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Thread: Share your 23andMe Ancestry Composition

  1. #251
    Regular Member Sile's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Regio X View Post
    Father


    Mother
    Most people in the north seem to have sicily and calabria in a minor capacity.............maybe its a goth/lombard etc migration from the past
    Is this test only for 500 years or is it longer?
    có che un pòpoło no 'l defende pi ła só łéngua el xe prónto par èser s'ciavo

    when a people no longer dares to defend its language it is ripe for slavery.

  2. #252
    Regular Member Sile's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tutkun Arnaut View Post
    Explain me something! Why Sicily and Calabria known Greeks settlements are low on Balkans? Does this mean that ancient Greeks were not Balkan people?
    And wester Italy where there were Illyrian settlements is higher on Balkan as it should be? Also Island Greeks are equal with Sicily and Calabria with very little Balkan admixture? Does this mean the real Greeks are Island Greeks and mainland Greek in name only?
    it means that sicily and calabria had many different ethnic races from Roman times to present .
    the illyrian settlements are part of your dark balkan along the adriatic coast.
    Island greek and mainland greeks.....there is still an issue here based on the parents of my( and wife friends ) greek island friends
    .
    I will ask my next door Greek neighbour after........he is from samothrace island

  3. #253
    Advisor Angela's Avatar
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    3 members found this post helpful.
    All the academic papers show how close southern Italians, mainland Greeks, and island Greeks are to one another.

    The discrepancy in 23andme is because of where they place their clusters. It's because they have an Italian cluster which is heavily based on Southern Italians and to an extent on central Italians, and then a cluster on the Balkans including mainland Greece. That leaves the island Greeks out in the cold, so the algorithm chooses the "closest" clusters and makes them sort of a mix.

    If they had a cluster based on northern Italy and one based on mainland Greece, but no southern Italian cluster, then southern Italians would come out with a big chunk of Greek, and a chunk of "Italian", or Northern Italian.

    Some companies, like Ancestry, I think, just combine Southern Italy and Greece. I assume that people like Romanians get a chunk of that component?


    The ancestry doesn't change: just the labels.

    You can't think so linearly, people.

    FYI, the Lombards and Goths moved north to south.

    Also fyi, my husband's beta map shows a bit of movement north to south, but although widespread, it's not very significant. Colonia as well? Or perhaps in his case it's northerners going into Napoli. It does a great job of showing that he has mixed Calabrian and Campanian ancestry. The Sicily signal makes sense as well: the province of Reggio Calabria isn't all that different from eastern Sicily.

    He has 12% "West Asian" i.e. Caucasus, and .7% North African and Arabian. It doesn't seem as if much traveled up into the mainland. Also, Balkan shows up: 2.2%.

    I wonder what Sicilians show.



    Non si fa il proprio dovere perchè qualcuno ci dica grazie, lo si fa per principio, per se stessi, per la propria dignità. Oriana Fallaci

  4. #254
    Regular Member Sile's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sile View Post
    my new 23andme v3 ancestry

    ....
    .
    .
    .
    Clicking on my Italian which increased to 36% ( rounding )
    Taking away family members .....2 matches with Trentini ......
    .
    My 14% french -German
    3 matches with Austrians and 2 with Germans ( hmm, no french ) .............2 Austrians have Italian surnames, Cisneros from south-tyrol and Moro from Veneto
    .
    My 3 % Balkan
    matches with 1 each of Croatian, Montenegrin and Romanian ( is Romania really Balkan ?)
    .
    My 3% UK
    all matches just say united kingdom
    .
    1% Sardinia
    zero matches.
    .
    26% NW-Europe
    zero matches.
    .
    15% south Europe
    zero matches
    .
    1% westAsian.
    .
    1% east-Asian
    Last edited by Sile; 24-12-18 at 19:30.

  5. #255
    Thorr vigi Thorbjorn's Avatar
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    I don't think I participated in this thread, if I did please excuse me.

