Hellens or Romei?

[ΠΑΝΑΞ]

Helleenes or Romei?
A long lasting companion...

That's science!

 

[Aberdeen]

I don't know, personally I have doubts about the coherence of Greek population. Fallmerayer noticed that too. There is no day when Greeks don't curse Fallmerayer for saying there are no Hellenes in Greece. Most are Albanians and Slavs.
Rome left Greece in the 5th century, it means 1200 years latter Greeks still felt Romans?

I personally have doubts about the coherence of the Albanian population, since their DNA looks so similar to that of Greeks, and nobody ever heard of Albanians until a few centuries ago. I suspect that "Albania" is just an elaborate practical joke created by some mountain dwelling Greek cattle thieves.

 

[Ike]

@Aberdeen

Exactly what I'm saying. If he has doubts about homogeneity of Greek ethnicity, and he is convinced that Albanians are at least just as autochtonous on Balkans as Greeks are, he should be also worried as hell for his own ethnic identity. Since he he doesn't seem stressed about that even a single bit, I'm thinking that this thread is just a pure provocation.

 

[albanopolis]

@Aberdeen

Exactly what I'm saying. If he has doubts about homogeneity of Greek ethnicity, and he is convinced that Albanians are at least just as autochtonous on Balkans as Greeks are, he should be also worried as hell for his own ethnic identity. Since he he doesn't seem stressed about that even a single bit, I'm thinking that this thread is just a pure provocation.

You seem to not know anything about Fallmerayer! Was he provoking too? Had you known about him you would see that there is no provocation here. In the time of ottoman empire if you asked a Greek who are you?-he would answer in one of two ways; I am Romei or I am a christian. Nobody would tell you I am a Hellene.
If you asked an Albanian he would tell you he was an Arbereshe or since the conversation was in Turkish; I am from Arnautlluk. So always Albanians did not identify themselves neither with the religion nor with Rome. Why Greeks?
As one forumer here noticed the Byzantines had Greek as the language of the Empire. Were the Greeks not able to distinguish among their language and Latin?(of Rome) I don't think so. So, my personal view is that Greece is an hybrid state of people, that has very little to do with Hellenes.
Albania too is not a monolithic Albanian state of Albanians only. We are the majority.
Seen the Greek Government chauvinist stance towards south Albania( Epirus is Greek) me as an Albanian have a legitimate question: Who are you Romei? Southern Albania has no Romei heritage in its veins. So since you are an amalgam of people under a false umbrella of Hellenism can't have territorial claims for other countries. Who knows where the majority of your people came from!
So as you can see its no provocation here, just a legitimate question.

 

[Yetos]

You seem to not know anything about Fallmerayer! Was he provoking too? Had you known about him you would see that there is no provocation here. In the time of ottoman empire if you asked a Greek who are you?-he would answer in one of two ways; I am Romei or I am a christian. Nobody would tell you I am a Hellene.
If you asked an Albanian he would tell you he was an Arbereshe or since the conversation was in Turkish; I am from Arnautlluk. So always Albanians did not identify themselves neither with the religion nor with Rome. Why Greeks?
As one forumer here noticed the Byzantines had Greek as the language of the Empire. Were the Greeks not able to distinguish among their language and Latin?(of Rome) I don't think so. So, my personal view is that Greece is an hybrid state of people, that has very little to do with Hellenes.
Albania too is not a monolithic Albanian state of Albanians only. We are the majority.
Seen the Greek Government chauvinist stance towards south Albania( Epirus is Greek) me as an Albanian have a legitimate question: Who are you Romei? Southern Albania has no Romei heritage in its veins. So since you are an amalgam of people under a false umbrella of Hellenism can't have territorial claims for other countries. Who knows where the majority of your people came from!
So as you can see its no provocation here, just a legitimate question.

