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Thread: Questions on my Y-DNA Haplogroup T

  1. #876
    Regular Member Huracan's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    T1a2-CTS1848
    MtDNA haplogroup
    L3e2b

    Ethnic group
    Spanish
    Country: United States



    2 members found this post helpful.
    Was recently able to trace my paternal line to ~1700s in the Canary Islands, Spain. Updated my info on FTDNA. Based on oral histories and genealogies of other Fundora families, this was expected as the Canaries served as a notable source of Fundora's who migrated to Cuba or elsewhere. In trying to find the ultimate mainland source, people have told me Asturias in Northern Spain may be the origin place of the surname. Perhaps that is where my paternal line ultimately hails from...

    So this officially links my CTS1848 line to Spain
    Last edited by Huracan; 16-11-20 at 16:40.

  2. #877
    Regular Member torzio's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    T1a2 - SK1480
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H95a

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    North Italian
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    Quote Originally Posted by Huracan View Post
    Was recently able to trace my paternal line to ~1700s in the Canary Islands, Spain. Updated my info on FTDNA. Based on oral histories and genealogies of other Fundora families, this was expected as the Canaries served as a notable source of Fundora's who migrated to Cuba or elsewhere. In trying to find the ultimate mainland source, people have told me Asturias in Northern Spain may be the origin place of the surname. Perhaps that is where my paternal line ultimately hails from...

    So this officially links my CTS1848 line to Spain

    your marker does not appear to be

    Ancient Canary Islanders (Guanches)
    Fathers mtdna ... T2b17
    Grandfather mtdna ... T1a1e
    Sons mtdna ... K1a4o
    Mum paternal line ... R1b-S8172
    Grandmum paternal side ... I1d1-P109
    Wife paternal line ... R1a-Z282

  3. #878
    Regular Member Huracan's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    T1a2-CTS1848
    MtDNA haplogroup
    L3e2b

    Ethnic group
    Spanish
    Country: United States



    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by torzio View Post
    your marker does not appear to be

    Ancient Canary Islanders (Guanches)
    No, it definitely is not Guanche or native Canary Islander. It was most definitely introduced via Spanish colonization of the islands.
    Last edited by Huracan; 19-11-20 at 16:48.

  4. #879
    Regular Member torzio's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
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    MtDNA haplogroup
    H95a

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    1 members found this post helpful.
    Another 2 x T1a that are distant matches to myself

    Christian Burtscher


    Francesco Antonio Onorato (1727 - 1806) Lucania, Italy

    .................................................. .....................

    others of T1a2 not linked to myself, but close for my snp


    Carl August Zimmerling b.1834 from North-Tyrol


    Hans Caspar Gräser; b1660 from Nosellari, Trento, Trentino-South Tyrol, Italy

  5. #880
    Regular Member Salento's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
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    H12a

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    Quote Originally Posted by torzio View Post
    Another 2 x T1a that are distant matches to myself

    Christian Burtscher


    Francesco Antonio Onorato (1727 - 1806) Lucania, Italy

    .................................................. .....................

    others of T1a2 not linked to myself, but close for my snp


    Carl August Zimmerling b.1834 from North-Tyrol


    Hans Caspar Gräser; b1660 from Nosellari, Trento, Trentino-South Tyrol, Italy
    There should be a few T1a2 (SK1480) in Lucania (Basilicata), ... some relatives fled there after WW2 (wrong side of history) until the Amnesty, ... the usual :)
    one of them met his wife and had a family, he didn’t go back to Puglia, ...

