Eupedia Forums
Site NavigationEupedia Top > Eupedia Forum & Japan Forum
Page 6 of 56 FirstFirst ... 4567816 ... LastLast
Results 126 to 150 of 1384

Thread: Free and independent Kurdistan is coming soon.

  1. #126
    Banned
    Join Date
    22-02-13
    Posts
    553


    Country: Albania



    Quote Originally Posted by Goga View Post
    It's all about the survival. Kurds have their own interests. Kurds (children of the Medes) from Kurdistan (land of the Sun & Fire) will choose what is the best for them. We survived for thousands of years. We survived in much more difficult times. And of course, this time we will survive too. There're 50 million Kurds! No matter what, there will be a free independent Great Kurdistan. Personally I do believe that an alliance with Russia & Persia are the best for Kurdish interests. And that one day Kurdistan and Persia will make a pact and form some kind of an 'Iranian Union'. Persian and Kurds together will be very strong. It's obvious that the Turks & Sunni Arabs are the biggest enemies of the 'Iranic race'. I sincerely hope that Kurdish leaders will go through this path…
    I don't quite get your point!
    That an independent Kurdish state is a legitimate dream I get that. Now dreams sometimes come true sometimes not. I hope Kurdish dream of an independent state comes true. But Union with Iran? Iran is assimilating its Kurds within its borders. That means in a few centuries they will be proud Iranians. If you join Iran they will make sure you speak their language and have a mullah as the head of state. So if you want to become someone else what's the point of independence?
    Turkey is a major player and an important USA partner. Knowing that Greece, Bulgaria and Serbia have strong cultural and economic ties with Russia, mutual sympathy for each other and strong economic ties, do you really think USA will throw Turkey under the bus for an Iraqi Kurdistan?
    There are 65 million Turks in Turkey and its hard to ignore them.
    So my point is Kurdish independence will be decided in Ankara.

  2. #127
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    28-05-09
    Location
    Illinois
    Posts
    54

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    I2a2b-Isles-A1

    Ethnic group
    Irish, Italian, Portuguese, Blackfoot
    Country: USA - Illinois



    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by albanopolis View Post
    I don't quite get your point!
    Turkey is a major player and an important USA partner. Knowing that Greece, Bulgaria and Serbia have strong cultural and economic ties with Russia, mutual sympathy for each other and strong economic ties, do you really think USA will throw Turkey under the bus for an Iraqi Kurdistan?
    There are 65 million Turks in Turkey and its hard to ignore them.
    So my point is Kurdish independence will be decided in Ankara.
    Turkey used to be a major partner and ally but under the AK party it has been increasingly uncooperative and it has lead to increasing divisions between Washington and Ankara. I have said before that this will cause diplomatic isolation for Turkey for being uncooperative and you see the results today. as they were passed over for position on the UN security table. (Spain and New Zealand got the spots) source

    As an American veteran I can tell you that we are deeply vested in Iraq and the Kurds in particular have always been a loyal ally.

    We will not throw 'Turkey" under the bus but after 3 years of allowing them to direct the FSA and allowing them political control of the "recognized" opposition in Syria it has gotten out of hand. Obama recently mocked the FSA and started bypassing the Turkish backed leadership and supplying and communicating with units on our own. Under Turkish guidance the Kurds in Syria were shunned and left out of the main voice for unifying the opposition in Syria. They were not present in 2011-2012 for the summits in Turkey and the one they went to in Cairo was a disaster because the Turkish backed speaker openly mocked the Kurds and when the Kurdish speaker went to speak back it lead to a fist fight!

    As of today the US State Department confirmed that this weekend they have had direct talks with the PYD the main Syrian Kurdish political alliance... you may have heard of the YPG-YPJ fighters in Kobane in the news. The Turks HATE the PYD because they think of them as the Syrian version of PKK.

    This is significant because this week Obama said he is looking for "moderate" rebels to back. When your choices are the failed Turkish lead FSA that was backed by the UK&USA or a long list of Islamic brigades that either work with al-nursa or ISIS who does that lave? Thats right the Syrian Kurds who today the US State Department held direct talks with and this week started direct military aid to the YPG. Check out twitter for some great stuff on it. source

    And guess what else happened today? The government of Iraqi Kurdistan the Kurdish regional Government held a meeting with the PYD to mend fences and unite in the face of ISIS attack. This is also significant because before the KRG did not support the Syrian Kurds unilateral decoration of autonomy. As all of this is happening today more and more comments are coming out.

    The Kurdish Regional Government is now officially recognizing Rojava!

