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Thread: 1600 year old wreck of Roman cargo ship found in Caesaria harbor

  1. #26
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    Country: Greece





    ...(continue)
    Αs i mention to my previous posts which kindly supported with Angela's links and confirmations...
    Greek art is idealism and not realism, in the contrary, of that the majority of people believe.


    @Angela #19
    the young man - which instictively I thought it could be, Ganemedes or Dionyssus- is also Hellenistic; he weared a gariand; a golden wreath; -as also the beutifull girl with her's "wounded" neck; -The flower's are Roman;...and her breathing lips.., are Roman copy of hellenistic period?


    @Le Brok, about circumcision, it could be also possible to practiced from agriculturalists, after hygiene demands;- but surely with fully ceremonial religion practices; maybe also - to naturalized as members or "citizens";.
    with your consent thats my perspective...
    It reminds me the prehistorical myths of Uranus and Cronus... with some intense need of Gaia or the God,s for -little, as enough, blood!-a "modest" sacrifice for fertalization or -maybe- a sort of "manipulation" of the males, under the will of/for community (;)... From the brave and free(;) will, individual, to the faithfull on duty calls, collectivist...sort of type;


    The Egyptians as i posted, surely enforced with their, cleansing "mania", -shaving body, hair, many baths everyday, white clothes; etc.
    (need some time for Herodot..)
    I speculate at the time of pax Aegyptiaca, propably the circumcision adopted from.


    I also believe that "greek nose" exists. Also the "toes", the blue/black curly hair. the round shaped... back's, etc.
    which can easily recognise to today Greeks, but
    Maybe it was my fault to engage terms and meanings of "art" with "anthropology" terms, which probably not well combine together... I was just asking. _Who are they? -the Reggio/Ρήγιο warriors...


    for the head of Socrates and others...as posted #20
    It belongs to a different era from classic's, I suspect that probably -the one you post -is a roman copy of an hellenistic period ,which allready indicates the significant turn to more pragmatistic values and at last realism at Roman period.
    I mean that, if the "ancient sculptor"-actually, more than a dozen sculptors, plus the archicraftsman;- who could tried to make Socrates,at the real time, when the philosopher was alive... ...that it could be unacceptable, it consists blasphemy at the worst of its kind!
    -Probably would all both, exiled to the islands, at the best case scenario.
    (by the way Socrates, was sculptor).

    and he is an actor
    https://www.google.gr/search?q=%CE%9...FSokRfd1SZM%3A



    even if the hypothesis of the example,
    - let us to have-, Socrates "marbled bust", to the time of "Reggio's warriors", that bust,could possibly look with all the divine characteristics of eternal youth, -classic's, is proper to name them;- that would appear, with tottaly different features, from this we allredy-as Socrates- today recognize.
    If, he was God, Hero, Founder, the icon of Socrates how could be look like...?
    a" bold and unshaved Akhenaton!" -strange isn't it?




    @Angela, @Le Brok
    If the Greeks -of that time- had -the majority; or some minority; or even all of them; that, all, the specifigues traits, which we usually and commonly address as greek, the next problem will probably we have to solve is:
    Why the avant-guarde, the elite -excuse me for my enthusiasm- ,all this world class personalities, which recognize and attested as Greeks, do not carry nothing of the so, "greek features" ?Why the avant-guarde, the eliteall this world class personalities, which recognize and attested as Greeks, do not carry nothing of the so, "greek features" ?


    a briefly example of some of them.
    http://www.greek-language.gr/digital...ary/index.html


    The greek art, especially the classics are "illusion" and not real, eternal young but also mature as Zeus ?!. This phenomena would last for another ~200yrs, or more 50+;... (plus another ~300years of the stepping -Kouros- son,as explained to post#16
    So what happened; (rhetorically answeriring)... ?
    Who was able to fund busts, and the bodies of these... bipod mammals; mortals; -the humans I mean, with wrinkles and almost tired ... and what was their purpose... ?
    Socrates... and sceptical? I am also skeptical, about that...

