Black Irish come from R1b Iranians?

Not surprising that Prince William looks a little German his 5th Greatgrandfather is Prince Albert of Saxe Coburg Gotha who married Queen Victoria. His 4th Great grandmother was Princess Alexandra daughter of Christian IX King of Denmark. Both Banderas and Brosnan do look similar.
 
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I question the studies that say Irish and English are closely related. For example, here is Pierce Brosnan (Irish):

View attachment 6035

Here is Antonio Banderas (Spanish):
View attachment 6036

They look very similar to me. Then here is Prince William (English):

View attachment 6037

He looks more like a Dane or maybe a German. So back to the topic. Where do the features come from?

The British upper class has far more Germanic ancestry than the lower classes.
 
The British upper class has far more Germanic ancestry than the lower classes.

The British Monarchy has many ties with the Germanic people, there is Germanic Blood even through the Princes Williams maternal line, Queen Victoria's Grandfather was King George III (of England), King George III was also the King of Hanover. George the III spoke English and was born in England, his father, King George II (of England) and his Grandfather King George I (of England) were both born in Hanover and spoke German as their first language.
 
The British Monarchy has many ties with the Germanic people, there is Germanic Blood even through the Princes Williams maternal line, Queen Victoria's Grandfather was King George III (of England), King George III was also the King of Hanover. George the III spoke English and was born in England, his father, King George II (of England) and his Grandfather King George I (of England) were both born in Hanover and spoke German as their first language.

Beyond just that, the upper classes have more Norman ancestry.
 
We can agree that some people can perceive Spaniards as being too dark, but we would also need to agree, that some can be subjective at the other side of the spectrum, and see Spaniards too blond. You claim to be an objective person, therefore show us the one post where you "defended" Spain against being labeled too blond by some subjective people.
Right, there is none. You only come to "defend" (attack others) Spain when, in your eyes, it is shown too dark. This shows how "objective" you are on this point.


Administrator are against Spaniards, and so are most members of Eupedia? This is the biggest lie you can tell to yourself.
Scientifically speaking, external observers on any issue, are more objective than people personally involved in these issues. Wouldn't you conclude that most of Eupedia members, the external observers, are more objective than you are on issue of pigmentation in Iberia? Extending this logic, we don't give a damn, whether Spain is blond or dark. The only ones that make an issue out of it are some Iberians, actively blogging about this around internet.
Think about this, if you wouldn't care whether you're dark or white, how others (who don't like Iberians) could hurt you telling you that you're "brown"? If you wouldn't care, telling you about being darker than you are, wouldn't hurt you. Therefore your supposed enemies wouldn't use this argument, would they? Making an issue out of it and defending Spaniards against "browning" you show others your phobias and insecurities. You are making a problem where it doesn't exist (to the rest of the world), and you are showing your enemies (if they are) where they can hurt you. You are telling them that you don't want to be perceived as "brown", and this is exactly what will use against you. You are your worse enemy!
Also, vigorously and aggressively defending pigmentation status of Iberia, every time someone mentions something about this issue, doesn't help your cause either. You are acting like a child when someone hurts its feelings.
Most people who I know don't care how Spaniards look, and actually they love Spanish culture, architecture, music, etc. You don't realize obviously, but you have more sympathetic people around this planet than you imagine. Please, stop making enemies where there are none.



That's the only logical conclusion.

I wonder why did you rush to erase my original reply to your post? Did it touch a nerve?
 
I question the studies that say Irish and English are closely related. For example, here is Pierce Brosnan (Irish):

View attachment 6035

Here is Antonio Banderas (Spanish):
View attachment 6036

They look very similar to me. Then here is Prince William (English):

View attachment 6037

He looks more like a Dane or maybe a German. So back to the topic. Where do the features come from?


It depends on what parts of England you consider. According to British writers on this topic, the more west you go (closer to Ireland and Wales), the less "Germanic" and the more "Iberian/Celtic" the average English population gets.
 
