Haplogroup C

I'm a bit late here...

Orca1, if you haven't ordered yet, know there are $20 coupons issued these weeks, which would make your Y37 at $119. If you still haven't order and I got one in my new batch this monday, I'll give you mine.
Great to know people who care. :)
 
I have just got results from 23andme and all it says about paternal line is C, no subclade ( where can I get the subclade from? )

At 23andme, they always give a subclade even if not always elaborated. If you don't have one it means C* or a new unknown branch of C. That being said, 23andme are a bit behind with haplogroups, so maybe your branch of C is known, but 23andme haven't update to it yet.

We'll have to see where you fit in the C tree, but all kind of scenario are possible, from "your father line have been in North Africa for millennia before the Berbers came in" to "your father line moved to Algeria only five or six generations ago".

Here's the ISOGG page for Y-haplogroup C (thanks Huitzilopochtli ^_~)
http://isogg.org/tree/ISOGG_HapgrpC.html

It states C1a2 or C-V20 is found both among Europeans and Algerian Berbers. Also, C1b1a3 or C-Z16582 is found in Saudi Arabia, Iraq and could have come with the Muslim Conquest. Or you could still be C*, or a new C1* branch.
 
OK. And how long it takes for a DNA composition to melt up to 80% into a certain group ? 500 years? 1000, 10 thousands..?

Breeders says it take 8 generations to turn a mongrel into a pure blood. The number is the same for dogs, cats, horse, cow, you name it.
To get 80%, let's see...

Let's say your father line is 100% foreign, on the first generation your patriarch marry an Algerian woman and they have a son who is 50% Algerian / 50% other. He marry an Algerian woman, their son is 75% Algerian / 25% other. The son marry an Algerian woman again, their son is now 87.5% Algerian / 12.5% Other.

We are already there and it took only four generations, so about a century. But then, the women may not be 100% Algerian either, so it can takes more generations. Also, there may be some old foreign blood in the region gene poll due to some Antic or prehistoric migration. As LeBrok said, better check how other Algerian score, specially from your area if you can find any.
 
Thanks, that's clearer.

Even if your haplogroup C was an European Clade it does not mean you have nothing to do with Mongolians who mostly carry the other cousin of C. Back in time you share one grandfather with them, and with that some of their characteristics like horse riding for instance. My haplo is E-13 and the parent clade of it appeared in North Africa which they are my distant cousins in my fathers side.
 
We'll have to see where you fit in the C tree, but all kind of scenario are possible, from "your father line have been in North Africa for millennia before the Berbers came in" to "your father line moved to Algeria only five or six generations ago".

Here's the ISOGG page for Y-haplogroup C (thanks Huitzilopochtli ^_~)
http://isogg.org/tree/ISOGG_HapgrpC.html

It states C1a2 or C-V20 is found both among Europeans and Algerian Berbers. Also, C1b1a3 or C-Z16582 is found in Saudi Arabia, Iraq and could have come with the Muslim Conquest. Or you could still be C*, or a new C1* branch.

Yes All kind of scenarios are possible. That's why I need another test to see which subclade.

Thanks for your offer by the way. I sent you an MP
 
actually haplogroup c was observed in algeria in study 1 out 80 sample from oran and they are also a c v20 sample in ftdna
 
It seems finally that I am C-V20, still need to identify which sub branch, which still in process. This meant to be one of the earliest Sapiens that entered Europe and wiped out the neanderthals. but what time crossed to North Africa ... i have no idea ....still need some reading/searching about it.

So me the north afircan, ironically could be more European than most of you in here...LOL
 
It seems finally that I am C-V20, still need to identify which sub branch, which still in process. This meant to be one of the earliest Sapiens that entered Europe and wiped out the neanderthals. but what time crossed to North Africa ... i have no idea ....still need some reading/searching about it.

So me the north afircan, ironically could be more European than most of you in here...LOL

C-V20 could very well indicate being very anciently European paternally. I'd be interested in your subclade result. Right now on FTDNA, most belong to the (obviously European) V222 subclade, with a small minority of Europeans in the Z29329 subclade, and a single person with a Berber surname in the Z38888 subclade. Z38888 is the most ancient known V20 subclade (next to La Brana's V20* V86- subclade), so that person, I assume a North African, likely descends from a very ancient migration to North Africa that we probably can't tie to a historical migration. Z38888 isn't dated on yfull, but could be anywhere from 43k to 16k years old per their numbers, so it may need more study before we can even say simple things about it like "it passed through Europe."

If you turn out to be Z38888 or a close cousin of it, I imagine that Haplogroup C specialists will be very interested in your results, and will want you to continue testing. If you turn out to be V222 instead, then at least you'll be more certain of the timeline when your paternal line migrated from Europe to North Africa.
 
C-V20 could very well indicate being very anciently European paternally. I'd be interested in your subclade result. Right now on FTDNA, most belong to the (obviously European) V222 subclade, with a small minority of Europeans in the Z29329 subclade, and a single person with a Berber surname in the Z38888 subclade. Z38888 is the most ancient known V20 subclade (next to La Brana's V20* V86- subclade), so that person, I assume a North African, likely descends from a very ancient migration to North Africa that we probably can't tie to a historical migration. Z38888 isn't dated on yfull, but could be anywhere from 43k to 16k years old per their numbers, so it may need more study before we can even say simple things about it like "it passed through Europe."

If you turn out to be Z38888 or a close cousin of it, I imagine that Haplogroup C specialists will be very interested in your results, and will want you to continue testing. If you turn out to be V222 instead, then at least you'll be more certain of the timeline when your paternal line migrated from Europe to North Africa.

Hi sparkey,

The next subclade in process is v222. I let you know resulst after 2/3 weeks from now.

And by the way how do I know the timeline when my paternal line migrated to North Africa, if i turn out v222? this might happen in the ice age, neolithic, 1000 years ago, 400 years ago ...any time basically
 
Hi sparkey,

The next subclade in process is v222. I let you know resulst after 2/3 weeks from now.

And by the way how do I know the timeline when my paternal line migrated to North Africa, if i turn out v222?

The timeline still will not likely be very precise, but if you are V222, you can at least date the migration event to the TMRCA of V222 (currently 4300 YBP -- unless your result pushes that value back).
 
The timeline still will not likely be very precise, but if you are V222, you can at least date the migration event to the TMRCA of V222 (currently 4300 YBP -- unless your result pushes that value back).

Ah I just checked and found out that v222 is only 4300 ybp old. in my autosomal dna it says im about 10% european mostly italien and more than 80% north african (speculative 23andme) but this doesnt help tracking the time of migration from a to b.
 
If you turn out to be Z38888 or a close cousin of it, I imagine that Haplogroup C specialists will be very interested in your results, and will want you to continue testing. If you turn out to be V222 instead, then at least you'll be more certain of the timeline when your paternal line migrated from Europe to North Africa.

Again Sparkey, What special about Z38888 ?

old and rare ?
 
yes it is rare go and see haplogroup c project in ftdna its found only in one algerian and it has also seen in one sample out of 80 from oran
 
Hi Orca1, Hi Red
One more Algerian with C-V20...me :)
I am From Azefoun (duar Zekri). I understood from the elder sayings and some evidences that my ancestor could be a Foreigner who came to this region 200 years ago,at the time of the Ottoman Empire.
Talk to you soon
 
Garrinun from Zekri (c-V20 Z38888+ according to ftdna)

And am also Z38888
 

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