  6. #881
    Regular Member torzio's Avatar
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    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Salento View Post
    There should be a few T1a2 (SK1480) in Lucania (Basilicata), ... some relatives fled there after WW2 (wrong side of history) until the Amnesty, ... the usual :)
    one of them met his wife and had a family, he didn’t go back to Puglia, ...

    thanks

    I got a message that the person came from Foggia or Molise

    the surname comes from these 2 area

    Biccari, Foggia, Italy
    Alberona, Foggia, Italy

    I was also given this as his parents

    Vincenzo Onorato, Rachele Verdorato

    Usually ato surname endings are Veneti....same as endings with lin, otto, acco and gher to name a few ...................not to say that Vincenzo was Veneto , because he seems complete foggian

  7. #882
    Regular Member torzio's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
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    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by torzio View Post
    thanks

    I got a message that the person came from Foggia or Molise

    the surname comes from these 2 area

    Biccari, Foggia, Italy
    Alberona, Foggia, Italy

    I was also given this as his parents

    Vincenzo Onorato, Rachele Verdorato

    Usually ato surname endings are Veneti....same as endings with lin, otto, acco and gher to name a few ...................not to say that Vincenzo was Veneto , because he seems complete foggian

    had to recheck ...I was slightly wrong




    my cousin, my wife on the border of veneti and friuli have endings of

    t, and olo


    then there is also lin endings
    Guidolin
    Santolin
    Michielin .....................all after christian names , Michiel being Michele in venetian

  8. #883
    Regular Member torzio's Avatar
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    1 members found this post helpful.
    new yfull matches



    they have me confirm SK1480 , but Yfull do not use it
    Known SNPs at this position:
    SK1480 A to G YB

    I lost my notes on samples NA20758 ........it says TSI ( toscani ) but I think it is Apulia.....one of these below

    TB9PE Benedetto Bari, Italy
    13 22 13 10 13 13 11 12 11 14 13 30 16 8 9 11 12 26 15 19 33 11 11 15 16 10 12 23 24 16 13 18 17 34 34 13 9


    YSU4S Da Lessio Salerno, Italy
    13 22 13 10 13 13 11 12 11 14 13 30 16 9 9 11 12 27 15 19 35 11 11 15 16 10 11 23 25 16 13 19 16 34 34 14 9 12 11 15 11 8 17 17 8 11 10 8 12 11 20 20 17 10 12 12 15 8 26 21 11 12 14 10 11 12 11

  9. #884
    Regular Member torzio's Avatar
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    1 members found this post helpful.
    Benedetto I know married a german woman

    Da Lessio can also be Alessio as I have spoken to a woman who runs the line ............but I think the original surname was lessio

    https://www.antenati-italiani.org/it/cognomi/8234-lessio


    https://www.cognomix.it/mappe-dei-co...taliani/LESSIO

  10. #885
    Regular Member Salento's Avatar
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    1 members found this post helpful.
    probably: ... D’Alesssio ... :)

    Il mio ... :



  11. #886
    Regular Member torzio's Avatar
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    1 members found this post helpful.
    Last edited by torzio; 23-12-20 at 02:53.

  12. #887
    Regular Member Salento's Avatar
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    ... Stratford ... go by I-95 or nicer Merritt Parkway to get to New York

  13. #888
    Regular Member torzio's Avatar
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    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Salento View Post
    ... Stratford ... go by I-95 or nicer Merritt Parkway to get to New York

    this one is the latest with the new updated snp

    compare the last two

    post 886 to post 883

  14. #889
    Regular Member torzio's Avatar
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    A new yfull match for myself


    James Carson b. 1765 England YF13207 T-BY45377



    hmm, Carson ......from the Good, the Bad and the Ugly film........did he hide the gold

  15. #890
    Regular Member Huracan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by torzio View Post
    Yfull has just given me a new branch under Z19945
    with a Pole and an ancient trentino/South Tyrol sample
    Because there are 3 different non family samples it has been accepted so it is
    T - BY143483


    @torzio, how do you know the ERS sample grouped with you and the Pole (Bartosiak) is from Trentino/South Tyrol? It only lists Cagliari, Sardinia as its origin

  16. #891
    Regular Member torzio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Huracan View Post
    @torzio, how do you know the ERS sample grouped with you and the Pole (Bartosiak) is from Trentino/South Tyrol? It only lists Cagliari, Sardinia as its origin
    I state that ERS is a sardinian who matches another sample in Trentino surname erspamer
    https://www.italianames.com/italian-...-maps/ERSPAMER



