E1b1b is black?

[real expert]

Good question--it proves that "race," which is a social construct and not a biological one, has no place in science.

Can you please stop with parroting this PC Matra and dogma that "race or gender is a social construct". Race is real. Hence the liberal denial of it has no place in science. The only social construct about race is the claim that it's a social construct. There is a biological structure in humans. Genetically speaking a Yoruba can never be confused for an Australian Aborigine or a Swede for a Chinese or a Pgymy for a Native American. There is nothing wrong with acknowledging the existence of race. Denying race as if it‘s a bad thing is actually the real racism here. We should celebrate diversity by denying it? Is racism only wrong because there is not such a thing as race? Would be racism right and good if race did exist? Racism is wrong not because race isn‘t real, but because hating and dehumanizing other human beings who look different is wrong and immoral. Christianity believes that ALL humans, male or female have a human diginity since they were created in the image of God. Hence this God given dignity shouldn‘t be violated by hatred or dehumanization.

 

[ratchet_fan]

But they were different. This sample is a Paleolithic/Mesolithic Hunter Gatherer from Egypt. He was quite robust like the Iberomaurusians, so i think his Y-DNA might be E-M35/E-M78 and probably his autosomal hypothetically would be mostly ANA.

I agree. But still closer to Eurasians than Africans. Plus these people were absorbed by Eurasians not Africans anyways.

Also that guy is ridiculously robust. Wow. Impressive.

 

[Fleurdelys]

Your question is not stupid.

Your question is not stupid, I asked the same question myself. For personal reasons, I travel a lot in the Maghreb and I meet them a lot.The average Maghrebi has East Africans features, which would correspond to this population which was E1b1b. I'm not just talking about the color of the skin, but physical features, like the skeleton, musculature, face, etc. They are thin and the arms are built like ethiopians athletic runners, but the chest remain thin, even if they work out a lot. Some Ethiopians also look a lot like Moroccans. I suppose that the Maghrebis are East Africans mixed mainly with other diverse Mediterranean peoples, but who were all similar (phoenicians, greeks, romans, ottomans, spanish, etc.). They would look like a lot like ancient egyptians ethnically (Horners or very ancient Near Easteners who were related to horners E1b1b mixed to more recent mediterraneans J1 and others).

(They obviously don't want to hear about it, because they like to believe that real Berbers are blondes like Germanics, but for me it make no sense).

1/3 of their maternal mtdna is from european women, 1/3 near easterner womens and 1/3 subsaharans. How these women from far regions were introduced in Maghreb is anothers subject of debate.

 

[kingjohn]

Your question is not stupid, I asked the same question myself. For personal reasons, I travel a lot in the Maghreb and I meet them a lot.The average Maghrebi has East Africans features, which would correspond to this population which was E1b1b. I'm not just talking about the color of the skin, but physical features, like the skeleton, musculature, face, etc. They are thin and the arms are built like ethiopians athletic runners, but the chest remain thin, even if they work out a lot. Some Ethiopians also look a lot like Moroccans. I suppose that the Maghrebis are East Africans mixed mainly with other diverse Mediterranean peoples, but who were all similar (phoenicians, greeks, romans, ottomans, spanish, etc.). They would look like a lot like ancient egyptians ethnically (Horners or very ancient Near Easteners who were related to horners E1b1b mixed to more recent mediterraneans J1 and others).

(They obviously don't want to hear about it, because they like to believe that real Berbers are blondes like Germanics, but for me it make no sense).

1/3 of their maternal mtdna is from european women, 1/3 near easterner womens and 1/3 subsaharans. How these women from far regions were introduced in Maghreb is anothers subject of debate.

where do you see it
in apricity where ?


p.s
our emperor carcalla very likely was e1b1b1

https://www.ancient.eu/image/13003/caracalla-facial-reconstruction/

 

[Fleurdelys]

I don’t know Apricity and I don’t understand the meaning of your post at all.

 

[Fleurdelys]

The romans are a mixed population, of various origins. The North Africans too. But the origin of E1b1b is most likely East Africa or the Near East, but both are related. Modern Maghrebians still have obvious Horner features, which exist also in others saharans region Africans. Romans not that much.

 

[real expert]

where do you see it
in apricity where ?


p.s
our emperor carcalla very likely was e1b1b1

https://www.ancient.eu/image/13003/caracalla-facial-reconstruction/

Yes very possible. Caracalla was from his father side Punic, thus there is the possibility that he belonged to hp J1, too. Anyway, Voshart is a left-wing moron. He made several Roman emperors much darker than in his original reconstruction and also changed their facial features a bit. North Africans and Middle Easterners criticized him on Twitter for darkening their emperors, and he arrogantly dismissed them. Later he just made lame excuses and referred to artistic license.

 

[kingjohn]

I don’t know Apricity and I don’t understand the meaning of your post at all.

The point is where did you saw e1b1b1b people
Who claim or think they are blond and germanic.. ...
I am e1b1b1-m84 an i never claim that ....
Neither do most europeans who belong to the european e-v13....
I wonder what do they will think on calling them black....
Our connection to black people majority e1b1a-v38...
Is 40 ky old damn old....
Many water went through the river....


P.s
And the ancestor of most berbers e-m81
is e-L19 that was found in neolithic morroco...
Zidane doesn't look black infact i see cro-magnon feature

 

[Fleurdelys]

Zidane have some features of the East Africans athletic body that I talked about. He look white, but he have also a little ? something ?.

Many Europeans carry the E1b1b haplogroup, but lost completely the phenotype of the original tribe, because they married Europeans women for many generations. But North Africans are closer to the origins of E1b1b. In Morocco there is villages where 90% of the men are E1b1b and high E1b1b populations in Maghreb really have a typical look.

 

[kingjohn]

Zidane have some features of the East Africans athletic body that I talked about. He look white, but he have also a little � something �.
Many Europeans carry the E1b1b haplogroup, but lost completely the phenotype of the original tribe, because they married Europeans women for many generations. But North Africans are closer to the origins of E1b1b. In Morocco there is villages where 90% of the men are E1b1b and high E1b1b populations in Maghreb really have a typical look.

Can you post picture of the typical look
You are talking about ...
I never been in the maghreb

 

[Fleurdelys]

I would have many examples, but the forum
Forbid me posting links because I’m new here.

Search for example the french-tunisian actor Sami Bouajila. He look very much like the average man of the street in Morocco, Algeria, Tunisia.

But we don’t see these browns peoples that much in the tv programs in these countries. If you watch the tv there, everybody seem turkish or italian, and women have blue eyes. (The upper society look like that but it’s not the typical Maghrebian).

 

[Fleurdelys]

Dahmane El Harrachi, Algerian singer. Search on Google.

 

[Fleurdelys]

Moroccan, algerian, tunisian rappers on Google image. Usually they come from the poors neighborhood, so they look more average than the actors.

 

[kingjohn]

I would have many examples, but the forum
Forbid me posting links because I’m new here.
Search for example the french-tunisian actor Sami Bouajila. He look very much like the average man of the street in Morocco, Algeria, Tunisia.
But we don’t see these browns peoples that much in the tv programs in these countries. If you watch the tv there, everybody seem turkish or italian, and women have blue eyes. (The upper society look like that but it’s not the typical Maghrebian).

He look more arabian than southern european
But yes i can see the horn features
E1b1b1
still i wouldn't call him black

little bit of a strech don't you think...
P.s
When i think on black face
I think on shakil oneel

not this actor face

 

[Hawk]

I don't think Maghrebis look like Ethiopians at all.

 

[Alyan]

Maghrebis from the Neolithic onward were always a West Eurasian population with no real connection to Subsaharans accounting for events like the slave trade and mixture from West Asian populations. And the Egyptians were never like Horners biologically (especially when leaks of Old Kingdom samples are Neolithic Levantine meaning they're closest to Arabians among all non-stop town populations).

Horners and select other East Africans are admixtured with non-Subsaharans. They are a poor example to use.

Blondism and other signs of depigmation in NA populations traces to population movements from cultures like Neolithic Spain into NA.

 

[Fleurdelys]

You should develop more your sense of observation.

 

[Alyan]

accidental unneeded post delete

 

[TaktikatEMalet]

Y-DNA and mtDNA have nothing to do with your physical appearance. That is dictated by your autosomal DNA.

So wrong, autosomnal dna is diluted. Most important dna is y dna from your grandfather as usually men tend to look like their grandfather and for women it's mtdna but again look at recent ancestors for similar appearance. Y dna and mdna are continuous, autosomnal dna is not as important as these 2

 

[kingjohn]

Lol ... E1b1b had Hitler too? R1b has concentrations of over 80% in sub-Saharan Africa ? So, E1b1b is black...

and einstein and napoleon and wright brothers
and lyndon johnson .....
and other great :cool-v:



p.s
you speak about r1b-v88 .....
this is the common ancestor of us and e-v38 west africans
it call e-p177 and it is 40,000 ky damn damn old
https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-P177/