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View Poll Results: Y hg of Maykop culture

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  • E1b1b

    2 4.44%
  • G2a

    15 33.33%
  • I1

    1 2.22%
  • I2

    4 8.89%
  • J1

    7 15.56%
  • J2

    18 40.00%
  • N1c

    1 2.22%
  • Q

    0 0%
  • R1a

    7 15.56%
  • R1b

    23 51.11%
  • T

    5 11.11%
  • L

    1 2.22%
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Thread: What is the main haplogroup of Maykop culture?

  1. #1
    Advisor LeBrok's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b Z2109
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H1c

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    2 members found this post helpful.

    What is the main haplogroup of Maykop culture?

    The genetic research is speeding up these days and it shouldn't be long when we have published genomes of many ancient cultures. I think it is time to have a little competition here for bragging rights. Give your best guess.



    Personally, I believe we might find the hiding spot of J2 folks. Other than that we should find G2a, or even some R1b.
    Multiple choice is allowed.
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  2. #2
    Regular Member Fluffy's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    G2a l497 s10458
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H1n

    Ethnic group
    Dutch / French
    Country: Canada-Ontario



    1 members found this post helpful.
    Went with R1b and G2a.
    Species adapt to their environment,
    and those who do so best (the fittest) survive and prosper the most.

  3. #3
    Satyavrata Maciamo's Avatar
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    I have always said R1b1a2 + G2a3b1. There might be a minority of J2 and T1a.
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  4. #4
    Advisor bicicleur's Avatar
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    I would say G2a, but why was this not found in anciant Armenia/Russia then?

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by bicicleur View Post
    I would say G2a, but why was this not found in anciant Armenia/Russia then?

    Yes it seems to me it would most likely be (one of):
    G from the south
    R1b from the south
    R1b from the north

    but no G being found yet pushes it to R1b.
    Last edited by Greying Wanderer; 23-06-15 at 23:07.

  6. #6
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1a1a1
    MtDNA haplogroup
    HV2a1 +G13708A

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    Kurdish
    Country: Germany



    R1b, G2a and some J is my guess.

    Edit: By the way I am the guy who tipped N*.
    Last edited by Alan; 24-06-15 at 02:56.

  7. #7
    Elite member holderlin's Avatar
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    J2 with some R1b

  8. #8
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    It depends on what a period of this culture. According to the logic, the early pre-indo-european Maikop should be J/G like. The late layers of Maikop, which have traces of Indo-Europeonization (Parikrama, Wheel-sun, two dogs in graves) should add some R1.
    We'll see.

  9. #9
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    My bet is on J2 and a substantial minority of R1b.

  10. #10
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    How about R1b?

  11. #11
    Advisor Angela's Avatar
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    It could be a form of G2 as well, perhaps.


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  12. #12
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b - L21/S145*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H3c

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    more celtic
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    1 members found this post helpful.
    it's uneasy to guess upon O info, but "phylosophically" I doubt the elite was Y-G2 bearer; this culture had something very barbaric in it, and seems to me a small warlike elite dominating surrounding regions, maybe running raids here and there sometimes. Not the way I dream the Y-G2 post-Tripolje elites. So I would give the preference to a Y-R1b small elite not by force coming from South Caucasus (it could have been the opposite way); the metrics surveys evocate a not Caucasus not Steppic type but something close to Southeastern Caspian lands, so Y-J2 as well as some isolated kind of Y-R1b, or even Y-L2 why not? No answer here. As we know the males haplos are not tightly linked to auDNA a pop from South-East could have passed North but after could also having been overruned by some less "educated" warriors elites, and here I see rather northern Y-R1b.
    It's just to make bets and give life again to the thread because I think the "unpassable" mountains saw a lot of come and retourn events what is very upsetting concerning origins of R1b in these regions!

  13. #13
    Advisor Angela's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MOESAN View Post
    it's uneasy to guess upon O info, but "phylosophically" I doubt the elite was Y-G2 bearer; this culture had something very barbaric in it, and seems to me a small warlike elite dominating surrounding regions, maybe running raids here and there sometimes. Not the way I dream the Y-G2 post-Tripolje elites. So I would give the preference to a Y-R1b small elite not by force coming from South Caucasus (it could have been the opposite way); the metrics surveys evocate a not Caucasus not Steppic type but something close to Southeastern Caspian lands, so Y-J2 as well as some isolated kind of Y-R1b, or even Y-L2 why not? No answer here. As we know the males haplos are not tightly linked to auDNA a pop from South-East could have passed North but after could also having been overruned by some less "educated" warriors elites, and here I see rather northern Y-R1b.
    It's just to make bets and give life again to the thread because I think the "unpassable" mountains saw a lot of come and retourn events what is very upsetting concerning origins of R1b in these regions!
    You've persuaded me out of G2. :) Maybe R1b and perhaps J2b?

