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Thread: The Mediterranean route into Europe (Paschou et al. 2014)

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    Quote Originally Posted by joeyc View Post
    ROFL? An American triracial mulatto talking about Egyptian slaves in Italy?

    First of all, the Italian peninsula was already heavily urbanized and satured well before Rome expanded in the East. It was not like Brazil or Alabama which were completely empty and needed hordes of slaves.

    Better watch for your Iberian masters who were active in the shipping of African slaves in the last 1.500 years with their Moorish and Jewish buddies, with all the obvious mixing.
    Too bad that it's actually American and European (even some Italian ones) historians who keep pointing out the large numbers of Asiatic and African slaves and free citizens in Roman Italy, and not just the "American triracial mulattoes" of your racist rants, "Joey". BTW, weren't you already banned before? What are you doing here again?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drac II View Post
    Too bad that it's actually American and European (even some Italian ones) historians who keep pointing out the large numbers of Asiatic and African slaves and free citizens in Roman Italy, and not just the "American triracial mulattoes" of your racist rants, "Joey". BTW, weren't you already banned before? What are you doing here again?

    You got a point, there were some emperors who came from north Africa and west Asia, I don't remember the names of the north African emperors, but a good example for a west Asian one was Philip the Arab, who came from the Roman province of Arabia.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drac II View Post
    Too bad that it's actually American and European (even some Italian ones) historians who keep pointing out the large numbers of Asiatic and African slaves and free citizens in Roman Italy, and not just the "American triracial mulattoes" of your racist rants, "Joey". BTW, weren't you already banned before? What are you doing here again?
    All debunked non scientific stuff from deluded nordicists like Arthur Kemp. Whereas your Iberian masters were very active in the African slave trade with their North African/Arab friends, with all the obvious mixing, my mulatto friend.

    Do you actually know that they have found a copper age Iberian farmer who was genetically very similar to modern mainland Italians? I guess he was one of those milions of slaves who invaded Italy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LeBrok View Post
    Egypt has direct connections to Crete (also known from Minoan civilization records), but surprisingly to Sicily too. I know Egypt was producing lots of food for Rome. Perhaps Sicily was a shipping hub?

    Equally surprising are the extensive connections from Palestine to Europe. It might be indication for the whole Near East. I would gladly want to see connections from Lebanon (old Phoenician), but they missed this important spot, and also Varna and Cucuteni cultures, coastal Bulgaria and Romania. A bit disappointing in sight selection.

    East Rumelia, the land above Rodope mountains from Pontos sea to Aimos Mountains, Varna is included.
    part of today Turkey and Bulgaria the antique Odrysse Thrace
    ΟΘΕΝ ΑΙΔΩΣ OY EINAI
    ΑΤΗ ΛΑΜΒΑΝΕΙΝ ΑΥΤΟΙΣ
    ΥΒΡΙΣ ΓΕΝΝΑΤΑΙ
    ΝΕΜΕΣΙΣ ΚΑΙ ΤΙΣΗ ΑΚΟΛΟΥΘΟΥΣΙ ΔΕ

    When there is no shame
    Divine blindness conquers them
    Hybris (abuse, opprombium) is born
    Nemesis and punishment follows.

    Εχε υπομονη Ηρωα
    Η τιμωρια δεν αργει.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post
    East Rumelia, the land above Rodope mountains from Pontos sea to Aimos Mountains, Varna is included.
    part of today Turkey and Bulgaria the antique Odrysse Thrace
    Glad to see somebody bringing this thread back to topic.

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    Quote Originally Posted by joeyc View Post
    All debunked non scientific stuff from deluded nordicists like Arthur Kemp. Whereas your Iberian masters were very active in the African slave trade with their North African/Arab friends, with all the obvious mixing, my mulatto friend.