    Italian 70.8%
    Broadly Southern European 10.4%
    Broadly Northwestern European 1.4%
    Broadly European 3.6%
    Western Asian & North African 12.9%
    Western Asian 10.7%
    North African & Arabian 1.1%
    Broadly Western Asian & North African 1.2%

    My four grandparents were from Italy and Sicily. My maternal side was from Maddaloni, Campania, Caserta. My paternal line was from Collesano, Palermo Sicily. mtDNA is HV4a, yDNA is T1a1a.

  6. #256
    Advisor Jovialis's Avatar
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    1 members found this post helpful.

    Here's mine, both sides of my family come from the same two towns in the province of Bari, from as far back as they can remember.

  7. #257
    Regular Member Salento's Avatar
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    2 members found this post helpful.

    Share your 23andMe Ancestry Composition

    Quote Originally Posted by Jovialis View Post

    Here's mine, both sides of my family come from the same two towns in the province of Bari, from as far back as they can remember.
    Compare to AncestryDNA
    Merry Christmas :)










    I know, they didn’t include Salento. lol

  8. #258
    Advisor Jovialis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salento View Post
    Compare to AncestryDNA
    Merry Christmas :)




    I know, they didn’t include Salento. lol
    Thanks Salento, Merry Christmas
    I'm actually waiting for my AncestryDNA results to come in soon. It will be interesting to compare it to my 23andme results.

  9. #259
    Regular Member Lenab's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sile View Post
    Clicking on my Italian which increased to 36% ( rounding )
    Taking away family members .....2 matches with Trentini ......
    .
    My 14% french -German
    3 matches with Austrians and 2 with Germans ( hmm, no french ) .............2 Austrians have Italian surnames, Cisneros from south-tyrol and Moro from Veneto
    .
    My 3 % Balkan
    matches with 1 each of Croatian, Montenegrin and Romanian ( is Romania really Balkan ?)
    .
    My 3% UK
    all matches just say united kingdom
    .
    1% Sardinia
    zero matches.
    .
    26% NW-Europe
    zero matches.
    .
    15% south Europe
    zero matches
    .
    1% westAsian.
    .
    1% east-Asian
    South Romania is ''really Balkan''huge population of Pontids in that region.

  10. #260
    Regular Member Regio X's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sile View Post
    Most people in the north seem to have sicily and calabria in a minor capacity.............maybe its a goth/lombard etc migration from the past
    Is this test only for 500 years or is it longer?
    In theory, about 500 years, I guess. In theory...
    Not sure, but assuming these additional French & German plus NW European %s in Venetians ("additional" compared to most of other Italians) tend to be in fact (Southern) French mostly - rather than Northern French or German -, like my own results suggest, I wonder if it wouldn't be a clue that it has almost nothing to do with the invasions of Lombards, Goths or whatever. And I'm not aware of any big movements from France/Swiss to NE Italy in recent times. Perhaps it's nothing more than shared ancestry with some Central Europeans, notably French and Swiss?

  11. #261
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    1 members found this post helpful.
    I just enter to become a Beta tester to get the same feature as some of you but it doesn't seems to update from the older V5 version? Any clue? And also i'm German from my maternal Grand-Mother but it still doesn't seems to found any ancestry from there while my maternal lineage clearly is from North Europe... They only found me ancestry from Switzerland and " Maybe " from France.

    DNA.png
    Is one of those supposed to represent German ancestry? Taking into account that French & German is supposed to represent some Rhine Celtic/Germanic shared ancestry but my German origins are in Eastern Germany, so should be shifted towards Poles and Slavs no?

  12. #262
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    Attachment 10568

    Attachment 10569


    This is mine. I'm Apulian.

  13. #263
    Moderator Pax Augusta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stuvanè View Post
    This tool is experimental, so I suspect that at present it works with good approximation only for individuals from areas with many samples tested and / or regions whose ethnic composition is extremely homogeneous, and Italy is too complex in this respect, nor tested in a capillary way.
    These tools always depend on the accuracy of the reference samples. The more you divide Italy into regional areas, the more accurate the reference samples must be. Most likely not all regions are sampled in the same way, there may be some regions with many more samples than others.


    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    I think my part Tuscan roots "increase" my "Italian" number. I have a feeling the "centrum" for Italy is around there.

    Italian on 23andme has always peaked more south of Tuscany, around Abruzzo/Molise, but with the V5 there may have been some changes. If your Tuscan roots are from Massa-Carrara Italian there is no significant difference from the neighbouring areas of Liguria and Emilia.

  14. #264
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    Hm, so i finally figure it how to use the Beta version of 23andme, and i have to say i found something very odd. So i'm Swiss from both side but my maternal grand-mother comes from Dresden, Germany and her father had origins in Bern, Switzerland. When i use the Beta version, off 79.5% of French & German, my only results are:

    Highly Likely Match: Switzerland. On the 26 Regions, 2 matchs: Lucerne Strong, Bern a little less strong, wich corroborate my maternal Swiss ancestry.

    Possible Match: France. On 13 Regions, 3 matchs: Grand Est, Bourgogne Franche-Comté, Pays de la Loire. All Strong.

    Problem? I dont have any French ancestry that i'm aware of. My father came from Canton de Vaud in Switzerland, that i dont seems to have match for in the Switzerland Cluster. He had a very French name who could explain a French origin at some point so i dont know.

    Questions: 1) Why is my Eastern Germany ancestry not shown, or is it comprise into the French & Germany without distinctions? [ We did not detect a match for Austria, Belgium, Germany, Luxembourg, or Netherlands. ] 2) Is Canton de Vaud and peripheric French regions like Bourgogne-Franche-Comté genetically indistinguishable?

    DNA.png

    French DNA.jpg

    Switzerland DNA.jpg

    Thanks for the answers if you can help me.

  15. #265
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sile View Post
    my new 23andme v3 ancestry

    ....
    .
    .
    Veneto as first, which are your other Italian regions? According to your map there is also signal of your ancestry in Calabria, Sicily and Sardinia.

  16. #266
    Regular Member Sile's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brick View Post
    Veneto as first, which are your other Italian regions? According to your map there is also signal of your ancestry in Calabria, Sicily and Sardinia.
    Sardinia next, ...............then i have to wait ....until the site gives me access as its updating , again.
    .
    a few hours ago it changed
    also my french-german dropped from 15 to 14 % , but the 2 austrians have shown themselves as coming from Villach and Lienz ( not Linz )
    the other states Austria but comes from Zernez switzerland , must be a border town

  17. #267
    Advisor Angela's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pax Augusta View Post
    These tools always depend on the accuracy of the reference samples. The more you divide Italy into regional areas, the more accurate the reference samples must be. Most likely not all regions are sampled in the same way, there may be some regions with many more samples than others.





    Italian on 23andme has always peaked more south of Tuscany, around Abruzzo/Molise, but with the V5 there may have been some changes. If your Tuscan roots are from Massa-Carrara Italian there is no significant difference from the neighbouring areas of Liguria and Emilia.
    Yes, I think you're right. Although I originally didn't think so, being fooled by "phenotypic" differences, I think both sides of my family are generally the same genetically, or, as you say, there is no huge difference between Massa Carrara, eastern Liguria, and Emilia, despite the mountain ranges bisecting it. That's borne out by the languages, which are variously forms of Emilian and Ligurian, i.e. northern Italian languages.

    I think the reason may be that Cavalli Sforza was right, and the Apennines and Apuan Alps and Ligurian Alps were refuge areas for the Celt-Ligurians, who, of course, had mixed with locals. In fact, I think those "Ligurian" matches are probably from people actually from Massa Carrara and Emilia. That's what the surnames indicate, anyway.

    They must not have very many Ligurian samples, because that should be as dark as Toscana and Emilia-Romagna. I checked my "matches" again, and the "good" ones are eastern Liguria, Emilia, and Massa Carrara, with a few from Lucca and Viareggio. None south or west of that. A few from Piemonte also show up. I would bet that they're probably Ligurian speaking areas.
    Last edited by Angela; 26-12-18 at 18:46.

  18. #268
    Advisor Jovialis's Avatar
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    I've checked my other family members and they get some slightly different results, but generally the same. For example, my sister gets some signals from Veneto, that me, nor my mother and father get.

  19. #269
    Advisor Jovialis's Avatar
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    1 members found this post helpful.
    My 22.5% "Balkan", and 5.5% "West Asian" (Caucasian) do not have any specific regions, which leads me to believe it is very ancient. My closest matches for "Balkan" are in Croatia, and Romania, as well as Greece. I also get 0.6% "broadly west asian and north african". Since the centrum for "Italian" is probably around Tuscany, the 5.5% west asian I get is probably excess from the bronze age anatolian migration, being read by the algorthim as such. If the centrum for Italian on V5 were further south, the Caucasian and much of Balkan would be subsumed.
    Last edited by Jovialis; 26-12-18 at 20:22.

  20. #270
    Regular Member Sile's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lenab View Post
    South Romania is ''really Balkan''huge population of Pontids in that region.
    I presume you mean
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wallachia
    which was its own kingdom in the medieval/renaissance period

  21. #271
    Advisor Jovialis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jovialis View Post
    My 22.5% "Balkan", and 5.5% "West Asian" (Caucasian) do not have any specific regions, which leads me to believe it is very ancient. My closest matches for "Balkan" are in Croatia, and Romania, as well as Greece. I also get 0.6% "broadly west asian and north african". Since the centrum for "Italian" is probably around Tuscany, the 5.5% west asian I get is probably excess from the bronze age anatolian migration, being read by the algorthim as such. If the centrum for Italian on V5 were further south, the Caucasian and much of Balkan would be subsumed.
    I also get 7.0% "Broadly Southern European".

  22. #272
    Regular Member Sile's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sile View Post
    Clicking on my Italian which increased to 36% ( rounding )
    Taking away family members .....2 matches with Trentini ......
    .
    My 14% french -German
    3 matches with Austrians and 2 with Germans ( hmm, no french ) .............2 Austrians have Italian surnames, Cisneros from south-tyrol and Moro from Veneto
    .
    My 3 % Balkan
    matches with 1 each of Croatian, Montenegrin and Romanian ( is Romania really Balkan ?)
    .
    My 3% UK
    all matches just say united kingdom
    .
    1% Sardinia
    zero matches.
    .
    26% NW-Europe
    zero matches.
    .
    15% south Europe
    zero matches
    .
    1% westAsian.
    .
    1% east-Asian
    They said
    NW-Europe is from Ireland to Scandinavia to Switzerland and vienna Austria ...............LOL, what a huge area
    so i should add the 17% of UK and french/german to the 26% NW-Euro .............43%

  23. #273
    Advisor Jovialis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sile View Post
    They said
    NW-Europe is from Ireland to Scandinavia to Switzerland and vienna Austria ...............LOL, what a huge area
    so i should add the 17% of UK and french/german to the 26% NW-Euro .............43%
    You are from Veneto. Goes to show that using modern populations are a terrible means to understand one's ancestry. Had you been adopted, you would have a false understanding of your heritage, if you took their labels as proof of it.
    This is why some people may dismiss consumer genomics as a junk science.

  24. #274
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sile View Post
    My 3 % Balkan
    matches with 1 each of Croatian, Montenegrin and Romanian ( is Romania really Balkan ?)
    Geographically, it's at the crossroads of the Balkans and Eastern Europe. The better term would be Southeastern Europe.
    But genetically, Romanians are closer to Bulgarians and Serbs than the latter are to Croatians, Albanians and Greeks for example, so being included in a cluster with them makes sense.

  25. #275
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    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Salento View Post
    Compare to AncestryDNA
    Merry Christmas :)




    I know, they didn’t include Salento. lol


    I recieved my results from AncestryDNA. Check it out, we both get 79%.

    Edit: when I get a chance, i'll move these to an ancestryDNA results thread. I don't have access to a desktop for the next few days.

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