r1b u106 in france

[Nobody1]

Larmuseau et al 2012
http://www.nature.com/hdy/journal/v109/n2/full/hdy201217a.html?WT.mc_id=FBK_NPG#bib25

There is always an obvious majority shift of U106/U152 between Germanic and Romanic (Gallic/Gallo-Roman) areas;

 

[adamo]

So if the Flemish results indicate anything in terms of belgians, we can assume they have 15-25% rs21.

 

[MOESAN]

Mmmmm, wat part of that phrase must i savor onto in terms of its undeniable contribution to the forum? The ’in regards‘ part or the ‘only time will tell‘ portion. The answer is no more than 5-8%, maybe 10% across the country, even Switzerland has 15%ish, austria has more like 25-30%. Places hit hard by germanic invasions such as england, norway austria of course germany and holland have higher rs21 frequencies, whereas places that resiste germanic invasions such as france or places that didnt receive any such as italy naturally have lower frequencies .

you are speaking of France as if it were a monolithic land, aren't you?
if we find 8% to 13% of Y-I1 in northern and northeastern France it would not be amazing to find about 13% to 18% of Y-R-U106 there: but I'm not so self confident as you: I prefer wait more data:

 

[Sile]

Larmuseau et al 2012
http://www.nature.com/hdy/journal/v109/n2/full/hdy201217a.html?WT.mc_id=FBK_NPG#bib25

There is always an obvious majority shift of U106/U152 between Germanic and Romanic (Gallic/Gallo-Roman) areas;

michael Hammer stated last month
U106 is east german
U152 is central german

but neither where germanic areas at that time, nor celtic

http://www.nature.com/hdy/journal/v109/n2/fig_tab/hdy201217t1.html#figure-title

12% of U106 in flanders , granted its not normandy, but normans where there as well

 

[adamo]

U152 I would push for south-central German though; Halstatt areas and associates. Speaking of hg I, I believe the Ostrogoths to have been in thy same category as the Lombards finding their original origin in Southern Sweden before campaigning across parts of Europe.

 

[adamo]

In fact I wouldn't be surprised if the Ostrogoths WERE the Lombards or later versions of them, I believe everything goth (Ostrogoth,Visigoth) to have an original origin around southern Sweden.

 

[Nobody1]

michael Hammer stated last month
U106 is east german
U152 is central german

but neither where germanic areas at that time, nor celtic

I wasnt at that conference;
But what i know from what i have read and seen (in articles about the conference) is that Dr. Hammer concludes that all R1b (M269) comes from a post-Neolithic migration stemming from Anatolia;
That R1b is post-Neolithic is the current state of knowledge based on the current results of the 32 Neolithic corpses from Treilles/Avellaner/Ötzi/Derenburg; 0% (not a single one) is R1b and mostly G2a;

If the Hammer scenario is correct and all R1b (M269) lineages are from a non-Indo-European post-Neolithic migration than the dominant R1b lineages (U106/U152) in Indo-European societies (Germanic/Keltic/Italic) must than be at least pseudo-Indo-European; in the sense that these lineages were subjugated and absorbed by Indo-Europeans further East and than expanded into the rest of Europe with the succeeding Bronze-age cultures of Tumulus and Urnfield;

Either that or U106/U152 are proper-Indo-European;
And given the sheer dominance of U106/U152 in Indo-European societies (Germanic/Keltic/Italic) in comparison to R1a and given the Archaeological reality that these societies emerged from a common continuity than U106/U152 look very proper-Indo-European;
But only future tests and more data from the Chalcolithic and early Bronze-age will show whats pseudo and whats proper;

I didnt read that Dr. Hammer claimed that U106 and U152 originated in Germany - just that those are the epicenters and centers-of-expansions;

12% of U106 in flanders , granted its not normandy, but normans where there as well

Do you mean I1-M253?
Because U106 is 26.7% and I1-M253 is 12.0%;

 

[Sile]

I wasnt at that conference;
But what i know from what i have read and seen (in articles about the conference) is that Dr. Hammer concludes that all R1b (M269) comes from a post-Neolithic migration stemming from Anatolia;
That R1b is post-Neolithic is the current state of knowledge based on the current results of the 32 Neolithic corpses from Treilles/Avellaner/Ötzi/Derenburg; 0% (not a single one) is R1b and mostly G2a;

If the Hammer scenario is correct and all R1b (M269) lineages are from a non-Indo-European post-Neolithic migration than the dominant R1b lineages (U106/U152) in Indo-European societies (Germanic/Keltic/Italic) must than be at least pseudo-Indo-European; in the sense that these lineages were subjugated and absorbed by Indo-Europeans further East and than expanded into the rest of Europe with the succeeding Bronze-age cultures of Tumulus and Urnfield;

Either that or U106/U152 are proper-Indo-European;
And given the sheer dominance of U106/U152 in Indo-European societies (Germanic/Keltic/Italic) in comparison to R1a and given the Archaeological reality that these societies emerged from a common continuity than U106/U152 look very proper-Indo-European;
But only future tests and more data from the Chalcolithic and early Bronze-age will show whats pseudo and whats proper;

I didnt read that Dr. Hammer claimed that U106 and U152 originated in Germany - just that those are the epicenters and centers-of-expansions;



Do you mean I1-M253?
Because U106 is 26.7% and I1-M253 is 12.0%;

yes, 26.7& have flemish names and 12% have roman french names

R1b1b2a1 (R-U106)

147

26.78%

6

12%

I read that U106 formed between pannonia and the epi-center of east Germany. In east germany was alsothe "non-mutated" P312 ( pannonia was P312's epicentre)