    The Pole is not from trentino.......we chat regularly on messenger, he states he is currently living in old prusi lands -.......old prussians near the baltic sea , east of Gdansk
    He states his ancestors are thuringians

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thuringia

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Prussians

    he is an engineer on a merchant boat , trading between Poland and Britain

  17. #892
    Regular Member torzio's Avatar
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    183663
    Erspamer Giovanni ERSPAMER, b. 1704 (Malosco, Italy) Italy T-M70



    this site is so crap in updating ones messages

  18. #893
    Regular Member torzio's Avatar
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    http://freepages.rootsweb.com/~berta...72.html#I18790

    I have a distant DNA connection with this line from link above

    Erspamer, Giovanni Giuseppe (1826 - 1903) - male
    b. 19 Mar 1826
    d. 23 Sep 1903 in Fondo,Trento,Trentino,Italy

    father: Erspamer, Giovanni (*1787 - >1835)
    mother: Sartori, Marianna (1791 - 1875)
    spouse: Pretol, Maria (1841 - 1887)

  19. #894
    Regular Member Huracan's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
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    L3e2b

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    Spanish
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    Quote Originally Posted by torzio View Post
    I state that ERS is a sardinian who matches another sample in Trentino surname erspamer
    https://www.italianames.com/italian-...-maps/ERSPAMER
    Thanks that is interesting.

    So is the Erspamer individual (#183663) positive for your same SNP SK1480? or BY143483?

  20. #895
    Regular Member torzio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Huracan View Post
    Thanks that is interesting.

    So is the Erspamer individual (#183663) positive for your same SNP SK1480? or BY143483?
    not sure .....more analysis needs to be done

    he is a T1a2 -L446


    check also the old swiss Ulrich , also T1a2


  21. #896
    Regular Member torzio's Avatar
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    1 members found this post helpful.
    4 members of the group below match me in level 0 or 1 , others do not appear





    more info below


    https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Hill-3101

  22. #897
    Regular Member Huracan's Avatar
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    I used SAPP (https://www.jdvsite.com) to create a Y-STR tree of CTS11984/CTS54 to get an idea about origin and dispersal. I specified in my input the currently known positive and negative SNPs for each sample and the program did the rest. It is in high agreement with YFull dates and organization. The red annotations are predictions based on timing and the patterns I see. It suggests CTS11984 originated in Central Europe ≥3,000 ybp, suggesting a connection to the Bronze Age expansion of Indo-Europeans such as the Celts, Italics, Illyrians, etc.

    CTS54 tree p1.jpg CTS54 root with CTS8489 and CTS8862

    CTS54 tree p2.jpgFirst CTS54* branch: the UK individuals (Powell, etc.)

    CTS54 tree p3.jpgCTS8862* and Y17493 branch (Knox, etc.)

    CTS54 tree p4.jpg CTS1848 branch (those cut off are Pereira [Azores] on the left and two Bernot individuals at the bottom)
    Last edited by Huracan; 03-01-21 at 18:10.

  23. #898
    Regular Member Huracan's Avatar
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    1 members found this post helpful.
    Sorry about the poor image quality. Trying to see how to share a higher resolution one.

  24. #899
    Regular Member torzio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Huracan View Post
    I used SAPP (https://www.jdvsite.com) to create a Y-STR tree of CTS11984/CTS54 to get an idea about origin and dispersal. I specified in my input the currently known positive and negative SNPs for each sample and the program did the rest. It is in high agreement with YFull dates and organization. The red annotations are predictions based on timing and the patterns I see. It suggests CTS11984 originated in Central Europe ≥3,000 ybp, suggesting a connection to the Bronze Age expansion of Indo-Europeans such as the Celts, Italics, Illyrians, etc.

    Attachment 12509
    attachment does not work for me.....it says, ask administrator

  25. #900
    Regular Member Huracan's Avatar
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    CTS54 tree p5.jpg
    Last part: the rest of Z19945 (not including CTS1848) showing BY143483, the Ashkenazi group (PAGES00113) and the Brooks/Curtiss group

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