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Thread: Genetic history of the Indian subcontinent

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    Genetic history of the Indian subcontinent

    From the paper "A genetic chronology for the Indian Subcontinent points to heavily sex-biased dispersals":

    In the last 4 ka, most genetic influx on the maternal line
    was restricted to Pakistan and traces mostly to Iran (H29 + 9156 + 4689, R2a + 7142 and U1a1a2a) (2.4% in
    South Asia, reaching 5.4% in the western populations).
    Gene flow at this time was clearly bi-directional, as seen
    in the expansion west of lineages M5a2a4, U2c1b + 146
    and M3a1b + 13105). This is reflected in the genomewide
    ADMIXTURE analysis (below), where the autochthonous
    South Asian component (green in Fig. 2a) appears
    at low levels in Iran.
    The Yamnaya aDNA samples are scattered around the
    Central Asian and Pakistani groups (Additional file 1:
    Figure S8), confirming the ADMIXTURE results
    (Additional file 1: Figure S6), and suggesting links
    between the Bronze Age Steppe and today’s Central Asia
    and Indian Subcontinent.
    yet Yamnaya, no matter if that was a Copper Age culture.

    A markedly higher proportion of male lineages of
    likely West Eurasian origin, of ~50–90%, is evident
    across the Subcontinent (Fig. 3c), in comparison with
    both the maternal line (Fig. 3b) and the GW pattern
    (Fig. 3d). A sex-biased pattern is also seen in the East
    Asian fraction, but is much less marked, with a much
    lower contribution overall and mainly focused on
    speakers of Tibeto-Burman and Austroasiatic language
    families [22].
    Given the difficulties with deriving the
    European Corded Ware directly from the Yamnaya [96], a
    plausible alternative (yet to be directly tested with genetic
    evidence) is an earlier Steppe origin amongst Copper Age
    Khavlyn, Srednij Stog and Skelya pastoralists, ~7-5.5 ka,
    with an infiltration of southeast European Chalcolithic
    Tripolye communities ~6.4 ka, giving rise to both the
    Corded Ware and Yamnaya when it broke up ~5.4 ka [12].
    There are now sufficient high-quality Y-chromosome
    data available (especially Poznik et al. [58]) to be able to
    draw clear conclusions about the timing and direction of
    dispersal of R1a (Fig. 5). The indigenous South Asian
    subclades are too young to signal Early Neolithic
    dispersals from Iran, and strongly support Bronze Age
    incursions from Central Asia. The derived R1a-Z93 and
    the further derived R1a-Z94 subclades harbour the bulk
    of Central and South Asian R1a lineages [55, 58], as well
    as including some Russian and European lineages, and
    have been variously dated to 5.6 [4.0;7.3] ka [55], 4.5–
    5.3 ka with expansions ~4.0–4.5 ka [58], or 4.7 [4.0;5.5] ka
    (Yfull tree v4.10 [54]). The South Asian R1a-L657, dated
    to ~4.2 ka [3.3;5.1] (Yfull tree v4.10 [54]]), is the largest (in
    the 1KG dataset) of several closely related subclades
    within R1a-Z94 of very similar time depth. Moreover, not
    only has R1a been found in all Sintashta and Sintashtaderived
    Andronovo and Srubnaya remains analysed to
    date at the genome-wide level (nine in total) [76, 77], and
    been previously identified in a majority of Andronovo
    (2/3) and post-Andronovo Iron Age (Tagar and Tachtyk:
    6/6) male samples from southern central Siberia tested
    using microsatellite analysis [101], it has also been identified
    in other remains across Europe and Central Asia ranging
    from the Mesolithic up until the Iron Age (Fig. 5).
    Although they are closely related, suggesting they likely
    spread from a single Central Asian source pool, there
    do seem to be at least three and probably more R1a
    founder clades within the Subcontinent [58], consistent
    with multiple waves of arrival.
    For example, haplogroup H2b (dating to
    6.2 ka [3.8–8.7] ka; Fig. 6) is a starlike subclade with a
    probable ultimate ancestry in Eastern Europe, but includes
    several South Asian lineages (from Pakistan, India and Sri
    Lanka) that probably arrived more recently from Central
    Asia. Tellingly, H2b also includes two aDNA samples
    (Fig. 6): one individual from the small number of Yamnaya
    sampled to date [53, 76] and another from the Late
    Bronze Age Srubnaya culture [77].
    indeed, a
    sizeable fraction of the non-R1a West Eurasian Ychromosome
    lineages (e.g. R2a-M124, J2-M241, L1a-M27,
    L1c-M357) were most likely associated with the spread of
    agriculture or even earlier expansions from Southwest
    Asia, as with the mtDNA lineages [55, 59]. The
    "What I've seen so far after my entire career chasing Indoeuropeans is that our solutions look tissue thin and our problems still look monumental" J.P.Mallory

