Eupedia Forums
Site NavigationEupedia Top > Eupedia Forum & Japan Forum
Page 1 of 5 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 121

Thread: slavic, germanic and others for the fun

  1. #1
    Elite member
    Join Date
    25-10-11
    Location
    Brittany
    Age
    72
    Posts
    4,863

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b - L21/S145*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H3c

    Ethnic group
    more celtic
    Country: France



    slavic, germanic and others for the fun

    as I had done for the gaelic, I 'll put here some slavic words and what could be their cognates (and sometimes only loanwords) in germanic - sometimes the root will be shared with other I-E languages - no pretention only a play...

    R russian - B bulgarian - SC serbo-croat - C -Czechoslovak - P polish -
    the modern germanic corresponding words are not complete (nor the slavic ones!) - but the order is from left to right: english, dutch, german, and scandinavian (I precise when it is icelandic)

    SKO C suffix -ish / - isch / -isk <> lat- -escu / -esco / -esque / -ique
    bagno P marsh <> - bog / lat- bain / baigner / bagnare / boue (baw) ?
    beba SC baby / celt- baban / babig / lat-fr- bébé
    beo SC běl C bjelo R white / blank <> bleach / bleek / bleich / blue / blauw / blau / blå >> lat- blanc / blanco / bianco / branco
    biskup SC biskup C bishop / bisschop / bisschoff / biskop (surely recent loanword)
    biti 1 SC być P to be / being / celt- bezañ / boud / bod / bew / beo / bywyd /
    błąd P blud C fault / error / mistake <>?*bland >>to blend /

    blady P pale / clear <> bleich, bleach, blank see beo/belo
    bled SC bledě C pale (pale blue) >> slav-SC- blady, beo/belo see above
    bledeti SC to blemish, see above
    blejati SC to bleat / blöken / lat- bêler / bélier / celt- bloeddio / ble(i)jal (to moo, to low) ???
    blesk C lightning germ- blitz ? - see also beo / bled
    brada SC brada C beard (+ chin) / baard / bart >> bradat SC
    brat SC bratr C brat P brother / broeder-broer / bruder / broder / bror / celt- brathair / brawd / brodher / breur /
    lat- fratellu / frère / freire ...

    brđanin SC highlander see beneath
    brdo SC mount / mountain <> berg /berg / bjerg >> lat-fr- berge / celt- *briga / bre (mount) / bryn / brenn / bri (estime) / briell (river bank) /
    breg SC brzeg* P břeh C hill / (*P board) see above
    brest SC elm <> ?birch
    breza SC břiza C birch germ- berk / birke / njörk + see above
    brod SC brod* C ship (*C ford) <> ? board << ! germ ! << lat-fr- bord / borde / bordel

    brstiti SC to graze <> lat-fr- brouter << ! old germ- !
    brva C brew* P eyelash (*P eyebrow) <> germ- brow - braue -

    burk P board (maritime, loan << ? germ- more récent?)

    chlad C hlad SC chłod P coolness / freshness <> germ- cold / koud / kalt / kall + cool / kühl : ? more recent loan to high- german ??? if from PIE *g-l we would have something close to **zlad ???

  2. #2
    Elite member
    Join Date
    25-10-11
    Location
    Brittany
    Age
    72
    Posts
    4,863

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b - L21/S145*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H3c

    Ethnic group
    more celtic
    Country: France



    erratum

    breza (birch: scand-swed- björk not # njörk)

  3. #3
    Elite member
    Join Date
    25-10-11
    Location
    Brittany
    Age
    72
    Posts
    4,863

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b - L21/S145*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H3c

    Ethnic group
    more celtic
    Country: France



    again for the fun

    dług P
    debt <> celt-britt- dyle/dle « -id- » <#> ??? germ- deal, deel, teil, del : « part » ???


    dno SC fond (britt- dwfn/don ? << *dobn- ? germ- deep, diep, tief, djup

    dol B, dô, dolina SC valley (britt- dol / dol : valley, river curve - germ- ? dale / daal / tal / dal ?

    drag SC dorogiy R drogi P expansive germ- dear, duur, teuer,
    dremati SC to sleep (dorm- << **drm ??? < ?> germ- dream, droom, traum?

    držati SC to hold (germ- dragen / tragen ???)
    dvor (~# vrata) SC palace, court >> dvorana SC : hall / dvorac SC : castle / dvoranin SC : courtisan <???> door / deur / tor/tur / dörr ??? celt- doras / drws / dôr / dor ??? very speculative !

    farba P farba SC colour <> germ- verv / farb / farg (?) surely a recent loan to german...
    gęś P guska SC goose / gans / gans (in polish the little sign or accent under e an a marked nasalization)

    gleba P glib SC* ground, earth (*SC silt, mud) <> lat- gleba >> gleba / glèbe see germ- clay /klei :
    glina SC clay, see gleba

    gorąco P horko C hot <> celt-bret- gor/goriñ abcess / to hatch (egg) – germ- warm / warm / warm / varm / lat- furn- / form- >> forno / four(née) / hornillo / greek thermos : hot – sanskr- gharmàh : heat
    gost SCguest / germ- gast / gast

    gorivo SC combustible / fuel, see gorąco
    goveče SC young bull or cow / germ- cow / koe / kuh / sanskr- gâùh : ox / greek bous / lat- bos/bovis >> bœuf / bovin / buey / bue / bove / + / bubal / bufalus … Celt- bo / buwch / buoc'h PIE ?*ghw-

    govedina SC ox, see above
    grad SC hrad C gorod R town (C : castle) <> germ *gard-, >> yard / garden / gaarden / garten / ? celt-britt- *garth ? (hedge) lat- *hort- >> ortolano / huerta / ortolan >> horti(-)culteur + cohorte

    granica P granica SC frontier / border <> germ- grens / grenze – maybe a recent loan
    grob SC grób P grave <> germ- grave / graaf / graven / grabe <?> greek graph- ? Celt- grafignad, skrafignad to scratch ???