    The parliament in South Kurdistan decided yesterday to develop relationships with the cantons of Rojava after a day-long debate. 79 deputies approved a motion calling on the Federal Kurdistan Government to improve links with the administrations in Rojava.

    After a debate yesterday in the South Kurdistan parliament, a motion was passed calling for relationships to be developed with the cantons established in Cizire (Jazireh), Afrin and Kobanê.

    The following articles are in the motion passed by parliament asking for the Federal Kurdistan administration to develop relations with the administrations in Rojava.

    1-The Kurdistan Parliament supports the will of the people of Rojava and wants the Kurdistan Regional Government to develop formal relations with the administrations in Rojava.

    2- The government should be in material solidarity with Rojava.

    3- The relevant bodies should implement this decision.

    4- There should be absolutely no action contrary to this decision.

    5- This decision will come into force after it is officially published by the Kurdistan Regional Parliament.




    IN SUMMARY BIG DEVELOPMENTS THIS WEEK: Good news for the Kurds in Syria and Iraq but very sad news coming out of Turkey
    1. Direct communication between US Military and PYG fighters in Kobani (a snub to turkey)
    2. State Department has direct talks with PYD for the first time (a snub to Turkey)
    3. Iraqi and Syrian Kurds work out differences in attempt to stand unified in the face of ISIS (I think this is the magical moderate opposition Obama has been looking for to train and supply)
    4. Turkey fails in its bid to get a seat on the UN Security Council (Spain and New Zealand got the spots)

  3. #128
    Banned
    Join Date
    22-02-13
    Posts
    553


    Country: Albania



    Quote Originally Posted by Ua'Ronain View Post
    Turkey used to be a major partner and ally but under the AK party it has been increasingly uncooperative and it has lead to increasing divisions between Washington and Ankara. I have said before that this will cause diplomatic isolation for Turkey for being uncooperative and you see the results today. as they were passed over for position on the UN security table. (Spain and New Zealand got the spots) source

    As an American veteran I can tell you that we are deeply vested in Iraq and the Kurds in particular have always been a loyal ally.

    We will not throw 'Turkey" under the bus but after 3 years of allowing them to direct the FSA and allowing them political control of the "recognized" opposition in Syria it has gotten out of hand. Obama recently mocked the FSA and started bypassing the Turkish backed leadership and supplying and communicating with units on our own. Under Turkish guidance the Kurds in Syria were shunned and left out of the main voice for unifying the opposition in Syria. They were not present in 2011-2012 for the summits in Turkey and the one they went to in Cairo was a disaster because the Turkish backed speaker openly mocked the Kurds and when the Kurdish speaker went to speak back it lead to a fist fight!

    As of today the US State Department confirmed that this weekend they have had direct talks with the PYD the main Syrian Kurdish political alliance... you may have heard of the YPG-YPJ fighters in Kobane in the news. The Turks HATE the PYD because they think of them as the Syrian version of PKK.

    This is significant because this week Obama said he is looking for "moderate" rebels to back. When your choices are the failed Turkish lead FSA that was backed by the UK&USA or a long list of Islamic brigades that either work with al-nursa or ISIS who does that lave? Thats right the Syrian Kurds who today the US State Department held direct talks with and this week started direct military aid to the YPG. Check out twitter for some great stuff on it. source

    And guess what else happened today? The government of Iraqi Kurdistan the Kurdish regional Government held a meeting with the PYD to mend fences and unite in the face of ISIS attack. This is also significant because before the KRG did not support the Syrian Kurds unilateral decoration of autonomy. As all of this is happening today more and more comments are coming out.

    The Kurdish Regional Government is now officially recognizing Rojava!

    The parliament in South Kurdistan decided yesterday to develop relationships with the cantons of Rojava after a day-long debate. 79 deputies approved a motion calling on the Federal Kurdistan Government to improve links with the administrations in Rojava.

    After a debate yesterday in the South Kurdistan parliament, a motion was passed calling for relationships to be developed with the cantons established in Cizire (Jazireh), Afrin and Kobanê.

    The following articles are in the motion passed by parliament asking for the Federal Kurdistan administration to develop relations with the administrations in Rojava.

    1-The Kurdistan Parliament supports the will of the people of Rojava and wants the Kurdistan Regional Government to develop formal relations with the administrations in Rojava.

    2- The government should be in material solidarity with Rojava.

    3- The relevant bodies should implement this decision.

    4- There should be absolutely no action contrary to this decision.

    5- This decision will come into force after it is officially published by the Kurdistan Regional Parliament.