Fallmayer is rejected long time ago,
at least the PC4 genetical mark should convince you,

now about Bορειος Ηπειρος, i will not answer, simply I remind you the testimony of the 2 Irish monks at Crusaders times

I will just tell this,
most of ancient Greek nobility was slain by Christians,
but not the heart, neither the core, the soul,
by force of Christians and Flavians and Codex about Paganism we were forced to change religion, but we kept our customs inside christian church,
we replace Poseidon with Agio Nikola, St Nicola, and Apollo with St George,
since in East Roman Emperrors Codexes there was identification of word Ελληνας with Pagan, we accepted the term Ρωμιος, just to survive,
but by time we become one with East Romans, and lately we manage to reject the fear of Christianity, and we return to our roots,
nobody said we do not have admixtures, yes we have, I personally described the 5 Slavic tribes, but not in the numbers you are referring,

from just 2 genetical characteristics we have >45% on 1 and >63 % on the other with our fathers, the Greeks of antique, and from what I heard there is also one with >72% although not published yet, so consider it not correct
and these are unigue global,



So yes we change our name as Graikoi, Hellenes, Romioi, Hellenes again

 

[Ike]

You seem to not know anything about Fallmerayer! Was he provoking too? Had you known about him you would see that there is no provocation here. In the time of ottoman empire if you asked a Greek who are you?-he would answer in one of two ways; I am Romei or I am a christian. Nobody would tell you I am a Hellene.
If you asked an Albanian he would tell you he was an Arbereshe or since the conversation was in Turkish; I am from Arnautlluk. So always Albanians did not identify themselves neither with the religion nor with Rome. Why Greeks?
As one forumer here noticed the Byzantines had Greek as the language of the Empire. Were the Greeks not able to distinguish among their language and Latin?(of Rome) I don't think so. So, my personal view is that Greece is an hybrid state of people, that has very little to do with Hellenes.
Albania too is not a monolithic Albanian state of Albanians only. We are the majority.
Seen the Greek Government chauvinist stance towards south Albania( Epirus is Greek) me as an Albanian have a legitimate question: Who are you Romei? Southern Albania has no Romei heritage in its veins. So since you are an amalgam of people under a false umbrella of Hellenism can't have territorial claims for other countries. Who knows where the majority of your people came from!
So as you can see its no provocation here, just a legitimate question.

Empty talk. Whole Albania and Balkans were also Romei:




"Romei" (dal greco: Ῥωμιός / Rōmiós) era il termine usato dagli stessi abitanti dell'Impero Romano d'Oriente per definirsi. Come l'Impero bizantino era Impero romano, così la sua capitale Costantinopoli era la Nuova Roma. I Romei, infine, chiamavano la penisola Balcanica Rumelia, nome di regione che sarà conservato pure dai conquistatori ottomani."

http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romei

 

[albanopolis]

Fallmayer is rejected long time ago,
at least the PC4 genetical mark should convince you,

now about Bορειος Ηπειρος, i will not answer, simply I remind you the testimony of the 2 Irish monks at Crusaders times

I will just tell this,
most of ancient Greek nobility was slain by Christians,
but not the heart, neither the core, the soul,
by force of Christians and Flavians and Codex about Paganism we were forced to change religion, but we kept our customs inside christian church,
we replace Poseidon with Agio Nikola, St Nicola, and Apollo with St George,
since in East Roman Emperrors Codexes there was identification of word Ελληνας with Pagan, we accepted the term Ρωμιος, just to survive,
but by time we become one with East Romans, and lately we manage to reject the fear of Christianity, and we return to our roots,
nobody said we do not have admixtures, yes we have, I personally described the 5 Slavic tribes, but not in the numbers you are referring,

from just 2 genetical characteristics we have >45% on 1 and >63 % on the other with our fathers, the Greeks of antique, and from what I heard there is also one with >72% although not published yet, so consider it not correct
and these are unigue global,



So yes we change our name as Graikoi, Hellenes, Romioi, Hellenes again

Fallmerayer is rejected by Greek government not the academics. He was an eyewitness of 19 century Greece and his accounts can not be dismissed because Greeks don't like it.
Rome was in Albania too, Christianity was imposed upon Albanians, Roman amphitheaters were erected but nothing Romei happened.
I know you guys have many reasons to oppose the Romei's arguments but my main goal of this thread is to show you that we (Albanians) know who you are. Stop beating your chest with Hellenes because some of you have nothing to do with it. Get to senses and recognize the new Albanian republic of Macedonia because it was not Greek. No provocations, just straight talk.

 

[Ike]

Get to senses and recognize the new Albanian republic of Macedonia because it was not Greek. No provocations, just straight talk.