I wonder why did you rush to erase my original reply to your post? Did it touch a nerve?
Did you mean to hurt me with your post? Besides, I got enough of your non-sense posts, and telling us that only you can see how the world works.
Just watch out and tone down your conspiracies of the whole world against Iberians.
 
Haha most stupid treadstart ive read! INDOEUROPEANS where NOT from IRAN they orginated on the steppes north of black sea. In modern day Ukrania!

R1b is a Italic-Celtic haplogroup!
 
Did you mean to hurt me with your post? Besides, I got enough of your non-sense posts, and telling us that only you can see how the world works.
Just watch out and tone down your conspiracies of the whole world against Iberians.

Apparently it did just that, since you went ahead and erased it. If all I had posted was harmless "nonsense" (all supposedly the product of my imagination) that I couldn't back up you would not have done that.
 
Haha most stupid treadstart ive read! INDOEUROPEANS where NOT from IRAN they orginated on the steppes north of black sea. In modern day Ukrania!

R1b is a Italic-Celtic haplogroup!

So then why do Irish have so much gedrosia and not caucasus on admixture tests?
 
Irish are as west-European a population you could find, with "European" genetic input cranked to the maximum, the type belonging to R1b, very west-European.
 
Wether pierce brosnan looks like you or not the most similar clustering countries as those such as England, Wales, Scotland, France, Spain or Belgium for example.
 
Other extreme west European nations basically lol. This is where most men are R1b and most of it is M269+ With later U106+ and P312+ mutations dominating.
 
There is no need to speculate about percentages. The works of Spanish, Portuguese and Italian anthropologist have already recorded the actual percentages of hair pigmentation in these countries.

There is no such "tendency" of Spaniards to do anything like that, except a few radicals who are not happy with reality and would like for things to be different, which kind of people you can find in any country, not just Spain. The only thing that has been said regarding hair pigmentation in Spain in this thread is that modern Spaniards are not characterized by having black hair. Maciamo argues that this is because Celts brought lighter hair to both Spain and the British Isles, so the darker prehistoric inhabitants eventually got lighter features. Fair enough, I never disagreed with this. I only disagreed with his original characterization of modern-day Spaniards as "black haired", which is not backed up by pigmentation surveys. It seems you can never make a backed-up statement about modern Spanish pigmentation in these forums without some people going into strange angry fits.

false concerning your first paragraph: the "scientists" of these times in southern lands of Europe (Spanish ones more yet than Italian ones) had a very "special" conception of pigmentation categories and did not worry about the genetic signification of the catégories they created - sorry and sorry... the better categorization I saw with my proper experience is the German scientists ones (I don't care if they were 'nazies' or not: some said their works were so accurate that Hitler's band refused to publish the results, because a lot of bordering regions of the 'germanic great country' (Austria, Flanders, Elsass, Switzerland included) were too dark...
 
So then why do Irish have so much gedrosia and not caucasus on admixture tests?

1- links surely existed at first between Y-HGs and autosomals but with time drift and male biased crossings-admixtures they have had the opportunity to break off - our amateurs task is to try to ponderate these links, to see in what proportions they kept consistance
2- Irish all I-Es IN FAR ORIGIN? Maybe not?
3- I-E? steppic or eastern-anatolian at first? who knows for now? it is debated! what is sure for me is that 'caucasian' autosomal component whatever the first P-I-E speaker, seems more linked to A PART OF the Neolithical expansion (more complicated we previously believed ) than to the I-Eans expansion: indoeuropeanized or genuine indoeuropean, it seems the northernmost (steppic,) part of them was very slightly 'caucasian' and more 'european' (and very secondarly 'gedrosian'?)- I have no "religion" at this point of my life; I'm not a wizard! but I think some later movements of I-Eans in southern Europe contained more 'caucasian' than their predecessors... AND that the first arrived in Europe came from the Steppes (apparently) does not prove anymore they were THE FIRST I-Eans speakers and the Anatolians the last ones; no proof...
what seems evident is that 'gedrosian' component in NW Europe came SEPARATED FROM 'caucasian' component, whatever the way taken by these last ones (trans Caucasus, W-Anatolia???)
interesting debate where we can discover new theories if we had more ancient data
to conclude, dark hairs among Irish people (autosomals conditioned) arrived in ireland at different times from diverse regions (except Scandinavia for the most) and with different phenotypes (again autosomals) - there is not something like an unique BLACK GAEL type, it is sure.
 