  14. #14
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    1 members found this post helpful.
    You forgot a important haplogroup in your poll: L-M20

    Important in the Black sea region and most important after being found among the Kura Araxes culture.

  15. #15
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    J1 and L.
    J1 coming from Uruk and L coming from the east(iran).
    Freaking reptilian (ubaid) people. :)

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpenjager View Post
    You forgot a important haplogroup in your poll: L-M20

    Important in the Black sea region and most important after being found among the Kura Araxes culture.
    Looks like I'm the only one that predicted L-M20 in Maykop. This lineage, now is found to dominates the Late Maykop.

  17. #17
    Advisor LeBrok's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b Z2109
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    H1c

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpenjager View Post
    Looks like I'm the only one that predicted L-M20 in Maykop. This lineage, now is found to dominates the Late Maykop.
    Congrats. It was a difficult one.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeBrok View Post
    Congrats. It was a difficult one.
    Three individuals who lived in the Chalcolithic era (c. 5700–6250 years BP), found at the Areni-1 ("Bird's Eye") cave in the South Caucasus mountains (present-day Vayots Dzor Province, Armenia), was also identified as belonging to haplogroup L1a. The individual's genome also indicated that he had red hair and blue eyes.
    There does seem to be a link between R1b and L1a then, how peculiar. Perhaps the R1b-Anatolian theory is wrong, and it's actually from the Zagros, and the R1b guys got their Gedrosian from migrating Westwards through Northern South Asia and Iran, before heading onto the Steppe, but this still doesn't explain CHG (unless they picked up CHG women on the way too). Also, now I think about it, is there not a discrepancy between the lack of Caucasian among the Indo-Europeans (relative to Gedrosia) and the claim that CHGs moved up and mixed with Steppe EHGs? I'd hugely appreciate anybody explaining that to me, as I've never found a good answer, but maybe I haven't looked hard enough
    I think Gedrosian was found on the pre-Maykop Steppe though, so perhaps that migration is a lot more ancient than is relevant in this context.
    Or perhaps this Armenian was some fusion between Kura-Araxes and R1b women, who got their R1b admix from R1b men who went up to the Caucasus from Anatolia. That's my working theory at the moment, but the correlation between Y DNA L and Gedrosian (and the known correlation between R1b and Gedrosian in Europe) is striking.
    Ancient Chalcolithic genomes from Anatolia and Iran (and Mesopotamia would be amazing) are desperately needed.
    Whatever the case, it's very clear that these Y DNA Ls and R1bs are clearly related through Gedrosian admixture.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpenjager View Post
    Looks like I'm the only one that predicted L-M20 in Maykop. This lineage, now is found to dominates the Late Maykop.
    You first. But me too.
    Those L1a in kura were a give away, were they not? ;)

    Better question is...where did they came from?

  20. #20
    Regular Member Johane Derite's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    E-V13>Z5018>FGC33625
    MtDNA haplogroup
    U1a1a

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    Quote Originally Posted by Olympus Mons View Post
    J1 and L.
    J1 coming from Uruk and L coming from the east(iran).
    Freaking reptilian (ubaid) people. :)

    These are ubaid sculptures. They show the woman as powerful. Is it possible they had some different sort of social organization where the men worshipped and served their women?

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  21. #21
    Regular Member Johane Derite's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Johane Derite View Post
    These are ubaid sculptures. They show the woman as powerful. Is it possible they had some different sort of social organization where the men worshipped and served their women?

    They seem to show her as frightening also.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Johane Derite View Post
    They seem to show her as frightening also.
    They looks rather sexy to me. Also I seems to see a baby being breastfed.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Olympus Mons View Post
    You first. But me too.
    Those L1a in kura were a give away, were they not? ;)

    Better question is...where did they came from?
    L trace their roots to West Eurasia, around the Black Sea. as all the most ancient LT lineages.

  24. #24
    Advisor Angela's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Johane Derite View Post
    They seem to show her as frightening also.
    Some cultures don't see a conflict.

    Kali: Kali is the Hindu goddess (or Devi) of death, time, and doomsday and is often associated with sexuality and violence but is also considered a strong mother-figure and symbolic of motherly-love.




  25. #25
    Elite member Coriolan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    Some cultures don't see a conflict.

    Kali: Kali is the Hindu goddess (or Devi) of death, time, and doomsday and is often associated with sexuality and violence but is also considered a strong mother-figure and symbolic of motherly-love.



    How can the goddess of death be also a symbol of love and a motherly figure? That's so twisted!

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