France bans skinny models

[sparkey]

From Reuters:

France will ban excessively thin fashion models and expose modeling agents and the fashion houses that hire them to possible fines and even jail, under a new law passed on Friday.
...
The measure is part of a campaign against anorexia by President Francois Hollande's government. Lawmakers also made it illegal to condone anorexia and said any re-touched photo that alters the bodily appearance of a model for commercial purposes must carry a message stating it had been manipulated.
...
The lawmaker behind the bill previously said models would have to present a medical certificate showing a BMI of at least 18, about 55 kg (121 lb) for a height of 1.75 meters (5.7 feet), before being hired for a job and for a few weeks afterwards.

I'm a skinny dude with a BMI around 17. There goes my dream of being a French model.

[hope]

I think Israel also has a similar ban on skinny models. I know Italy and Spain have bans too but I`m not sure if it is across the board or related to advertisements or fashion shows only.
Bodies come in assorted shapes and sizes, as we know, and in my opinion it would be a good step to actually include all these different shapes and sizes, rather than target only skinny bodies. People, especially young people, should not be exposed to only one image which has too long been promoted as "perfect".
That said well done France.

Like you sparkey, I don`t think my chances as a model are much better. My BMI is pretty good, but I think I might be what the model world would class as vertically challenged ... 5 2".

[Angela]

Hope, I think they want something closer to this....(She says she's 5'8 and about 130)



Than to this....




You know there's something wrong when this girl can only get a job as a "plus size" model. Meanwhile, I think she'd probably swim in the clothes in the plus size department. She looks like an American size 10 or even an 8 to me given that the camera puts on about 15 pounds.

[Garrick]

I'm a skinny dude with a BMI around 17. There goes my dream of being a French model.

I have no opinion for models, but in real life I'm strongly against that someone must put on weight or lose weight if she or he does not confirm to standards. People should not be uniform and that all look similar. If someone wants to be skinnier or fattier it is her/his desire (and right), who cares.

[hope]

Hope, I think they want something closer to this....(She says she's 5'8 and about 130)



Than to this....




You know there's something wrong when this girl can only get a job as a "plus size" model. Meanwhile, I think she'd probably swim in the clothes in the plus size department. She looks like an American size 10 or even an 8 to me given that the camera puts on about 15 pounds.

A great deal of the blame lies with the big fashion houses, Angela IMO. They make clothes so tiny that only the thinnest models can squeeze into then. Models who are not thin as wafer, wont get work in their shows. Recall the statement from one of the biggest in the business when being asked about skinny models, his reply was "only fat mummies who sit with crisps, complain about skinny models".......and by this, again enforcing the idea that skinny is good, fat is bad, and giving a negative picture to go with it.
Also, the media must take its share of the blame.
I think any ban regarding ultra thin models is a sensible step but as I said in earlier post, rather than saying we wont use models who are too skinny, why not also use models of a more regular weight. I recall a study that showed average size models were just as effective at selling products than were skinny ones.

[Angela]

A great deal of the blame lies with the big fashion houses, Angela IMO. They make clothes so tiny that only the thinnest models can squeeze into then. Models who are not thin as wafer, wont get work in their shows. Recall the statement from one of the biggest in the business when being asked about skinny models, his reply was "only fat mummies who sit with crisps, complain about skinny models".......and by this, again enforcing the idea that skinny is good, fat is bad, and giving a negative picture to go with it.
Also, the media must take its share of the blame.
I think any ban regarding ultra thin models is a sensible step but as I said in earlier post, rather than saying we wont use models who are too skinny, why not also use models of a more regular weight. I recall a study that showed average size models were just as effective at selling products than were skinny ones.

The problem comes with projecting this image onto young girls. I don't think it's a coincidence that the glorification of the "emaciated" look coincided with the incredible rise in eating disorders of all types. That isn't to say that at the same time we don't have a massive explosion in some countries of obesity rates. The way to combat that is not, however, in my opinion, to glorify women who look like Auschwitz survivors.

I can't believe that we've gotten to the point where Katy Perry has to publicly defend her weight, or where Sophia Vergara has trouble getting clothes for red carpet events because the fashion houses no longer made couture gowns in her size. It doesn't make any sense to me. The sample sizes used to be a fours and sixes (which was great for me!), then they were all fours, and then twos and now some are in size 0. My skeleton is bigger than that! What's the percentage of women who can get down to that size? I'd have to have surgery to remove some bits and pieces!!!!!!

[Diocletian]

The same govt. should ban the consumption of fast food too to prevent obesity if all this is for caring for the people.

[Aberdeen]

The problem comes with projecting this image onto young girls. I don't think it's a coincidence that the glorification of the "emaciated" look coincided with the incredible rise in eating disorders of all types. That isn't to say that at the same time we don't have a massive explosion in some countries of obesity rates. The way to combat that is not, however, in my opinion, to glorify women who look like Auschwitz survivors.

I can't believe that we've gotten to the point where Katy Perry has to publicly defend her weight, or where Sophia Vergara has trouble getting clothes for red carpet events because the fashion houses no longer made couture gowns in her size. It doesn't make any sense to me. The sample sizes used to be a fours and sixes (which was great for me!), then they were all fours, and then twos and now some are in size 0. My skeleton is bigger than that! What's the percentage of women who can get down to that size? I'd have to have surgery to remove some bits and pieces!!!!!!

I can remember a time before size zero was invented and models weren't as skinny as they are now, but they were still thinner and taller than the average woman. And owners of high fashion businesses admitted that their models were thinner and taller than the average woman, and said it was necessary because they were selling clothes, not models, and they wanted models who wouldn't draw attention away from the product. But a lot of young women were still beating themselves up because they thought their faces weren't pretty enough or their breasts weren't big enough. If Katy Perry had been around then, a lot of teenage girls would have been upset because they weren't as curvy as she is. So it seems to be that women and girls have always been encouraged to aspire to unrealistic standards of beauty. The difference is that in the past they didn't aspire to malnutrition.

We men as often given the message that we don't measure up unless we look like fashion models but with lots of muscles and a metre long penis. However, the messaging isn't so relentless for us, so most of us manage to ignore it.

[Minty]

There are people naturally very slim and small, like me, but I am also fairly short I am only 160cm, where as those models are in between 170cm tall to 180 cm or even taller. In the past the models are shorter and not this skinny, look at Marilyn Monroe, she was 166cm and Elizabeth Taylor was only 157cm. I think what is healthy looking is about proportion, can you imagine a petite person like me with large bones, and huge boobs that would make me look short and stocky.

[Minty]

I can remember a time before size zero was invented and models weren't as skinny as they are now, but they were still thinner and taller than the average woman. And owners of high fashion businesses admitted that their models were thinner and taller than the average woman, and said it was necessary because they were selling clothes, not models, and they wanted models who wouldn't draw attention away from the product. But a lot of young women were still beating themselves up because they thought their faces weren't pretty enough or their breasts weren't big enough. If Katy Perry had been around then, a lot of teenage girls would have been upset because they weren't as curvy as she is. So it seems to be that women and girls have always been encouraged to aspire to unrealistic standards of beauty. The difference is that in the past they didn't aspire to malnutrition.

We men as often given the message that we don't measure up unless we look like fashion models but with lots of muscles and a metre long penis. However, the messaging isn't so relentless for us, so most of us manage to ignore it.

Well, I recently watched a french documentary where they discriminate women at job interviews, now in France it is much easier to get a job as a man than a woman. According to this documentary, women get discriminated even more, they get discriminated for their height, weight and their physical features. This is illegal in France, and none of the jobs they had investigated has anything to do with selling clothes.

So as a man, it is because you received less discriminations than women to be able to ignore those discriminations you mentioned.

[Angela]

I don't think anybody got the message about banning skinny models.

She has a very pretty face but I think her body is...well, the picture speaks for itself. The worse thing is that she's ruining her health to look this way.



I think she was the third highest paid model in 2015.

Adriana Lima, who I think was second is marginally healthier looking, but she's had surgical enhancements, so she's an impossible role model for most women.



The role models for men are just as impossible. The highest paid male model for probably a decade.



As for job interviews, men face their own pressures. Being fat is a no no for them as well, and a lot of men worry that hair loss will make them look too old for the job.

[Dinarid]

I find particularly irritating the male model look that is pushed on us constantly. At 192cm it is physically impossible to have the body type they promote. Which is funny, because they glorify tall men. Well, if you want a body type like that then you may as well stick with 175cm men who from what I've seen have a much easier time looking like that. Of course there are definitely tall and robust men (especially in Montenegro) but they look too intimidating and "big".

[Minty]

I don't think anybody got the message about banning skinny models.

She has a very pretty face but I think her body is...well, the picture speaks for itself. The worse thing is that she's ruining her health to look this way.



I think she was the third highest paid model in 2015.

Adriana Lima, who I think was second is marginally healthier looking, but she's had surgical enhancements, so she's an impossible role model for most women.

Some girls are naturally thin, some have worked out to be thin, and another proportion of them will have dieted heavily to get into those tiny samples. Unless a girl looks unwell, acts spacey, or is publically displaying dangerous diet practices it’s not really for us to judge how she got thin or to assume she has an eating disorder. You can’t be sure. You are not with her 24/7.

The other question is, of course, are these skinny, perfect creatures causing eating disorders in other impressionable young women, who are dieting radically in order to look like them?

But the world of high fashion, and couture, will never change – designers prefer to see their fashions presented on a thin, gamine silhouette, with long limbs and wasp waists, like line drawings come to life.

Yes, in more recent times they sometimes experiment with showing other shapes and sizes, dancers and athletes, but in general high fashion is focused on glittering creatures who are not meant to resemble the ordinary woman. That’s the dream.

The important underlying message should be that we teach young women that these exotic birds are just fashion models, not role models. They are simply there to sell clothes, meant to be admired, but not necessarily emulated. And I don’t know how you do that.

The role models for men are just as impossible. The highest paid male model for probably a decade.



As for job interviews, men face their own pressures. Being fat is a no no for them as well, and a lot of men worry that hair loss will make them look too old for the job.

It must be different in Italy, I know plenty of fat bold men who get jobs without any problems.

[Angela]

I find particularly irritating the male model look that is pushed on us constantly. At 192cm it is physically impossible to have the body type they promote. Which is funny, because they glorify tall men. Well, if you want a body type like that then you may as well stick with 175cm men who from what I've seen have a much easier time looking like that. Of course there are definitely tall and robust men (especially in Montenegro) but they look too intimidating and "big".

Well, it's not impossible, because he exists: David Gandy :)

"David Gandy Weight: 201 lbs (91 kg)David Gandy Height: 6′ 3″ (1.91 m)
David Gandy Measurements:
Chest: 43 in (109 cm)
Biceps: 15 in (38 cm)
Waist: 33 in (84 cm)"

http://www.celebheightweight.com/201...nts-net-worth/

The point is, though, how many men have the genetics to look like that even with diet and exercise? After university I worked in advertising for a few years, and my particular role was in overseeing the production of the print ads and the television commercials.

These models don't look like the average person walking down the street. They're incredibly tall, for one thing, but they also have to have iron discipline, because they have to be very thin for their height. Among the women, in particular, most of them have severe eating disorders, which can lead to other health problems, like terrible skin, which has to be covered up, or thinning hair, which means they need extensions or wigs. Then, in order to fit the "ideal", a lot of them have breast implants, not to mention nose jobs, which are sort of de rigeur. Lately, I've heard some of them have had ribs removed. and buttocks implants. The men spend hours a day in the gym.

What credulous people also don't realize is that, as I said, they have hair extensions, tons of make up on, and still the photos are air brushed. If you were to meet them on the way into the shoot you wouldn't recognize them if you'd only seen them in ads and commercials. Some of them were downright plain in their natural state, in my opinion.

It's insane for most people to think they can look like the images they see in those glossy magazines.

[Dinarid]

Well, it's not impossible, because he exists: David Gandy :)

"David Gandy Weight: 201 lbs (91 kg)David Gandy Height: 6′ 3″ (1.91 m)
David Gandy Measurements:
Chest: 43 in (109 cm)
Biceps: 15 in (38 cm)
Waist: 33 in (84 cm)"

http://www.celebheightweight.com/201...nts-net-worth/

The point is, though, how many men have the genetics to look like that even with diet and exercise? After university I worked in advertising for a few years, and my particular role was in overseeing the production of the print ads and the television commercials.

These models don't look like the average person walking down the street. They're incredibly tall, for one thing, but they also have to have iron discipline, because they have to be very thin for their height. Among the women, in particular, most of them have severe eating disorders, which can lead to other health problems, like terrible skin, which has to be covered up, or thinning hair, which means they need extensions or wigs. Then, in order to fit the "ideal", a lot of them have breast implants, not to mention nose jobs, which are sort of de rigeur. Lately, I've heard some of them have had ribs removed. and buttocks implants. The men spend hours a day in the gym.

What credulous people also don't realize is that, as I said, they have hair extensions, tons of make up on, and still the photos are air brushed. If you were to meet them on the way into the shoot you wouldn't recognize them if you'd only seen them in ads and commercials. Some of them were downright plain in their natural state, in my opinion.

It's insane for most people to think they can look like the images they see in those glossy magazines.

I meant impossible for me. Yes, there are tall men with bodies like that but not many. That's probably why they go to such an extent to seek them out. As you pointed out they are far above average height- even here in Herzegovina, the region with the highest mean male height in the world, most men are comfortably below that height at ~186cm on average. I see a problem with beauty standards for both genders. Anorexia for women is bad, and so is telling men that we need to have a torso like David Gandy.

Also, I don't think most people do expect to look like that. They just want to approximate it as much as possible and even if they get somewhat close or rather look significantly more like that than they used to, it still isn't good enough, and this is why women are obsessed with dieting and men with exercise.