    Do you actually know that they have found a copper age Iberian farmer who was genetically very similar to modern mainland Italians? I guess he was one of those milions of slaves who invaded Italy.
    "Debunked" only in your dreams, my delusional friend, plus on top of that none of them were "Nordicists", and one of the scholars (Mommsen) that Kemp quotes even won a Nobel Prize for his work on Roman history, a work which is still consulted by modern scholars on the subject. Arthur Kemp, the only one of the people who you have in mind who in fact is a Nordicist, had it very easy when he consulted those actual historians of Rome seeking to back up his beliefs, he did not need to look around too much for what he wanted to find since the historians who point out those things are very common and easy to find. On the other hand, he hardly found anything regarding his silly claims about medieval Iberia backed up by any specialists in the history of the area since most of them do not say what he wanted to hear when it comes to demographics.

    Regarding the African slave trade: practically all of Western Europe -including Italy- was involved in it, so moot point.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drac II View Post
    "Debunked" only in your dreams, my delusional friend, plus on top of that none of them were "Nordicists", and one of the scholars (Mommsen) that Kemp quotes even won a Nobel Prize for his work on Roman history, a work which is still consulted by modern scholars on the subject. Arthur Kemp, the only one of the people who you have in mind who in fact is a Nordicist, had it very easy when he consulted those actual historians of Rome seeking to back up his beliefs, he did not need to look around too much for what he wanted to find since the historians who point out those things are very common and easy to find. On the other hand, he hardly found anything regarding his silly claims about medieval Iberia backed up by any specialists in the history of the area since most of them do not say what he wanted to hear when it comes to demographics.
    Yeah debunked nonsense from the XIX century. Written by a German. LOL. Even Obama won a Nobel Prize, go figure.

    Still you have not answered how is it possible that a copper age Iberian farmer was so similar to modern mainland Italians. Was he one of those milions of slaves?

    Quote Originally Posted by Drac II View Post
    Regarding the African slave trade: practically all of Western Europe -including Italy- was involved in it, so moot point.
    Iberia was the center of the Atlantic slave trade for centuries. Only an American mulatto could deny that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by joeyc View Post
    Still you have not answered how is it possible that a copper age Iberian farmer was so similar to modern mainland Italians. Was he one of those milions of slaves?
    There you are the explanation for this "similarity", although I know it is useless to make you understand: http://eurogenes.blogspot.com.au/201...cient-dna.html

    To summarize, what the original study you're referring to was pointing out, was simply a Southern European-like similarity, which could also be Sardinian or Basque. Don't forget they did not even include any modern Iberian samples, but still doesn't matter for those who really understand the implications derived from the employed methodology of the PCA plot you're using as clear proof of your agenda. So I immediately exclude you from this group, it just will be helpful for other forumers.

    Quoting the paper, this is what the author states when it comes to similarities (no misinterpretations): The Neolithic Iberian individual was genetically similar to Scandinavian Neolithic farmers

    Balanced and objective as expected from an academic abstract: http://www.diva-portal.org/smash/rec...d=diva2:667495

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    Quote Originally Posted by Knovas View Post
    There you are the explanation for this "similarity", although I know it is useless to make you understand: http://eurogenes.blogspot.com.au/201...cient-dna.html

    To summarize, what the original study you're referring to was pointing out, was simply a Southern European-like similarity, which could also be Sardinian or Basque. Don't forget they did not even include any modern Iberian samples, but still doesn't matter for those who really understand the implications derived from the employed methodology of the PCA plot you're using as clear proof of your agenda. So I immediately exclude you from this group, it just will be helpful for other forumers.
    LOL a genome blogger. Do not make me laugh.

    I don't see how the lack of modern Iberian samples is important.

    Quote Originally Posted by Knovas View Post
    Quoting the paper, this is what the author states when it comes to similarities (no misinterpretations): The Neolithic Iberian individual was genetically similar to Scandinavian Neolithic farmers

    Balanced and objective as expected from an academic abstract: http://www.diva-portal.org/smash/rec...d=diva2:667495
    He was closer to Scandinavian farmers than to Mesolitich hunther gatherers. Of course Tuscans are genetically closer to Sardinians than to North Eastern Europeans. From the paper.

    There are major genetic similarities between the Scandinavian farmer, the Iberianfarmer, and Ötzi, who all cluster with contemporary southern Europeans (see Figure
    13B).

