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Thread: Corded Ware Culture Signals Population Change in Europe

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    Quote Originally Posted by LeBrok View Post
    Z93 is not very old. It might happen after the split of IE into West and East (Indo-Iranian) groups in the Steppe.
    Migration of proto-Indo-Aryans, but the R1a-Z93 is in the opposite side
    http://i023.radikal.ru/1407/59/cd24245b498a.png

    Around the Dnieper river, L. Kleijn place the proto-Indo-Aryans,
    but there is no R1a-Z93 around the Dnieper river.

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    It is fine. Indo Europeans has spread along the steppe from Ukraine to Mongolia. The ones around Kazakhstan developed Z93 and around same time became Indo-Iranians. From Kazakhstan they have moved down South. That's why Z93 is only there.
    We had this discussion here:
    http://www.eupedia.com/forum/threads...an-split-of-IE
    Be wary of people who tend to glorify the past, underestimate the present, and demonize the future.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LeBrok View Post
    It is fine. Indo Europeans has spread along the steppe from Ukraine to Mongolia. The ones around Kazakhstan developed Z93 and around same time became Indo-Iranians. From Kazakhstan they have moved down South. That's why Z93 is only there.
    We had this discussion here:
    http://www.eupedia.com/forum/threads...an-split-of-IE
    While it's unconfirmed, I wouldn't be surprised if they were predominantely ANE.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LeBrok View Post
    It is fine. Indo Europeans has spread along the steppe from Ukraine to Mongolia. The ones around Kazakhstan developed Z93 and around same time became Indo-Iranians. From Kazakhstan they have moved down South. That's why Z93 is only there.
    We had this discussion here:
    http://www.eupedia.com/forum/threads...an-split-of-IE
    http://www.eupedia.com/forum/threads...220#post441220
    http://www.eupedia.com/forum/threads...p-did-they-had

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    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    suppositions based upon an inextricable mix of diverse data:
    the Yamna People were a mix of dominent 'corded' physical type (not culture), so high statured dolichocephalic people where I see the robust longiligne 'nordic' type mixed with robust ess longiligne 'brünnoids' + sub-dolichocephalic broader faced 'cromagnoid' - the Kurgans cultures of the Steppes show everytime high %s of dolichocephalic robust people mixed with a minority of brachycephals, planoccipital = 'dinaroid' or 'armenoid' (# armenian!) - very often the brachycephals are females! -
    as the planocciptal brachycephals appeared lately in Armenia and South Caucasus, I think the most of this component came from the Carpathian mountains, rich enough even in the 1950's, forthe 'dinaric' type: this population, surely local Hunters-Gatherers at first, underwent (for some time) domination of southern or northeastern dolichocephalic newcomers at Neolithic, then at bronze Ages or just before - they were in the "Hurricane Eye" between Neolithic agricultors and then metallurgists, and the seppic folks -
    if I believe Coon, the cultures associated to the Corded CWC in Ukraina show more mixture than the Corded (dolichos) of Germany and the element present among special BBs of Britain (# other BBs of South), so I suppose the original Corded people were the 'non-dinaric' ones - we can suppose the brachycephalic element was of Y-I2a1 or I2a2 ligneages, when the dolichicocephallic one was of Y-R1a ligneage (+ some others Y-I >> Y-I1, not dinaricized, and rare enough? -
    Russian scholars think the 'cromagnoids' came from South Baltic West (Maglemose?) to East and met high dolichocephals in N-Russia before Neolithic; we can suppose they spoke a non-uralic language: the region at the N-E of Moscow in Russia show still today some percentages of Y-I2a2 (5-8%) and Y-I1 (10-12%), drowned among Y-R1a and Y-N1...
    I suppose northern Y-R1a and the neighbours had some serious ANE autosomals component in them and the presence of this ANE in today Iran, Kurdistan, Pakistan and so on, doesn' tprove this ANE came from South: I prefer think it's the result of the constant contacts between Steppes semi-nomadic pastors and the southern people East the Caspian Sea (Bogdiana, Ferghana etc...) reinforced by Iranic tribes, later -maybe original Y-R1a had not, how to know? and the current presence of oldest clades of Y-R1a in the Zagros region and surroundings don' prove us they had always been there -
    R1a can have colonized at some time a huge territory, speaking at some stage a proto-indo-iranic language (contacts: loanwords proto-I-E and proto-Iranic in Finnic-Ugric languages) even if it was not (I 'm not sure) their primary language? the European y-R1a are the product of a demographic boom upon a R1a root closer to the origin ("iranic-like")??? To conclude, I prefer see the origin of ANE in South-central Asia, not in South-Asia - the today presence in Near-East can be explained by more than an historical event (Hurrits, even Sumerians, and after Iranians of Steppes, a bit with Mongols and Turks... with different cultures -
    reading other threads about Germanics and first Finns (history) and germanic language or slavic (linguistic) is interesting too because human beings history links all these aspects and some links can be dragged -

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