to my new "brother" Goga
Goga :
Brotheryou are wrong. You forgot these studies?
Cited by Goga :
" Hequestioned the resemblance between the Maikop crania from Evdyk I andthose from Syezzheye and Zadono-Avilovsky; and he believed the formerto resemble crania from the Caucasus, the Near East,and Southwestern Central Asia, being closest to those fromSamtavro, Georgia, and Ginchi, Dagestan (Khokhlov, 2002).
Moesansays : She compared a Maykop skull to other cultures skulls, andfound, yes, a global resemblance to southern europoid types, nothingmore.
Citedby Goga :
T.I.Alekseyeva (2004) measured a male skull from mound 13 burial 5 atNezhinskaya near Kislovodsk (the plastic reconstruction of thisindividual’s appearance was made by L.T. Yablonsky), as well as twocrania (male and female) from mound 70 burial 1 at Zamankul inNorthern Ossetia. All these crania came from “Maikop–Novosvobodnaya” burials and were attributed to the Mediterraneanvariety of the Southern Caucasoid type which was distributed inArmenia, Georgia, Iran, and Mesopotamia during the Chalcolithic andEarly Bronze Age. The heterogeneity of the Maikopgroup in Alexeyeva’s opinion may be due to individual variability,but also to admixture with the natives of the southeastern Europeansteppes (Alekseyeva, 2004).
Moesansays : the alleged type at this time (Chalco/EBA) were,according to old descriptions, on the irano-afghan type, not too farfor old 'eurafrican' type. It tends to partially exclude otherNear-Eastern types, more crossed with western gracile'mediterraneans' of European and Anatolia Neolithic. Only Georgiawould be erroneous ?
Citedby Goga:
Insum, the results of the multivariate analysis suggest that Maikoppeople are distinct from all the contemporary and later EasternEuropean groups of the steppe and forest-steppe zones.This provides an additional argument in favor of the hypothesis thatMaikop burials in Kalmykia attest not merely to the cultural impactof the Maikop community on the steppe tribes (Munchaev, 1994: 168);rather, they were left by a separate group which was unrelated to thelocal Pit Grave population by origin. The SouthernCaucasoid trait combination revealed by the Maikop series is somewhatsimilar to that shown by the contemporaneous groupsof the Northern Caucasus and southern Turkmenia.Clearly, this does not imply a directconnection with any of these regions.
However,the isolated position of the Maikop group in Eastern Europe, itsvague resemblance to the Southern Caucasoids ofthe Caucasus and Southwestern Central Asia, and theNear Eastern cultural affinities of Maikop and Novosvobodnaya(Munchaev, 1994: 170) indirectly point to Near Eastern provenance."
Moesan says:
Kazarnitskycited the above lines you cited yourself. An did not say, as I wrotemyself, the contrary concerning demic moves frome elsewhere thanthe Steppes. Here we agree.The fact remains that on some figure provided by him, the moreprecise evidence(distance) I cited appears clearlyand not the fruit of myimagination : Maykop of Novosvobodnaya is closer to EasternCaspian than to Western Caspian=Caucasus of the same time.
http://dienekes.blogspot.nl/2013/06/...zarnitsky.html
Gogacited
" Uruk migrants in the Caucasus »
Duringthis period the South Caucasus experienced two powerful waves ofMiddle Eastern expansion: the first at the time of Late Neolithicculture of Sioni in the 4th-5th millennia B.C., and the second at theperiod of Tsopi culture in the Late Neolithic Age, at the end of the5th and the first half of the 4th millennium B.C., which is known asthe Uruk expansion era. Later, in the second half of the 4th andthroughout the 3 rd millennium B.C., during the Early Bronze Age theKura-Araxes culture of the Caucasus spread throughout the greaterpart of the Caucasus, Eastern Anatolia, northern parts of Iran,Middle East and even Europe. "
Moesansays : the « climbing northwards » of someNear-Eastern people (Uruk?), proved by archeology atleast at the cultural level, could explain the less typically'west-asian' ('gedrosia'?) aspect and surely autosomal inheritage ofsome Caucasus populations (lost of a part of ancient CHG?). I see(guess) rather the Kura-Araxes people as linked to East caspian, moreCHG and less « near-eastern-drifted » and cause of theMaykop people situation. Other itching question : areKura-Araxes people PIE-speaking : nothing less sure !...So, were Maykop people the PIE language promotors ???
Idon't find back the abstract I red and the two axis plotting I've athand on paper, but I verified it and confirm my post, whatever thevalue of sorts of things (I think they have some worth concerningpopulation in close enough place and time). Here under a smallestabstract confirming that even if close enough compared to more remoteplaces, Caucasus is not identical to Maykop.
Samefor Turkmenistan places, spite I insist on his plotting they werecloser to Maykop. I don't know how to interprete his « parallels… to the Near East » in this precise phrase. A generalstatement about 'mediterranean' vague resemblances ?
[h=5]
[FONT=Rosalind Serif, Georgia, serif]TheMaikop crania revisited :[/FONT][/h]
[FONT=Roboto, Arial, sans-serif]ABSTRACT:[/FONT][FONT=Roboto, Arial, sans-serif] Measurements of crania of people associated with the Early Bronze Age Maikop culture of the Northern Caucasus are analyzed. Data on Maikop males, [/FONT][FONT=Roboto, Arial, sans-serif]new and previously published[/FONT][FONT=Roboto, Arial, sans-serif], were compared with those concerning chronologically and geographically related people using the canonical variate analysis. The Maikop series turned out to be [/FONT][FONT=Roboto, Arial, sans-serif]isolated and no close parallels to it were found among the Bronze Age groups, either from the steppe and forest-steppe zones of Eastern Europe [/FONT][FONT=Roboto, Arial, sans-serif]or from the Caucasus and Southwestern Central Asia[/FONT][FONT=Roboto, Arial, sans-serif]. While certain parallels seem to point to the Near East, they are too few to warrant definite conclusions.[/FONT]
[FONT=Roboto, Arial, sans-serif]Nopreview · Article · Mar 2010 · Archaeology Ethnology andAnthropology of Eurasia[/FONT] [FONT=Roboto, Arial, sans-serif]A.A. Kazarnitsky[/FONT]