    hala P hala C market, french 'halle' << germ- ??? engl- 'hall' ?
    hleb SC chléb C chleb P bread <> germ- *hlaif- >> loaf / laib /

    knez SC kňez C* prince, count (*C preast, minister) germ- king / koning / konig / kung /
    kniga B knjiga SC kniha C book >> knjižnica SC : library (germ- to know / kennen / känna)

    kod Sc in someone house germ- hutt- >> hut / hütte / <> hûs, house / haus / huis / hus /
    koliko SC how much ? - (germ- *hu (how/hoe?) + *lik- : like / lijk / leich / lika / ???

    kola SC car, wagon (wain) see beneath
    kolo SC koło P kolo C wheel / germ- wiel / hjôl (iceland-) <<**kwîl

    kolovoz SC cartway, road for cars (kolo SC wheel, circle, kola SC cart, car + voz see germ- way, weg...)

    kord C sword <> *kr°-d- ? ~= *kl°-d ???<> celt- cledhamh, cleddyf, klezeñv ?-
    see germ- **skhword >> sword / zwaard / schwert / ???

  4. #4
    Elite member
    Join Date
    25-10-11
    Location
    Brittany
    Age
    72
    Posts
    4,863

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b - L21/S145*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H3c

    Ethnic group
    more celtic
    Country: France



    just some details: approximatively
    czech H is as a rule for slavic G (but it is true in Slovak, Ukrainian too) - sometimes for a germanic recent loanword but very very rare
    polish CZ = /tch/ SZ = /sh/ SZCZ = /schtch/ - as a rule an accent upon the C or S or Z tends to palatalize the sound on the way to /tch/ or /sh/ or /zh/ - RZ
    was surely pronounced /rzh/ in past but now it is /zh/ only - the L with an oblique bar is pronounced /w/ not like W which pronounced /v/ as in german - the /rzh/ still existes in czech -

    slavic: in general C = /ts/

    it is just a superficial help for first contact with these languages very hard to read and pronounce

  5. #5
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    04-01-12
    Posts
    125


    Country: Poland



    1 members found this post helpful.
    Here is fragment of polish comedy making fun of difficulties of polish pronunciation. The film Title is "Jak rozpętałem drugą wojnę światową"(How I unleashed World War II).

  6. #6
    Elite member
    Join Date
    25-10-11
    Location
    Brittany
    Age
    72
    Posts
    4,863

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b - L21/S145*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H3c

    Ethnic group
    more celtic
    Country: France



    same childish but pleasant play (without taking care of the laryngals (H1, H2... and so on: I 've not the sufficient knowledge)



    -OST suffix = celt –britt- -aeth, -aezh <?> °-act ? << °-agit ?
    koža SC kůže C skin <> slav- *kod-j- ? *kogj- ? / ??? lat- cut- ?- cutané, couënne, germ- hood/huid/haut ???
    krčag SC pitcher, jug french cruche from germ- *krûka, german krug, dial-german krauche
    krdo SC herd, flock germ- herde / hjord
    supposedly from I-E *ker- to cut, to separate: germ- harvest / herbst
    krepost SC strength, energy germ- kracht / kraft see Celt-britt- cryf / kreñv
    krik SC shout, cry germ- shriek/scream / schrei / skrik see # lat- critare << quiritare >> gritar, crier
    kriviti SC to curve, to bend (*I-E k-r >> *k-r-b/*k-r-v : concept/meaning of circle, curve) see appendix 1
    kruh C krąg P krug SC circle germ- *hring > ring / ring / ring / see kriviti and appendix 1
    krnjiti SC tronquer, ébrécher (br- krenn, krignañ, court ???) see appendix 2
    kroj SC taille, façon (*kr-?) see krnjiti and appendix 2
    krov SC krov C toit (britt- crau/kraou : étable, germ roof < hrof ? <> tèt fr-dial- : toit = étable)
    & appendix 1
    a) indo-european of Europe: *k-r <> *ker- = «to curve, to bend»
    Greek = Hell- kurtos: «bent», korônos: «hooked» - Lat- + corona – corolla >> A-Fr- corb- >> courbe – incurver – couronne – couronner – corolle – corollaire - Esp- corvo – encorvar – corona – coronar - It- curvo – incurvare – coronare - >> Slav- Srb-Cro kruna = « crown » -
    >> enlarged form (sic) *kerk- = same basic meaning
    Hell- kirkos / krikos = «ring» - kerkos = «animal tail» - Lat- circus = «circle», «creek» - circa = «around» (lonad in a lot of languages) circuire – circulus - circellus – circare – circulare – circinus = «compass» - A-Fr- cerche = «round» - cerchier = «to go in a circle» - cernel = «small hole» - Fr- cirque – cercle – circonférence – circuit – circuler – circonspect – cerceau – chercher – recherche – cerne – cerner - >> Ang- search – All- zirkel – bezirk = «district» - Esp- circo – cerco – cerca – circuir – circulo – cercillo, zarcillo = «earring» - cercar = «to belt» - cercenar = «to clip» - It- circa – cerchia = «enclosure – cerchio – circuire - circolo – cerchiello – cercare – cercine =«rolled fold» - >> Br- kelc'h – kerc'hlenn >> kerlenn – Gall- cylch – the celtic words in *k-l-k would perhaps be a variant ?
    b) my other words : celtic in *kr- and germanic in *hr-
    Br- krenn = «average », « circular », « clipped* - gronnañ << °kronnañ = «to surround» (Welsh- cronhoi) – gael - cruinnim/cruinnich = «to aggregate», «to gather»– Br kromm = «curved», «convex» - Welsh- crwm/crom – Gael- cruim – cruimim - cruinn = «exact» - - + Br- krek = «stalk» -
    Br- krugell = «tumulus», « barrow » -
    Germ- hring = - Eng- ring – Dutch- ring – All- ring – Isl- hringur >> Fr- rang – rangée – ranger (existance of possible 'infixe N'! Isl- hrokk-inn = «curled (hair)»