    Similarly, the Scandinavian Neolithic hunter-gatherers and Mesolithic Iberian
    all have genetic affinities towards contemporary Northern Europeans. The farmers
    can be considered to form a “farmer” cluster separated from the “hunter-gatherer”
    cluster, e.g. the gene-pool of hunter-gatherers. The fact that the Iberian farmer
    clusters closely with contemporary southern Europeans in contrast to Iberian
    Mesolithic individuals suggest an early colonization of Iberia and (at least one) later
    distinct migration event.

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    Quote Originally Posted by joeyc View Post
    Yeah debunked nonsense from the XIX century. Written by a German. LOL. Even Obama won a Nobel Prize, go figure.
    Nah, wishful thinking on your part. Plus it also includes a whole bunch of scholars on the same subject from the 20th and 21st century who reached very similar conclusions as the 19th century ones, based on all the historical evidence at their disposal.

    Obama won a Nobel on something completely different. Mommsen is the only man to ever have won a Nobel for a work on history. Comparing apples with oranges.


    Still you have not answered how is it possible that a copper age Iberian farmer was so similar to modern mainland Italians. Was he one of those milions of slaves?
    Possibly because it is pretty irrelevant to the subject, plus Knovas is clarifying that for you.

    Iberia was the center of the Atlantic slave trade for centuries. Only an American mulatto could deny that.
    No, not "Iberia", mostly Portugal was, but then Holland and England jumped in as well and got deeply involved in the same trade to compete with the Portuguese. Plus Italy was another client of these slave trading nations, just like Spain was. Only a paranoid Italian with an agenda would deny this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drac II View Post
    Possibly because it is pretty irrelevant to the subject, plus Knovas is clarifying that for you.
    What a waste of time. Reading comprehension below zero (added to other evident problems).

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    Gentlemen, here is an official warning to all. Derogatory statements towards other Eupedia members, or referring to mulatos, blacks or slaves as a lesser human being, or suggestion of shameful relation to both, will be treated with demerit points and eventually with a banhammer.
    Be wary of people who tend to glorify the past, underestimate the present, and demonize the future.

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    Quote Originally Posted by joeyc View Post
    LOL a genome blogger. Do not make me laugh.

    I don't see how the lack of modern Iberian samples is important.



    He was closer to Scandinavian farmers than to Mesolitich hunther gatherers. Of course Tuscans are genetically closer to Sardinians than to North Eastern Europeans. From the paper.
    is this person you refer to the 4000bc old neolithic farmer in basque area who has nearly the same markers as an etruscan
    Neolithic farmers from the site of El Portalón
    a Chalcolithic Iberian farmer from Atapuerca
    có che un pòpoło no 'l defende pi ła só łéngua el xe prónto par èser s'ciavo

    when a people no longer dares to defend its language it is ripe for slavery.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LeBrok View Post
    Gentlemen, here is an official warning to all. Derogatory statements towards other Eupedia members, or referring to mulatos, blacks or slaves as a lesser human being, or suggestion of shameful relation to both, will be treated with demerit points and eventually with a banhammer.
    the term Mulatto is not Derogatory, its the general term for a child of a mixed marriage of a white and black person, you find this term in every registry and census................it would only be derogatory if it was used in reference for a child of a marriage of a white and yellow mix.
    children of anglo-indian marriages are neither referred to as a mulatto....but simply angloindian

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sile View Post
    the term Mulatto is not Derogatory, its the general term for a child of a mixed marriage of a white and black person, you find this term in every registry and census................it would only be derogatory if it was used in reference for a child of a marriage of a white and yellow mix.
    children of anglo-indian marriages are neither referred to as a mulatto....but simply angloindian
    Read again relevant posts.

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    nothing just another mistake of me

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sile View Post
    the term Mulatto is not Derogatory, its the general term for a child of a mixed marriage of a white and black person, you find this term in every registry and census................it would only be derogatory if it was used in reference for a child of a marriage of a white and yellow mix.
    children of anglo-indian marriages are neither referred to as a mulatto....but simply angloindian
    The term itself is not offensive, but the way characters like "Joey" use it is with obvious offensive intention.

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