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Thread: What do you consider Southeastern Europe

  1. #26
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    For mean Southeast Europe is basically all the Balkans and Carpathians and what lies in the middle. So from Slovenia to Romania and Moldova and south all the way to Greece. I don't included Italy in SE Europe, but geographically it's debatable for South Italy.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maciamo View Post
    For mean Southeast Europe is basically all the Balkans and Carpathians and what lies in the middle. So from Slovenia to Romania and Moldova and south all the way to Greece. I don't included Italy in SE Europe, but geographically it's debatable for South Italy.
    Yes I was trying to figure out why the FTDNA includes Italy in southeastern. I heard it is because all of the DNA from that area to turkey is very closely connected?

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    From Sicily to Istria,
    Istria to Odessa,
    Odessa To Constantinopel,
    Constantinopel to Hallicarnassos,
    Halicarnassos to Sparta,
    Sparta to Sicily.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Balkanite View Post
    From Sicily to Istria,
    Istria to Odessa,
    Odessa To Constantinopel,
    Constantinopel to Hallicarnassos,
    Halicarnassos to Sparta,
    Sparta to Sicily.
    What do you mean?

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    Quote Originally Posted by tahir0010 View Post
    What do you mean?
    If you draw a line from each location to the next, you get an outline of what i would call Southeastern Europe.
    But of course, there is not one correct definition. This is just my thoughts on what SE Europe is.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Balkanite View Post
    If you draw a line from each location to the next, you get an outline of what i would call Southeastern Europe.
    But of course, there is not one correct definition. This is just my thoughts on what SE Europe is.
    Sicily is not SE Europe. Adriatic and Ionian sea are the borders between East and West. Basically, Balcans are considered South East Europe.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LABERIA View Post
    Sicily is not SE Europe. Adriatic and Ionian sea are the borders between East and West. Basically, Balcans are considered South East Europe.
    There is not one true definition. The definitions are political.
    Why call it Europe then? Isn't Europe really just the westernmost extension of Asia?
    We call it Europe because we do not want to put ourselves in the same box as asians. Probably because we have more history and culture in common with each other within Europe, than we have with the asians.
    Also for the same reasons i don't think one can speak of southeastern european identities, histories and cultures without incorporating western anatolians and southern Italians.
    Just because it is part of Italy today, does not mean that it was not within the influential sphere of ancient greek and illyrians.
    And just because Constantinopel is no longer ours, it is still the place where our emperors pushed through the laws which would eventually clear the way for the modern laws we have in Europe today.

    So yea, if Constantinopel, the most important city of SE European history is not SE european, then Europe i also just the westernmost part of asia.

    Geologically speaking, Europe does not exist. But we make up these definitions for political and historical reasons.
    So as Europe does not exist, so doesn't SE Europe. But we invent the terms anyway. And what meanings we put on these invented terms, is something we choose subjectively. There is no controlling instance to tell which definition is the absolute true and omnishading definition of the term.

    But yes, i would agree that your definition is far more widely accepted. But that is because of the misconception that Europe really is a geological continent, and that we therefore must chop it up into further parts, just like we do with other continents.

    And judging by the fact that the word europe is just a historical and cultural construct(and not a geological one), leads me to believe that dividing europe into further parts, should also be consistent with the original method. Beginning to divide a cultural construct up by purely geograpical criteria is inconsistent with the starting method.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LABERIA View Post
    Sicily is not SE Europe. Adriatic and Ionian sea are the borders between East and West. Basically, Balcans are considered South East Europe.
    I would rather rephrase what you said into that the balkans is the core area of SE europe today. While Anatolia and southern Italy are drifting away from the SE european cultural identity sphere. South italians drifting towards germano-celtic shpere. Western anatolians drifting towards turkic sphere.

    The reach of SE european power throughout antiquity has been so great, that the core area at that time streched from Rome to Constantinopel. But i will agree with you that our core is not that big anymore. But the connections between balkans and south italy is still strong both genetically and linguistically. The same is true(to some degree) for western anatolians and balkans.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tahir0010 View Post
    Yes it is the same with Turkish coffee, and Turkish tea people who aren't used to it are say it is so strong. I love tea... Yetos are you Pomak originally or are you Greek 100% you know a lot about them. It is hard to find out about them, and even with Turkish sites there is not a lot.
    Genetically I am a neolithic Farmer
    Caucasian mainly

    for ethnicity as far I know my family is connected with the area I live, Makedonia and always spoke Greek, their own dialect and style.
    I can not certify 2000 years ago,
    one of my grand grandma was Aromani.


    original Pomaks are a closed society,
    yet I had 1 fellow student at University,
    and happened to find him 2 years when I went Alexandroupoli to Samothrake
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  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post
    Genetically I am a neolithic Farmer
    Caucasian mainly

    for ethnicity as far I know my family is connected with the area I live, Makedonia and always spoke Greek, their own dialect and style.
    I can not certify 2000 years ago,
    one of my grand grandma was Aromani.


    original Pomaks are a closed society,
    yet I had 1 fellow student at University,
    and happened to find him 2 years when I went Alexandroupoli to Samothrake
    What would be the DNA of the Pomak from what I am reading they are Bulgarians who accepted Islam... They have so much in common with the laz people, but the laz obviously are from almost the whole other side of the world (not really but Greece, and Georgia are not closely related at all.)

  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by tahir0010 View Post
    What would be the DNA of the Pomak from what I am reading they are Bulgarians who accepted Islam... They have so much in common with the laz people, but the laz obviously are from almost the whole other side of the world (not really but Greece, and Georgia are not closely related at all.)
    No nothing with Laz by what I know until now,
    Pomak language is satem and sounds like Bulgarian by it is not Slavic
    yet you could say that is in a wider Balto-Slavic family,
    their DNA shows clearly endogamy and existance of known Mediterrenean blood geneticks which is rare or non exist in both Slavs or Laz etc
    but common in Mediterrenean population.
    genetists believe they exist there more than 2000 years isolation,
    and possibly connected with ancient Thracians or other nation from around mediteranean,
    At Byzantine and Ottoman times they were connected with Islam that is why they are named Pomaks.
    Pomak is wider name for million around Greece Bulgaria and European Turkey,
    but many of them are not Pomakoi, just other,
    True Pomaks live in Rodope among Greece and Bulgaria, and some moved around Adrianoupolis (Edirne) late century
    their majority lives in W Europe specially Deutschland and Australia

    true Pomaks are not Bulgarians neither Greeks neither Turks,
    they have HBO-Arab so high that can not be connected with Pontos area neither Grussia neither true Bulgarians or Slavs
    only with ancient tribes close to Aegean, were HBO is high,
    to understand genetik say that at least 2000 years exist as tribe and in an Aegean area, or East meditterenean,
    so the most possible is to come from ancient Thracians

    see
    https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms6345
    http://www.he.duth.gr/conference/att.../ABSTRACTS.pdf
    Last edited by Yetos; 17-06-17 at 23:14.

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by tahir0010 View Post
    What would be the DNA of the Pomak from what I am reading they are Bulgarians who accepted Islam... They have so much in common with the laz people, but the laz obviously are from almost the whole other side of the world (not really but Greece, and Georgia are not closely related at all.)
    Based on a small sample their major haplogroups seemd to be I2a1, R1b, I1, E while there's also J2. Today in Greece, many Pomaks have Turkish identity, though.

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