    Slav- *k-r – SrbCro- kriv = «curved» >> «wrong», «coupable» - krivina = «curve» - krug = «circle» -kružiti = «to go,in a curve» - Rus- krug = «circle» - krivoj = «curve» - Czeh- kruh / kružnice = «circle» - kružitko = «compas»Bulg- krägov = «circular» - okräžnost = «circle» - kriv = «curve» - Pol- krąg =«circle» (n.), do notice the little sign under the 'a' of the 'infixe N'!!! «hring»!) - okrągły = «rounded »
    &: the slavic word kolo = «wheel» and the germ- hwîl (wheel; wiel) could have a remote common origin with celtic *k-l = *k-r ??? = «to curve », to «make round »

  7. #7
    Elite member
    Join Date
    25-10-11
    Location
    Brittany
    Age
    72
    Posts
    4,863

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b - L21/S145*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H3c

    Ethnic group
    more celtic
    Country: France



    ląd P continent, ground, earth germ- land / land / land / land/län << celt- llan / lann >> lat-fr- lande

    <> lat- plaine / plana / llana << *plyana / ...

    laž SC lež C lie / germ- lie / leug / lüge / lögn …..
    legki SC /lehky C light / germ- light, licht, leicht, lätt, lat- léger / liggero / A VOIR
    lehati C ležati SC se coucher (gésir SC) <> germ – to lie / to lay / liggen, leggen / ligga <?> celt- lle / le/lec'h place, site
    leš SC cadavre ( ? germ-dutch- lichaam)
    letva SC slat germ- lath / latte , celt- ? llath ? /lazhenn
    ljubiti SC libezny C* lubić P to love, to like, to kiss aimer, baiser, embrasser , *C : sweet, pleasant (germ- to love / liver (rather, prefered) / lieb / ? <?> lat- libido ???)
    ljudi SC lud-zie P lid C people, men >> ljudski SC : human (germ- leute : people)
    lože C łożko P bed (<> germ- to lie / to lay / liggen / leggen / + latin ? Lect-? > lit)
    lud SC crazy, fool, stupid (celt- dial-bret- lu + ? lot)
    luk 1 SC ail (germ- whitlock / knoblauch /(knof)look / vitlök)
    manje SC mnieje P meńšij R less germ- mind- >> minder, minst – Lat- minus : mini- / fr- moins – Celt-Wels- miniog, main, Br- moan (minuscule, slim)
    mati SC matka C mat' R mother (germ- mother / mutter / moeder / moder : mor + ~ all other I-E languages)
    milost SC milość P milost C grace, softness

    mily C mio SC mily P m'ilij R dear, sweat:soft(germ- mild / mild / mild / milis, mélisse, miel, mild <> celt-britt- melys / miliss – lat- melissa + ... link with I-E **mel-/mil- honey ???

    miš SC mysz P m'iš' souris (Germ- mouse / maus / muis : muus / mus – Lat- °mus-)
    mlin SC mlyn C miel'inča R moulin (germ- mill / mühl / molen / 2- malare (kvarn) - << ? lat- molin- >> moulin/ molino / moinho >> celt-britt- melyn / milin – surely enough not a I-E cognate

    mlitav SC mlitî C* flabby / *to grind – see mlin : mill
    mnogo SC mnogo P mnogo R a lot, much >> too much – see ? main / many germ- *magin- / ? lat- maximus / magnus / magister ? >> maestro - fr- mais + maint / span- mas /it- mai ???

    moć SC moć P* moč' R might, power, *strength >>moćan SC : strong, mighty, powerful – germ- to may / mögen (to want) / mogen + macht / macht / makt

    moguć SC possible, see moc (germ- möglich / mogelijk / möjlig)

    možda SC maybe, perhaps, possibly
    moi SC dear, amiable, graceful - (néerl- mooi beautiful)
    moliti SC to demand, to appeal, to seek ? celt- gael- molaim / -britt- mol-/meuliñ : to praise, to laud )

    mračan SC mračnij R mrači C* dark, obscure, *C cloudy, sad (germ- scand- mörk = dunkel : dark)

    mrak SC mrak C* darkness, *C clouds – see above : mračan ...
    mreti SC umrat' R umrzeć P to die – see germ- to murder / ermorden / vermoorden / mörda – lat : mort, muerto, morto ...

    mortvy C martwy P miortvij R dead – see above : mreti …

  8. #8
    Elite member
    Join Date
    25-10-11
    Location
    Brittany
    Age
    72
    Posts
    4,863

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b - L21/S145*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H3c

    Ethnic group
    more celtic
    Country: France



    ląd P continent, ground, earth germ- land / land / land / land/län << celt- llan / lann >> lat-fr- lande

    <> lat- plaine / plana / llana << *plyana / ...
    laž SC lež C lie / germ- lie / leug / lüge / lögn …..
    legki SC /lehky C light / germ- light, licht, leicht, lätt, lat- léger / liggero / A VOIR
    lehati C ležati SC se coucher (gésir SC) <> germ – to lie / to lay / liggen, leggen / ligga <?> celt- lle / le/lec'h place, site
    leš SC cadavre ( ? germ-dutch- lichaam)
    letva SC slat germ- lath / latte , celt- ? llath ? /lazhenn
    ljubiti SC libezny C* lubić P to love, to like, to kiss aimer, baiser, embrasser , *C : sweet, pleasant (germ- to love / liver (rather, prefered) / lieb / ? <?> lat- libido ???)
    ljudi SC lud-zie P lid C people, men >> ljudski SC : human (germ- leute : people)
    lože C łożko P bed (<> germ- to lie / to lay / liggen / leggen / + latin ? Lect-? > lit)
    lud SC crazy, fool, stupid (celt- dial-bret- lu + ? lot)
    luk 1 SC ail (germ- whitlock / knoblauch /(knof)look / vitlök)
    manje SC mnieje P meńšij R less germ- mind- >> minder, minst – Lat- minus : mini- / fr- moins – Celt-Wels- miniog, main, Br- moan (minuscule, slim)
    mati SC matka C mat' R mother (germ- mother / mutter / moeder / moder : mor + ~ all other I-E languages)
    milost SC milość P milost C grace, softness
    mily C mio SC mily P m'ilij R dear, sweat:soft(Germ- mild / mild / mild / milis, mélisse, miel, mild <> Celt-britt- melys / miliss – Lat- melissa + ...
    miš SC mysz P m'iš' souris (Germ- mouse / maus / muis : muus / mus – Lat- °mus-)
    mlin SC mlyn C miel'inča R moulin (Germ- mill / mühl / molen / 2- malare (kvarn) - << ? Lat- molin- >> moulin/ molino / moinho >> Kelt-Britt- melyn / milin – surely enough not a I-E cognate
    mlitav SC mlitî C* flabby / *to grind – see mlin : mill
    mnogo SC mnogo P mnogo R a lot, much >> too much – see ? main / many Germ- *magin- / ? Lat- maximus / magnus / magister ? >> maestro - Fr- mais + maint / Span- mas / It- mai ???
    moć SC moć P* moč' R might, power, *strength >>moćan SC : strong, mighty, powerful – Germ- to may / mögen (to want) / mogen + macht / macht / makt
    moguć SC possible, see moc (Germ- möglich / mogelijk / möjlig)
    možda SC maybe, perhaps, possibly
    moi SC dear, amiable, graceful - (néerl- mooi beautiful)
    moliti SC to demand, to appeal, to seek ? Kelt- Gael- molaim / -Britt- mol-/meuliñ : to praise, to laud )
    mračan SC mračnij R mrači C* dark, obscure, *C cloudy, sad (germ- Scand- mörk = dunkel : dark)
    mrak SC mrak C* darkness, *C clouds – see above : mračan ...
    mreti SC umrat' R umrzeć P to die – see Germ- to murder / ermorden / vermoorden / mörda – Lat : mort, muerto, morto ...
    mortvy C martwy P miortvij R dead – see above : mreti …

  9. #9
    Elite member
    Join Date
    25-10-11
    Location
    Brittany
    Age
    72
    Posts
    4,863

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b - L21/S145*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H3c

    Ethnic group
    more celtic
    Country: France



    [QUOTE=MOESAN;422950]

    nad SC / nad R nad B above (germ- engl- ? on ?
    nag SC nagoj R bare (germ-engl- nake) >> nagota SC: nudité
    neznalost C < znat' R znaja B ignorance < to know, germ- to know / kennen / kennen / känna, lat co-gnoscere > fr- connaîre / sp- conocer
    nic- C nic P niščo B ničto R nothing, nobody, germ- / niets /nichst /
    nit C nić:nitka P nitka R niška B wire (br- neud <> ? (germ- to knit, knot / knoop / knoten / knut) ???
    noc C, R, P, SC nošt B germ- night / nacht / nacht / natt / nott
    novy C / nov SC, B / nowy P germ- new / nieuw / neu / ny + lat- nuovo / nuevo / novo / neuf / celt- newydd / newez
    nozdra C nozdra B nozdrja R nostril
    obava C fear, celt- *ob-n ? britt- ofn / aon ???-
    oblak SC, B / oblako R cloud, <<*ob-vlk <> germ- wolk / wolk )
    ogreb->ogrepsti to scratch (v. 'grob' : « grave ») >> ogrebotina SC : scratch
    oko SC, B, C, P germ- eye / oog / auge / ogon – lat- ocul- >> œil / ochio / ojo / olho
    pest, pesnica SC ? germ- fist / vuist / faust ???
    pila SC, B germ- file (tool) / vijl / feile / fil
    ram C frame <> ? germ- rahm / rahmen / ram

  10. #10
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    13-01-12
    Location
    Bucharest
    Posts
    943

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    proly R1B

    Ethnic group
    Romanian
    Country: Romania



    You should add some Scandinavian languages and Gothic also,since there are cognates between those.
    For example:
    chair - stol - Scandinavian - stol - Bulgarian - stolica -Serbian.
    (Scandinavian - Swedish,Norwegian or Danish language).

  11. #11
    Banned
    Join Date
    16-01-14
    Posts
    150


    Country: Canada



    The goths were southern swedes.

  12. #12
    Elite member
    Join Date
    25-10-11
    Location
    Brittany
    Age
    72
    Posts
    4,863

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b - L21/S145*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H3c

    Ethnic group
    more celtic
    Country: France



    Quote Originally Posted by mihaitzateo View Post
    You should add some Scandinavian languages and Gothic also,since there are cognates between those.
    For example:
    chair - stol - Scandinavian - stol - Bulgarian - stolica -Serbian.
    (Scandinavian - Swedish,Norwegian or Danish language).
    I agree -
    it is evident - I did no specify but very often I put a scandinavian word (swedish) at the end of the "Germ-" forms - this little "work" is only to open the appetite of some new forumers, it is not 'exhaustive' (too lazy of mine: I could have had put every slavic language form when it was relevent (the most of the time) but...)

  13. #13
    Elite member
    Join Date
    25-10-11
    Location
    Brittany
    Age
    72
    Posts
    4,863

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b - L21/S145*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H3c

    Ethnic group
    more celtic
    Country: France



    I hold on

    pług P plug R B + palo B plough / ploeg / pflug /

    sedećki SC sitting , germ- to set – to sit / zitten – zetten / setzen / sitta – sätta, see to settle
    lat- °sed- >> fr- siège, séant, sénace, sédiment, asseoir (< *at-sedere?) >> sédatif
    celt-britt- hedd peace + sedd, asez(loanwords from latine)
    sedeti SC siadać P sadit'sija R to sit, to be sitting>> sedište SC: sit