    IN SUMMARY BIG DEVELOPMENTS THIS WEEK: Good news for the Kurds in Syria and Iraq but very sad news coming out of Turkey
    1. Direct communication between US Military and PYG fighters in Kobani (a snub to turkey)
    2. State Department has direct talks with PYD for the first time (a snub to Turkey)
    3. Iraqi and Syrian Kurds work out differences in attempt to stand unified in the face of ISIS (I think this is the magical moderate opposition Obama has been looking for to train and supply)
    4. Turkey fails in its bid to get a seat on the UN Security Council (Spain and New Zealand got the spots)
    Turkey is a Nato member and USA is fighting hard to get them to the EU.
    Kurds are not substitute for Turkey in terms of the regional importance.
    I don't really think that USA will allow for now at least, Iraqi Kurds to be independent. They don't want to upset Turkey so they will ask Kurds to settle with autonomy. If Kurds attempt to proclaim their independence will immediately be under Turkish military assault. The USA will tell Kurds; I told you so;
    Kurds can in fact get a mini state in Syria which I think Turkey might not oppose.

  4. #129
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    28-05-09
    Location
    Illinois
    Posts
    54

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    I2a2b-Isles-A1

    Ethnic group
    Irish, Italian, Portuguese, Blackfoot
    Country: USA - Illinois



    The Kurds in Syria are modling themselves much like in iraq where they remain within the state they are a part of now but with autonomy. The Turks oppose any rights to the kurds in syria.

    You are missing the point I am trying to make. That the west is starting to back the Kurds outside of Turkey even if the Turks do not like it.

    In the end Ankara has no power over international aid that is strengthening the Kurds as they are being made a part of the coalition to fight ISIS. If they are rewarded with equal rights in Syria as they are in Iraqi and granted the same rights as the Iraqi Kurds then it is a victory for the Kurds. None of the main Kurdish political parties in Iraq, Syria or Turkey are calling for outright independence, they are calling for equal rights, self determination and some autonomy.

    (not even the terror listed PKK calls for independence)

  5. #130
    Advisor LeBrok's Avatar
    Join Date
    18-11-09
    Location
    Calgary
    Posts
    10,295

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b Z2109
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H1c

    Ethnic group
    Citizen of the world
    Country: Canada-Alberta



    Thanks Ua'Ronain for a detailed update. I'm glad Obama gave up on Turkey with supplying Kurds with military equipment.
    Too bad Turkey sucumbs to its insecurities in regards to Kurds and doesn't want to play positive and constructive role in this region. It seems like Turkey doesn't want to do any moves not to screw up anything, to be blamed for outcomes, and embraces status quo. Even though the world is changing around them.
    Be wary of people who tend to glorify the past, underestimate the present, and demonize the future.

  6. #131
    Banned
    Join Date
    22-02-13
    Posts
    553


    Country: Albania



    Quote Originally Posted by LeBrok View Post
    Thanks Ua'Ronain for a detailed update. I'm glad Obama gave up on Turkey with supplying Kurds with military equipment.
    Too bad Turkey sucumbs to its insecurities in regards to Kurds and doesn't want to play positive and constructive role in this region. It seems like Turkey doesn't want to do any moves not to screw up anything, to be blamed for outcomes, and embraces status quo. Even though the world is changing around them.
    I think Turkey probably is smelling something is being played behind its back. They will not blindly follow the Israelis.
    For some time The Israelis have smelled oil in Kurdistan. They probably are pushing USA for recognition of Kurdish state but that will anger both Turkey and Iran which could end in a coalition.
    I don't know but I think Turkey can not be ignored in the surrounding region.It did help USA in the Cold war and its contribution will not easily be forgotten.
    Kurds had the best chance of independence now. They are not even talking about it. I think they have a good reason not to talk about it. But as I have said Kurdish independence will happen with USA blessing.
    I wish them luck though. One can not deny others what is asking for themselves.

  7. #132
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    28-05-09
    Location
    Illinois
    Posts
    54

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    I2a2b-Isles-A1

    Ethnic group
    Irish, Italian, Portuguese, Blackfoot
    Country: USA - Illinois



    Quote Originally Posted by albanopolis View Post
    I think Turkey probably is smelling something is being played behind its back. They will not blindly follow the Israelis.
    For some time The Israelis have smelled oil in Kurdistan. They probably are pushing USA for recognition of Kurdish state but that will anger both Turkey and Iran which could end in a coalition.
    I don't know but I think Turkey can not be ignored in the surrounding region.It did help USA in the Cold war and its contribution will not easily be forgotten.
    Kurds had the best chance of independence now. They are not even talking about it. I think they have a good reason not to talk about it. But as I have said Kurdish independence will happen with USA blessing.
    I wish them luck though. One can not deny others what is asking for themselves.
    Not everything is about oil and Israel.... Almost the whole world cares about the Palestinians and western countries are officially starting to recognize a Palestinian state. But god forbid we apply the same to the Kurds. Apparently hating the Kurds is the only acceptable form of racism left on the entire planet.