    So what we conclude?

    i) These persons are not Greeks._
    ii) Clever and nice persons, do not have beautifull noses._
    iii) Panax is an exception._
    and
    (iv) The Greeks(with their noses and their intelligence) moved to Western Europe and left alone, back in Greece the fool with noses like eggplants, fully covered with body hair... Damn and ugly and fool...and alone... but ready, ready, and prepared from a long time ago... waiting and awaiting, not for the mighty Persians, not even for the Ottomans, but all the world to against them. The bloody name of that curse was I.M.F. ... (next Episode ,tsipras,reforms ancient space shuttle technology and ten naked Myrmidons without a penny in their pocket!)

    Getting intrigued?- No!

    -Illusion; There is no "straight line", allthough that they appear everything straight and in tact on, ...Parhtenon,.. under the will of the constructors, and not by accident... everything is curved.

    You cannot approach the Greeks -"Classics", as spreadly known- without ReligionReligio spectacles.
    Everything it is about the "divine perspective"... of the viewer, of the craftsman, of the God/Godess...you believe.
    -"do as you believe" or "do, your believe".

    That; is what i believe.
    -Reggio warri.


    Last edited by ΠΑΝΑΞ; 04-06-16 at 16:19. Reason: links and comma's. syntax

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    Panax

    you forgot something.

    except the nose
    is also the foot,
    and the wavy, not grapy hair/beard,
    ΟΘΕΝ ΑΙΔΩΣ OY EINAI
    ΑΤΗ ΛΑΜΒΑΝΕΙΝ ΑΥΤΟΙΣ
    ΥΒΡΙΣ ΓΕΝΝΑΤΑΙ
    ΝΕΜΕΣΙΣ ΚΑΙ ΤΙΣΗ ΑΚΟΛΟΥΘΟΥΣΙ ΔΕ

    When there is no shame
    Divine blindness conquers them
    Hybris (abuse, opprombium) is born
    Nemesis and punishment follows.

    Εχε υπομονη Ηρωα
    Η τιμωρια δεν αργει.

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    ΠΑΝΑΞ;480757]...(continue)
    Αs i mention to my previous posts which kindly supported with Angela's links and confirmations...
    Greek art is idealism and not realism, in the contrary, of that the majority of people believe.


    @Angela #19
    the young man - which instictively I thought it could be, Ganemedes or Dionyssus- is also Hellenistic; he weared a gariand; a golden wreath; -as also the beutifull girl with her's "wounded" neck; -The flower's are Roman;...and her breathing lips.., are Roman copy of hellenistic period?


    I wish I knew the provenance of that statue. I love it for itself and also for personal reasons. The only description of it I've ever seen is that it is a "Greek statue". It wouldn't surprise me to discover it's an Italian copy or even that it was modeled and carved in Italy.

    Yes, Antinous looks like Ganymede in that statue. Hadrian was so besotted he had him carved in various incarnations.

    This is supposedly Antinous as Osiris:


    And then deified:



    Now, whether they're all Antinous, or even whether Antinous really looked like this, or they portrayed him like this precisely because he was supposed to be the handsomest young man in the world, I don't know, and I don't think anyone else knows either.

    @Le Brok, about circumcision, it could be also possible to practiced from agriculturalists, after hygiene demands;- but surely with fully ceremonial religion practices; maybe also - to naturalized as members or "citizens";.
    with your consent thats my perspective...
    It reminds me the prehistorical myths of Uranus and Cronus... with some intense need of Gaia or the God,s for -little, as enough, blood!-a "modest" sacrifice for fertalization or -maybe- a sort of "manipulation" of the males, under the will of/for community (;)... From the brave and free(;) will, individual, to the faithfull on duty calls, collectivist...sort of type;
    Well, the rationale in the U.S. is that it's a health issue. Virtually every white baby boy gets circumscribed, over 90% I think. Pediatricians are adamant about it. ( Hispanics have the lowest rate, but it's high even among them. There's even outreach in minority communities to educate them about it.)They do it in the hospital. My father was against it, but my husband was insistent. As a new, first time mother I had to leave the room.



    The Egyptians as i posted, surely enforced with their, cleansing "mania", -shaving body, hair, many baths everyday, white clothes; etc.
    (need some time for Herodot..)
    I speculate at the time of pax Aegyptiaca, propably the circumcision adopted from.
    That makes sense to me too. Blowing sand could be a nasty problem.