1- links surely existed at first between Y-HGs and autosomals but with time drift and male biased crossings-admixtures they have had the opportunity to break off - our amateurs task is to try to ponderate these links, to see in what proportions they kept consistance
2- Irish all I-Es IN FAR ORIGIN? Maybe not?
3- I-E? steppic or eastern-anatolian at first? who knows for now? it is debated! what is sure for me is that 'caucasian' autosomal component whatever the first P-I-E speaker, seems more linked to A PART OF the Neolithical expansion (more complicated we previously believed ) than to the I-Eans expansion: indoeuropeanized or genuine indoeuropean, it seems the northernmost (steppic,) part of them was very slightly 'caucasian' and more 'european' (and very secondarly 'gedrosian'?)- I have no "religion" at this point of my life; I'm not a wizard! but I think some later movements of I-Eans in southern Europe contained more 'caucasian' than their predecessors... AND that the first arrived in Europe came from the Steppes (apparently) does not prove anymore they were THE FIRST I-Eans speakers and the Anatolians the last ones; no proof...
what seems evident is that 'gedrosian' component in NW Europe came SEPARATED FROM 'caucasian' component, whatever the way taken by these last ones (trans Caucasus, W-Anatolia???)
interesting debate where we can discover new theories if we had more ancient data
to conclude, dark hairs among Irish people (autosomals conditioned) arrived in ireland at different times from diverse regions (except Scandinavia for the most) and with different phenotypes (again autosomals) - there is not something like an unique BLACK GAEL type, it is sure.

I think they ( black irish) did come from the steppes and they might have been cimmerians/thracians . the year would have been not later then 700BC. they had black hair, light eyes and pale "irish" skin .............the markings of a black irish.
the components of cimmerians/thracians are gedrosian ( eastern persian )and north caucasus
 
The British upper class has far more Germanic ancestry than the lower classes.

the bottom picture was confirmed as having Indian genetics last month
 
I think they ( black irish) did come from the steppes and they might have been cimmerians/thracians . the year would have been not later then 700BC. they had black hair, light eyes and pale "irish" skin .............the markings of a black irish.
the components of cimmerians/thracians are gedrosian ( eastern persian )and north caucasus

very often I find worth in what you write but here I disagree, no offense: it is normal not always being of the same opinion...
you seem pretty sure of your story, I cannot guess as well as you:
my thoughts in disorder: the pale skins (today) seems more typical to N-W Europe than to East -
even in southern countries, SW show less numerous typically brunet white skins than S-E - even among Slavs I noted a % of very dark skins in comparison of latitude -
I 'm not sure at all dark haired light eyed light skinned people are typical of the 'gedrosian' component -
there is one or two black haired dark eyed relatively brunet skinned components among Irish people, even if very moderate
there is something close to an alpinish-lapponish component among Irish people, to , and other components hard to link to a precise global autosomal component (because the today poolings are for the most partially unsatisfying for me)
by the way, the lilly to pinkish white skin (freckled under sun) of a lot of Irishmen has nothing to do with the very greyish white skin of Baltic and Finnic regions - but I don't say you ever pretend that, it is just a statement of mine -
and Irish people (if I rely on Dodecad K12b, maybe not available?) has almost no 'caucasian' component, the same as Orcadians and Basques and Norwegians
the dark haired light eyed light skinned element is present too if less than in Ireland, and dicreasing gradually, among W-British people, W-Bretons, and in some part some other regions of W Europe but does not represent a dominent percentage, only in some parts of Ireland (West) - I don't know more, maybe this element has a tendancy to erythrism (red hairs or beards) - (red minority among black or verydark brown: no contradiction: red is not "light" but "reddish more than brownish" do not confuse)
&: superficially we could think in Mordvins concerning pigmentation but it is going very far! red hair and white skin among only certain tribes can be linked there to another kind of gene... but who knows??? there are living in steppes for a long time I presume...?