Yep, it was just a matter of time

 

[Yetos]

Fallmerayer is rejected by Greek government not the academics. He was an eyewitness of 19 century Greece and his accounts can not be dismissed because Greeks don't like it.
Rome was in Albania too, Christianity was imposed upon Albanians, Roman amphitheaters were erected but nothing Romei happened.
I know you guys have many reasons to oppose the Romei's arguments but my main goal of this thread is to show you that we (Albanians) know who you are. Stop beating your chest with Hellenes because some of you have nothing to do with it. Get to senses and recognize the new Albanian republic of Macedonia because it was not Greek. No provocations, just straight talk.

Fallmayer is used only by Albanian and Slav-Makedonian extra-nationalists,
you stick on the glue, and you do not see what they show you,

you better read again what the 2 Irish monks have written,
Durres was a Greek city at 1200 AD,
one day you must recognise that majority of Albanians are Greeks, Venicians, Normands Anju Slav and Aromani,

and as you said, we Greeks know it,. no provocations, just straight talk. to use your words,
your imams can not change history.

get your senses and recognise the Aytochthonos and archegonos republic of North Epiros

 

[albanopolis]

Fallmayer is used only by Albanian and Slav-Makedonian extra-nationalists,
you stick on the glue, and you do not see what they show you,

you better read again what the 2 Irish monks have written,
Durres was a Greek city at 1200 AD,
one day you must recognise that majority of Albanians are Greeks, Venicians, Normands Anju Slav and Aromani,

and as you said, we Greeks know it,. no provocations, just straight talk. to use your words,
your imams can not change history.

get your senses and recognise the Aytochthonos and archegonos republic of North Epiros

Now you got me. I have no arguments to fight. Irish monks have said Durres was Greek in 1200.:disappointed:
Had they been German monks one could take them in consideration but Irish?
Everyone knows they drink why don't you? Fallmerayer was not a drunk dumb Irish! He was an Austrian member of Academy of science, a person armed with Knowledge. And he did not see many Greeks in Greece.
As for Epirus ( South) we have a plan! You will here about it when time is ripe!

 

[Yetos]

Now you got me. I have no arguments to fight. Irish monks have said Durres was Greek in 1200.:disappointed:
Had they been German monks one could take them in consideration but Irish?
Everyone knows they drink why don't you? Fallmerayer was not a drunk dumb Irish! He was an Austrian member of Academy of science, a person armed with Knowledge. And he did not see many Greeks in Greece.
As for Epirus ( South) we have a plan! You will here about it when time is ripe!

Are you saying that Irish Catholic Monks were alcoholic?



”Inhabitatur enim Latinis, Grecis, Judeis perfidis, et barbaris Albanensibus” 1322AD

 

[albanopolis]

Are you saying that Irish Catholic Monks were alcoholic?



”Inhabitatur enim Latinis, Grecis, Judeis perfidis, et barbaris Albanensibus” 1322AD

Not only alcoholics! Rapists too!

 

[Yetos]

Not only alcoholics! Rapists too!

i quess you do not drink alcohol, like Arabs, right?

 

[albanopolis]

i quess you do not drink alcohol, like Arabs, right?

Let me explain you why those Irish monks are dumb! Its 1200 ad. Byzantines are at their height as an empire. Lingua franca of the empire was Romei language. So to have a conversation with a foreigner one had to speak Romei. But that did not mean Romei was their mother toungue. Albanians living in a multiethnic empire new the language of their neighbors, and of course Romey as their immediate neighbors.Albanians could easily tell that those pale Irish, that looked like they had never seen the sun, were foreigners and they talked to them in Romei. Those monks being dumb thought the language of the people was Romei.

 

[Gorgonzola]

In 1274 Charles Anjou wrote that Durres had been besieged by the Albanians and the Greeks (albanenses et greci) by these appellations he meant the Catholic and Orthodox Albanians.
In the beginning of the XIV century appellation Arbanite, Albanite referred only to the catholic Albanians. (Ref: V. Tapkova-Zaimova, L’idee byzantine de l’unite du monde et l’Etat Bulgare, in “Resumes des Communications Ier CongresInt. Et. Du S.E. Europeen”, Sofia 1966, p. 228.)
Basically the name greeks in that situation has no function other than orthodox albanians, because that's how they were called at the period.Because it was a period that the religion of the albanians had changed, the names for an albanian weren't the same.Religion was the most important thing in order to identify a person at the time.
Let's not forget that the first dictionary that was made about albanian was the "latin-epirotum" dictionary, epirote being the albanian language.

 

[Dianatomia]

In 1274 Charles Anjou wrote that Durres had been besieged by the Albanians and the Greeks (albanenses et greci) by these appellations he meant the Catholic and Orthodox Albanians.
In the beginning of the XIV century appellation Arbanite, Albanite referred only to the catholic Albanians. (Ref: V. Tapkova-Zaimova, L’idee byzantine de l’unite du monde et l’Etat Bulgare, in “Resumes des Communications Ier CongresInt. Et. Du S.E. Europeen”, Sofia 1966, p. 228.)
Basically the name greeks in that situation has no function other than orthodox albanians, because that's how they were called at the period.Because it was a period that the religion of the albanians had changed, the names for an albanian weren't the same.Religion was the most important thing in order to identify a person at the time.
Let's not forget that the first dictionary that was made about albanian was the "latin-epirotum" dictionary, epirote being the albanian language.

It is confirmed once again in 1332 when two Irish monks who visited Albania on their way to Jerusalem that Durrës was “inhabited by Latins, Greeks, perfidious Jews and barbaric Albanians”.

The Latins were the Vlachs and they were also Orthodox like the Greeks, so they did not make a religious distinction. The Albanians are also referred separately in the quote.

As for the dictionary. It was published in Rome, where they traditionally referred to the whole of Albania as Epirus. Epirus Nova in Roman times.

 

[Gorgonzola]

It is confirmed once again in 1332 when two Irish monks who visited Albania on their way to Jerusalem that Durrës was “inhabited by Latins, Greeks, perfidious Jews and barbaric Albanians”.

The Latins were the Vlachs and they were also Orthodox like the Greeks, so they did not make a religious distinction. The Albanians are also referred separately in the quote.

As for the dictionary. It was published in Rome, where they traditionally referred to the whole of Albania as Epirus. Epirus Nova in Roman times.

You can't know who the latins were, they might the people who were ruling Kingdom of Albania at the time, Anjus.In 1274 they were no Latins there.
There is no historic proof of the existence of a Greek speaking community in the Durres region.I made a search and at the same period the name greek was also used for the orthodox albanians,for which i brought a reference.Since they were religiously Orthodox, they were still not lumped under the same identity as the Catholic Albanians.The albanians were also called epirotes several times by the byzantine writers.
In the medieval there was not a standart name for the albanians depending mostly by religion.

 

[Yetos]

”Inhabitatur enim Latinis, Grecis, Judeis perfidis, et barbaris Albanensibus”

can someone explain that? i do not know Latin

 

[Yetos]

You can't know who the latins were, they might the people who were ruling Kingdom of Albania at the time, Anjus.In 1274 they were no Latins there.
There is no historic proof of the existence of a Greek speaking community in the Durres region.I made a search and at the same period the name greek was also used for the orthodox albanians,for which i brought a reference.Since they were religiously Orthodox, they were still not lumped under the same identity as the Catholic Albanians.The albanians were also called epirotes several times by the byzantine writers.
In the medieval there was not a standart name for the albanians depending mostly by religion.

i do not see about religion,
the irish monks speak about language

 

[Dianatomia]

You can't know who the latins were, they might the people who were ruling Kingdom of Albania at the time, Anjus.In 1274 they were no Latins there.
There is no historic proof of the existence of a Greek speaking community in the Durres region.I made a search and at the same period the name greek was also used for the orthodox albanians,for which i brought a reference.Since they were religiously Orthodox, they were still not lumped under the same identity as the Catholic Albanians.The albanians were also called epirotes several times by the byzantine writers.
In the medieval there was not a standart name for the albanians depending mostly by religion.

I think we are walking around the bush here. Durres, previously Epidamnos, was founded by Greeks and there was also a Greek presence there until the late Middle ages.

The Byzantine Greeks never referred to other Orthodox non-Greek speaking peoples as Greek/Romios. Could you offer a source where it says that Albanian speakers were referred to as Greeks?