    sedlo SC siodło P sedlo B saddle, germ- saddle / zettel / sattel / sadel
    sejati SC séjat' R to sow, to sieve / zaaien / säen / så /
    seme SC, B nasienie P seed, germ- seed / zaad / saat / utsäde – lat- semen, seminis semina >> fr- semence -
    celt-britt- had / had
    setva SC sowing(s)
    sin SC syn P, C, B son >> germ- son / zoon / sohn / son - >> sinovac SC : nephew
    sirće SC vinegar <> germ- bitter : sour / zuur / sauer / sur /
    škurt SC ?skapy P ?skupoj R avaricious <> germ- short / kort / kurz / kort – fr- court – celt-britt- skort (loan?)
    škopiti SC to cut : I-E root *s-k- very productive with a lot of descendants in languages : sharp, to shape, to share, to shave, to shear, short, shred, shrill (?) scar, scarce, … ? see lat-fr-sequence, scier
    celt-britt- skizh, skej, skar ...
    slab SC weak, feeble, sick >> slabiti SC : to weaken
    slabo SC peu, faiblement, rarement (engl- slab, german schlapp ?<<? *sklabb->s-hlab ? >< **kla-p/m ?
    ??? kelt-britt- : claf / klañv sick, ill
    & : a lot of germanic words in sk-/sh-/scl-/schl-/sl-/sn-/schn-/scr-/shr-/schr- seem bearing roughly the meaning of « to cut », « to shorten », « to diminish », « to kill » - scr-/schr- could be different, from a supposed I-E *s+kr- in place of *sk +r- with a very close meaning ???
    slava SC, R, C, B, sława P glory, renowm – I-E *kl- celt- cluintinn / clywed / klewed to ear - greek cleos - slav- see slovo SC, word – germ- loud / luid strong voice / laut / ljud accoustic << *hlûd- (Hludwig Chlodovecus >> Clovis, Louis)
    slavoljubiv SC ambitious (*** « klew-lover » : *** « glory-lover »!!!)
    sloj SC bed, layer <> ??? s?+loj- : germ- to lie/lay / liggen … ???
    šmrkati SC smärkam B to sniff - <?> germ- smaak / schmack / smak <?> engl- smell ? <> pol- smak/smaczny tasty
    sneg SCsnjag B snjeg R śnieg P snow - germ- snow / sneeuw / schnee / snö / + celt-gael- sneachta
    šnicla SC slender slice of meat – germ- snit / schnitz cutting – surely a lonesome loanword in SC
    spalinja R ? soba SC bedroom <?> germ-scand- sova : to sleep << ?* s-p- <> lat- °sopor-, °somn- greek °hypn-
    celt-britt- hun << **subn- ? unsure : see under

    spavati SC spia B spać P spat' R to sleep : <> *s-p- : see above
    stoka SC stock, cattle >> stočar SC : breeder

    stolica SC stol B stul Rchair germ- 'stool' / stoel / stuhl / stol

  14. #14
    Elite member
    Join Date
    25-10-11
    Location
    Brittany
    Age
    72
    Posts
    4,863

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b - L21/S145*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H3c

    Ethnic group
    more celtic
    Country: France



    sorry, I beg your pardon !
    for slabo, german schlapp ("sluggish") is correct but english slab ("big slice", fr- "dalle") is irrelevant concerning the meaning - it rather concerns the *s-k question ("to cut", "short", "sharp" a.s.o...)
    excuse me again...

  15. #15
    Elite member
    Join Date
    25-10-11
    Location
    Brittany
    Age
    72
    Posts
    4,863

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b - L21/S145*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H3c

    Ethnic group
    more celtic
    Country: France



    šunka SC B szynka P ham (schinka germ. loanword?)
    svadba SC svatba B svad°ba R wedding >> svadbeni SC: nuptial
    svinja SC R B pig / >> germ- swine / zwijn / schwein / svin
    tanak SC slim : germ- thin / din / dünn / tunn + lat- ténue / tenue / ténu /+ celt-britt- tenau / tanaw>> tanjiti SC: to slim
    tanjir SC talerz P tarelka R plate / germ- teller ? / tallrik ?
    trava SC travà R treva B trawa P grass, plant / ? germ- turf / turf / torf / torv <> lat-fr- tourbe - ???
    trbuh SC B belly / paunch / ? germ- buik / bauch / buk ? + ? celt-britt- tor ???
    trčati SC to run / ? germ- trek / trek / trekking ??? see lat-fr- trait / tirer / tract / traquer ???
    >> trk(a) SC : run
    trg SC targ P torg R town square, market place, fair / germ- ° »tory », torg) >> tržista SC place du marché
    trgovac SC trademan / merchant
    trn SC B thorn : germ- dorn / dorn / törne / >< celt-britt- draen / drein ???
    tuš SC shower (water) : loanword to the german ?
    udovac SC vdovèc B vdóv'ij R wdowiec P germ- widow / weduwnaar / witwer / << lat. ? IE. ?) fr- veuf
    vagati SC vesit' R waźyć P to weigh – germ- wegen / (ab)wiegen / väga / vega >> važan SC : valoir
    vera SC vjara B wiara P véra R faith, religion, confession – germ- waar / wahr / tvär : IE lat- vero / vrai (voire << ver-) /
    celt- fior / fior / gwir / gwir
    >> veran SC: fidèle, dévoué (ver, vrai, gwir, fior)
    veresnik SC fiancé (con-fidance) >> vernost SC : truth
    verovati SC to believe (vrai, ver)
    vest SC B wieść P vest' R news, information – germ- wise, wit, witch / weten, aanwijzen / wessen / veta << IE (greek 'idea-' / lat- video / vedere / veer / voir, viser, avisé / -
    celt-britt- gwybod / gouzoud << *uuid-bot
    vetr SC, wiatr P véter R wind, germ- wind / wind / vind – IE lat- vento / viento / vent – celt-britt- gwynt / gwent
    vid SC sight – see : vest
    vlàd C / vlada SC / władza P° government, °power <> ? Celt-Britt- gwlad country (kingdom?) / glad country patrimony ? Frank- Germ- *waldan to govern, see : ? <> wealth ?
    vladař/vladce C sovereign
    voda 1 SC B vodà R woda P water – Germ- water, wasser, vatten

  16. #16
    Advisor LeBrok's Avatar
    Join Date
    18-11-09
    Location
    Calgary
    Posts
    10,295

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b Z2109
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H1c