    I also believe that "greek nose" exists. Also the "toes", the blue/black curly hair. the round shaped... back's, etc.
    which can easily recognise to today Greeks, but
    Maybe it was my fault to engage terms and meanings of "art" with "anthropology" terms, which probably not well combine together... I was just asking. _Who are they? -the Reggio/Ρήγιο warriors...
    So do I, and not only in Greece. I definitely have the toes, and if Flora's nose were just somewhat smaller, that could be my profile.


    for the head of Socrates and others...as posted #20

    It belongs to a different era from classic's, I suspect that probably -the one you post -is a roman copy of an hellenistic period ,which allready indicates the significant turn to more pragmatistic values and at last realism at Roman period.
    I mean that, if the "ancient sculptor"-actually, more than a dozen sculptors, plus the archicraftsman;- who could tried to make Socrates,at the real time, when the philosopher was alive... ...that it could be unacceptable, it consists blasphemy at the worst of its kind!
    -Probably would all both, exiled to the islands, at the best case scenario.
    (by the way Socrates, was sculptor).

    and he is an actor
    https://www.google.gr/search?q=%CE%9C%CE%AC%CE%BA%CE%B7%CF%82+%CE%A0%CE% B1%CF%80%CE%B1%CE%B4%CE%B7%CE%BC%CE%B7%CF%84%CF%81 %CE%AF%CE%BF%CF%85&sa=X&biw=1430&bih=764&stick=H4s IAAAAAAAAAONgFuLVT9c3NEzOys4tNC_KUeLSz9U3yLJIMyhO0 eLxzS_LTA3Jd0wuyS8CAJtpgp
    MrAAAA&tbm=isch&imgil=k7ARM68RBSwpvM%253A%253Btlds bpCtdNA_RM%253Bhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fwww.naftem poriki.gr%25252Fstory%25252F736667%25252Fmakis-papadimitriou-na-allaksoume-emeis-oi-idioi&source=iu&pf=m&fir=k7ARM68RBSwpvM%253A%252Ct ldsbpCtdNA_RM%252C_&usg=__7ChglLFgAOZ7Rd_3iyUQBrhJ YBU%3D#imgrc=4uJFSokRfd1SZM%3A

    [/QUOTE]

    That makes sense to me too. Good catch on the actor. He does look like him.

    @Angela, @Le Brok
    If the Greeks -of that time- had -the majority; or some minority; or even all of them; that, all, the specifigues traits, which we usually and commonly address as greek, the next problem will probably we have to solve is:
    Why the avant-guarde, the elite -excuse me for my enthusiasm- ,all this world class personalities, which recognize and attested as Greeks, do not carry nothing of the so, "greek features" ?


    a briefly example of some of them.
    http://www.greek-language.gr/digital...ary/index.html

    So what we conclude?

    i) These persons are not Greeks._
    ii) Clever and nice persons, do not have beautifull noses._
    iii) Panax is an exception._
    and
    (iv) The Greeks(with their noses and their intelligence) moved to Western Europe and left alone, back in Greece the fool with noses like eggplants, fully covered with body hair... Damn and ugly and fool...and alone... but ready, ready, and prepared from a long time ago... waiting and awaiting, not for the mighty Persians, not even for the Ottomans, but all the world to against them. The bloody name of that curse was I.M.F. ... (next Episode ,tsipras,reforms ancient space shuttle technology and ten naked Myrmidons without a penny in their pocket!)

    Getting intrigued?- No!

    -Illusion; There is no "straight line", allthough that they appear everything straight and in tact on, ...Parhtenon,.. under the will of the constructors, and not by accident... everything is curved.

    You cannot approach the Greeks -"Classics", as spreadly known- without Religion spectacles.
    Everything it is about the "divine perspective"... of the viewer, of the craftsman, of the God/Godess...you believe.
    -"do as you believe" or "do, your believe".


    Now you've lost me and you've also gone into a political rant which is totally off topic and totally uncalled for.