    If we take out all of the geo-politics and apply our humanity it should be obvious to everyone that liberty and equality should be a universal right for everyone on our planet. The fact that we globally ignored the plight of the Kurds for so long is a disgrace.

  8. #133
    Banned
    Join Date
    22-02-13
    Posts
    553


    Country: Albania



    Quote Originally Posted by Ua'Ronain View Post
    Not everything is about oil and Israel.... Almost the whole world cares about the Palestinians and western countries are officially starting to recognize a Palestinian state. But god forbid we apply the same to the Kurds. Apparently hating the Kurds is the only acceptable form of racism left on the entire planet.

    If we take out all of the geo-politics and apply our humanity it should be obvious to everyone that liberty and equality should be a universal right for everyone on our planet. The fact that we globally ignored the plight of the Kurds for so long is a disgrace.
    Nobody is hating the Kurds. They have not done anything. They absolutely deserve the independence. But the real world is quite different. Humanity is not always taken into account. The interests play a huge role. Its not in Turkish interest an independent Kurdistan. They feel like an independent Iraqi Kurdistan will serve as base for uprising of Turkish Kurds. Any split Turkey- Kurds of Turkey will certainly involve violence.
    In 1920 the whole Greek population of Turkey was exported to Greece when Greeks could not control their appetite. They wanted a big piece which got stuck in their throat.
    So who can guarantee that can not happen again.
    I think Kurdish Independence will come over a longer time.
    There is no reason for USA to recognize a Kurd state at this point. They are not mistreated by the Iraqi government. ISIS is a risk for Iraqis too.
    Everything can happen but thats the way I see it.

  9. #134
    Regular Member Diocletian's Avatar
    Join Date
    09-10-14
    Posts
    29


    Ethnic group
    Turkish
    Country: Turkey



    Quote Originally Posted by Ua'Ronain View Post
    To Diocletian do not worry there is plenty of mud to sling when it comes to ISIS but you cannot ignore Turkey's role while blaming Washington for everything. I am also going to add that you do not have an objective view towards the Kurdish question. Your number of 40,000 dead soldiers is a misrepresentation of the truth. A quick Google search would prove this! You scream about PKK but not one time have I seen you try to understand what caused the PKK to be created int he first place. Widespread discrimination of the Kurdish people on a massive scale for the ENTIRE history of what we know as the Republic of Turkey. I will make sure to list each and every law, massacre and injustice done to the Kurds to lead to the creation of PKK for you in great detail in my new series of threads.
    I don't ignore Turkey's involvement in the development of ISIS, but Washington is not as pure as the driven snow. You have to comprehend that in the first place. I do have an objective view towards the Kurdish issue. According to the official figures, the number of the casualties regarding the Turkish side will always be claimed lesser than the actual. Maybe you should allocate your time to learn Turkish and do more research on the topic by reading some books written by retired Turkish military officers and commanders that fought against PKK.

    You think I won't speak about why PKK was created. Kurds were subject to an intense Turkification. Kurds are muslims, that's why they have been regarded as a part of the Turkish nation. Turkish authorities banned Kurdish language in the public institutions, such as courts, prisons, schools etc. They even denied that such a language actually exists. Kurdish towns had received harassment by the Turkish military police hundreds of times in the past and Kurdish rebels were massacred that they were put inside acid pits. You see? I am very objective, so you don't need to do anything for me to understand something that I already know of.

  10. #135
    Regular Member Sile's Avatar
    Join Date
    04-09-11
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    5,115

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    T1a2 -Z19945..Jura
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H95a1 ..Pannoni

    Ethnic group
    North Alpine Italian
    Country: Australia



    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Diocletian View Post
    I don't ignore Turkey's involvement in the development of ISIS, but Washington is not as pure as the driven snow. You have to comprehend that in the first place. I do have an objective view towards the Kurdish issue. According to the official figures, the number of the casualties regarding the Turkish side will always be claimed lesser than the actual. Maybe you should allocate your time to learn Turkish and do more research on the topic by reading some books written by retired Turkish military officers and commanders that fought against PKK.

    You think I won't speak about why PKK was created. Kurds were subject to an intense Turkification. Kurds are muslims, that's why they have been regarded as a part of the Turkish nation. Turkish authorities banned Kurdish language in the public institutions, such as courts, prisons, schools etc. They even denied that such a language actually exists. Kurdish towns had received harassment by the Turkish military police hundreds of times in the past and Kurdish rebels were massacred that they were put inside acid pits. You see? I am very objective, so you don't need to do anything for me to understand something that I already know of.
    banning a language and culture of a group of people is racism in its extreme form .....you know this and everyone knows this. But since the concept of nationlism in the 18th century we see every nation percentage of lies have increased ten fold.

    the term , "because they are muslim then they are part of the Turkish nation" is 100% wrong....what does religion have to do with ethnicity and nationalism?
    có che un pòpoło no 'l defende pi ła só łéngua el xe prónto par èser s'ciavo

    when a people no longer dares to defend its language it is ripe for slavery.

  11. #136
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    14-12-10
    Posts
    1,603


    Country: Serbia



    1 members found this post helpful.
    Kurds must acquire full human rights and not mercy from "big boss".

    This is century when Kurds should achieve full national affirmation and be on their own.

  12. #137
    Advisor LeBrok's Avatar
    Join Date
    18-11-09
    Location
    Calgary
    Posts
    10,295

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b Z2109
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H1c

    Ethnic group
    Citizen of the world
    Country: Canada-Alberta



    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by albanopolis View Post
    There is no reason for USA to recognize a Kurd state at this point. They are not mistreated by the Iraqi government. ISIS is a risk for Iraqis too.
    Strong ally of US in Near East is always a good reason to have. Strong and independent Kurdistan would be a better friend of Europe and US than Turkey at the moment. ISIS is a common enemy of the West and Kurds. Kurds will be the only reliable ally, of all the involved parties, and "boots on the ground".

    Who else we can trust? Double faced Turkish government? Corrupt and incapable Iraqis? Iran, who is enjoying the mess, which makes other countries weaker and taking Iran off center of attention in Middle East?

  13. #138
    Elite member
    Join Date
    14-11-10
    Posts
    2,508

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1a1a1
    MtDNA haplogroup
    HV2a1 +G13708A

    Ethnic group
    Kurdish
    Country: Germany



    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Diocletian View Post
    I don't ignore Turkey's involvement in the development of ISIS, but Washington is not as pure as the driven snow. You have to comprehend that in the first place. I do have an objective view towards the Kurdish issue. According to the official figures, the number of the casualties regarding the Turkish side will always be claimed lesser than the actual. Maybe you should allocate your time to learn Turkish and do more research on the topic by reading some books written by retired Turkish military officers and commanders that fought against PKK.
    No way are the Turkish casualities even comparable to those of Kurds. Not even the slightest. All this conflict took place in the pred. Kurdish East not in Central nor Western Turkey. It was 3000 Kurdish villages destroyed and not a single Turkish one. I am not denying that there are Turkish casualities but you have to see it in an objective way. Those casualties are not the result of Kurdish "aggressions" towards peacefull Turkish public. It was a reaction to the century long oppression.

    You think I won't speak about why PKK was created. Kurds were subject to an intense Turkification. Kurds are muslims, that's why they have been regarded as a part of the Turkish nation. Turkish authorities banned Kurdish language in the public institutions, such as courts, prisons, schools etc. They even denied that such a language actually exists. Kurdish towns had received harassment by the Turkish military police hundreds of times in the past and Kurdish rebels were massacred that they were put inside acid pits. You see? I am very objective, so you don't need to do anything for me to understand something that I already know of.
    If it were only Kurdish rebels. Most of the massacred people were simple civilians. Massacred to give the Kurds the message of "keep silent or die".

  14. #139
    Regular Member Yetos's Avatar
    Join Date
    02-10-11
    Location
    Makedonia
    Posts
    5,813

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    G2a3a
    MtDNA haplogroup
    X2b

    Ethnic group
    Makedonian original
    Country: Greece



    Quote Originally Posted by Diocletian View Post
    I don't ignore Turkey's involvement in the development of ISIS, but Washington is not as pure as the driven snow. You have to comprehend that in the first place. I do have an objective view towards the Kurdish issue. According to the official figures, the number of the casualties regarding the Turkish side will always be claimed lesser than the actual. Maybe you should allocate your time to learn Turkish and do more research on the topic by reading some books written by retired Turkish military officers and commanders that fought against PKK.

    You think I won't speak about why PKK was created. Kurds were subject to an intense Turkification. Kurds are muslims, that's why they have been regarded as a part of the Turkish nation. Turkish authorities banned Kurdish language in the public institutions, such as courts, prisons, schools etc. They even denied that such a language actually exists. Kurdish towns had received harassment by the Turkish military police hundreds of times in the past and Kurdish rebels were massacred that they were put inside acid pits. You see? I am very objective, so you don't need to do anything for me to understand something that I already know of.