    Ethnic group
    Citizen of the world
    Country: Canada-Alberta



    Quote Originally Posted by MOESAN View Post
    šunka SC B szynka P ham (schinka germ. loanword?)
    svinja SC R B pig / >> germ- swine / zwijn / schwein / svin
    tanjir SC talerz P tarelka R plate / germ- teller ? / tallrik ?
    trava SC travà R treva B trawa P grass, plant / ? germ- turf / turf / torf / torv <> lat-fr- tourbe - ???
    trčati SC to run / ? germ- trek / trek / trekking ??? see lat-fr- trait / tirer / tract / traquer ???
    >> trk(a) SC : run
    trg SC targ P torg R town square, market place, fair / germ- ° »tory », torg) >> tržista SC place du marché
    trgovac SC trademan / merchant
    vagati SC vesit' R waźyć P to weigh – germ- wegen / (ab)wiegen / väga / vega >> važan SC : valoir
    These look like borrowings from germanic




    svadba SC svatba B svad°ba R
    wedding >> svadbeni SC: nuptial
    udovac SC vdovèc B vdóv'ij R wdowiec P germ- widow / weduwnaar / witwer / << lat. ? IE. ?) fr- veuf
    vera SC vjara B wiara P véra R faith, religion, confession – germ- waar / wahr / tvär : IE lat- vero / vrai (voire << ver-) /
    celt- fior / fior / gwir / gwir
    >> veran SC: fidèle, dévoué (ver, vrai, gwir, fior)
    veresnik SC fiancé (con-fidance) >> vernost SC : truth
    verovati SC to believe (vrai, ver)
    vest SC B wieść P vest' R news, information – germ- wise, wit, witch / weten, aanwijzen / wessen / veta << IE (greek 'idea-' / lat- video / vedere / veer / voir, viser, avisé / -
    celt-britt- gwybod / gouzoud << *uuid-bot
    vetr SC, wiatr P véter R wind, germ- wind / wind / vind – IE lat- vento / viento / vent – celt-britt- gwynt / gwent
    vid SC sight – see : vest
    vlàd C / vlada SC / władza P° government, °power <> ? Celt-Britt- gwlad country (kingdom?) / glad country patrimony ? Frank- Germ- *waldan to govern, see : ? <> wealth ?
    vladař/vladce C sovereign
    voda 1 SC B vodà R woda P water – Germ- water, wasser, vatten
    These seam to have IE roots.



    tuš SC shower (water) : loanword to the german ?
    I thought it was borrowing from french.

    vest SC B wieść P vest' R news, information – germ- wise, wit, witch / weten, aanwijzen / wessen / veta << IE (greek 'idea-' / lat- video / vedere / veer / voir, viser, avisé / -
    celt-britt- gwybod / gouzoud << *uuid-bot
    vid SC sight – see : vest
    In Polish it is "widzieć".
    I think to see ( vid/ved) is precursor to know (veda). I see therefor I know. In Polish "wiedzma" (witch) is made of "wiedz" to know, and "ma" denoting female, mother or old lady.
    Be wary of people who tend to glorify the past, underestimate the present, and demonize the future.

  17. #17
    Elite member
    Join Date
    25-10-11
    Location
    Brittany
    Age
    72
    Posts
    4,863

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b - L21/S145*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H3c

    Ethnic group
    more celtic
    Country: France



    Quote Originally Posted by LeBrok View Post
    These look like borrowings from germanic




    [FONT=Times New Roman]
    These seam to have IE roots.



    I thought it was borrowing from french.

    In Polish it is "widzieć". I put a polish word having a close meaning, not always the strict same meaning - thanks for the precision (my polish dictionary is ridiculously scarce!)
    I think to see ( vid/ved) is precursor to know (veda). I see therefor I know. In Polish "wiedzma" (witch) is made of "wiedz" to know, and "ma" denoting female, mother or old lady.
    I agree with you for the very most (but I'm an "amateur")
    1° group: the words in T- (or Z-) in germanic languages ought to be in D- in slavic languages - concerning vagati : vesit : wazyc I think the root is I-E, only the preserved G is weird here -
    2° group: tus^ (I'm obliged to make a 'copy-and-paste' if I want have the correct letters, sorry) seems to me a french word which would be passed through german languahe (modern enough loanword)
    OK for the semantic evolution of "to see" >> "to know" (and perhaps one like "to know" >> "to can"...)

  18. #18
    Elite member
    Join Date
    25-10-11
    Location
    Brittany
    Age
    72
    Posts
    4,863

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b - L21/S145*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H3c

    Ethnic group
    more celtic
    Country: France



    vosakSC wax (- germ- wax, wachs, vaksa ) >> voštiti :to wax

    vozarSC coach driver (?) fr- voiturier (voz)
    vozSC woz P° train, transport, °car (germ- wain/wagon / wagen/ way / weg, lat- vector + ? via, voie +
    ???celt-britt- gwythien:gwazhienn : vein)

    vranaSC crow - germ- engl- wren
    vrataSC door ( ? from I-E ----- fr- verser, intervertir, tourner,pivoter?) or germ- gward,wardan?)
    vratarSC porter
    vrdatiSC to wring, to try toavoid : Germ- wrong, to wriggle, to wrestle, wrench + towrap + Dut- wringen (
    Celt-britt-gwar wrong
    vredetiSC to be worthof, (germ- werd / celt-britt- gwerth, gwerzh)
    vukSC wilk? P wolf(germ- wolf / wolf / ulf ??? - lycaon, lupus, loup, lobo <>ulp*, ulk* ?) >> vičica SC : louve
    vulnaSC wolna P?- wool (*wulana >> germ- wol / woll / wool -celt-gael- olan / folan / celt-britt- gwlan –
    seealso lat- lana / laine /
    vunenSC/vunast SC laineux see vulna SC
    wagaP balance, weight, look at vagati
    wdowaP veuve (widdow << latin ?)
    zadržatiSC to keep, to hold in place, to stop (<< drg*>> ??? dragen, tragen, engl- ? to draw/to drag?)
    zadovoljitiSC udovljetvorjat' R tosatisfy, (to + will)vôlja R will
    zagoretiSC cramer, sentir le roussi (germ- warm/lat- forn- oven /celt-gor- abcess /?slav- gor-
    zagraditiSC to enclosev. : grad (germ- gard/lat- hortus/huerta/ort-/britt-garth/garzh...) I-E : village ENCLOS
    žalbaSCcomplaint,appeal, reclaim ><Germ-Engl-call,réclamation <>celt- galbh, galw, galw : call
    zamračitiSC to darken (za+mrk- : Germ- Scand- mörk
    ženaSC femme <> I-E gen-,g-n- ? <> to generate, to give birth, kneeFr- gendre, genou, générer, britt- geni/geniñ/ganet (to givebirth, to be born...) - Germ- kind, akin, child (kid?), kinder
    ženitiSC to marry <> žena
    zinutiSC to yawn, to open the mouth Germ-chin, kinn, kin, - Celt-britt- gen, genau, genoùmouth, jaw)
    zlatanSCgolden<> seezlato
    zlatoSC B C złotoP gold, 'geld' (yield?) <>, 'glossy'? to glint,to glisten, to glitter,glimmer, glass, Lat- flamma ?)
    C gael-geal « clair », grec 'khloros
    znatiSC to know – Germ kennen, känna(*gno- > Rom- agnostique, co-(g)naître, celt- anavezoud << << ad(g)nabod)
    zrnastSC granulated (?) with grains <> zrno
    zrnoSC grain <> Germ- corn / koren / korn – Lat -gran- Celt-britt-, grawn/greun/gran
    žutSC želt (?) jaune– germ- 'yellow / gelb / geel – gul + gold, geld... / Slav-žjolt'ij/ żołty/ žluty/ žut/ žălt-
    Celt-Gaelgeal

  19. #19
    Advisor LeBrok's Avatar
    Join Date
    18-11-09
    Location
    Calgary
    Posts
    10,295

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b Z2109
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H1c

    Ethnic group
    Citizen of the world
    Country: Canada-Alberta



    Slavs call themselves Slovane (approximation for all slavic), meaning all people who understand Slavic language. It also sounds close to word "slava" fame, but I think it is purely coincidental.

    In contrast Germanic people was called with an exonym "Nemci", meaning people who don't speak (a slavic language).

    Slavs have also an exonym for Romance language speakers, "Vlosi". What could this mean in slavic languages? The closest sounding word is Vlos (hair). Does Vlasi mean hairy people? Does it make sense?


    I'm sort of guessing that Vlasi an exonym because this name is popular through slavic languages. However local romance speakers of balkans called themselves Vlahi, Valah, there is also region of Valahia in Romania. Therefore Vlasi might be slavisized Vlah.

  20. #20
    Elite member
    Join Date
    25-10-11
    Location
    Brittany
    Age
    72
    Posts
    4,863

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b - L21/S145*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H3c

    Ethnic group
    more celtic
    Country: France



    2014 additif


    nabìd C offre (proposition, enchère) > Germ- aanbieden, anbieten, bitte + ? to beg (?)
    ràmě C shoulder >> Germ- arm / arm / arm / arm – Lat- arm- upper part of arm << I-E *ar- joint
    Lat- articulation, articul- >> fr- orteil (arteil), arme armée army + armary, Celt-Britt-(welsh) arf
    vrak C wreck Germ- wreck, wrack, wrak
    věd- C knowledge, science – this root has been already seen by us...(see also videti)
    vedle C close to, near, aside, Germ- wide°, wijd, weit, vid°
    vědni C science ground
    věděni C to know >> nevěděti C to ignore ( to not know)
    viděti C > vidati° C to see > °to see often I-E ?*wid-/wis- to see/to know >> Germ- wise wisdom aanwijzen anweisen weten wissen veta / Lat- visu vedere ver voir visuel visa / celt-britt- gweled << ? *gwez—led?- + gwybod gouzoud gouied << uuid-bot -see vid / vest

  21. #21
    Elite member
    Join Date
    25-10-11
    Location
    Brittany
    Age
    72
    Posts
    4,863

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b - L21/S145*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H3c

    Ethnic group
    more celtic
    Country: France



    Quote Originally Posted by LeBrok View Post
    Slavs call themselves Slovane (approximation for all slavic), meaning all people who understand Slavic language. It also sounds close to word "slava" fame, but I think it is purely coincidental.

    In contrast Germanic people was called with an exonym "Nemci", meaning people who don't speak (a slavic language).

    Slavs have also an exonym for Romance language speakers, "Vlosi". What could this mean in slavic languages? The closest sounding word is Vlos (hair). Does Vlasi mean hairy people? Does it make sense?


    I'm sort of guessing that Vlasi an exonym because this name is popular through slavic languages. However local romance speakers of balkans called themselves Vlahi, Valah, there is also region of Valahia in Romania. Therefore Vlasi might be slavisized Vlah.
    in the most of forms, it is an A and not an O which appears:: slAv-: I don't exclude any explanation: I-E *Kl-w greek cleos < > celtic cluintinn, clywed, klewed "to hear", klod (clot) "glory", "fame", "reputation" germanic *hl-û-d "noise" >> english loud - german laut "sound"- dutch luid "noisy" - *Hlûd-wîk: HLODOVECUS >> C(H)LOVIS + LUDWIG / LUDVIK / LODOWIJK / LUDOVIC / LOUIS / LEWIS... the meaning link of "glory", "reputation", "fame" with "sound", "noise", "shout" , is well attested in languages: breton brud << french brut/bruit "noise" = " rumour" + "good fame" (brudet: "famous") - for me, a name as "the famous ones" is not too amazing among old I-Ean tribes...
    by the way, the word slovo = "word", "speech" could very well be linked too toe this meaning of "noise" << "speech" >> "fame" - no real obstacle - the variation of vowels associated to a same consonnants group seems common in ancient I-Ean to create close but different significations -
    I'll answer you about vlosi/vlasi/vlak/vla(k)h: thi)ese terms are linked too in my mind

  22. #22
    Elite member
    Join Date
    25-10-11
    Location
    Brittany
    Age
    72
    Posts
    4,863

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b - L21/S145*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H3c

    Ethnic group
    more celtic
    Country: France



    this *K-l >> *kel- /*kle- root seems having a huge posterity in daughters languages of I-E origin, associated with "shout"; "noise", "glory" (Latin << **klor-i ???):
    not stupid at all because latine knew a lot of evolutions K- >> G- without any explanation at this date, if not a dead ancient dialect based on a pre-I-E sunstratum)
    we can find: sanskrit usà-kalah "rooster", "cock" calling down - Greek kaleô "to call" "to hail" >> ekklêsia "meeting by calling"/"convocation" >> Lat- ecclesia >> église, iglesia, gleisa, chiesa "church" - Lat calare "to call" >> calendae - intercalare/intercaler + >> clamor >> clameur, chiamare / llamar Engl- "claim"- Germ- hellan >> to "hail" > "hello" - plus with a meaning shift "clear sound" to light colour Lat clarus >> clair, chiaro, claro, clar, clarté + clairon Germ- hell, Helle "light" >> hallen "to resound" "to reverberate" >> *s-k-l schallen "to ring' 'to sound" classis ("class"): "call/convocation of troops etc... a.s.o...

    concerning Vlak/Vla(k)h - Slav- could propose the alternances vlaši / vlakhi:vlahi or vlasi / vlaki - if Slavs say Vlasi so the origin was vlaki for them
    romance speakers could have had vlahi/valah based on a germanic pronounciation *wal(a)h - vlosi is a possible alternative to vlasi -

    ##vlos or vles
    "hair" seems coming from a *w-l we find in vela, voile "sail", "veil", velu "strongly haired", velours, maybe wool /wolle - olan / folan / gwlan "wool" -
    -

  23. #23
    Advisor LeBrok's Avatar
    Join Date
    18-11-09
    Location
    Calgary
    Posts
    10,295

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b Z2109
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H1c

    Ethnic group
    Citizen of the world
    Country: Canada-Alberta



    Quote Originally Posted by MOESAN View Post

    concerning Vlak/Vla(k)h - Slav- could propose the alternances vlaši / vlakhi:vlahi or vlasi / vlaki - if Slavs say Vlasi so the origin was vlaki for them
    romance speakers could have had vlahi/valah based on a germanic pronounciation *wal(a)h - vlosi is a possible alternative to vlasi -

    ##vlos or vles
    "hair" seems coming from a *w-l we find in vela, voile "sail", "veil", velu "strongly haired", velours, maybe wool /wolle - olan / folan / gwlan "wool" -
    -
    Interesting, perhaps the word describes celtic/Italic people of Valahia dressed in tartans, wool clothing, or even sheep skins?

  24. #24
    Elite member
    Join Date
    25-10-11
    Location
    Brittany
    Age
    72
    Posts
    4,863

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b - L21/S145*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H3c

    Ethnic group
    more celtic
    Country: France



    Quote Originally Posted by LeBrok View Post
    Interesting, perhaps the word describes celtic/Italic people of Valahia dressed in tartans, wool clothing, or even sheep skins?
    not stupid (we have some surprises when we look at namings and semantic evolutions) - but at this stage of MY knowledge I prefer considering the name of these foreign people (foreign for the others who named them) as derivated from the Volcae celtic tribe... it is, I think, the "official current" scholar view?

  25. #25
    Elite member
    Join Date
    25-10-11
    Location
    Brittany
    Age
    72
    Posts
    4,863

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b - L21/S145*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H3c

    Ethnic group
    more celtic
    Country: France



    Quote Originally Posted by MOESAN View Post
    this *K-l >> *kel- /*kle- root seems having a huge posterity in daughters languages of I-E origin, associated with "shout"; "noise", "glory" (Latin << **klor-i ???):
    not stupid at all because latine knew a lot of evolutions K- >> G- without any explanation at this date, if not a dead ancient dialect based on a pre-I-E sunstratum)
    we can find: sanskrit usà-kalah "rooster", "cock" calling down - Greek kaleô "to call" "to hail" >> ekklêsia "meeting by calling"/"convocation" >> Lat- ecclesia >> église, iglesia, gleisa, chiesa "church" - Lat calare "to call" >> calendae - intercalare/intercaler + >> clamor >> clameur, chiamare / llamar Engl- "claim"- Germ- hellan >> to "hail" > "hello" - plus with a meaning shift "clear sound" to light colour Lat clarus >> clair, chiaro, claro, clar, clarté + clairon Germ- hell, Helle "light" >> hallen "to resound" "to reverberate" >> *s-k-l schallen "to ring' 'to sound" classis ("class"): "call/convocation of troops etc... a.s.o...

    concerning Vlak/Vla(k)h - Slav- could propose the alternances vlaši / vlakhi:vlahi or vlasi / vlaki - if Slavs say Vlasi so the origin was vlaki for them
    romance speakers could have had vlahi/valah based on a germanic pronounciation *wal(a)h - vlosi is a possible alternative to vlasi -

    ##vlos or vles
    "hair" seems coming from a *w-l we find in vela, voile "sail", "veil", velu "strongly haired", velours, maybe wool /wolle - olan / folan / gwlan "wool" -
    -
    I answer myself here: no big danger, except an access of Altzheimer lost of memory - and I remarked I was full of sympathy for myself -
    here some addenda if it could show the richess of I-Ean words not visible at first sight

    I was persuaded I had finished concerning the I-Ean root *K-l-(w) linked to the meanings of «noise», «sound», «shout», «hearing» and «fame», «glory» but I found some more akin words:

    in Slavic languages I put slava and slovo (sensible bet) -

    looking at verbs I found too: slùšat' / słyszeć / slušati / čuja / slušati = «to hear», the meaning «to listen is rended by the same words, only polish and czech giving: słuchać / shližeti (this last one, spite some ressemblance, could be a «son» of a supposed *s-glig- «sharp noise», «metallic sound» <???> see Germ- *kling- clang», german klang/klingen by loan >>french clinquant, quincaille (clinquaille), clenche, déclencher, english «clink») - just a bet!!!

    in Germanic languages I put words like: loud / laut / luid + icelandic hljóð= «noise», «voice» -

    I can add: to listen / zuhören / luisteren / lytte / lytte / lyssna + icelandic hlusta = «to listen» ... (hlýðinn = «obediant» («who listen»!) - the problem is that except in icelandic for all words and in danish only for hv- (*khw-) the modern germanic languages show no spelling remnant of the old I-Ean *K- before liquid consonnants -

Page 1 of 5 123 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •