be unrelated to those found in ancient Europe, just like the previously found among the PPNB samples.

[Suleyman]

Why is the T so badly studied?? How does it come? For me the T is the most interesting Haplogroup that there is..It is very spread and in very low frequences..