Northener
Elite member
- Messages
- 2,008
- Reaction score
- 522
- Points
- 113
- Location
- Groningen
- Ethnic group
- NW Euro
- Y-DNA haplogroup
- E1b1b/ E-V22
A bold hypothesis .... or fiction ? It is a well-known theory of Steve S. Bird that haplogroup E-V13 in Wales and England was partly introduced by the Romans. But what about E-V22?
For E-V22 there is made a connection with the Phoenicians. This was an old seafaring people (at their peak from 1550 to 300 BC) which emerged from the Levant in the entire coastal area and the Mediterranean islands. They are often associated with the spread of E-V22 from the Levant to the rest of the Mediterranean. Or as Eupedia states: "The Phoenicianscould have disseminated E-V22 to Sicily, Sardinia, southern Spain and the Maghreb."
But did they remain only in de Mediterranean? No probably not, because the Phoenicians had an active trade with North West Europe. They focused on two things: tin and to the very exclusive and expensive amber. The prices of amber were so high that it sometimes happened that the price of a piece of amber was the same as the price of a slave and that amber sometimes had a higher value than gold.
Tin was derived from England. In Caldwell et al 'The Early Jews and Muslimsin England and Wales: A Genetic and Genealogical History' (2014) is explained that the Phoenicians set foot on English shore to get some tin out of the Cornwell area. Findings of skulls of monkeys from North Africa has showen that there was more than just tin trade and that there was probably a trading post or colonia.
But for the exclusive amber the Phoenicians went to: Friesland (Frisia). Amber was found on the North Sea Coast. In the recorded naming you can recognize this. For the Isle of Ameland or Oostergo (where my Y-DNA roots lie) the Romans spoke about “Austeravia”. And in Danish rav is still equal to amber. And until today you can find amber stone on Ameland (recently a stone of 5,5 kilogram). The Greeks used for amber the term elektron. The name “Elektriden” was used for the Frisian area. In 2006 John Richter reconstructed the ancient amber trade route, Friesland was apart of it!
Steve Bird (of the Roman E-V13 theory) stated in2007 on E-V22 and England: "The Phoenicians traded May tin in Cornwall near Penzance. I for one thinkThat subclade E-V12 (E3b1a1) or V22 (E3b1a3) might well have arrived with them." Why would that be limited to the tin mines (Cornwell) in England and not for the Phoenicians may be much more interesting amber area in Friesland?
PS I don’t dare any risk calculation on my YDNA with a high child (/boys) dead rate in ancient times, all kinds of migrations and the Black Death
For E-V22 there is made a connection with the Phoenicians. This was an old seafaring people (at their peak from 1550 to 300 BC) which emerged from the Levant in the entire coastal area and the Mediterranean islands. They are often associated with the spread of E-V22 from the Levant to the rest of the Mediterranean. Or as Eupedia states: "The Phoenicianscould have disseminated E-V22 to Sicily, Sardinia, southern Spain and the Maghreb."
But did they remain only in de Mediterranean? No probably not, because the Phoenicians had an active trade with North West Europe. They focused on two things: tin and to the very exclusive and expensive amber. The prices of amber were so high that it sometimes happened that the price of a piece of amber was the same as the price of a slave and that amber sometimes had a higher value than gold.
Tin was derived from England. In Caldwell et al 'The Early Jews and Muslimsin England and Wales: A Genetic and Genealogical History' (2014) is explained that the Phoenicians set foot on English shore to get some tin out of the Cornwell area. Findings of skulls of monkeys from North Africa has showen that there was more than just tin trade and that there was probably a trading post or colonia.
But for the exclusive amber the Phoenicians went to: Friesland (Frisia). Amber was found on the North Sea Coast. In the recorded naming you can recognize this. For the Isle of Ameland or Oostergo (where my Y-DNA roots lie) the Romans spoke about “Austeravia”. And in Danish rav is still equal to amber. And until today you can find amber stone on Ameland (recently a stone of 5,5 kilogram). The Greeks used for amber the term elektron. The name “Elektriden” was used for the Frisian area. In 2006 John Richter reconstructed the ancient amber trade route, Friesland was apart of it!
Steve Bird (of the Roman E-V13 theory) stated in2007 on E-V22 and England: "The Phoenicians traded May tin in Cornwall near Penzance. I for one thinkThat subclade E-V12 (E3b1a1) or V22 (E3b1a3) might well have arrived with them." Why would that be limited to the tin mines (Cornwell) in England and not for the Phoenicians may be much more interesting amber area in Friesland?
PS I don’t dare any risk calculation on my YDNA with a high child (/boys) dead rate in ancient times, all kinds of migrations and the Black Death