    As to what was on topic, I took a look at all those representations and I saw Greek noses and eye shapes aplenty (given those aren't profile views), although certainly not on all of them. Handsome men of a certain age, most of them, wrinkled, care worn, with their lives written on their faces, who haven't been idealized. What the sculptors were doing at a certain point in Greek history is like what air brushing does to a picture of an actress in a magazine. I know something about this because for two awful years after university I worked in advertising. This is done all the time. It's her alright, but with all imperfections smoothed away. It's what happens when they shoot a sequence of an older actress or actor through fine gauze. It's what Canova did to "idealize" Napoleon's slightly bumpy and rather pointy nose.

    I repeat what I said above, they had to get the model from somewhere. Did they imagine a nose shape which never existed, which they'd never seen in the flesh, or certain types of toes, or certain body builds on women (which I find too hippy for the breast size to be honest, but that's what they thought was beautiful). Some dippy bunch of "researchers" did a survey of a random collection of Brits and found that 3% had "classical Greek" noses. That was Britain. You're telling me that in Greece you don't have at least that many? You tell me. I've only been to the islands, and that only once, but it was certainly my impression that some of those handsome young men had very nice classical Greek noses. Not that other kinds of noses can't also be very attractive, of course. If there's a lot fewer of them now than there once was, perhaps it's drift, or perhaps it's the Slavic invasions. I have no idea, but I know that this kind of outburst is inappropriate, and I don't know what on earth what LeBrok and I posted can have to do with any perceived conspiracy against Greece.





    Non si fa il proprio dovere perchè qualcuno ci dica grazie, lo si fa per principio, per se stessi, per la propria dignità. Oriana Fallaci

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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    Well, the rationale in the U.S. is that it's a health issue. Virtually every white baby boy gets circumscribed, over 90% I think. Pediatricians are adamant about it. ( Hispanics have the lowest rate, but it's high even among them. There's even outreach in minority communities to educate them about it.)They do it in the hospital. My father was against it, but my husband was insistent. As a new, first time mother I had to leave the room.
    Hmm, I dont know why Pediatricians are adamant about circumcision in the US....and of course its not in relation to religious reasons like Jews and Muslims. There is a good reason for the foreskin to stay on and eventually cause more discomfort due to sensitivity later on, that otherwise should be protected. All the baby needs is just one pull to uncover the glance and no scissors needed . They will function very well and be hygienic too. Its funny that a 'god' / nature created concept for protection, has become part of some religions rituals to remove what 'god' created ........removing foreskin is also known to reduce sexual stimulation.




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    I am proud that I am not,

    and here in Greece we consider that as stupidity,

    millions and millions male raise with out circumcision,
    what hygiene and crap
    the only problem is that a very small number about 1/10000 might cause φιμωσις phimosis that is why all mothers the first year do as Maleth said.
    or at least let the baby play with its hands.
    it is a natural action to male babies to touch their organs

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maleth View Post
    Hmm, I dont know why Pediatricians are adamant about circumcision in the US....and of course its not in relation to religious reasons like Jews and Muslims. There is a good reason for the foreskin to stay on and eventually cause more discomfort due to sensitivity later on, that otherwise should be protected. All the baby needs is just one pull to uncover the glance and no scissors needed . They will function very well and be hygienic too. Its funny that a 'god' / nature created concept for protection, has become part of some religions rituals to remove what 'god' created ........removing foreskin is also known to reduce sexual stimulation.



    In the U.S. it certainly has nothing to do with religion. Jews make up about five percent or so of the population. There aren't very many Muslims either.

    There are a few naysayers, but most doctors strongly recommend it. Our pediatrician felt it should be mandated, like vaccinations. As I said, it's almost universal among white Americans, although the same type of mothers who don't want their children vaccinated are starting to decide against circumcision. For most white couples it's an absolute no brainer. They probably spend five minutes thinking about it. (Hispanics are different because they come from a different culture.) A couple I know where the husband immigrated here as a grown man from Italy decided not to have it done to their son. It turned out that my husband was right and it was the wrong decision. The boy wasn't happy about it later on. Adolescent boys don't want to be different from their male peers or the subject of whispers by the girls. Like so many other things, it boils down to cultural norms.

    Anyway, this article discusses it.
    http://pediatrics.aappublications.or...3/585.abstract

    The Center for Disease Control is even advocating it for for adolescent and grown men as a prophylactic measure.
    http://www.webmd.com/parenting/baby/...health-reasons

    @Yetos
    Well good for you. I'm happy you're happy with your body. What I'm not happy about is your insulting comments about practices in another country.

    Must most of what you post be insulting in some way or the result of some bizarre paranoia or conspiracy theory? Did I say anything derogatory about uncircumcised men? Take a chill pill, buddy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    In the U.S. it certainly has nothing to do with religion. Jews make up about five percent or so of the population. There aren't very many Muslims either.

    There are a few naysayers, but most doctors strongly recommend it. Our pediatrician felt it should be mandated, like vaccinations. As I said, it's almost universal among white Americans, although the same type of mothers who don't want their children vaccinated are starting to decide against circumcision. For most white couples it's an absolute no brainer. They probably spend five minutes thinking about it. (Hispanics are different because they come from a different culture.) A couple I know where the husband immigrated here as a grown man from Italy decided not to have it done to their son. It turned out that my husband was right and it was the wrong decision. The boy wasn't happy about it later on. Adolescent boys don't want to be different from their male peers or the subject of whispers by the girls. Like so many other things, it boils down to cultural norms.

    Anyway, this article discusses it.
    http://pediatrics.aappublications.or...3/585.abstract

    The Center for Disease Control is even advocating it for for adolescent and grown men as a prophylactic measure.
    http://www.webmd.com/parenting/baby/...health-reasons.
    I guess we have different experiences. My partner has been circumcised at Birth and told me he wished he hasn't mainly for the sensitivity issues. I mean some doctors argue that foreskin is necessary for savages to be protected from grasses and tree branches and the modern man does not need it anymore . As if we now do not wear underwear these days even if its the softest of cotton its non stop friction and I presume people wear them for the best part of the day. Some bathing suites can be pretty rough too, depending on the style. Doctors used to argue on removing the appendix and tonsils too. Now there are strong cases that these are useful and should not be removed unless there are complications which would be the exception and not the rule (especially with tonsils that apparently the do save a great deal of chest infections and some lung complications). In regards to the studies done in Africa in regards to std's transmissions I cannot help but being VERY skeptical on how these are done and the interests involved. Also the issue in regards to transmission is the full exposure of the glans which is perfectly possible without circumcision and just a matter of education. Only rare cases would need to be 'operated'.

    My skepticism in these kind of studies has been further fueled now by some study in Denmark that proibotics are all hype, when myself they were the only thing that have helped my IBS issues, and given me my life back (and its not in the mind). (Just to give an example). Also its not the first time we hear of a study contradicting another.

    I guess at the end of the day its everybody to their own oh how they see things as long as they feel convinced its the right thing ;) :)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    @Yetos
    Well good for you. I'm happy you're happy with your body. What I'm not happy about is your insulting comments about practices in another country.

    Must most of what you post be insulting in some way or the result of some bizarre paranoia or conspiracy theory? Did I say anything derogatory about uncircumcised men? Take a chill pill, buddy.
    that is a main difference of how people think, how science work, dogma, and nature.

    it is not only in USA,
    many Greek friends from Deutschland (sons of immigrants) that I know they had it at hospital, by a pushing of doctors as hygiene, they almost forced parents to accept
    I do not know why, that is happening, to West countries,
    but I believe it is against nature, a myth,
    same with female cut of clitoris,
    same with pragnacy, ceasarian section to modern world is multiply the possible of need,
    and that Stupidity is at my country, which the number 'ceadare' mothers is so high, that is surely 8 and more times the need of possible death at pregnacy,

    Besides IS Imoral TO DO SUCH TO A KID, A VIOLATION OF CHILDREN RIGHTS,
    SINCE NO EPIDEMIC, NEITHER SERIOUS DANGER EXIST,


    besides shaving is also hygiene,
    but how many men are shaving every day or two?

    sorry in greek the word is ωμος χαρακτηρας,
    means straight character, I can not hide behind my finger, that is why I did not become a politician

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    something went wrong with my post...??????.....Vanished...
    i wii try to find some time... next time

    Do you believe that was my [email protected],
    I was slightly have Fun to with conclusions (i). (ii), (iii), (iv)etc.
    Humour=Χυμώδης=juicy!
    Sorry,
    my posts are #12,16,17
    That; is what i believe.
    -Reggio warriors deserve their own thread .




    No Hard feelings my lady, my respect to @le Brok and to you and your Family.
    Hope not to get upset. Thanks for the host.





    [/QUOTE]
    Last edited by ΠΑΝΑΞ; 29-05-16 at 19:29. Reason: In to the void...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post
    Panax

    you forgot something.
    No you Forgot to... come to Athens ... call... .

    except the nose
    is also the foot,
    and the wavy, not grapy hair/beard,
    when you come, I will prepare your nose... and a Buddha, haircut.. nothing else to worry. )

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maleth View Post
    I guess we have different experiences. My partner has been circumcised at Birth and told me he wished he hasn't mainly for the sensitivity issues. I mean some doctors argue that foreskin is necessary for savages to be protected from grasses and tree branches and the modern man does not need it anymore . As if we now do not wear underwear these days even if its the softest of cotton its non stop friction and I presume people wear them for the best part of the day. Some bathing suites can be pretty rough too, depending on the style. Doctors used to argue on removing the appendix and tonsils too. Now there are strong cases that these are useful and should not be removed unless there are complications which would be the exception and not the rule (especially with tonsils that apparently the do save a great deal of chest infections and some lung complications). In regards to the studies done in Africa in regards to std's transmissions I cannot help but being VERY skeptical on how these are done and the interests involved. Also the issue in regards to transmission is the full exposure of the glans which is perfectly possible without circumcision and just a matter of education. Only rare cases would need to be 'operated'.

    My skepticism in these kind of studies has been further fueled now by some study in Denmark that proibotics are all hype, when myself they were the only thing that have helped my IBS issues, and given me my life back (and its not in the mind). (Just to give an example). Also its not the first time we hear of a study contradicting another.

    I guess at the end of the day its everybody to their own oh how they see things as long as they feel convinced its the right thing ;) :)
    Well, my "experience" of it is of a different "nature", so to speak, and not extensive even then, so I'm not a leading personal authority. :) I've always wondered who on earth these women are who feel competent to participate in surveys about the love making abilities of all these nationalities of men. As to the differences as men see them, I would think it would be difficult to judge even for them unless they had "experience" in both "states", so to speak, but again, I'm not competent at all to judge in that case.

    I basically just didn't want my son to feel "different" or "odd" in his world, so on balance I think it was the right decision, especially given the research, although I agree that one should take all medical research with a bit of a grain of salt. They've been wrong a lot of times. Also, perhaps more importantly, it was something my husband felt extremely strongly about, so I deferred to his judgment in something so related to male sexuality. There's also something to be said for a son "looking" like his father in this case.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ΠΑΝΑΞ View Post


    something went wrong with my post...??????.....Vanished...
    i wii try to find some time... next time

    Do you believe that was my [email protected],
    I was slightly have Fun to with conclusions (i). (ii), (iii), (iv)etc.
    Humour=Χυμώδης=juicy!
    Sorry,
    my posts are #12,16,17
    That; is what i believe.
    -Reggio warriors deserve their own thread .




    No Hard feelings my lady, my respect to @le Brok and to you and your Family.
    Hope not to get upset. Thanks for the host.





    [/QUOTE]

    It used to happen to me all the time too. Before you click on post make sure you save everything you've written (just highlight and click copy), because after a certain amount of time the program sort of clocks you out.

    That's fine. I'm not offended. You'd know if I were really offended! :) Plus, I'm no believer in so controlling what's posted that it all becomes like reading a mechanic's manual. I just get the feeling sometimes that the responses are to things said on other sites, not here. I try never to be disrespectful to any group, and certainly not to Greeks. I can't tell you the number of times I've had Greeks say to me when they discover that I'm Italian, "Una faccia, una razza", which is indeed true to some extent. Oh, and we have some men with "eggplant" noses too. I did love that analogy!. So vivid. :)

    I wondered whether you literally meant that the bas relief of Ashtarte looked like your wife. Given Ashtarte's virtually perfect body, in my opinion, in that representation I'd say you were a lucky man if she looked like her, although looks are indeed not everything. Of course, the face is a bit square and stern, yes? So perhaps, if physiognomy is any judge of character, a bit domineering and controlling? In my experience with Mediterranean men indirection is sometimes the easiest path for getting your own way if you can stomach it, otherwise you can spend your whole life battling things out. Not that battling doesn't add some spice to life and make reconciliations very sweet.

    It may be a stereotype and very exaggerated, but I laughed out loud when I saw this commercial. I've been there, shall we say! Only I was usually the one telling him to go home to his family. :) Everybody wanted to live with my mother, including him, so he would have wanted to go along if I went home.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ov3G0oC798E

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    I basically just didn't want my son to feel "different" or "odd" in his world, so on balance I think it was the right decision, especially given the research, although I agree that one should take all medical research with a bit of a grain of salt. They've been wrong a lot of times. Also, perhaps more importantly, it was something my husband felt extremely strongly about, so I deferred to his judgment in something so related to male sexuality. There's also something to be said for a son "looking" like his father in this case.
    Perfectly understandable

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    https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/i...ISXdy3rMIO78ii


    https://www.google.gr/search?q=%CF%8...xhl856Y5-_M%3A


    (wish not to bother you with details, just a comment)

    Her kindness oftenly, enjoyed a lot.... the teaser Pan. (Yes, she is.)
    It don't look... like "first time", actually looks!
    PAN:

    -Have we ever met... ?


    Eros, / Mars son:
    "-Hey leave her... now !

    Her's delicate hand...


    ( some informations)
    http://www.namuseum.gr/object-month/...jun10-en.html#
    Last edited by ΠΑΝΑΞ; 01-06-16 at 21:07. Reason: grammar

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    My case story and how the hunter becames... the hunt. She was an athlete at 110m. hurdles, running as fast as with her bike... I had to impress her. The drama processed in four minor actions and one major destruction... Late summer, the place cape: -Sounio Attica, Temple of Poseidon...





    I dragged her to the caves,


    and wait...


    *


    ...at night,


    I gaved her salt, breath...


    and Τime...


    *


    ...the morning cames.


    She gaved me, her beauty and a boy...


    Α boy, -Sun!


    *


    That Sun, my Son...


    a Sun, who burns and lights...



    *


    Now dying,


    burned.





    ΠΑΝΑΞ ΕΠΟΗΣΕΝ


    Last edited by ΠΑΝΑΞ; 02-06-16 at 14:46.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ΠΑΝΑΞ View Post
    https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/i...ISXdy3rMIO78ii


    https://www.google.gr/search?q=%CF%8...xhl856Y5-_M%3A


    (wish not to bother you with details, just a comment)

    Her kindness oftenly, enjoyed a lot.... the teaser Pan. (Yes, she is.)
    It don't look... like "first time", actually looks!
    PAN:

    -Have we ever met... ?


    Eros, / Mars son:
    "-Hey leave her... now !

    Her's delicate hand...


    ( some informations)
    http://www.namuseum.gr/object-month/...jun10-en.html#
    It's a really lovely piece of art, and I think she's beautiful, but Pan strikes me as a "creeper" in my daughter's language, a pervert following you around, or an old lecher, not a teaser.

    Plus, he went one step further and put his hand on her. She should slap him in the face with that shoe she's carrying! That would teach him...

    For our members, an English language description of the piece.
    http://www.namuseum.gr/object-month/.../jun10-en.html

    She has one of the highest rooted noses I've ever seen. Maybe even more pronounced than Fabio Rongione's.

    http://mythagora.com/bios/gallery/im...phrodite11.jpg

    http://1.fwcdn.pl/ph/85/08/678508/376111.1.jpg


    The poem is very nice. Who wrote it?

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    hahaha

    we do not know what is written under the shoe,

    many ancient used marks under their sandals, written messages that could be understood as signs,

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    ΠΑΝΑΞ probably as another Παν is in love with Aphrodite

    but I would put him a temptation




    Νικη της Σαμοθρακης
    trying to step at the front edge of a ship? or to fly?

    since we do not know the golden/ivory Virgin Athena
    (we assume it was like Βαρβακειος Αθηνα)
    Ι consider Νικη as the most beautifull female statue, with far behind to be Aphrodite

    yet as always something is missing, (damned christians),
    but that is ok, I can imagine her with every face I want,

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post
    hahaha

    we do not know what is written under the shoe,

    many ancient used marks under their sandals, written messages that could be understood as signs,
    Yes, I know about the sandal trick, but it would be for someone like him, not that Pan! :)


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    I think Aphrodite allready applied a sandal slap to his face (-Look at Pan's nose),but he stills enjoyed and happy to receive another one...


    The light is the protagonist, it depends the time... Sometimes Aphrodite looks to enjoy also. (As in real myths)


    The poem is mine and I first write a poem in English.

    I tried to post pictures but I couldn't...

    This story is mine, is real, and i am me.

    @ Angela , I tried to be concetrate and timeless, I hoped you recognise also, many icons of an archetypical genesis
    the Water/Male/Oceanus/Uranus, to the other pole the beauty of the earth Mother/matter the Gaia/and Gyny gr.-Γυνή... etc etc

    But you probably ask

    Dying?
    Because as parents that is what we have to do. The mortality, is the hope for the new to come.

    So, we live in a no time moment, ok Enough

    I cannot explain, but you allready know that is something deep behind it and that's true.

    I feel Rudiculous to say more because i cannot afford much English to serve myself.

    I Thought you could loved the pictures (real places), unfortunatelly i couldn't post it.

    the title is:
    from salt and time. It is the before time story of the Cosmos... in a day which is a period ....(stop ,Now.-)

    and big Thank you @Angela because you were the reason to write it, - you asked me about my Aphrodite.


    Damn Insomnia... I should be in sleep at 10:30

    Ι wil lose my job @yetos...
    I will answer all guestions, motorcyles and cars included...in time!



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    Quote Originally Posted by ΠΑΝΑΞ View Post
    I think Aphrodite allready applied a sandal slap to his face (-Look at Pan's nose),but he stills enjoyed and happy to receive another one...


    The light is the protagonist, it depends the time... Sometimes Aphrodite looks to enjoy also. (As in real myths)


    The poem is mine and I first write a poem in English.

    I tried to post pictures but I couldn't...

    This story is mine, is real, and i am me.

    @ Angela , I tried to be concetrate and timeless, I hoped you recognise also, many icons of an archetypical genesis
    the Water/Male/Oceanus/Uranus, to the other pole the beauty of the earth Mother/matter the Gaia/and Gyny gr.-Γυνή... etc etc

    But you probably ask

    Dying?
    Because as parents that is what we have to do. The mortality, is the hope for the new to come.

    So, we live in a no time moment, ok Enough

    I cannot explain, but you allready know that is something deep behind it and that's true.

    I feel Rudiculous to say more because i cannot afford much English to serve myself.

    I Thought you could loved the pictures (real places), unfortunatelly i couldn't post it.

    the title is:
    from salt and time. It is the before time story of the Cosmos... in a day which is a period ....(stop ,Now.-)

    and big Thank you @Angela because you were the reason to write it, - you asked me about my Aphrodite.


    Damn Insomnia... I should be in sleep at 10:30

    Ι wil lose my job @yetos...
    I will answer all guestions, motorcyles and cars included...in time!


    You're quite welcome. Yes, I did get some of the symbolism; very appropriate. Thank you for the explanation.

    If you want to post pictures from the internet, click on the square image above, third from the right. Then make sure From URL is highlighted, and click on the mark next to retrieve remote file so the check mark disappears. Now, move the cursor to the start of the long URL box and click. If you've highlighted and copied the url of the internet picture previously, just click on paste from your browser tools and it should appear there. Click OK. When you post, the image should appear.

    Or, you can just highlight the url of the picture you like, click copy from the tools on your browser, place your cursor where you want it to appear, and then click paste from your tools. The url should appear and people can click it to see the picture.

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