Eupedia Forums
Site NavigationEupedia Top > Eupedia Forum & Japan Forum
Results 1 to 15 of 15

Thread: Dutch election fever; breakthrough of Trumpist in Europe?

  1. #1
    Elite member Achievements:
    Tagger Second ClassThree FriendsVeteran10000 Experience Points

    Join Date
    23-02-15
    Location
    Groningen
    Posts
    715
    Points
    12,160
    Level
    33
    Points: 12,160, Level: 33
    Level completed: 30%, Points required for next Level: 490
    Overall activity: 29.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    E1b1b/ E-V22

    Ethnic group
    North Sea Germanic
    Country: Netherlands



    Dutch election fever; breakthrough of Trumpist in Europe?



    Today are the Dutch in a real election fever....the turnout figures are very high. People are standing in rows.
    Within an our we will know the exit poll, the hottest topic is: will 'Trumpist' Wilders make a breakthrough and even will be the biggest party or?
    Lots of people where not sure until they went out to vote on what party they want to vote. Great electoral shifts are predicted....
    Trending for the other elections in Europe, like in France or Germany?

  2. #2
    Regular Member Achievements:
    VeteranThree Friends25000 Experience Points
    Sile's Avatar
    Join Date
    04-09-11
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    5,119
    Points
    29,699
    Level
    52
    Points: 29,699, Level: 52
    Level completed: 96%, Points required for next Level: 51
    Overall activity: 37.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    T1a2 -Z19945..Jura
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H95a1 ..Pannoni

    Ethnic group
    North Alpine Italian
    Country: Australia



    Quote Originally Posted by Northener View Post
    Today are the Dutch in a real election fever....the turnout figures are very high. People are standing in rows.
    Within an our we will know the exit poll, the hottest topic is: will 'Trumpist' Wilders make a breakthrough and even will be the biggest party or?
    Lots of people where not sure until they went out to vote on what party they want to vote. Great electoral shifts are predicted....
    Trending for the other elections in Europe, like in France or Germany?
    41 seats rutte to 15 wilders last election is too much to make up

    rutte lost 10 seats and wilders gained only 4 in this election ..................big winner as I was told by my wife's dutch friend is that the "frisian" party gained 16 and is now running second to rutte
    có che un pòpoło no 'l defende pi ła só łéngua el xe prónto par èser s'ciavo

    when a people no longer dares to defend its language it is ripe for slavery.

  3. #3
    Advisor Achievements:
    Three FriendsVeteranTagger First Class50000 Experience PointsRecommendation First Class
    Awards:
    Discussion Ender
    LeBrok's Avatar
    Join Date
    18-11-09
    Location
    Calgary
    Posts
    10,331
    Points
    113,888
    Level
    100
    Points: 113,888, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b Z2109
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H1c

    Ethnic group
    Citizen of the world
    Country: Canada-Alberta



    Trumpist didn't win. Uplifting!
    Be wary of people who tend to glorify the past, underestimate the present, and demonize the future.

  4. #4
    Satyavrata Achievements:
    Three FriendsRecommendation First ClassVeteran50000 Experience PointsTagger First Class
    Maciamo's Avatar
    Join Date
    17-07-02
    Location
    Lothier
    Posts
    8,788
    Points
    732,414
    Level
    100
    Points: 732,414, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 53.0%


    Ethnic group
    Italo-celto-germanic
    Country: Belgium - Brussels



    I am quite pleased with the results. The right liberals lost a few seats but stay ahead as the first party. Geert Wilder's PVV didn't gain nearly as many seats as expected. The big loser is the Labour Party, which lost 29 of its 35 seats. 10 of them went to the Green Party, which jumped from 4 to 14 seats. The centrist party Democrats 66 grabbed 7 more seats to reach 19 in total.
    My book selection---Follow me on Facebook and Twitter --- My profile on Academia.edu and on ResearchGate ----Check Wa-pedia's Japan Guide
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    "What is the use of living, if it be not to strive for noble causes and to make this muddled world a better place for those who will live in it after we are gone?", Winston Churchill.