    Kurds were regarded as part of Turkish 'wider' nation, or as the valuable/precious ally from the battle of Manjikert almost a millenium before,
    always indipentended and always under Ottomans or Neo Turks
    the last alliance of Kurds and Turks was in1920's with Kemal and Topal Osman in Trapezous and Kerasous areas, (Trabzon Giresun)

    if you are really a Turk then you know the 2 biggest allies of Turks in History were Kurds and Azeris,
    and after 1500 Albanias (Arnauts) in Balkans, the ones who did not paid blood taxation

    the Kurdish awakening in Turkey started around 1960's and grow after 1970-80s
    ΟΘΕΝ ΑΙΔΩΣ OY EINAI
    ΑΤΗ ΛΑΜΒΑΝΕΙΝ ΑΥΤΟΙΣ
    ΥΒΡΙΣ ΓΕΝΝΑΤΑΙ
    ΝΕΜΕΣΙΣ ΚΑΙ ΤΙΣΗ ΑΚΟΛΟΥΘΟΥΣΙ ΔΕ

    When there is no shame
    Divine blindness conquers them
    Hybris (abuse, opprombium) is born
    Nemesis and punishment follows.

    Εχε υπομονη Ηρωα
    Η τιμωρια δεν αργει.

  15. #140
    Regular Member Yetos's Avatar
    Join Date
    02-10-11
    Location
    Makedonia
    Posts
    5,813

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    G2a3a
    MtDNA haplogroup
    X2b

    Ethnic group
    Makedonian original
    Country: Greece



    Kurdish problem is bigger,

    as Greek I happened to know quite a few about them,
    and if I am wrong I call upon the kurds of the forum to falsify me,
    Kurds are generally under 3 major sub nationalistic divisions
    and under many leaders (patriarchs if you like) that before 100 years could fight each other,
    they never tried to unite and succed a unification,
    and if they fail now, they start war among each other, as happens always,
    the only combined actions of sub tribes are shown today,

    Kurds had many opportunities to become indipendent from the times of British Empire and revolt of Arabs and liberation of Damaskos,
    till the 1920's the Greek-Turkey wars,
    but they decide to ally with Turks,
    so Today they face either a Turkization, or Arabization, either a genocide or a destruction
    Those who know History, know about the Armenians and Greeks and Neo-Turks
    IT IS VERY HARD AND DIFFICULT TO ESCAPE FROM OTTOMANS, and Neo-Turks are much much smarter than Ottoman sultans,
    besides Turkey has excellent diplomacy, and excellent army,

    no matter a Greek i admire their raise and their progress from the 1970's and after,
    Last edited by Yetos; 19-10-14 at 23:34.

  16. #141
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    14-12-10
    Posts
    1,603


    Country: Serbia



    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post
    Kurdish problem is bigger, as Greek I happened to know quite a few about them, and if I am wrong I call upon the kurds of the forum to falsify me, Kurds are generally under 3 major sub nationalistic divisions and under many leaders (patriarchs if you like) that before 100 years could fight each other, they never tried to unite and succed a unification, and if they fail now, they start war among each other, as happens always, the only combined actions of sub tribes are shown today, Kurds had many opportunities to become indipendent from the times of British Empire and revolt of Arabs and liberation of Damaskos, till the 1920's the Greek-Turkey wars, but they decide to ally with Turks, so Today they face either a Turkization, or Arabization, either a genocide or a destruction Those who know History, know about the Armenians and Greeks and Neo-Turks IT IS VERY HARD AND DIFFICULT TO ESCAPE FROM OTTOMANS, and Neo-Turks are much much smarter than Ottoman sultans, besides Turkey has excellent diplomacy, and excellent army,
    Turks in the late 19th and first quarter of 20th century (there we think about Ottomans in last phase and after them Turkish nationalists) did more genocides and massacres, where victims were Armenians, Greeks and Assyrians, all non-Muslim nations (and of course Turkish president Erdogan again talks about Neo-Ottoman Balkans and his Balkan allies).

    But after twenties only numerous minority who remained in Turkey were Kurds, and they came on line.

    Questions are: how many massacres and crimes were against Kurds from thirties to now, how many Kurdish villages and resorts are destroyed, how many them Kurds had to escape, what all kinds of repressions against Kurds leaded by Turkish regime, what human rights Kurds have in Turkey now etc., it would be good that Kurds are talking about it, evidence in Internet is awful and very serious for Turkish regime.

  17. #142
    Regular Member Diocletian's Avatar
    Join Date
    09-10-14
    Posts
    29


    Ethnic group
    Turkish
    Country: Turkey



    Quote Originally Posted by Sile View Post
    banning a language and culture of a group of people is racism in its extreme form .....you know this and everyone knows this. But since the concept of nationlism in the 18th century we see every nation percentage of lies have increased ten fold.

    the term , "because they are muslim then they are part of the Turkish nation" is 100% wrong....what does religion have to do with ethnicity and nationalism?
    It is wrong, but not because it doesn't have its own sense of logic. What we refer to as "nation" was called "millet" in the Ottoman period. Millet was differentiated according to the religion. So, if you were Albanian, Bosniak, Kurd, Turk, Circassian etc. you were muslim and therefore part of the extended Turkish identity. That's probably why "Turkish" is regarded equal to "muslim" in Europe. This type of understanding didn't change when the republic was established.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alan View Post
    No way are the Turkish casualities even comparable to those of Kurds. Not even the slightest. All this conflict took place in the pred. Kurdish East not in Central nor Western Turkey. It was 3000 Kurdish villages destroyed and not a single Turkish one. I am not denying that there are Turkish casualities but you have to see it in an objective way. Those casualties are not the result of Kurdish "aggressions" towards peacefull Turkish public. It was a reaction to the century long oppression.
    Yes, thousands of Kurdish villages were destroyed by Turkish forces, I'm not denying this. Do you confirm that PKK kidnapped school teachers and burned schools down and rejected any financial betterment initiative to the area, threatened Kurdish families who tried to keep away from the conflict in order to recruit more terrorists from among the young to the training camps?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alan View Post
    If it were only Kurdish rebels. Most of the massacred people were simple civilians. Massacred to give the Kurds the message of "keep silent or die".
    True. But I need to correct that "keep silent or die" part. "Keep silent" means "don't keep sending more terrorists to the camps". If they were to listen this advice, then PKK comes and says "you didn't send us more terrorists, die!!!!". That's how you add to the total number of "only civilian" Kurdish casualties.

    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post
    Kurds were regarded as part of Turkish 'wider' nation, or as the valuable/precious ally from the battle of Manjikert almost a millenium before,
    always indipentended and always under Ottomans or Neo Turks
    the last alliance of Kurds and Turks was in1920's with Kemal and Topal Osman in Trapezous and Kerasous areas, (Trabzon Giresun)

    if you are really a Turk then you know the 2 biggest allies of Turks in History were Kurds and Azeris,
    and after 1500 Albanias (Arnauts) in Balkans, the ones who did not paid blood taxation

    the Kurdish awakening in Turkey started around 1960's and grow after 1970-80s
    Kurds have had been a good ally to Turks also during the Armenian Genocide. Most of the "dirty job" was executed by them.

  18. #143
    Regular Member Yetos's Avatar
    Join Date
    02-10-11
    Location
    Makedonia
    Posts
    5,813

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    G2a3a
    MtDNA haplogroup
    X2b

    Ethnic group
    Makedonian original
    Country: Greece



    Quote Originally Posted by Diocletian View Post
    It is wrong, but not because it doesn't have its own sense of logic. What we refer to as "nation" was called "millet" in the Ottoman period. Millet was differentiated according to the religion. So, if you were Albanian, Bosniak, Kurd, Turk, Circassian etc. you were muslim and therefore part of the extended Turkish identity. That's probably why "Turkish" is regarded equal to "muslim" in Europe. This type of understanding didn't change when the republic was established.
    almost correct,
    Muslim were identified as Turks in census that Ottomans did before 1900






    Quote Originally Posted by Diocletian View Post
    Kurds have had been a good ally to Turks also during the Armenian Genocide. Most of the "dirty job" was executed by them.

    I know, I know the story of Topal Osman, his army were Kurds, at 1922-23

    they could have their own state that time,
    it would a Bigger Greece, a indipendent Kurdistan, a Bigger Armenia (the 2 kings, the proposal of Pontic and armenian state), and a indipendent Laz state, and a pure core Neo Turk state from Adrianoypolis and Prussa to Myrsina and Kastamone
    but they decided to follow the Muslim relation than their indipendence.

    anyway, things are tough today for the 2 'allies'.

    I hope a good solution for both, with less damage possible.


    btw
    do you believe that if Kurdistan make indipendent state, then Turkey might be a trully Alobites Allevi islamic state, closer to kemalic believes? or will turn again to deep islamic roots?

  19. #144
    Regular Member Diocletian's Avatar
    Join Date
    09-10-14
    Posts
    29


    Ethnic group
    Turkish
    Country: Turkey



    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post
    btw
    do you believe that if Kurdistan make indipendent state, then Turkey might be a trully Alobites Allevi islamic state, closer to kemalic believes? or will turn again to deep islamic roots?
    Kemalists comprise of Alevis, which are de facto secularists, and secular nationalist Sunnis. Quite a big part of the Islamists comprise of religious Sunni Kurds. If Kurdistan establishes its independence and takes land from Turkey, there would be an immediate population exchange like we did in 1923, but this time on the ethnic basis rather than the religious. That would weaken the Islamist side in Turkey, making the country more secular, progressive and pro-European.

  20. #145
    Advisor LeBrok's Avatar
    Join Date
    18-11-09
    Location
    Calgary
    Posts
    10,295

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b Z2109
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H1c

    Ethnic group
    Citizen of the world
    Country: Canada-Alberta



    Quote Originally Posted by Diocletian View Post
    Kemalists comprise of Alevis, which are de facto secularists, and secular nationalist Sunnis. Quite a big part of the Islamists comprise of religious Sunni Kurds.
    This is what I'm afraid about Kurds. Vast section of their society is susceptible to ISIS and fundamentalists ideology. However so far they prove not to be the case.

  21. #146
    Banned
    Join Date
    06-06-11
    Posts
    2,651

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1a*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    HV1b2

    Country: Netherlands



    1 members found this post helpful.
    Islamic State onslaught on Yazidis may be attempted genocide - U.N. -> http://in.reuters.com/article/2014/1...0IA2PS20141021

  22. #147
    Banned
    Join Date
    06-06-11
    Posts
    2,651

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1a*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    HV1b2

    Country: Netherlands



    Quote Originally Posted by LeBrok View Post
    This is what I'm afraid about Kurds. Vast section of their society is susceptible to ISIS and fundamentalists ideology. However so far they prove not to be the case.
    As long genocidal maniac criminals like Islamist Barzani are at power in South Kurdistan, there will be NEVER Kurdistan. I’m sure the responsible will be caught and brought to justice! According to me the main responsible of the Yezidi attempted genocide are Islamist Erdogan and Barzani! They should be brought to the Hague tribunal. Barzani is still trying to genocide the Yezidis and sending his Daesh mad dogs to Shingal to intimidate and genocide the Yezidis. There is more chance for the free Ezdixan than free Kurdistan. The Yezidis are the original Kurds, Kurds in South Kurdistan are Muslim and do look like their Muslim Arab neighbours.

  23. #148
    Banned
    Join Date
    06-06-11
    Posts
    2,651

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1a*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    HV1b2

    Country: Netherlands



    The REAL Kurds are the Yezidis and the PKK (Alevi Kurmanji, Yezidi, Alevi Zazaki, Rojava (Syrian) Kurds, secular Kurds etc.). Both groups fight against Islam and for Kurdistan. Arabized or Turkified Muslims. They lost their touch with Kurdistan, Kurdish identity, Kurdish history and Kurdish culture. The PKK is the best nationalistic/patrioric non-CORRUPT PAN-Kurdistan group to lead Kurdish race toward total independence.

  24. #149
    Banned
    Join Date
    06-06-11
    Posts
    2,651

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1a*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    HV1b2

    Country: Netherlands



    Arabized Islamic Fundamentalist Sunni Muslim ‘Kurds’ in Southern Kurdistan are trying to genocide the true original Kurds, the Yezidis. Before Islam, all ethnic Kurds were like the Yezidi. The world must take action and bring the responsible into justice! Barzani must be brought to the Hague Tribunal!

  25. #150
    Banned
    Join Date
    18-05-14
    Posts
    144


    Ethnic group
    Slavic
    Country: Slovenia



    I hope so... Kurds definitelly deserve to have their own country. Just look at their effords, they produce their own tanks & fight against those neanderthals called Isis (a typical derivative of another dangerous militarian Osirian (Osiris) / Asura आसुर Abrahamic (against Brahmanic अ ब्राह्म ) Islamic offspring/derivative...

    http://rt.com/news/191312-syria-kurds-home-made-armor/





    Whole families among Kurds, Yazides who were tortured, barbarically slaughtered by the Isis/Osiris members...


    http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/0...0GA0FJ20140810

    Kurdish women fighters(kshatria; this is their genetic memory) who are a nightmare, fear and trembling to the Isis (Osiris) neanderthals, degeneratives...










    Yazidic people(who preserved the original Mesopotamic antique pre Islamic/pre Abrahamic faith...





    Kurds, as descendants of the Kuru tribes, kshatrias, from the Kurukshetra war...

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kuru_Ki...3%E0%B4%95.jpg



    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agnicayana
    Last edited by Vedun; 23-10-14 at 13:20.

Page 6 of 56 FirstFirst ... 4567816 ... LastLast

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •