Politics Vote for a president of USA - 2016 election

Pick a president.

  • Hillary Clinton

    Votes: 11 20.8%
  • Bernie Sanders

    Votes: 11 20.8%
  • Ted Cruz

    Votes: 3 5.7%
  • Marco Rubio

    Votes: 4 7.5%
  • Donald Trump

    Votes: 24 45.3%

  • Total voters
    53
  • Poll closed .
Status
Not open for further replies.
People like Angela have this (conveniently) loaded, blown up, exaggerated notion of what it means to be a Racist, that it can only come in the form of wearing white robes and burning crosses on people's lawns or wearing a swastika and sending millions to the gas chambers, when the reality is that "small r" racism is far more pervasive and destructive in that it's better disguised (more systemic and institutional) and often cloaked in dubious rationalizations (being anti-political correctness, wanting protection from "terrorists" and "thugs" who just so happen to be brown).

More persuasive but definitely not more destructive. Little r racist will never do anything even close to what Hitler did. If Big R racist get their way they'll do real persecution and genocide. Also, you're right little r racist do cloak themselves in dubious rationalizations. You also have to understand that rationalizations of that variety are often correct as well.

And when we combine implicit bias, which is the mind’s way of making uncontrolled and automatic associations between two concepts very quickly and a healthy human adaptation that we all possess, with race, racism and racist acts are what oftentimes emerge. The implicit associations we harbor in our subconscious cause us to have feelings and attitudes about other people based on characteristics such as race, ethnicity, age, and appearance.

I spoke about this with my psych teacher a week ago. My Psych book and it appears you take a truth(bias, stero types are often wrong) and take it to a wrong extreme. All human groups(age, culture, gender, nerds, etc) aren't the same. Stero Types are almost always based on a truth. My Psych book basically says every little human group is exactly the same and anyone says otherwise is a bigot. I want to warn you not to think the same way. For example if you look at statistics and hip hop culture, you definitly shouldn't assume someone is racist if they feel threatened by a group of black dudes in hoods hanging out at night.

Though I think many Americans and many Trump supporters are "small r" (read: implicit bias) racists, Donald Trump, himself, is a Racist. He may not wear a white robe or a swastika, but the people who wear the white robes and swastikas see him as their hero and savior.

Plenty of his followers are little and big r racist. Donald Trump himself doesn't appear to be a big r or little r racist. He's an arrogant a-hole and an exaggerator. That explains his two so called instances of racism; his statements about Mexican illegal immigrants being mostly bad people and ban on Muslim immigration. Big r racist see Donald Trump as their savior because the leftist media has wrongly painted Trump as a big R racist. How many big r racist loved Trump before he ran for President but was a celebrity?

I'm not denying the possibility Trump is a racist. Some of the guys he has hired to his cabinet or whatever lately makes me suspicious. But there's nothing he has done which is good evidence that he's racist.

Ultimately, everything comes back to a sense of entitlement and fear of losing that power to those who don't look and believe the way they do--it's pure bigotry, selfishness and covetousness. I'm sorry but I have no sympathy for them. Or maybe I should? I don't know.

I agree with a lot of what you say but some of your believes are wrong. "Sense of entitlement". What? There's no sense of entitlement. White Americans don't have a sense of entitlement or believe they should have privilege. Those are both leftist oberservations on society which are true to an extent but few are conscious of them.

White Privilege should be called Minority Deprivation. In 1776 ~100% of American free people were white. The first time there was a decent amount of free non-whites was 1865. The first time whites feel under 80% was in the last 40 years. Today there is a large amount of non-whites, almost 40% of Americans. However still most live in cities. The majority of American land is majority white. The majority of almost everything in the public sphere is white. So, being white has and still sort of is the norm in America. The word "Privilage" suggests a small minority, like rich kids, get things the masses don't. That isn't the case with whites because they're the majority.

I suppose it must be difficult for those who believe themselves to be the chosen ones to have to reconcile with the fact that they were never chosen, just lucky (on the backs of others), and that pretty soon they will no longer possess the lion's share of undeserved privilege. It's not the child's fault that he was spoiled but he will nevertheless have to suffer the "rude awakening." I suppose one blames "the system" and rules and institutions that falsely empowered him.

Let me say a lot of what you say about race and I'm focusing on what I dis agree with. "On the backs of others". Give me a break. That's is anti-white bull crap. It's correct to say since the 1500s European powers have oppressed many non-Europeans but to say all European's accomplishments and power was made "on the backs of others" is historical fantasy.
 
Tread very carefully when talking about me: I will not, repeat, will not tolerate insults directed against me. Your infractions have not been wiped off the slate. They accumulate, and then the ban is permanent. Are we clear?

Oh, and just as anti-black racism is not acceptable, neither is anti-ethnic group "racism", for lack of a better term. Watch it.

Now you can't say I didn't warn you.

You're overeating.
 
You're overeating.

Actually, I'm a very controlled and disciplined person in terms of eating, but thank-you for your concern.

It somehow seems to have escaped you that you don't get to make these decisions.
 
Tread very carefully when talking about me: I will not, repeat, will not tolerate insults directed against me. Your infractions have not been wiped off the slate. They accumulate, and then the ban is permanent. Are we clear?

Oh, and just as anti-black racism is not acceptable, neither is anti-ethnic group "racism", for lack of a better term. Watch it.

Now you can't say I didn't warn you.

For f***'s sake, what are you talking about???? Where did I insult you or even come close? This is getting ridiculous. Am I allowed to be "insulted" that you are speaking to me as if I'm some sort of a child? I doubt it.

You seriously need to define FOR EVERYONE ACROSS THE BOARD what constitutes an insult--evidently, it shouldn't be left up to personal discretion. Google says that an insult is "a disrespectful or scornfully abusive remark or act" and I made no such remarks. If describing/interpreting someone's actions or mentality without using any kind of ad hominem counts as an insult, then that's a problem.

And you are wrong. Anti-black, anti-ethnic, anti-muslim, anti-immigrant bigotry is most definitely "accepted" here. Large swaths of people are subject to "insult" or offensive remarks constantly but somehow specific individuals on this board are supposed to be off limits? LOL If "insults" or disrespectful and offensive remarks were truly unacceptable, then the likes of Tomenable would have been banned a long time ago. Anthrogenica doesn't allow insults or disparaging remarks of any kind, directed at groups or individuals--that, IMO, is actually fair. That is not hypocritical and does not constitute a double standard. No one is allowed to post offensive and disrespectful videos about White Nationalists and their antagonistic rhetoric; or debunked pseudo-science that "insults" and disrespects certain peoples; or racialized language like "Mohammedan hordes" or "degenerate" nations. And yet, I've seen all the above plastered all over this website but somehow that doesn't seem to rise to the level of "offensive" and "insulting" in your estimation seeing as how some of the perpetrators are still skulking around here. It's just that you seem to take your "job" here very seriously, but I don't see how that's possible when there are glaring double standards.

And for the last time, I have NEVER made "ethnic" attacks against anyone. I've NEVER done that. Considering everything I repeatedly say about bigotry, prejudice and racism, that's just a preposterous and untrue accusation. I don't post videos espousing White Nationalists and yet somehow I'm the bigot here that deserves threats of being banned. Amazing.
 
For f***'s sake, what are you talking about???? Where did I insult you or even come close? This is getting ridiculous. Am I allowed to be "insulted" that you are speaking to me as if I'm some sort of a child? I doubt it.

You seriously need to define FOR EVERYONE ACROSS THE BOARD what constitutes an insult--evidently, it shouldn't be left up to personal discretion. Google says that an insult is "a disrespectful or scornfully abusive remark or act" and I made no such remarks. If describing/interpreting someone's actions or mentality without using any kind of ad hominem counts as an insult, then that's a problem.

And you are wrong. Anti-black, anti-ethnic, anti-muslim, anti-immigrant bigotry is most definitely "accepted" here. Large swaths of people are subject to "insult" or offensive remarks constantly but somehow specific individuals on this board are supposed to be off limits? LOL If "insults" or disrespectful and offensive remarks were truly unacceptable, then the likes of Tomenable would have been banned a long time ago. Anthrogenica doesn't allow insults or disparaging remarks of any kind, directed at groups or individuals--that, IMO, is actually fair. That is not hypocritical and does not constitute a double standard. No one is allowed to post offensive and disrespectful videos about White Nationalists and their antagonistic rhetoric; or debunked pseudo-science that "insults" and disrespects certain peoples; or racialized language like "Mohammedan hordes" or "degenerate" nations. And yet, I've seen all the above plastered all over this website but somehow that doesn't seem to rise to the level of "offensive" and "insulting" in your estimation seeing as how some of the perpetrators are still skulking around here. It's just that you seem to take your "job" here very seriously, but I don't see how that's possible when there are glaring double standards.

And for the last time, I have NEVER made "ethnic" attacks against anyone. I've NEVER done that. Considering everything I repeatedly say about bigotry, prejudice and racism, that's just a preposterous and untrue accusation. I don't post videos espousing White Nationalists and yet somehow I'm the bigot here that deserves threats of being banned. Amazing.

You seriously need to calm down. Did I say that you had outright insulted me since returning from your banishment? I merely gave you a friendly warning.

I would suggest you worry about your own infraction points, not those of others, but if you must know there are other people within a hair's breadth of getting banned as well.

If you don't realize how insulting your remarks in the past have been, not only against me but against a lot of other people as well, then you have bigger problems than an infraction.

Make your points civilly, without calling posters who disagree with you stupid, without integrity, lacking in fundamental decency, or any other personal attacks; that's it. It's really not that difficult to understand. Now, you can continue to argue with me, which will get you nowhere, or you can post your points. It's up to you.
 
In Australia , these 457 are not given out to anyone , but... ...only to tourists who have exhausted their 3 month visa stay and want a 6 month extension, they have to work ( unless they pay in advance the nominated fee to cover any health problems they get ) for 3 months of these 6 in the rural sector ...............they where once charged 36% of tax in the dollar, but that was reduced recently to 19% .
I cannot recall the hourly rate , but it should be set at the current minimum rate ( not $5)


On Le Pen...........she will definitely win ........people want change

yes, the French have two turns of voting, but this time it will not be an issue.
USA has one turn with no compulsory voting.
Australia has one turn with compulsory voting .....a fine is issued for not voting and this fine increases every month that you do not pay it.

I have a bit of time so I will reply to yours first.

Mr Hasam entered Australia on a short-term visa which did not permit him to work, but he had no problem finding a job after landing in Australia late last month.

After a telephone conversation with one of the labour hire contractors supplying workers to Cutri Fruit, Mr Hasam was offered a job and accommodation near Swan Hill.

The run-down house the journalist stayed in was owned by Cutri Fruit and run by the labour hire contractor as a temporary home to about 12 other illegal foreign workers.

After working 23 hours over several days, Mr Hasam was paid $110, which was reduced to $40 after $70 rent was taken out.


This is taken from this site: http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-11-...lworths-using-illegal-foreign-workers/8023570

So it is even less than 5 dollars an hour...:startled::useless:

I left Malaysia a long time ago because of inequality of ethnic rivalries between the Muslim Malay ethnic and my ethnic the Chinese. If Muslim Malays are coming to Australia to do this, I am certain the corruption in Malaysia has not improved. The Malaysian money started out as the same value as Singapore money, but after all these years, Singapore is now a first world country with a currency more than double of Malaysian money, and Malaysia? Still a corrupted developing country.


With regards to Le Pen, I have a couple of my highly educated French friends who will vote for her, I think it is too early to tell. She has 28% supporters at the moment. We will see what will happen...
 
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More persuasive but definitely not more destructive. Little r racist will never do anything even close to what Hitler did. If Big R racist get their way they'll do real persecution and genocide. Also, you're right little r racist do cloak themselves in dubious rationalizations. You also have to understand that rationalizations of that variety are often correct as well.

1.) Untrue. The "little r racists" are the ones who placed him into power and gave him the platform to be monstrous. Let that wash over you for a minute. If it weren't for them, he would have never been in the position to do the horrible things he did. They had long received all of his racial/ethnic "signaling" and dog whistling before he achieved power, and still championed him in spite of it and because of it. The "little r racists" are most certainly implicated in the atrocities carried out by Hitler.

2.) And the rationalizations may possess some elements of truth, but are often grounded in a fair amount of histrionics, hysteria and hyperbole.

I spoke about this with my psych teacher a week ago. My Psych book and it appears you take a truth(bias, stero types are often wrong) and take it to a wrong extreme. All human groups(age, culture, gender, nerds, etc) aren't the same. Stero Types are almost always based on a truth. My Psych book basically says every little human group is exactly the same and anyone says otherwise is a bigot. I want to warn you not to think the same way. For example if you look at statistics and hip hop culture, you definitly shouldn't assume someone is racist if they feel threatened by a group of black dudes in hoods hanging out at night.

1.) Stereotypes may be based on "a" truth but are never "the" (absolute) truth and that is the problem; acting on them as if they are always true can lead to damaging consequences and repercussions for others. If a male employer in a STEM field buys into the stereotype that women are bad at math, that may lead him to block and deny talented, qualified women who are more than suitable for the job, thereby enforcing the disproportionate amount of women in STEM fields. Also, there have been studies done that show that stereotype threat, which is the threat of being viewed through the lens of a negative stereotype or the fear of doing something that would confirm that stereotype, causes the stereotyped to underperform.

2.) If I look at the "statistics," then I should be left with the impression that white people commit the majority of violent crimes (on sheer numbers alone), and so I should primarily fear a group of young white men hanging around on the corner late at night. If I look at the "statistics," then I'd also know that most violent crimes are perpetrated by/against people of the same race. And so again, I should be weary of young white men, first and foremost. :)

3.) As someone who is a long time listener of Hip Hop and the many different forms of it, I'm informed and balanced enough to understand that the vast majority of it does not espouse the wanton violation/assault/destruction of white people and others. I'm smart and balanced enough to understand that it is a form of art and expression, and that not every view or idea espoused directly reflects concrete events and motivations in the real world.

4.) But yes, if I were to succumb to implicit bias via the indoctrination and acculturation of a white hegemonic nation where black people have served as a perpetual underclass and scapegoat, then yes, I might make an instinctual snap judgment on a group of young black men hanging on a corner late at night and feel threatened.

Plenty of his followers are little and big r racist. Donald Trump himself doesn't appear to be a big r or little r racist. He's an arrogant a-hole and an exaggerator. That explains his two so called instances of racism; his statements about Mexican illegal immigrants being mostly bad people and ban on Muslim immigration. Big r racist see Donald Trump as their savior because the leftist media has wrongly painted Trump as a big R racist. How many big r racist loved Trump before he ran for President but was a celebrity?

I'm not denying the possibility Trump is a racist. Some of the guys he has hired to his cabinet or whatever lately makes me suspicious. But there's nothing he has done which is good evidence that he's racist.

I'm sorry but it's undeniable that Donald Trump is a racist if you actually pay attention to the things he's done. Let me quote myself from earlier in the thread:

If one were to play the semantics game and opt for a word like bigot over racist to describe Trump, fine, but racist still fits like a glove seeing as how he has voiced opinions and done things (recently and over the past few decades) that suggest he sees certain racial/ethnic groups as inferior. For example:

1.) It was racist when he/his father refused to rent to black people and systematically discriminated against them--The Department of Justice (under a Republican President) agreed. A corroborating story just broke the other day where a former Trump rental agent said that Fred Trump, with a young Donald by his side, unequivocally told him "I don't sell to n*ggers." And according to the agent, Donald just quietly nodded in agreement. With a father like that as a role model....

2.) It was racist when he said this about a black accountant: "Black guys counting my money! I hate it. The only kind of people I want counting my money are short guys that wear yarmulkes every day. … I think that the guy is lazy. And it’s probably not his fault, because laziness is a trait in blacks. It really is, I believe that. It’s not anything they can control."

3.) It was racist when he transferred black and women dealers off tables at his casinos to accommodate a big-time gambler’s prejudices--The Trump Plaza Hotel and Casino had to pay a $200,000 fine because it.

Notice a trend?

Donald Trump actually did and said these things, these racist things. I don't know what further proof some of you need. This, by itself, speaks volumes. It's indefensible.

I agree with a lot of what you say but some of your believes are wrong. "Sense of entitlement". What? There's no sense of entitlement. White Americans don't have a sense of entitlement or believe they should have privilege. Those are both leftist oberservations on society which are true to an extent but few are conscious of them.

Where did I say that the sense of entitlement was necessarily "conscious?" For one, people generally tend to hold implicit biases that favor their own ingroup, and so of course, those who have always held power and benefited from an unfair system are more inclined to rationalize away the "unfairness" or any semblance of culpability. When Trump or the KKK or Neo-Nazis or White Nationalists and their sympathizers say things like "we have to take our country back," who do they want to take it back from? Why are they under the impression that it was ever solely "theirs" in the first place? How is that not a sense of entitlement? I don't think that most Americans are as conscious of this deeply embedded sentiment as some others may be, but it certainly exists on some level. How could it not? Anyone who understands how power dynamics often affect the psyche, understands this--power is not an easy thing to relinquish and especially when one's acculturation and socialization have fueled the belief that said power is deserved.

White Privilege should be called Minority Deprivation. In 1776 ~100% of American free people were white. The first time there was a decent amount of free non-whites was 1865. The first time whites feel under 80% was in the last 40 years. Today there is a large amount of non-whites, almost 40% of Americans. However still most live in cities. The majority of American land is majority white. The majority of almost everything in the public sphere is white. So, being white has and still sort of is the norm in America. The word "Privilage" suggests a small minority, like rich kids, get things the masses don't. That isn't the case with whites because they're the majority.

You seem to misunderstand what "white privilege" entails. At the most basic level, it simply comes down to being given the benefit of the doubt. For example, studies have shown that job applications with a "black sounding name" are disregarded and discounted far more likely than those with white sounding names, even when all of the qualifications are the same. White people and black people use drugs at similar rates and yet black people are more likely to be stopped, arrested and convicted. White Stanford rapist Brock Turner received the benefit of the doubt from a judge who believed that he was fundamentally a good kid that made a mistake and shouldn't suffer the rest of his life for said mistake--black males in similar situations usually fair far worse. The point is that white people have "privilege" from being given the benefit of the doubt. "White privilege" does not necessarily imply that whites all live some affluent, decadent lifestyles at the expense of non-whites.

Let me say a lot of what you say about race and I'm focusing on what I dis agree with. "On the backs of others". Give me a break. That's is anti-white bull crap. It's correct to say since the 1500s European powers have oppressed many non-Europeans but to say all European's accomplishments and power was made "on the backs of others" is historical fantasy.

Please stop putting words in my mouth. Where did I say that "all" European accomplishments came on the backs of others? For one, to keep this conversation within the proper context, we are speaking about the USA, a country whose very beginning involves the displacement and disenfranchisement of the indigenous natives. Want more? Read Simon Schama's "Rough Crossings: The Slaves, the British, and the American Revolution" and you'll learn that a significant factor in the revolutionary war was that the colonies feared that the British would abolish slavery, thereby stifling much of their economic development, and particularly in the South. Much of the wealth that made America a world power was wealth garnered by way of the enslavement and subjugation of others.

And later on, Irish, Jewish, Eastern European and Italian immigrants would benefit from the relegation of blacks to a lesser, more disenfranchised status. The New Deal and things like the G.I. Bill essentially functioned as affirmative action for immigrants. In a recent study, it was found that New Dealers often intentionally made welfare programs available to immigrants (particularly European immigrants) regardless of their citizenship or even their legal status. European immigrants like Italians were at times New Deal programs’ biggest beneficiaries. Regarding Social Security, which initially failed to cover certain types of work (in which, not coincidentally, African Americans were disproportionately represented), European immigrants were more likely than even native-born whites to work in occupations covered by Social Security, and they were also more likely to be nearing retirement when the program was instituted. Consequently, they ended up contributing little to the system but by design benefited almost as much as those who would contribute their whole working lives. For retirees of European origin, Social Security was more akin to welfare than insurance but without the means test and without the stigma.

My point is not that European Americans were never innovative or that they didn't work hard, but that they most certainly benefited from an unfair system that privileged some and disenfranchised others. This is undeniable.
 
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LOL If "insults" or disrespectful and offensive remarks were truly unacceptable, then the likes of Tomenable would have been banned a long time ago. Anthrogenica doesn't allow insults or disparaging remarks of any kind, directed at groups or individuals--that, IMO, is actually fair.

Tomenable on Anthrogenica is me and I am definitely not banned: http://www.anthrogenica.com/member.php?3024-Tomenable

BTW as far as I know discussing any politics on Anthrogenica is against the rules, because that is an Anthro forum sensu stricto.

Anthrogenica doesn't allow insults or disparaging remarks of any kind
I know someone who was banned from Anthrogenica just for writing the word "Mongoloid", which is ridiculous in my opinion.
 
1.) Untrue. The "little r racists" are the ones who placed him into power and gave him the platform to be monstrous. Let that wash over you for a minute. If it weren't for them, he would have never been in the position to do the horrible things he did. They had long received all of his racial/ethnic "signaling" and dog whistling before he achieved power, and still championed him in spite of it and because of it. The "little r racists" are most certainly implicated in the atrocities carried out by Hitler.

2.) And the rationalizations may possess some elements of truth, but are often grounded in a fair amount of histrionics, hysteria and hyperbole.

the main reason Hitler could rise to power is that the Germans did feel themselves treated unjust by the Versailles treaty
on top of that came the big depression
it affected their every day life and it looked like the allies - and the French at front - wanted to humiliate and destroy Germany and the Germans

that made them think in terms of 'us' and 'them'

the racist story came later

it is easy to blaim the Trump and his voters of racism or stupidity
in that case you don't need to look and find out what realy is the matter

the present situation of America is by no means comparable to the desperate situation of Germany when Hitler came to power
 
@Wanderlust,

I'll give a longer response later. But I just gotta say sheer number means nothing. In America White people do almost everything more than Black people because there's almost 5-times more white people. Statistics do show if anything you should be more afraid of Blacks. People commit crimes mostly against their own race because most Americans live in communities where their race is the majority.I would also say it isn't smart to hang around a group of suspecious looking rednecks either. But you ignoring the fact Blacks commit more crime and there's a serious issue of thug/gangsta-worshiping among African Americans is ridiculous.

I'll especially get into more detail about white privilege and slavery. I actually just did a presentation in school about Spanish/French/British Colonization. I made sure to give my peers a different narrative than our fairly liberal baby boomer teachers have our whole lives.

I presented it from the perspective of the invading Europeans and didn't take a moral stance I just presented the facts. If you do it that way you become aware of the anti-white message our teachers had taught us as kids. Their motivation for coming to America and their colonies in America weren't centered on racism. They wanted land and so they had to conquer Natives to get it, they needed cheap labor so they went to Africa to get slaves. Natives weren't always victims, they were at times the aggressors btw. If anything the Spanish were the most cruel towards Natives and Africans, yet I don't see people condemning Meztios(of largly Spanish decent) or pure blood Spanish Lationos like they do White Americans(who often are not of mostly Colonial American decent). I'll give a longer response later....................
 
There will always be 30%-ish of smart self-aware people that will vote with logic and long-term thinking; and other 70%-ish smart or not so smart lacking self-awareness that will always vote through anger, fear, racial attitude or, plainly put, with their EGO. EGO equals (=) fear of anything that we might perceive it as a threat to anything, like a fear of not being able to carry guns freely, fear of having a woman for president and other blah. People, who cannot manage themselves and adapt to the fast changing world, feel that they are loosing ground under their feet therefore will always go for a dictator (read SUPERMAN) that will kill all those "bastards, put the women to their place" and close in their self indulgence of being better of everyone else. Isis, duterte, miloshevic, hitler, stalin, breivik, trump the list goes on, come from the same place. People choose dictators ("supermen") who will solve their problems overnight simply because it is easier to put the blame on minority groups then to accept responsibility for the shity situation created by themselves in the first place.

When the majority is white how on earth can a minority be responsible? Really? It is not about the color the skin either, polish people in UK feel the same these days simply because the focus of those who cannot accept the change want to go back as it was.

And when people are talking about change these days, unfortunately they are thinking about going back to where they were 10-20 years ago. Well newsflash, it will get worse. People will lose more jobs simply because we need to solve the problem of fuel and other non-sustainable ways of living. The fuel industry will crash, car industry (if they do not keep up the pace) will crash, transportation will change.

So "change or die" means move forward or if you go back you will simply get extinct.

By the way, Bernie Sander is full of crap as well.
 
@Fire Haired14

It is dishonest to say that Mestizos are mostly of Spanish origin.

Most descend from incoming Spanish males and Native Americans.

Few North American whites mixed with Native Americans.

Also if Native Americans attacked white settlers it is because they encroached on Native hunting grounds or burial grounds.

I know most White Americans arrived after slavery ended but they were still racist against blacks till the later 20th century.

Some are still racist now.
 
According to a 2012 Y-Dna study of Mexicans by Martinez-Cortes et alia, 64.9pc had European male ancestry, 30.8pc Native American and 4.2pc African.

European male ancestry was greatest in the north and west (66.7-95pc) of Mexico while Native American male ancestry reached 37-50 pc in central and southeast Mexico.

Female ancestry is even more overwhelmingly Native American in the mitrochondrial Dna.
 
@Fire Haired14

It is dishonest to say that Mestizos are mostly of Spanish origin.

I said they are "largely" Spanish not mostly. It obviously varies by country to. I know from 23andme many Non-Black Caribbeanites are 80%+ Spanish while many or maybe most I don't know MesoAmericans are under 50%.

Few North American whites mixed with Native Americans.

Also if Native Americans attacked white settlers it is because they encroached on Native hunting grounds or burial grounds.

I know most White Americans arrived after slavery ended but they were still racist against blacks till the later 20th century.

Some are still racist now.

That's true. I think condemning people for their biological ancestors is stupid anyways. IMO, at least originally being a White American was not being the other. European immigrants were brought into some form of mainstream America while Blacks continued to be more deprived. As I said before I think instead of saying White privilege we should say Minority Deprivation.
 
Tomenable on Anthrogenica is me and I am definitely not banned: http://www.anthrogenica.com/member.php?3024-Tomenable

BTW as far as I know discussing any politics on Anthrogenica is against the rules, because that is an Anthro forum sensu stricto.


I know someone who was banned from Anthrogenica just for writing the word "Mongoloid", which is ridiculous in my opinion.


Where did I say that you had been banned from Anthrogenica? Oh, that's right, I didn't. Seriously, pay attention. My point is that you'd never try the crap you pull here over at Anthrogenica because they don't tolerate hate speech of any type, and the community is better off for it. And you believe in debunked and disproven racial pseudoscience, so of course you don't see the problem with using an offensive word like "mongoloid."
 
the main reason Hitler could rise to power is that the Germans did feel themselves treated unjust by the Versailles treaty
on top of that came the big depression
it affected their every day life and it looked like the allies - and the French at front - wanted to humiliate and destroy Germany and the Germans

that made them think in terms of 'us' and 'them'

the racist story came later

Yes, all of that is true. It's also true that virulent anti-semitism had been deeply embedded within Europe for almost 1,000 years at that point, and so the people were more sympathetic to a message that demonized, denigrated and scapegoated Jewish people. There had also been tons of negative implicit associations with the Romani (gypsies), homosexuals, the disabled, etc... and therefore, Hitler's bigoted messaging was not as off-putting as it should have been. Some people liked it and some people overlooked it (which can be argued as passive racism) because they were more drawn to the idea of coming together as a Herrenvolk and rejuvenating their economy and restoring their place in the world. But the point is that their own biases and prejudices allowed Hitler to assume control. Had they resisted him based on his more offensive rhetoric, he would've never been able to act on that rhetoric.

it is easy to blaim the Trump and his voters of racism or stupidity
in that case you don't need to look and find out what realy is the matter

the present situation of America is by no means comparable to the desperate situation of Germany when Hitler came to power

1.) "What really is the matter" has already been stated in this thread by you: racism and stupidity. lol Seriously, we can dress it up in nicer terms but that's what it comes down to; but I'd also add a healthy dose of fear to that concoction as well. Look, when it comes to certain things, I'm not someone who generally likes too much change, too quickly. And so I can understand how a rapidly changing (read: "globalizing") world can be disconcerting, off putting and scary to people. I can understand how some might be afraid that their standard of living could change for the worse with new, cheaper or "illegal" competition. But blaming economically disenfranchised people of color instead of the predominantly white male, filthy rich top 1% who don't pay their fair share in taxes and whose capitalistic greed has truly robbed and pillaged the middle class, IS A PROBLEM, and reeks of gross ignorance at best and utter stupidity at worst. And because of implicit bias and a centuries old history of dehumanizing and subjugating people of color, they are the easiest and most convenient scapegoat, which is wrong. So again, racism + stupidity + fear is why Trump was elected.

2.) The present situation in America is somewhat comparable to that of Germany during Hitler's rise--economically, not so much but a lot of people have yet to fully recover from the economic recession of 2008 and so there is still a sense of "depression" there, whether real or imagined. And once again, by a small but vocal minority (KKK, Neo-Nazis, White Nationalists, Alt-Right), Jews are being blamed for greedily "running and controlling" everything; blacks are being blamed for taking free handouts and their innate criminality; muslims are being blamed for terrorism; hispanics are being blamed for stealing away jobs illegally, etc....; gays are being blamed for moral degeneration and the breakdown of the family; Other people are being scapegoated for the current situation of America and in particular, White (straight male) America. 63% of all white men voted for Trump for crying out loud! They are bemoaning a decrease in their power and influence and electing him was their way of fighting back. Most Americans, perhaps like most Germans during the 1920s and 30s probably were not as virulently and ostensibly racist as the small vocal minority, but on some level, a hateful message appealed to them or they chose to overlook it to a disastrous outcome. Trump has done much of the same signaling and dog whistling that Hitler did during the 1920s and 30s. The situations, of course, are not exactly the same but there is a dangerous parallel that is undeniable.
 
1.) Untrue. The "little r racists" are the ones who placed him into power and gave him the platform to be monstrous. Let that wash over you for a minute. If it weren't for them, he would have never been in the position to do the horrible things he did. They had long received all of his racial/ethnic "signaling" and dog whistling before he achieved power, and still championed him in spite of it and because of it. The "little r racists" are most certainly implicated in the atrocities carried out by Hitler.

2.) And the rationalizations may possess some elements of truth, but are often grounded in a fair amount of histrionics, hysteria and hyperbole.

I agree with this. I was referring to little rs in power though. But yes you're right little rs have a dangerous capable of putting big rs in power.



1.) Stereotypes may be based on "a" truth but are never "the" (absolute) truth and that is the problem; acting on them as if they are always true can lead to damaging consequences and repercussions for others.

Agreed. I never refuted this btw.

2.) If I look at the "statistics," then I should be left with the impression that white people commit the majority of violent crimes (on sheer numbers alone), and so I should primarily fear a group of young white men hanging around on the corner late at night. If I look at the "statistics," then I'd also know that most violent crimes are perpetrated by/against people of the same race. And so again, I should be weary of young white men, first and foremost. :)

Everyone knows sheer number means nothing when there are almost 5 times more Whites in America than Blacks. The fact you ignore higher crime rates amoung African Americans and a hip hop culture which does worship being a bad ass means you're a little bias. In my hometown, Chicago, as of 2009 Blacks makeup 32.4% of the population and commit 75% of murder, 68% of aggravated assault, and 85% of robberies. Whites makeup 31.7% of the population and commit 2.8% of murder, 6.7% of aggravated assault, and 3.6% of robberies. White crime rates are very low despite historical White crime ethnicities in Chicago(mostly on South Side near Blacks); Italians and Irish. Everyone in Chicago and much of America knows the majority of crime and violence in Chicago is done on Black parts of the South Side. Chicago is one of the most violent cities in America. Color of Crime in Chicago

Also I've read a statistic where if you compare white on black and black on white violence and adjust for the higher number of whites in America the result is black on white violence is 25x times more likely than white on black violence.

I'm not doing this to bash blacks. I'm letting you know that the stero type that an inner city black guy is dangerous is based on truth. Of course people racially profile. I don't deny that. Most are normal people but the fact is there's a higher degree of criminals.

3.) As someone who is a long time listener of Hip Hop and the many different forms of it, I'm informed and balanced enough to understand that the vast majority of it does not espouse the wanton violation/assault/destruction of white people and others. I'm smart and balanced enough to understand that it is a form of art and expression, and that not every view or idea espoused directly reflects concrete events and motivations in the real world.

Depends what hip hop you listen to. Hip hop I've heard from friends is all about **** bitches and being a thug. I don't listen to it so I don't know much about it. I do know enough to know it's directly related to high crime rates among African Americans. It supports a thug culture. It's a music form. It's not all bad. The argument I'm making is much of it is expressive of a crime filled culture. I don't know if you grew up in Sweden or wherever, but I've known inner city Black kids. I'd say the majority in many communities are criminals or at least thugish(whatever you wanna call it). Even their clothing styles even are copying gangsters.

4.) But yes, if I were to succumb to implicit bias via the indoctrination and acculturation of a white hegemonic nation where black people have served as a perpetual underclass and scapegoat, then yes, I might make an instinctual snap judgment on a group of young black men hanging on a corner late at night and feel threatened.

If you see a group of men congregating at a street corner of any race you should stay away. I'd say, because of America's history with Blacks, your bias will be most harmful towards how you view Black individuals not guys hanging out on a street corner late at night for no reason lol. Black people will tell you to stay away lol.

I'm sorry but it's undeniable that Donald Trump is a racist if you actually pay attention to the things he's done. Let me quote myself from earlier in the thread:

Donald Trump actually did and said these things, these racist things. I don't know what further proof some of you need. This, by itself, speaks volumes. It's indefensible.

Those are racist statements. They're disturbing. But to be honest slight racism doesn't make a big effect on someone's job as President.

Where did I say that the sense of entitlement was necessarily "conscious?" For one, people generally tend to hold implicit biases that favor their own ingroup, and so of course, those who have always held power and benefited from an unfair system are more inclined to rationalize away the "unfairness" or any semblance of culpability.

Agreed.

When Trump or the KKK or Neo-Nazis or White Nationalists and their sympathizers say things like "we have to take our country back," who do they want to take it back from? Why are they under the impression that it was ever solely "theirs" in the first place? How is that not a sense of entitlement?/QUOTE]

Comparing Trump to the KKK lol dude!!! Trump has made it very clear his focus is on the economy and when he says "Make America Great Again" he's referring to the economy. Watch this video. He's been saying the same stuff for over 30 years. This Video Will Get Trump Elected. Some of his followers give a racist slogan to that slogan but Trump doesn't.


I don't think that most Americans are as conscious of this deeply embedded sentiment as some others may be, but it certainly exists on some level. How could it not? Anyone who understands how power dynamics often affect the psyche, understands this--power is not an easy thing to relinquish and especially when one's acculturation and socialization have fueled the belief that said power is deserved.

Racism doesn't give white people power. White privilege and what you're saying here gives the impression white Americans are a royal minority. Whites don't have power whites are a majority that doesn't have the lack of things which racial minorities lack. I don't think white racist are racist mostly because they want to personally be powerful or for white people to be powerful, I think they are racist mostly because they want a white populous.



You seem to misunderstand what "white privilege" entails. ...... point is that white people have "privilege" from being given the benefit of the doubt. "White privilege" does not necessarily imply that whites all live some affluent, decadent lifestyles at the expense of non-whites.

I understand what white privilege means. Whites usually aren't given the "benefit of the doubt" blacks are given bias suspicion. In some cases I do think whites are given special treatment that isn't normal by any standards and is therefore privilege. But I still think in most cases white privilege should be called minority deprivation.




Please stop putting words in my mouth. Where did I say that "all" European accomplishments came on the backs of others? For one, to keep this conversation within the proper context, we are speaking about the USA, a country whose very beginning involves the displacement and disenfranchisement of the indigenous natives.

You know there's the USA's very beginning involved a lot more than that and a lot that was good(including stuff which your country benefits from). A problem is liberals like you like to focus on that most. It seems your goal is to say white people and America are terrible and evil and shameful. Seems pretty racist to me.

Sorry for miss interpreting you. You know at the Field Museum I watched a movie about the history of China. In the movie they listed atrocities China has committed in the past but it still presented China as a glorious nation with a glorious history. That's how Americans should view their history. Mistakes don't define your nation.

Sorry for miss interpreting you. You know at the Field Museum I watched a movie about the history of China. In the movie they listed atrocities China has committed in the past but it still presented China as a glorious nation with a glorious history. That's how Americans should view their history. Mistakes don't define your nation.

Want more? Read Simon Schama's "Rough Crossings: The Slaves, the British, and the American Revolution" and you'll learn that a significant factor in the revolutionary war was that the colonies feared that the British would abolish slavery, thereby stifling much of their economic development, and particularly in the South.

"Want More?" wow you really do want to bash the USA. I doubt it was very significant motivation for the American revolution. Taxation without Representation!

Much of the wealth that made America a world power was wealth garnered by way of the enslavement and subjugation of others.

Ok that's immoral but also genius. Free labor is genius but immoral. Essentially all slaves were in the south which was the most underdeveloped part of the United States. It's why the South lost of the Civil War. Slavery didn't create the Industrial Revolution or the explosion of 19th century capitalism or American urbanization or etc.

Are slaves the ones who created the system slaves are involved in which helps an economy. Nope the credit goes to the British. Slaves were a piece British added to their puzzle for economic success. Credit for a successful society and the fruits of Slavery don't Slaves aren't the ones who had the navigation skills to reach America and then map it, nope that was the British. Slaves aren't the ones who created the military technology and training which allowed Europeans to conquer the Americas, nope that was the British. Slaves aren't the ones who brought productive and organized societies to the Americas, nope that was the British. Slaves aren't the ones who created one of the most literate societies an ocean away from their motherland, nope that was the British. Slaves aren't the ones who established the first colleges in America and gave some sort of education to all people, nope that was the British.

Europeans dominated in the Americas because they brought a superior culture. I know most people would call me a racist for saying that but it's true. Spanish, French and British were the greatest powers in the world. Lets move passed Colonial America. Who invented the Industrial Revolution? Who's the source of almost all modern academia; medicine, science, the STUDY OF HISTORY, and so on? Who's the source of almost all modern technology and Democratic government?

My point is the ultimate sources for American success isn't oppression of non-whites.

My point is not that European Americans were never innovative or that they didn't work hard, but that they most certainly benefited from an unfair system that privileged some and disenfranchised others. This is undeniable.

You're exaggerating how much we've benefited from an unfair system. The narrative you and other leftist give is definitely anti-white and you definitely like it that way.
 
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