  5. #5
    Advisor Achievements:
    Three FriendsVeteran50000 Experience Points
    bicicleur's Avatar
    Join Date
    27-01-13
    Location
    Zwevegem, Belgium
    Posts
    5,518
    Points
    53,053
    Level
    71
    Points: 53,053, Level: 71
    Level completed: 34%, Points required for next Level: 997
    Overall activity: 21.0%


    Country: Belgium - Flanders



    still polarisation and provocation by both Wilders, Turkish Erdogan supporters and Islamists in the Netherlands will stay - as elsewhere in Europe
    it's a problem that has been neglected and denied by political correctness for to long
    proactive measures 10 or 15 years ago could have avoided this, but now it is to late

  6. #6
    Advisor Achievements:
    Three FriendsVeteran50000 Experience Points
    bicicleur's Avatar
    Join Date
    27-01-13
    Location
    Zwevegem, Belgium
    Posts
    5,518
    Points
    53,053
    Level
    71
    Points: 53,053, Level: 71
    Level completed: 34%, Points required for next Level: 997
    Overall activity: 21.0%


    Country: Belgium - Flanders



    after Trump effect on Wall Street, today we have Rutten effect on European stock markets
    both are positive

    there is no need for polarisation
    but it is positive that certain things have been said which the political establishment has ignored by a 'reductio ad Hitlerum' for such a long time

  7. #7
    Elite member Achievements:
    Tagger Second ClassThree FriendsVeteran10000 Experience Points

    Join Date
    23-02-15
    Location
    Groningen
    Posts
    715
    Points
    12,160
    Level
    33
    Points: 12,160, Level: 33
    Level completed: 30%, Points required for next Level: 490
    Overall activity: 29.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    E1b1b/ E-V22

    Ethnic group
    North Sea Germanic
    Country: Netherlands



    Quote Originally Posted by Sile View Post
    41 seats rutte to 15 wilders last election is too much to make up

    rutte lost 10 seats and wilders gained only 4 in this election ..................big winner as I was told by my wife's dutch friend is that the "frisian" party gained 16 and is now running second to rutte
    There is only one Frisian party Sile that's the Fryske Nationale Party, this party is only active in the province of....of course Friesland.

    The big winner is the Dutch green-left party, from 4 to 14 (exit poll 16 indeed). Leaded by Jesse Klaver a kind of Trudeau!

  8. #8
    Elite member Achievements:
    Tagger Second ClassThree FriendsVeteran10000 Experience Points

    Join Date
    23-02-15
    Location
    Groningen
    Posts
    715
    Points
    12,160
    Level
    33
    Points: 12,160, Level: 33
    Level completed: 30%, Points required for next Level: 490
    Overall activity: 29.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    E1b1b/ E-V22

    Ethnic group
    North Sea Germanic
    Country: Netherlands



    Quote Originally Posted by Maciamo View Post
    I am quite pleased with the results. The right liberals lost a few seats but stay ahead as the first party. Geert Wilder's PVV didn't gain nearly as many seats as expected. The big loser is the Labour Party, which lost 29 of its 35 seats. 10 of them went to the Green Party, which jumped from 4 to 14 seats. The centrist party Democrats 66 grabbed 7 more seats to reach 19 in total.
    Indeed the biggest thing is, 'Trumpist' Wilders, initially in the lead in every poll, has lost, the upswing of populist right in Europe stopped?
    Lots of comments explain the lost of WIlders partly because of the presidential bonus for Rutte's right liberal party in the the Hague-Ankara affair. And because people were afraid of Trumpist kind of blunt moves when Wilders would be in power.

    But underneath we see a complete transition of the political landscape. The tradition of the big "people party's" like CDU and SPD in Germany, Labour and Conservatives in the UK and the Democrats and Republicans in the US, this tradition is almost lost in the Netherlands. In the earlier days the christ-democrats and social-democrats could score 40 a 50 seats of the 150 seats in parliament. Nowadays we have 13 parties represented! One with about 30 seats. And the rest 20 seats and far below....

    All niches.... Postmodernism?

  9. #9
    Satyavrata Achievements:
    Three FriendsRecommendation First ClassVeteran50000 Experience PointsTagger First Class
    Maciamo's Avatar
    Join Date
    17-07-02
    Location
    Lothier
    Posts
    8,788
    Points
    732,414
    Level
    100
    Points: 732,414, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 53.0%


    Ethnic group
    Italo-celto-germanic
    Country: Belgium - Brussels



    Quote Originally Posted by Northener View Post
    But underneath we see a complete transition of the political landscape. The tradition of the big "people party's" like CDU and SPD in Germany, Labour and Conservatives in the UK and the Democrats and Republicans in the US, this tradition is almost lost in the Netherlands. In the earlier days the christ-democrats and social-democrats could score 40 a 50 seats of the 150 seats in parliament. Nowadays we have 13 parties represented! One with about 30 seats. And the rest 20 seats and far below....
    This tradition of a few big parties has long been lost in the Netherlands. There were already 9 parties with seats a the parliament. Now there are 13. But all the 7 parties who scored at least 5% of the votes already had several seats before, at least for the last 20 years, or since 2006 for Geert Wilders's PVV as this is when it was founded. The PVV scored 24 seats in 2010, 4 more than yesterday, so it cannot be seen as an upsurge of populism either.

  10. #10
    Elite member Achievements:
    Tagger Second ClassThree FriendsVeteran10000 Experience Points

    Join Date
    23-02-15
    Location
    Groningen
    Posts
    715
    Points
    12,160
    Level
    33
    Points: 12,160, Level: 33
    Level completed: 30%, Points required for next Level: 490
    Overall activity: 29.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    E1b1b/ E-V22

    Ethnic group
    North Sea Germanic
    Country: Netherlands



    Quote Originally Posted by Maciamo View Post
    This tradition of a few big parties has long been lost in the Netherlands. There were already 9 parties with seats a the parliament. Now there are 13. But all the 7 parties who scored at least 5% of the votes already had several seats before, at least for the last 20 years, or since 2006 for Geert Wilders's PVV as this is when it was founded.
    No not all true, ok still long in decline, but it was most of the times possible to govern with two or three parties (with a few exceptions). The last one was a two parties coalition. That isn't possible anymore.
    There where only two real "people party's"in the classical way, aimed to be a glue between different social classes : CDA (like the CDU in germany), formed out of the earlier catholic and protestant parties and the PvdA, Dutch Labour.

    The decline of the CDA was the first, during the last election they recovered, but not on to the old "people party" level.
    The last election is dramatic for the second party the PvdA, back to nine seats, 7th party in the Netherlands.

    I guess that nowhere in Norhwestern Europe the decline of the "people party" has been so big....

  11. #11
    Advisor Achievements:
    Three FriendsVeteran50000 Experience Points
    bicicleur's Avatar
    Join Date
    27-01-13
    Location
    Zwevegem, Belgium
    Posts
    5,518
    Points
    53,053
    Level
    71
    Points: 53,053, Level: 71
    Level completed: 34%, Points required for next Level: 997
    Overall activity: 21.0%


    Country: Belgium - Flanders



    Quote Originally Posted by Northener View Post
    No not all true, ok still long in decline, but it was most of the times possible to govern with two or three parties (with a few exceptions). The last one was a two parties coalition. That isn't possible anymore.
    There where only two real "people party's"in the classical way, aimed to be a glue between different social classes : CDA (like the CDU in germany), formed out of the earlier catholic and protestant parties and the PvdA, Dutch Labour.

    The decline of the CDA was the first, during the last election they recovered, but not on to the old "people party" level.
    The last election is dramatic for the second party the PvdA, back to nine seats, 7th party in the Netherlands.

    I guess that nowhere in Norhwestern Europe the decline of the "people party" has been so big....
    still looking for a valid alternative for the traditional politics, both in Europe and US
    it's a negative story
    people know what they don't want any more, but still no valid alternative

  12. #12
    Great Adventurer Achievements:
    Three FriendsTagger Second ClassOverdriveVeteran50000 Experience Points
    Awards:
    Arm of Law
    sparkey's Avatar
    Join Date
    17-02-11
    Location
    California
    Posts
    2,270
    Points
    71,186
    Level
    82
    Points: 71,186, Level: 82
    Level completed: 85%, Points required for next Level: 264
    Overall activity: 0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    I2c1 PF3892+ (Swiss)
    MtDNA haplogroup
    U4a (Cornish)

    Ethnic group
    3/4 Colonial American, 1/8 Cornish, 1/8 Welsh
    Country: USA - California



    Wilders has gone too far right. He was once a viable coalition partner to the VVD party that he once belonged to, but those days are long gone. He's beyond Trump, with proposals to ban the Koran, among other things. I think that the Dutch recognized that, and Rutte captured a lot of the Dutch right by playing the Turkey situation correctly.

    Honestly, the Dutch should be happy with Rutte anyway. The Netherlands have done quite well under his leadership. I can't think of a world leader who is more competent, TBH. And even though his party lost seats, the new likely coalition partners CDA and D66 should be more cooperative than PvdA was.

  13. #13
    Elite member Achievements:
    Tagger Second ClassThree FriendsVeteran10000 Experience Points

    Join Date
    23-02-15
    Location
    Groningen
    Posts
    715
    Points
    12,160
    Level
    33
    Points: 12,160, Level: 33
    Level completed: 30%, Points required for next Level: 490
    Overall activity: 29.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    E1b1b/ E-V22

    Ethnic group
    North Sea Germanic
    Country: Netherlands



    Dutch election fever; breakthrough of Trumpist in Europe?

    Quote Originally Posted by sparkey View Post
    Wilders has gone too far right. He was once a viable coalition partner to the VVD party that he once belonged to, but those days are long gone. He's beyond Trump, with proposals to ban the Koran, among other things. I think that the Dutch recognized that, and Rutte captured a lot of the Dutch right by playing the Turkey situation correctly.

    Honestly, the Dutch should be happy with Rutte anyway. The Netherlands have done quite well under his leadership. I can't think of a world leader who is more competent, TBH. And even though his party lost seats, the new likely coalition partners CDA and D66 should be more cooperative than PvdA was.
    Maybe the voters found the PvdA too much cooperative, many consider the PvdA as the typical 'Third Way' party.....


    Sent from my iPad using Eupedia Forum
    Last edited by Northener; 23-03-17 at 15:24.

  14. #14
    Great Adventurer Achievements:
    Three FriendsTagger Second ClassOverdriveVeteran50000 Experience Points
    Awards:
    Arm of Law
    sparkey's Avatar
    Join Date
    17-02-11
    Location
    California
    Posts
    2,270
    Points
    71,186
    Level
    82
    Points: 71,186, Level: 82
    Level completed: 85%, Points required for next Level: 264
    Overall activity: 0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    I2c1 PF3892+ (Swiss)
    MtDNA haplogroup
    U4a (Cornish)

    Ethnic group
    3/4 Colonial American, 1/8 Cornish, 1/8 Welsh
    Country: USA - California



    Quote Originally Posted by Northener View Post
    Maybe the voters found the PvdA too much cooperative, many consider the PvdA as the a typical 'Third Way' party.....


    Sent from my iPad using Eupedia Forum
    Correct me if my outsider's impression is wrong, but it seems to me that PvdA has a much more leftist constituency than CDA and a slightly more leftist constituency than D66, and the biggest beneficiary from their collapse was GL. So although PvdA were certainly punished by people who normally would vote for them, typical CDA and D66 voters are less likely to punish those parties for cooperating with VVD than typical PvdA voters are to punish PvdA for cooperating with VVD.

  15. #15
    Elite member Achievements:
    Tagger Second ClassThree FriendsVeteran10000 Experience Points

    Join Date
    23-02-15
    Location
    Groningen
    Posts
    715
    Points
    12,160
    Level
    33
    Points: 12,160, Level: 33
    Level completed: 30%, Points required for next Level: 490
    Overall activity: 29.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    E1b1b/ E-V22

    Ethnic group
    North Sea Germanic
    Country: Netherlands



    Quote Originally Posted by sparkey View Post
    Correct me if my outsider's impression is wrong, but it seems to me that PvdA has a much more leftist constituency than CDA and a slightly more leftist constituency than D66, and the biggest beneficiary from their collapse was GL. So although PvdA were certainly punished by people who normally would vote for them, typical CDA and D66 voters are less likely to punish those parties for cooperating with VVD than typical PvdA voters are to punish PvdA for cooperating with VVD.
    From that perspective, indeed I guess so. Your knowledge of Dutch politics is quite good! (Dutch people are, in some way, always surprised by that


    Sent from my iPad using Eupedia Forum

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •