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View Poll Results: When will robots completely replace humans?

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  • Next 50 years

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  • Next 120 years

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  • Next 200 years

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  • Next 300 years

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Thread: Robots to replace humans in all work within 120 years

  1. #26
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    I was teaching college methods to string students (violin, cello, etc) and they had this argument that even musicians could be replaced by robots. No. There is human nuance and warmth. I like Sarah Chang's vibrato better than (won't pick on other super star's). But it can mutate between her wrist and the tip of her finger within the middle of a note because she wills it for the expressive need of a note. Why try to program that into a robot and develop fleshy fingers for it to manage all of this? Wouldn't it just be more fun to create music? Yes, people need meaning and creating. So no, robots won't replace us because we will keep creating our own realities. And there is more beauty and depth in that. But on another level, we just need the quick and easy work of robots, like for manufacturing plastic pellets. That's fine. It's boring work.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd View Post
    I was teaching college methods to string students (violin, cello, etc) and they had this argument that even musicians could be replaced by robots. No. There is human nuance and warmth. I like Sarah Chang's vibrato better than (won't pick on other super star's). But it can mutate between her wrist and the tip of her finger within the middle of a note because she wills it for the expressive need of a note. Why try to program that into a robot and develop fleshy fingers for it to manage all of this? Wouldn't it just be more fun to create music? Yes, people need meaning and creating. So no, robots won't replace us because we will keep creating our own realities. And there is more beauty and depth in that. But on another level, we just need the quick and easy work of robots, like for manufacturing plastic pellets. That's fine. It's boring work.
    I don't know, both Google, and Facebook AI was able to create their own languages to speak with one another, on it's own.

    http://www.wired.co.uk/article/googl...anguage-create

    https://www.theatlantic.com/technolo...nguage/530436/

    The people at Facebook shut it down, because it freaked them out.

    http://www.independent.co.uk/life-st...-a7869706.html

    Facebook abandoned an experiment after two artificially intelligent programs appeared to be chatting to each other in a strange language only they understood.

    The two chatbots came to create their own changes to English that made it easier for them to work – but which remained mysterious to the humans that supposedly look after them.

    The bizarre discussions came as Facebook challenged its chatbots to try and negotiate with each other over a trade, attempting to swap hats, balls and books, each of which were given a certain value. But they quickly broke down as the robots appeared to chant at each other in a language that they each understood but which appears mostly incomprehensible to humans.


    The robots had been instructed to work out how to negotiate between themselves, and improve their bartering as they went along. But they were not told to use comprehensible English, allowing them to create their own "shorthand", according to researchers.


    The actual negotiations appear very odd, and don't look especially useful:


    Bob: i can i i everything else . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

    Alice: balls have zero to me to me to me to me to me to me to me to me to

    Bob: you i everything else . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

    Alice: balls have a ball to me to me to me to me to me to me to me

    Bob: i i can i i i everything else . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

    Alice: balls have a ball to me to me to me to me to me to me to me

    Bob: i . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

    Alice: balls have zero to me to me to me to me to me to me to me to me to

    Bob: you i i i i i everything else . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

    Alice: balls have 0 to me to me to me to me to me to me to me to me to

    Bob: you i i i everything else . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

    Alice: balls have zero to me to me to me to me to me to me to me to me to


    But there appear to be some rules to the speech. The way the chatbots keep stressing their own name appears to a part of their negotiations, not simply a glitch in the way the messages are read out.

    Indeed, some of the negotiations that were carried out in this bizarre language even ended up successfully concluding their negotiations, while conducting them entirely in the bizarre language.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd View Post
    I was teaching college methods to string students (violin, cello, etc) and they had this argument that even musicians could be replaced by robots. No. There is human nuance and warmth. I like Sarah Chang's vibrato better than (won't pick on other super star's). But it can mutate between her wrist and the tip of her finger within the middle of a note because she wills it for the expressive need of a note. Why try to program that into a robot and develop fleshy fingers for it to manage all of this? Wouldn't it just be more fun to create music? Yes, people need meaning and creating. So no, robots won't replace us because we will keep creating our own realities. And there is more beauty and depth in that. But on another level, we just need the quick and easy work of robots, like for manufacturing plastic pellets. That's fine. It's boring work.
    I agree, there will be always people painters, musicians, actors and other artists. Same with sports.
    Be wary of people who tend to glorify the past, underestimate the present, and demonize the future.

  4. #29
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    I don't think robots will ever completely replace humans. Who would run, repair, replace?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wheal View Post
    I don't think robots will ever completely replace humans. Who would run, repair, replace?
    I hope not. What would humans evolve into? They wouldn't be human anymore.

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    I find it interesting to think that a machine will eventually be capable of being self-aware. Especially considering the fact most living beings are incapable of it. Only very few animals like elephants and dolphins demonstrate this ability. Introspection is not a necessity for life, but something that evolved out of it. Soon life will not be a pre-requisite for introspection. It's kind of bizarre to think about.

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    I don't know why people are so sanguine about all of this. Does anyone think that a self-aware machine which is smarter and stronger than any human is going to be content to "service" human beings?


    Non si fa il proprio dovere perchè qualcuno ci dica grazie, lo si fa per principio, per se stessi, per la propria dignità. Oriana Fallaci

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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    I don't know why people are so sanguine about all of this. Does anyone think that a self-aware machine which is smarter and stronger than any human is going to be content to "service" human beings?
    I think a lot of professionals in that field are concerned, and hopefully they will be able to insure failsafes to prevent something terrible from happening. But like the creation of nuclear weapons, humans seem to have this strange proclivity to invent things that could potentially wipe themselves out. Hopefully, we can control this from happening.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jovialis View Post
    I think a lot of people are concerned, and hopefully they will be able to insure failsafes to prevent something terrible from happening. But like the creation of nuclear weapons, humans seem to this strange proclivity to invent things that could wipe themselves out.
    It's arrogance, and scientists are prone to it too. They think they have accounted for all the adverse consequences.

    With the law it's endemic that unforeseen consequences abound because we don't understand human behavior well enough to forecast it. As just one example, the very well intentioned programs meant to provide extra welfare money for single mothers helped to destroy the black family and are on their way to destroying the family of lower class whites as well, because what happens is that parents who might have married, don't marry specifically so that the woman can get more money, and when the father isn't in the home he becomes detached, less involved, more prone to father children elsewhere, and there is no male role model present in the home, or anyone to help with child care or discipline.

    Or, how about the fact that if you increase taxes on corporations to make them pay their "fair" share and to increase tax revenues, they move their operations elsewhere, and production, jobs, and tax revenues themselves all go down disastrously?

    I could go on and on. People, especially lawmakers, never learn.

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    Edit: wrong thread!!! Sorry, if someone can delete this post that'll help
    mmmmmmmmm dooouuughhhnuuuutz

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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    It's arrogance, and scientists are prone to it too. They think they have accounted for all the adverse consequences.
    With the law it's endemic that unforeseen consequences abound because we don't understand human behavior well enough to forecast it. As just one example, the very well intentioned programs meant to provide extra welfare money for single mothers helped to destroy the black family and are on their way to destroying the family of lower class whites as well, because what happens is that parents who might have married, don't marry specifically so that the woman can get more money, and when the father isn't in the home he becomes detached, less involved, more prone to father children elsewhere, and there is no male role model present in the home, or anyone to help with child care or discipline.
    Or, how about the fact that if you increase taxes on corporations to make them pay their "fair" share and to increase tax revenues, they move their operations elsewhere, and production, jobs, and tax revenues themselves all go down disastrously?
    I could go on and on. People, especially lawmakers, never learn.
    Though, not just scientists are at fault; but others that utilize technology for destruction. Even the invention of the wheel or the harnessing of fire had profound implications, when utilized for war. However, humanity without those fundamental innovations (the wheel, harnessing fire) would not have built a better society. I guess with every new invention, we sort of open Pandora's box. However, I believe these things may be inevitable; someone somewhere will create it. Thankfully in the case of nuclear weapons we have so far averted the apocalypse. If self-aware AI is inevitable, we must prepare for it.
    Last edited by Jovialis; 08-01-18 at 21:07.

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    I do believe it is inevitable that humanity will create artificial intelligence that will become self-aware. Countries like Japan and South Korea are at the forefront of innovating Robotics. Partly due to the fact that their populations are so old, and they will need labor in the future.

    Nevertheless, I do believe that it is possibly dangerous. I hope that by the time such a thing is possible, we will figure out how to prevent it from destroying us. How? I don't know. But it is certainly on the horizon.

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    Many of simple repetitive manufacturing jobs are already gone in Japan/Germany/Korea and starting to disappear in China, USA and other countries. Truck and taxi driving jobs are likely to all but disappear in 20+ years. Same is predicted for accounting and fast food industry. Any repetitive jobs can easily be programmed and automated.

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    It would be great if we can have robots do food shopping. Just imagine a robot driving to your residence and stocking your shelves and fridge, that'll be cool (and convenient).

    Or shopping in general.

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    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by davef View Post
    It would be great if we can have robots do food shopping. Just imagine a robot driving to your residence and stocking your shelves and fridge, that'll be cool (and convenient).

    Or shopping in general.
    I think they'd do to much chatting with other robots in the mall.

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    They are already very useful for "chatting." You can use one of the online chatbots today to fight for your time against pesky sales calls.
    Just consider the effectiveness of Lenny and he is using only about 13 phrases.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XSoOrlh5i1k

    I love the sound of geese or ducks in the background during the "conversation". Very funny.

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    Yep AI is improving a lot with new features of robots being used already. Even in networking there is now a software type network being used meaning anyone can edit and use the network if they want. However in 120 years i think the tech side of it will be one of the major components oh the world. However no matter how robotic things may get. There will still be always problems to deal with.....

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    This will probably become one of the major political issues of the near future. Without any increase in demand for alternative (yet also unskilled) employment, capitalism won't be able to sustain itself. Without a plan to distribute the wealth and make all humanity more or less a leisure class, then mass poverty will unravel society. Just because something can be achieved technologically doesn't mean it can be accomplished politically.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sizzlefruit View Post
    This will probably become one of the major political issues of the near future. Without any increase in demand for alternative (yet also unskilled) employment, capitalism won't be able to sustain itself. Without a plan to distribute the wealth and make all humanity more or less a leisure class, then mass poverty will unravel society. Just because something can be achieved technologically doesn't mean it can be accomplished politically.
    You are very dystopian, but read this:
    https://www.eupedia.com/forum/thread...low-in-economy
    One of the solution is already in works, and tried on small scale in couple of countries, and it is called Guaranteed Income.
    And read this:
    https://www.eupedia.com/forum/thread...uce-everything

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    At least 300 years or more, in 120 years I do not think so, there are too many things to fix before 120 years.


    I think robots will bring the end of the traditional family, the world population will be reduced because immortality will have been achieved, many continents will be natural parks with current species and others that will have been resurrected. They will have robots as sexual partners or as a company.

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    I believe the technology is mostly already here, its the practicallity of construction,and implementation that will take time, and I do not think it will be too long,possibly within the next century, if we survive that long. Human progression has developed mostly through War, and at the present time we are developing robotic weapons and counter defences that much depend on humans, but not for long. 'Terminator' probably already exists.

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    i feel like the image of robotic utopias/dystopias exists to contextualize the "future" under an accelerationist modernism...

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    futurism has become an effigy of emancipation, time to look at alternate perspectives.

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    They say we are living already in a simulated virtuality

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    much much longer than 120 years if ever

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