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Thread: suebi y-dna input in north portugal and galicia

  1. #26
    Advisor Angela's Avatar
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    ^^Unfortunately for you I read Portuguese.

    So, now you have an infraction.

    In the future please post in English. Of course, if it's provocative nonsense like the above you'll still get an infraction.


    Non si fa il proprio dovere perchè qualcuno ci dica grazie, lo si fa per principio, per se stessi, per la propria dignità. Oriana Fallaci

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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    ^^Unfortunately for you I read Portuguese.

    So, now you have an infraction.

    In the future please post in English. Of course, if it's provocative nonsense like the above you'll still get an infraction.

    Hi,
    I posted in Portuguese because it's a topic about Portugal started by a Portuguese and the vast majority of the commentators are Portuguese.

    What do you define as "infraction" and "provocative"?

    I really can't see where is the "provocative" as I was just confirming what Pedro Gomes had stated.

    Cerezo M, Achilli A, Olivieri A, Perego UA, Gómez-Carballa A, Brisighelli F, et al. (2012) Reconstructing ancient mitochondrial DNA links between Africa and Europe. Genome Res 22: 821–826. pmid:22454235

    "Phylogeographic analyses showed that ∼65% of the European L lineages most likely arrived in rather recent historical times, including the Romanization period, the Arab conquest of the Iberian Peninsula and Sicily, and during the period of the Atlantic slave trade. However, the remaining 35% of L mtDNAs form European-specific subclades, revealing that there was gene flow from sub-Saharan Africa toward Europe as early as 11,000 yr ago."

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    Quote Originally Posted by suebiking View Post
    What I don't understand is why so reputed universities as porto and minho don't compare the dna of nowadays braga inhabitants with distant ancestors beeing of braga as well it suebi remains, even roman remains and medieval frankish remains. What are they afraid of, prooving that north-west portuguese are germanic or disproving. What matters is the truth. If a very well-done study on north-west portuguese said that we are just as germanic as other iberian peoples and that our beliefs and our predecessors beliefs about our ancestry are wrong then we would just have to accept the truth. It makes me sick that my town hostes great roman and even germanic festivals, some villages have germanic names(or influenced) and yet they don't care about genetics. It is like the celtic case we hoste celtic festivals in union with galicia and we don't try to prove our heritage just because we are afraid the dna tests could tell us that we are in fact not celtic. Sometimes and only sometimes I am ashamed of my own people's decisions but I have to deal with it. Hopefully I will test my own dna (autosomal,y-dna and mt-dna) then I will prove or disprove my suspicions of germanic heritage along with celtic, italic and even if I have any connection to berbers or basques, the later is most probably true.With time those tests get more accurate.

    You smell a conspiracy, as do I.

    My grandfather was a very nordic looking Portuguese man. He has blond hair and blue eyes, he was the only 2 of 9 brothers to have nordic phenotypes. My mother was born with blond hair until the age of 10 and has hazel eyes. I myself inherited none of these phenotypes, none the less, my family and genetics has, and continues to fascinate me.

    So then I learned about the massive amount of Celtic influence in Portugal, then I learned about the Germanic influence.

    The country is far from recognizing its Germanic roots, even though minor, it's still only as prevalent as the overly obsessed North African influence. The media obsesses over our north African history and yet it's almost invisible when looking at the country itself.

    Portugal is substantially Celtic. I took a trip to the north of the country and found myself in Citania de Biritieros, an ancient Celtic hill fort. The houses are undeniably Celtic, they used to use a bath house for rituals, well sometime in the mid 1900's, the Portuguese found this bathhouse from the ancient Celts in the district of Braga/Guimarães and rock actually has a Celtic Triskle symbol, exactly as shown in ancient Irish/Scotish monuments. The funny thing is, nowhere on the information pamphlet did they mention "Celtic", only to refer the site as "pre roman". The Portuguese government fails to address our Celtic lineage. I asked the grey eyed, dirty blond haired Portuguese woman at the information center for Citania de Biretieros, "what is the culture of this ancient site?" She responded, "It is Celtic". I asked her "why does it not say anywhere that it is Celtic?" She said "I really dont know why they dont say it is celtic".

    Anyways, I have seen with my own eyes the Celtic influence in Portugal, and the genetic studies have solidified the bloodline, Portugal and Spain (it's all homogenized now) is Celtic, and I mean substantially Celtic like 50% and the other 50% is mediteranian. The Portuguese just wont admit it!! Meanwhile they are fixed on the North African influence

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by suebiking View Post
    What I don't understand is why so reputed universities as porto and minho don't compare the dna of nowadays braga inhabitants with distant ancestors beeing of braga as well it suebi remains, even roman remains and medieval frankish remains. What are they afraid of, prooving that north-west portuguese are germanic or disproving. What matters is the truth. If a very well-done study on north-west portuguese said that we are just as germanic as other iberian peoples and that our beliefs and our predecessors beliefs about our ancestry are wrong then we would just have to accept the truth. It makes me sick that my town hostes great roman and even germanic festivals, some villages have germanic names(or influenced) and yet they don't care about genetics. It is like the celtic case we hoste celtic festivals in union with galicia and we don't try to prove our heritage just because we are afraid the dna tests could tell us that we are in fact not celtic. Sometimes and only sometimes I am ashamed of my own people's decisions but I have to deal with it. Hopefully I will test my own dna (autosomal,y-dna and mt-dna) then I will prove or disprove my suspicions of germanic heritage along with celtic, italic and even if I have any connection to berbers or basques, the later is most probably true.With time those tests get more accurate.
    Because the iberian peninsula is so homogenized now days, you probably have almost the same DNA as most Northern Portuguese. I myself have a long line of family from Madeira Island, and before that, ancestors from both the north and south. I took a genetic test. Im on the darkest spectrum that I know of for a 100% portuguese person and I can tell you I still have more specifically Germanic DNA than I do African. Though I'm not 100% sure if it's from the Suevi or from the last 300 years, but since it's under 5% it could be potentially very old.

  5. #30
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    I once saw a Galician Suebi woman, but one, the other million I have seen were not from the land.

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    How did you know?

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nick123321 View Post
    How did you know?
    I recognize very well the style of Swedish beauty, it is very different from any other. Keep in mind that my country is very touristy and we have received many Swedes, it is also ABBA and you look at things, you understand. but mainly because it is a beauty different from the rest of Europeans also beautiful.

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    Quote Originally Posted by suebiking View Post
    Well, I don't know for sure about the berber question in south portugal, it is very probable that some were allowed to stay.About the suebi and viking heritage it is very likely that the number of suebi along with other tribes was much bigger than what was estimated but they settled in particular areas( mountainous) more confined to inbreading, this is the case with povoa do varzim as well. It is also not uncommon to see brothers some with nordic features and others with more atlantic and even mediterranean ones.For example my paternal side out of ten siblings, two/three are nordic and the others I wouldn't quite classify they well may be nordic with atlanto mediterranean and although most are light skinned, all of them except the nordic types get really tanned in the summer and look somewhat palid in the winter. Maybe the result of miscigenation between germanics and the natives and has expected the native traits are more prevalent even today. Curious the nordic types are all men. Portugal is a very interesting place to study genetics. You can see a complete nordic type or a person with more berberian traits. I would love to study the region of the minho myself, I reallly would.
    I know this thread is old and you may never see this. But the genetic differences between North Portuguese and Southern Portuguese is so minimal that phenotype variation would not be this pronounced. The conversation of phenotype differences in Portuguese regions is probably a pointless conversation, we know Portuguese have a variety of looks. My family is from the Algarve coastal areas, and we are mostly darker Mediterranean people (very much EEF influenced in looks), but we have cousins who look very Germanic, others who look eastern Mediterranean (like my family), others who look standard med/atlantic influenced, and others who look like Berbers. There is actually quite a bit of differences between looks even though our genetics are almost exactly the same. Which brings me to my next point. The average northern person has almost 0 differences genetically to the average southern person. We see within anthroforums this phenomenon, because we see northern PT's with higher NA percentages to even southern PT's alentejo down to algarve). And then we even see some outliers, I know of an alentejo who gets lower NA than most northerners (but does get a little elevated SSA). But on average, northern PT's will plot indistinguishably to Algarvios. It's not a surprise anymore. There isn't an extensive enough study on us about haplogroup differences to really make any conclusions either. But haplogroup is an ancient marker... the only argument one can make for having an I haplogroup meaning your family has more nordic traits is that, that family somehow made sure to marry only lighter individuals for generations. Or better yet, in the recent generations someone chose to marry lighter individuals closer to your inception. I'd argue the latter is probably truer.

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