nos vad deoc'h a-benn ur wezh arall
 
very often I find worth in what you write but here I disagree, no offense: it is normal not always being of the same opinion...
you seem pretty sure of your story, I cannot guess as well as you:
my thoughts in disorder: the pale skins (today) seems more typical to N-W Europe than to East -
even in southern countries, SW show less numerous typically brunet white skins than S-E - even among Slavs I noted a % of very dark skins in comparison of latitude -
I 'm not sure at all dark haired light eyed light skinned people are typical of the 'gedrosian' component -
there is one or two black haired dark eyed relatively brunet skinned components among Irish people, even if very moderate
there is something close to an alpinish-lapponish component among Irish people, to , and other components hard to link to a precise global autosomal component (because the today poolings are for the most partially unsatisfying for me)
by the way, the lilly to pinkish white skin (freckled under sun) of a lot of Irishmen has nothing to do with the very greyish white skin of Baltic and Finnic regions - but I don't say you ever pretend that, it is just a statement of mine -
and Irish people (if I rely on Dodecad K12b, maybe not available?) has almost no 'caucasian' component, the same as Orcadians and Basques and Norwegians
the dark haired light eyed light skinned element is present too if less than in Ireland, and dicreasing gradually, among W-British people, W-Bretons, and in some part some other regions of W Europe but does not represent a dominent percentage, only in some parts of Ireland (West) - I don't know more, maybe this element has a tendancy to erythrism (red hairs or beards) - (red minority among black or verydark brown: no contradiction: red is not "light" but "reddish more than brownish" do not confuse)
&: superficially we could think in Mordvins concerning pigmentation but it is going very far! red hair and white skin among only certain tribes can be linked there to another kind of gene... but who knows??? there are living in steppes for a long time I presume...?

nos vad deoc'h a-benn ur wezh arall

no offense taken

my overall opinion is based on the current people I work with or am related to via marriages.
I work with a russian from Socie and a moldovan, both females ( females are overall lighter in skin tone than men, so!!). Both are black haired ( natural ) and one has grey eyes and other pale blue eyes. both tan easily but both loose natural tan colour quickly as well. Both born in their countries, both under 30 years of age, both been in Australia less than 10 years.

Via marriages....I see a dozen irish regularly during functions ( born and bred in ireland and recent( more than 20 years ago) arrivals). while only 1, I would declare "black irish" , i find the others have skin colour which is pale, but not as pale as the "black irish" and the females noted above. more of a pinkish colour.

To conclude, although I base my findings on current population, I see no reason why this would be a major error. Basically there is no way we can figure out the body skin colours of the ancients. So what is left is the AuDna. Everyone in Europe except the finns have a % of gedrosian

While on the subject of light skin, see below

http://dienekes.blogspot.com.au/2013/11/europeans-and-south-asians-share-by.html
 
I think they ( black irish) did come from the steppes and they might have been cimmerians/thracians . the year would have been not later then 700BC. they had black hair, light eyes and pale "irish" skin .............the markings of a black irish.
the components of cimmerians/thracians are gedrosian ( eastern persian )and north caucasus

Maybe partially, but I think it is rather the med admixture. Are Basques darker than the Irish? They have the same Gedrosia as the Irish in this run. But Basques have more Mediterranean admixture than Irish. Thus I think it is also the mediterranean admixture in Irish which produces fewer dark Irish. Also many south europeans can still become as pale as many north-europeans, when both are at northern latitude.
But for Eastern europe other admixtures might be more responsible though, for instance Caucasus, although Mediterranean is present as well. East europe is also sunnier than the northern atlantic.
After all, not even "100% North_europeans" (regardless which run, just imagine maximum) necessarily implies 0% dark.
 

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