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Thread: Eurogenes K15 - a closer look

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    Post Eurogenes K15 - a closer look

    Here's the correlation matrix of the 224 population averages from this spreadsheet: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...gid=1872836177

    North_Sea Atlantic Baltic Eastern_Euro West_Med West_Asian East_Med Red_Sea South_Asian Southeast_Asian Siberian Amerindian Oceanian Northeast_African Sub-Saharan
    North_Sea 1 0.82907 0.685673 0.448708 0.18488 -0.18007 -0.23952 -0.24735 -0.2653 -0.28824 -0.26861 -0.15932 -0.0972 -0.25591 -0.22893
    Atlantic 0.82907 1 0.527864 0.19318 0.613203 -0.23107 -0.04295 -0.11988 -0.32111 -0.31932 -0.33361 -0.18493 -0.10593 -0.25241 -0.2357
    Baltic 0.685673 0.527864 1 0.658021 0.0197 -0.14359 -0.23146 -0.24275 -0.2277 -0.24928 -0.19999 -0.13439 -0.08235 -0.23411 -0.207
    Eastern_Euro 0.448708 0.19318 0.658021 1 -0.22334 0.030626 -0.31726 -0.3358 -0.04538 -0.22336 0.081366 -0.04838 -0.08966 -0.28309 -0.24672
    West_Med 0.18488 0.613203 0.0197 -0.22334 1 -0.12112 0.412411 0.220175 -0.26823 -0.25275 -0.2855 -0.14599 -0.08405 -0.14177 -0.16247
    West_Asian -0.18007 -0.23107 -0.14359 0.030626 -0.12112 1 0.417185 0.074972 0.180244 -0.20128 -0.18488 -0.1376 -0.08182 -0.20832 -0.19664
    East_Med -0.23952 -0.04295 -0.23146 -0.31726 0.412411 0.417185 1 0.738665 -0.17717 -0.24948 -0.2774 -0.15786 -0.08575 -0.03716 -0.15961
    Red_Sea -0.24735 -0.11988 -0.24275 -0.3358 0.220175 0.074972 0.738665 1 -0.17759 -0.19547 -0.22352 -0.12374 -0.06581 0.344172 -0.05556
    South_Asian -0.2653 -0.32111 -0.2277 -0.04538 -0.26823 0.180244 -0.17717 -0.17759 1 -0.0294 -0.10954 -0.06239 0.011042 -0.13573 -0.11962
    Southeast_Asian -0.28824 -0.31932 -0.24928 -0.22336 -0.25275 -0.20128 -0.24948 -0.19547 -0.0294 1 0.319315 -0.0308 0.05219 -0.12127 -0.106
    Siberian -0.26861 -0.33361 -0.19999 0.081366 -0.2855 -0.18488 -0.2774 -0.22352 -0.10954 0.319315 1 0.122415 -0.0272 -0.14423 -0.12527
    Amerindian -0.15932 -0.18493 -0.13439 -0.04838 -0.14599 -0.1376 -0.15786 -0.12374 -0.06239 -0.0308 0.122415 1 -0.02135 -0.07584 -0.06464
    Oceanian -0.0972 -0.10593 -0.08235 -0.08966 -0.08405 -0.08182 -0.08575 -0.06581 0.011042 0.05219 -0.0272 -0.02135 1 -0.03884 -0.03581
    Northeast_African -0.25591 -0.25241 -0.23411 -0.28309 -0.14177 -0.20832 -0.03716 0.344172 -0.13573 -0.12127 -0.14423 -0.07584 -0.03884 1 0.460995
    Sub-Saharan -0.22893 -0.2357 -0.207 -0.24672 -0.16247 -0.19664 -0.15961 -0.05556 -0.11962 -0.106 -0.12527 -0.06464 -0.03581 0.460995 1

    Not surprisingly, the first four components (North Sea, Atlantic, Baltic, Eastern Euro) appear to form a cluster (their correlations are all positive). And the West Asian, East Med, and Red Sea components appear to form another cluster.

    The highest correlations are as follows:

    North Sea with Atlantic - 0.82907
    East Med with Red Sea - 0.738665
    North Sea with Baltic - 0.685673
    Eastern Euro with Baltic - 0.658021
    Atlantic with West Med - 0.613203

    With the ancient dna results I've seen, the North Sea with Atlantic mixing would seem to have occurred relatively recently, while the East Med with Red Sea correlation might have been there for a longer time. Most of the Neolithic Farmers were highest in the West Med component, with the Atlantic and East Med components also being high, along with smaller amounts of Red Sea. While the Western Eurasian HGs seem to have been overwhelmingly from the first four components, with often some Amerindian and traces of others such as South Asian and Oceanian. And of those Western Eurasian HGs, the Atlantic component tended to be smaller, especially for the non-Western European ones - although strangely, the oldest ones (Ust'-Ishim and Kostenki 14) had a good share of the Atlantic component.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JS Bach View Post
    And of those Western Eurasian HGs, the Atlantic component tended to be smaller, especially for the non-Western European ones - although strangely, the oldest ones (Ust'-Ishim and Kostenki 14) had a good share of the Atlantic component.
    Part, what is now Atlantic component, came from East with Bronze Age migration.
    Be wary of people who tend to glorify the past, underestimate the present, and demonize the future.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LeBrok View Post
    Part, what is now Atlantic component, came from East with Bronze Age migration.
    So what you're saying is the Atlantic component could be broken down into two parts, with one part coming from the East during the Bronze age?

    If so, I suspect the Bell Beakers had both of those components. The average of the Atlantic component for the 7 Bell Beaker samples is 27.08% from this spreadsheet: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...#gid=917906623 That's nearly as high as what it is now in the Atlantic coast countries.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LeBrok View Post
    Part, what is now Atlantic component, came from East with Bronze Age migration.
    What cultures could've the Atlantic Haplotype been involved with?

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    i think the most typical ancient 'atlantic' was made of some WHGs DNA + the double of early people closer to West-Med (neolithic part of EEF) - a small part only came from East, later, mediated by the some bearers of dominant 'north-sea' -
    the proximity 'atlantic' to 'north sea' could be a symetric flood of two directions osmosis not erasing the first great enough distances, but diminshing it, WITHOUT FORGET the common original WHG (we find too in 'baltic' -
    the little part common between today 'atlantic' and ancient skeletons DNA of Eurasia and Siberia is AN OLD INHERITAGE (ancient >> young, of course!)
    almost ALL the today componants we pooled are heirs of these previous men, at some level or another so we find nowaday parts of this ancient DNA inequally legated, but we LABELL IT 'atlantic' or 'south-asian' or 'X' according to the geographic populations where we find them concentrated today -

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