I also second this without any doubt. I always think EV 13 were moving North-South and not like many others believing viceversa. But I'm still confused how the hell E arrived to this North carpathian zone from it's NE Afrika origin ? And without any considerable impact in Europe till EV 13 appearance !?
Many haplogroups wandered in circles, E-V13 is no exception, but the rule. If you check where the majority of any given haplogroup was sitting in different eras, you will see that a lot moved quite a bit.
As a starter, we don't know for sure where haplogroup E, haplogroup E1b started, we also don't know how various haplotypes of E1b1b entered Europe, we just don't. We can say which options are still left, but we don't know for sure.
My current position goes like that:
- Haplogroup E was born in the Nile Valley or Near East.
- E1b1b was born in the Nile Valley or Near East - this can be the same place as E, or a different, we don't know.
- E1b1b moved up the Levante, we can find it among Natufians and entered the gene pool of the early Anatolian farmers
- The ancestor of E-V13 entered Europe with early Neolithics (E-L618 or even E-Z1919)
- E-L618 spread with other haplotypes of E1b1b in Europe among Neolithics, in Vinca, Cardial-Impresso Ware, Michelsberger, Lengyel-Sopot.
- Various descendents survived the expansion of the steppe people, with a possible centre in the Northern Carpathians, derived from Lengyel-Sopot - among them surviving clades of E-V13. They became largely Indo-Europeanised and began to spread beyond their homeland, in which they were reknowed miners and smiths, which was part of their pathway to survival and later success
- At the LBA-EIA transition, they spread out big time within the Urnfield-cremation horizon. Many clans and individuals move with new mining and metal processing technologies, as well as new tools, weapons, fighting styles and religious-ideological motifs to the North and West, but the bulk moves down, to the South, into the Southern Carpathians, Pannonia, the Balkan and beyond - some might even be associated with Sea People.
Part of this was exploiting the technological advantage, but another one was the pressure from the North and especially the East, because new steppe people entered the scene with the Thraco-Cimmerian horizon. Which created in the East, the mixture of the Fluted Ware/Gava and other Urnfield related people with a new steppe influx, the Daco-Thracian people, which were, without a doubt, the people with the highest frequency of E-V13.
But these same influences from the Southern and South Eastern Urnfield groups made it also to Italy, Noricum, Pannonia, Greece, the Balkans in general and even beyond, to Anatolia and the Near East. So really crucial is the Bronze Age to early Iron Age transition. If you look at the most important splits, between different regional subclades, they all happened before, between the LBA and EIA. There are practically no big splits, lets say Britain : Balkan or Scandinavia : Near East dating to a later, to a Roman Age and historical period. Such splits don't matter, almost all of the wide geographical distribution happened before the Roman Iron Age!
This is a clear indicator for what took place, and that many E-V13 clans from the Carpathians participated in migrations to the West, with Celts, or even with Germanics and Slavs afterwards, like E-L540. There is absolutely no way to explain the distribution by a more recent, historical time South -> North migration. Even most of the widespread Balkan clades date no earlier than to the LBA-EIA transition, and some are actually younger, pointing to a more recent, especially Celtic North -> South migration.
So any South -> North migration would have to have happened before the Middle Bronze Age, but there was none, Pannonia seems to have had little to no E-V13 originally, the Balkan too, Greece as well. So chances are, by now, bigger that probably the ancestor of E-V13 moved up to Central Europe/the North Carpathians with Lengyel-Sopot, survived there, all the turmoil, and came back as a successful lineage with new innovations, like new techniques in mining, metal processing, new types of swords and military tactics, increased usage of horse and chariot etc. We also have, in the North Carpathians, huge settlements like Teleac, with some of the most advanced metal technologies at that time, which came under pressure from the relative North and East (steppe) later. So they had a two part incentive for a big push to the South and a diaspora to the East.
In the Thraco-Cimmerian horizon, these two elements, Central European Urnfield and new steppe (Cimmerian-Scythian) fused and later produced the Hallstatt culture.