FTDNA FTDNA ancientOrigins

[Wheal]

My dad
11% Metal Age
44% Farmer
45% HG
0% Non-European

My Mom
11% Metal
45% Farmer
44% HG
0% Non-E

 

[Dibran]

14% Metal Age Invader, 62% Farmer, 24% Hunter-Gatherer

 

[Dema]

Mine:
Farmer: 59%
Metal age invader: 14%
Hunther- Gatherer: 27%
Non-European: 0%

Interesting feature tho, i think they will upgrade it in the future its pretty basic now..

 

[Arbaso]

My results:

0% Metal Age Invader
58% Farmer
42% Hunter-Gatherer
0% Non-European

I really would like to know why Basque people show 0% metal invader ancestry. As I understand it, the metal invaders were the carriers of haplogroup R1b to western Europe, and around 85% of Basque men belong to that haplogroup. Any ideas?

 

[IronSide]

My results:
0% Metal Age Invader
58% Farmer
42% Hunter-Gatherer
0% Non-European
I really would like to know why Basque people show 0% metal invader ancestry. As I understand it, the metal invaders were the carriers of haplogroup R1b to western Europe, and around 85% of Basque men belong to that haplogroup. Any ideas?

Very interesting. 0% metal age, Basques are indeed a relic of a distant past.

Please don't ever get extinct :embarassed:

 

[Angela]

My results:

0% Metal Age Invader
58% Farmer
42% Hunter-Gatherer
0% Non-European

I really would like to know why Basque people show 0% metal invader ancestry. As I understand it, the metal invaders were the carriers of haplogroup R1b to western Europe, and around 85% of Basque men belong to that haplogroup. Any ideas?

This commercial testing company is getting it wrong to some degree, imo. Basques do have "steppe" ancestry according to academic analyses.

In this test the "Metal Age Invaders" means, I think, the "Caucasus" portion of the "steppe" people. The only way that Basques could have no "Caucasus" ancestry is if their R1b ancestors only got EHG, not CHG/Iranian Neo. That would mean, however, that their results are somehow confounding the academic tests for "steppe".

 

[IronSide]

This commercial testing company is getting it wrong to some degree, imo. Basques do have "steppe" ancestry according to academic analyses.

In this test the "Metal Age Invaders" means, I think, the "Caucasus" portion of the "steppe" people. The only way that Basques could have no "Caucasus" ancestry is if their R1b ancestors only got EHG, not CHG/Iranian Neo. That would mean, however, that their results are somehow confounding the academic tests for "steppe".

Harrapa World Basque results:

S-Indian 1
Baloch 6
Caucasian 1
NE-Euro 32
SE-Asian 0
Siberian 0
NE-Asian 0
Papuan 0
American 0
Beringian 0
Mediterranean 56
SW-Asian 2
San 0
E-African 0
Pygmy 0
W-African 0

Caucasian is close to null, Baloch is 6. I never really grasped the difference between them, aren't they all associated with Iran Neolithic ? some calculators combine both to a West Asian component.

 

[Arbaso]

Angela, you are probably right when you say that the metal invader in FTDNA is associated to the Caucasus part of the Steppe ancestry.

Using Dodecad World 9 in Gedmatch, I get 2.11% in the Caucasus-Gedrosia component; and the Basque reference model for it is 0%.

In the Eurogenes K12b calculator I also get 0% for Caucasus and 0% for West Central Asia.

So, that would mean that the Basque Yamnaya or Steppe ancestry comes from a different source other than Caucasus. Which one would that be, though?

Looking at the Figure 3 you posted, it seems that the Yamnaya element is higher in Basques than in Spanish, which makes me wonder what the authors understand as Yamnaya then.

 

[Angela]

Angela, you are probably right when you say that the metal invader in FTDNA is associated to the Caucasus part of the Steppe ancestry.

Using Dodecad World 9 in Gedmatch, I get 2.11% in the Caucasus-Gedrosia component; and the Basque reference model for it is 0%.

In the Eurogenes K12b calculator I also get 0% for Caucasus and 0% for West Central Asia.

So, that would mean that the Basque Yamnaya or Steppe ancestry comes from a different source other than Caucasus. Which one would that be, though?

Looking at the Figure 3 you posted, it seems that the Yamnaya element is higher in Basques than in Spanish, which makes me wonder what the authors understand as Yamnaya then.

Arbaso, there is a big difference between calculators based on modern population clusters such as you can find on gedmatch, or even ones produced by commercial genomics companies based on those same modern populations, and academic analyses comparing modern genomes to actual ancient samples. The latter is always going to be more accurate. Then, comparisons based on ADMIXTURE programs are less accurate than formal stats.

That Haak et al graphic is based on formal statistical analysis, not on ADMIXTURE, which is why I turn to it often even though it's about two years old. I don't remember the particular ancient steppe samples that they used, but they would have been a combination of EHG hunter-gatherer and Caucasus ancestry. I'd have to comb through the supplement again to see if there is a breakdown for those particular samples.

So, imo, Pais Vasco does indeed have steppe ancestry.

They do have more of it than standard Spanish samples, but the difference is very slight. I think what difference exists may be a function of the ancestry they don't have. For example, they have much less North African and African from what I remember. As an isolated population who may have moved into the area from the French Basque area they have a slightly different population history.

 

[AdeoF]

Meh here is mine and I might the only few people here who has some "non-european"

Metal Age Invader: 10%
Farmer: 56%
Hunter-Gatherer: 32%
Non-European: 2%

 

[Angela]

Arbaso, there is a big difference between calculators based on modern population clusters such as you can find on gedmatch, or even ones produced by commercial genomics companies based on those same modern populations, and academic analyses comparing modern genomes to actual ancient samples. The latter is always going to be more accurate. Then, comparisons based on ADMIXTURE programs are less accurate than formal stats.

That Haak et al graphic is based on formal statistical analysis, not on ADMIXTURE, which is why I turn to it often even though it's about two years old. I don't remember the particular ancient steppe samples that they used, but they would have been a combination of EHG hunter-gatherer and Caucasus ancestry. I'd have to comb through the supplement again to see if there is a breakdown for those particular samples.

So, imo, Pais Vasco does indeed have steppe ancestry.

They do have more of it than standard Spanish samples, but the difference is very slight. I think what difference exists may be a function of the ancestry they don't have. For example, they have much less North African and African from what I remember. As an isolated population who may have moved into the area from the French Basque area they have a slightly different population history.

Arbaso, a correction. I once again forgot that the FTDNA ancient origins test does compare to actual ancient samples. However, I believe it is still based on ADMIXTURE. I would still go with Haak et al since it's based on formal stats.

@AdeoF,
I think all of that stuff is nonsense. If the genes in question have been in Europe for a thousand or more years, for any sensible purpose they're European.