Questions on my Y-DNA Haplogroup T

Great to see more Z19945 individuals are being identified. Is Wolf in the Y-DNA T group results page? I do not see him among us...
he is kit B239544
they have not ungraded the T project yet

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...........................
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I will post names of 3 more Z19945 in the following week , all east-german, czech, pole ...............they are not part of the T project
 
Recent Ancestors V2 (Admixture Studio)

AWlaMyQ.jpg
 
Y-DNA Ancestral Origins by Country

None of these matches are labeled T-Z19945.

They vary from T-M70 to T-CTS8862.

I guess the resemblance goes back thousands of years.

(Got a message saying they're updating the Haplogroups at FTDNA, soon).

QXxHqDh.jpg
 
I already submitted a paper which states Messapic was an east balkan language ............we need to find out who the Iapgians are as Measspic are Iapgian people of Italy
The Iapygians lived in Puglia, and were divided in three populations: the Daunians, Peucetians and Messapians.
@Sile The Iapygians-Illyrians connection, probably :)

GBxfBnd.jpg
 
@Sile The Iapygians-Illyrians connection, probably :)

GBxfBnd.jpg

The Iapydes (or Iapodes, Japodes) [Greek,"Ιάποδες"] were an ancient people who dwelt north of and inland from the Liburnians, off the Adriatic coast and eastwards of the Istrian peninsula. The first written mention of an Illyrian tribe known as "Iapydes" is by Hecataeus of Miletus.
.
Messapic

These tribes (Iapygian or Messapic tribes) did not dwell in Illyria, but in the heel of southern Italy. They could have had Illyrian origins[143] or some sort of link with Illyria.

Messapii
Dauni
Peucetii linked to the Liburnian Peucetias
Iapyges linked to the Iapodes, who were sometimes also called Iapyges
.
.
Are these messapic Iapyges the ones that came from near the Liburnians....the Iapodes ??
 
SZ36 (T1a1...) and CL23 (T1a2 L446) according to MyTrueAncestry:

SZ36 is my Top Archaeogenetic match in 2 of my Kits.

SZ36

1. Central Roman (590 AD) (11.64)
FTFOgli.jpg

Modern Group
1. Tuscan (2.937)
2. North_Italian (8.213)
3. West_Sicilian (8.444)
4. Kosovan (8.963)
5. Italian_Abruzzo (9.271)
6. Greek (9.454)
7. Greek_Thessaly (10.26)
8. East_Sicilian (12.06)


CL23

Medieval Iberian (670 AD) (23.26)

QNB0aeu.jpg


Modern Group
1. North_Italian (10.06)
2. Spanish_Andalucia (10.28)
3. Spanish_Valencia (11.60)
4. Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha (11.71)
5. Spanish_Extremadura (11.72)
6. Spanish_Murcia (11.87)
7. Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon (12.57)
8. Spanish_Cataluna (12.89)



My K36 Ancient results:

RD3Hdbn.jpg
 
SZ36 (T1a1...) and CL23 (T1a2 L446) according to MyTrueAncestry:

SZ36 is my Top Archaeogenetic match in 2 of my Kits.

SZ36

1. Central Roman (590 AD) (11.64)
FTFOgli.jpg

Modern Group
1. Tuscan (2.937)
2. North_Italian (8.213)
3. West_Sicilian (8.444)
4. Kosovan (8.963)
5. Italian_Abruzzo (9.271)
6. Greek (9.454)
7. Greek_Thessaly (10.26)
8. East_Sicilian (12.06)


CL23

Medieval Iberian (670 AD) (23.26)

QNB0aeu.jpg


Modern Group
1. North_Italian (10.06)
2. Spanish_Andalucia (10.28)
3. Spanish_Valencia (11.60)
4. Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha (11.71)
5. Spanish_Extremadura (11.72)
6. Spanish_Murcia (11.87)
7. Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon (12.57)
8. Spanish_Cataluna (12.89)



My K36 Ancient results:

RD3Hdbn.jpg

mine

Closest population distances

Population Distance

EMA_north-Italian_NW_54 1.197928
CL36_north-Italian 1.237396
CL57_north-Italian 1.330768
SZ28_north-Italian 1.438457
SZ43_north-Italian 1.541763
CL63_Alpine 1.577491
SZ37_Greek-Italian 1.615911
BA_Hungary_BR2 1.63093


how different are we and we are both T1a2 ..................clearly our T has been in Europe a very very long time
 
mine

Closest population distances

Population Distance

EMA_north-Italian_NW_54 1.197928
CL36_north-Italian 1.237396
CL57_north-Italian 1.330768
SZ28_north-Italian 1.438457
SZ43_north-Italian 1.541763
CL63_Alpine 1.577491
SZ37_Greek-Italian 1.615911
BA_Hungary_BR2 1.63093


how different are we and we are both T1a2 ..................clearly our T has been in Europe a very very long time

a curiousity

Yfull has this for snp Z19945

T-Z19945Z19945formed 3100 ybp, TMRCA 3100 ybp

so, 3100- ybp 1950 = 1150BCE .............this is the exact year that Venetic speaking people where known in Eastern alps ( as per studies by Elisa Perego , oxford univ )

https://journals.openedition.org/mefra/2503

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/269939561_Magic_and_Ritual_in_Iron_Age_Veneto_Italy


It’s possible that Z19945 developed in E.Alps, or it could also be Salento.

I don’t see why not, it’s all conjecture and coincidence.

That’s more than 3100 yeas ago.

You looked for differences, I looked for similarities instead.

You match some of my Ancient Samples too.

My K36 Ancient:

CL25_south_Italian 1.325678
SZ40_Italian 1.332341
CL31_Greek_Balkan 1.55981
SZ36_north-Italian 1.56524
EMA_Greek-Balkan_AEH_1 1.579821
SZ19_Italian-Balkan 1.634897
CL36_north-Italian 1.655377
SZ37_Greek-Italian 1.671724





 
The Iapydes (or Iapodes, Japodes) [Greek,"Ιάποδες"] were an ancient people who dwelt north of and inland from the Liburnians, off the Adriatic coast and eastwards of the Istrian peninsula. The first written mention of an Illyrian tribe known as "Iapydes" is by Hecataeus of Miletus.
.
Messapic

These tribes (Iapygian or Messapic tribes) did not dwell in Illyria, but in the heel of southern Italy. They could have had Illyrian origins[143] or some sort of link with Illyria.

Messapii
Dauni
Peucetii linked to the Liburnian Peucetias
Iapyges linked to the Iapodes, who were sometimes also called Iapyges
.
.
Are these messapic Iapyges the ones that came from near the Liburnians....the Iapodes ??


Whomever wrote that Iapygians or Messapi didn’t “dwell” in Illyria, needs to see this:


thiGZLF.jpg


xPyt5sV.jpg


GBxfBnd.jpg


E9g1CUp.jpg
 
It’s possible that Z19945 developed in E.Alps, or it could also be Salento.
I don’t see why not, it’s all conjecture and coincidence.
That’s more than 3100 yeas ago.
You looked for differences, I looked for similarities instead.
You match some of my Ancient Samples too.

My K36 Ancient:

CL25_south_Italian 1.325678
SZ40_Italian 1.332341
CL31_Greek_Balkan 1.55981
SZ36_north-Italian 1.56524
EMA_Greek-Balkan_AEH_1 1.579821
SZ19_Italian-Balkan 1.634897
CL36_north-Italian 1.655377
SZ37_Greek-Italian 1.671724





Iapydes/Iapygians/Illyrians could be the source of Z19945
One group went to south italy and the other to eastern alps
 
Iapodes/Illyrians could be the source of Z19945
One group went to south italy and the other to eastern alps

It’s possible, maybe 2 bros had a fight and said: “that’s it, I go South and you go North, ... and don’t follow me!” LOL :)
 
It’s possible, maybe 2 bros had a fight and said: “that’s it, I go South and you go North, ... and don’t follow me!” LOL :)

References at bottom in wiki thread
Iapygian-tarentni wars are interesting
 
Y-haplogroups and your closest match on Mytrueancestry.com may not be exactly equivalent; my haplogroup is R1a and my closest match is Bell Beaker Scotland, 2150 BC. If they ever found R1a in Bell Beaker...Carlos Quiles would have a stroke.
 

... and that makes two Colonial Era T-Z19945 in CT (Brooks and Curtiss).

I’m the first newcomer to the US from my family, so there can’t be any recent connection.

Another T1a2-z19945 match in ftdna
John Brooks .......check link for the john with 3g in his name
https://www.tributaries.info/ui49.htm#a2
his father John 1g ..........is from Windsor, Connecticut.......the same place as the family named Drake from Windsor, Connecticut. They where also haplogroup T
 
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