    "The ultimate homeland of the group [PIE] that also spread Anatolian languages is less clear." D. Reich

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    Again the info is providing a good track about IE origin: no Yamnaya of course (it was R1b-Z2015), but a R1a population from the steppes related to the CW in the Y-DNA and autosomal admixtures (Andronovo, Sintashta). The ultimate Urheimat only can be found in Kievan Russia.


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    Quote Originally Posted by berun View Post
    Again the info is providing a good track about IE origin: no Yamnaya of course (it was R1b-Z2015), but a R1a population from the steppes related to the CW in the Y-DNA and autosomal admixtures (Andronovo, Sintashta). The ultimate Urheimat only can be found in Kievan Russia.

    I think Lazaridis mentioned that models involving populations with EEF admixture are rejected for India. This would mean Europe is out of the picture.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MarkoZ View Post
    I think Lazaridis mentioned that models involving populations with EEF admixture are rejected for India. This would mean Europe is out of the picture.
    Early East Baltic Corded Ware had no EEF admixture.

    Much of Eastern Europe had little to no EEF influence.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tomenable View Post
    Early East Baltic Corded Ware had no EEF admixture.

    Much of Eastern Europe had little to no EEF influence.
    Right, but a migration from Latvia into India without intermediate cultures would be quite difficult to conceive of. Lazaridis thinks Sintashta-Petrovka as a source is falsified.

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    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    I have had the same thinking as Tomenable, but even in the paper they find EEF-like component in Punjabis, Makrits and Brahui (or Baluchi), this region would be the first to be settled coming from the Asian steppes, if the invasion was slow their original admixture of the steppe IE could be diluted enough as to leave thin tracks of it in secondary expansions. Otherwise I'm not much confident about admixture models as the data provided is allways partial.

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    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    PIE is looking more and more like the Steppe-Balkan interface rather than the steppe itself.

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    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tomenable View Post
    Early East Baltic Corded Ware had no EEF admixture.

    Much of Eastern Europe had little to no EEF influence.
    I would consider that early CWC culture sample to be an exception. Very soon after all of CWC has EEF as does the entire steppe by the middle bronze age.

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    Quote Originally Posted by holderlin View Post
    PIE is looking more and more like the Steppe-Balkan interface rather than the steppe itself.
    Well if you think that because of the recent R1b found in the Iron Gates, Iron Gates is in the frontier with the Wallachian Plain, wich is a continuity of the Pontic Steppe, wich is a part of the Eurasian Steppe. R1b definitely sound steppique, technically, all peripheric territories of eurasian steppe, at least up to central asia, can be linked with R1b ( Italie by pontic steppe, wallachian plain, iron gates, pannonian plain, padan plain..., Balkans, Baltic, Caucasus, even Iran ) one way or another.

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    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    you forgot the Baltic and German R1b HG, but well, being a case of steppitis it's all right.

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    Quote Originally Posted by berun View Post
    you forgot the Baltic and German R1b HG, but well, being a case of steppitis it's all right.
    Both Germany and Balt states are peripheric of plain area, southern bug and northern bug, with vistule makes you go on the baltic, and by following the danube you going in germany. Also both are in the great european plain, there is no natural frontier, like mountains, and this rules is more prevalent in last glacial period were mountains were litteraly impassable. So plains and rivers must have been the natural roads for all population want to go in europe, apart of an southern coastal mediterranean road.

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    Ok, if you don't like to take Ibuprofen you might check that German and Latvian Mesolithic HG had an origin in the Magdalenian, far away from the steppes. By the way the plains have not phisical frontiers, but human bands are prone to set invisible frontiers quickly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by berun View Post
    you forgot the Baltic and German R1b HG, but well, being a case of steppitis it's all right.
    Not to mention that Yamnaya R1b-Z2103 seems to have higher basal diversity in the southern Caucasus.

    Imho that would make an origin in the Balkans unlikely.

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    Nobody seems to mention the woods and forests. I can't imagine they were easy to pass through and live in for the farmers and pastoralists. And they were even more dense and widespread in the past than they are now. Must have been much harder to pass through those than it is n modern times specially for large scale migrations.

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    Quote Originally Posted by halfalp View Post
    Both Germany and Balt states are peripheric of plain area, southern bug and northern bug, with vistule makes you go on the baltic, and by following the danube you going in germany. Also both are in the great european plain, there is no natural frontier, like mountains, and this rules is more prevalent in last glacial period were mountains were litteraly impassable. So plains and rivers must have been the natural roads for all population want to go in europe, apart of an southern coastal mediterranean road.
    Magdalenian is totally linked with mt haplogroup U5b and not with R1b.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MarkoZ View Post
    Not to mention that Yamnaya R1b-Z2103 seems to have higher basal diversity in the southern Caucasus.

    Imho that would make an origin in the Balkans unlikely.
    There is no origin of an haplogroup, but association with an archeologic culture, say haplogroup I originate in europe, or R1b in the steppe or armenian highlands, doesn't mean anything. The point is, R1b is a major haplogroups of the european Epigravettian, thats gonna be shows more and more in the future, plus, cultures are never static and demographic even less. One point about transcaucasus, that people not think about it, its that after LGM north and south could have meet together, following the valleys previously impenetrable. So R1b is definitly of the steppe, the point is, that pontic steppe is huge, and R1b people from volga, and hypothetic R1b from south steppe caucasus range or caspian, could have been slightly differents, mixing with transcaucasus people, and have a new genetic flow, lead by women-like input.

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    Quote Originally Posted by halfalp View Post
    There is no origin of an haplogroup, but association with an archeologic culture, say haplogroup I originate in europe, or R1b in the steppe or armenian highlands, doesn't mean anything. The point is, R1b is a major haplogroups of the european Epigravettian, thats gonna be shows more and more in the future, plus, cultures are never static and demographic even less. One point about transcaucasus, that people not think about it, its that after LGM north and south could have meet together, following the valleys previously impenetrable. So R1b is definitly of the steppe, the point is, that pontic steppe is huge, and R1b people from volga, and hypothetic R1b from south steppe caucasus range or caspian, could have been slightly differents, mixing with transcaucasus people, and have a new genetic flow, lead by women-like input.
    I guess what people are interested in are the star-like expansions of L51 and Z2013 respectively. IMHO, both should predate Yamnaya expansion, though it may be too early to tell for sure.

    The origin of L23 at which they separated is even less clear. I think R1b-L23 has a lot of diversity in the region streching from Iraq to Albania so maybe somewhere inbetween?

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    IMO the bulck of CHG in India got there by R2 and J2 herders from the Zagros mountains in the early neolithic, 9 ka
    this CHG component was the first to get there after the native component, which was there allready before LGM
    in spite of what the study claims, I think India was pretty isolated during LGM and even later, till 9 ka

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