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Thread: EV13 from Central Asia

  1. #51
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    For example Chuvas Turks
    Chuvas Turks's hablogroup are %14 e1b1b1 and very chuvas people are EV13.
    They are not Slavic or Balkanic.
    They are Turkic.
    Chuvas's country is idil-Volga area. That area is before of B.C. Bulgarians and Hungarians old country. Bulgarian, Hungarians, Europe Huns and Scithian are came to Europe, idil-Volga region of migration. Are you know this information ?
    Last edited by EREN48; 15-12-17 at 08:56.

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    Whereas it is not impossible that E-V13 is present in Central Asia in very low quantities since 2000 years or so. It is highly unlikely that Turks are responsible form spreading this gene.

    While at the same time, if someone from Turkey has E-V13, I would bet it's there primarily from the Greeks, since they colonized Anatolia massively in Ancient and Medieval times. Let me put it this way, given Anatolia's history it would be impossible for Anatolia not to have any E-V13. So it would be a delusion to think that Turks were the primary cariers of this gene rather than peoples in the Balkans.

    Also many Albanians converted to Islam and were absorbed into the Ottoman mainframe. Ofcourse, I do not rule out that other Balkan peoples could have brought it there.

    Someone mentioned the idea that Huns thousands of years ago brought E-V13 into Europe, then it was spread by Balkan peoples. So this would actually make modern Turks who have Balkan ancestry ancient Turks. That is a mental delusion.

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    Ok. Please you show me for example, 2000 the year prior to a Greek the grave of a EV13. show me the scientific evidence for these ideas. I am evidence offer to you. You dont show it . i waiting.

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    Quote Originally Posted by EREN48 View Post
    For example Chuvas Turks
    Chuvas Turks's hablogroup are %14 e1b1b1 and very chuvas people are EV13.
    They are not Slavic or Balkanic.
    They are Turkic.
    Chuvas's country is idil-Volga area. That area is before of B.C. Bulgarians and Hungarians old country. Bulgarian, Hungarians, Europe Huns and Scithian are came to Europe, idil-Volga region of migration. Are you know this information ?
    According to the Chuvashia DNA project, the V13 there obviously has a founder effect as their haplotypes are very close to each other. It is already known the subbranch and it is E-BY400, which is under the big branch Z5018->S2979. The Chuvash completely lack either basal V13 branches or great variability of haplotypes to ever presume V13 originated there.

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    2 out of 2 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by EREN48 View Post
    Ok. Please you show me for example, 2000 the year prior to a Greek the grave of a EV13. show me the scientific evidence for these ideas. I am evidence offer to you. You dont show it . i waiting.
    For many reasons, genetic, historical and otherwise the onus is upon you to prove that E-V13 was spread by Turks rather than peoples who hail from the Balkans. You are being ignorant. But we are trying to keep an open mind.

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    Hahahaahah this forum page very funny. Because there have very lier.
    I want proof. you can not show me proof. you call it the Alexander period and the Greek period of instead. Are Alexander's soldiers gone to North America :) you are bullshit. I give you articles. You call it Iskender because of the evidence, you say greek. I am writing you historical facts. You are cursing me. you are real ignorant. Well, you have Alexander. well you have greek civilization. You are attaching everything to them. You are funny peoples :)

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    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by EREN48 View Post
    Hahahaahah this forum page very funny. Because there have very lier.
    I want proof. you can not show me proof. you call it the Alexander period and the Greek period of instead. Are Alexander's soldiers gone to North America :) you are bullshit. I give you articles. You call it Iskender because of the evidence, you say greek. I am writing you historical facts. You are cursing me. you are real ignorant. Well, you have Alexander. well you have greek civilization. You are attaching everything to them. You are funny peoples :)
    This guy deserves a ban.
    People are still being open minded by responding to his and axualonso's nonsense. Yet he has the audacity to use these words...
    Y-DNA: J-L283
    Maternal Y-DNA: E-V13

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    If somebody wants moderation on a thread, speak up and send a PM to one of the moderators.

    I don't read all the posts and threads.

    For everyone's information, no one is banned here for expressing opinions contrary to the consensus, or contrary to the scientific evidence, or contrary to those of the moderators, no matter how stupid they are...

    However, name calling, insults, provocative, disruptive posts etc. result in infractions. When enough infractions accumulate, there is an automatic ban.


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    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by eastara View Post
    According to the Chuvashia DNA project, the V13 there obviously has a founder effect as their haplotypes are very close to each other. It is already known the subbranch and it is E-BY400, which is under the big branch Z5018->S2979. The Chuvash completely lack either basal V13 branches or great variability of haplotypes to ever presume V13 originated there.
    Interesting, as I haven't looked into their E-V13.
    What's also interesting is that J-L283, the other "Balkan" haplogroup, seems to be a classic founder effect in the same Volga region, all of it so far belonging to J-Z631>>Y12000, TMRCA ~1400 years, which is also at the "tail" of J-L283, and Maciamo has mentioned as "evidence" J-L283 expanded from there

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    0 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    You must share older a EV13 sample in Balkan (2000 year ago) then make me believe :)
    But you haven't it and you say always the same tastes.

  11. #61
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    0 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    Actually i want also a scientific paper abot e v13 haplo, do anybody here have any link?

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    http://www.pnas.org/content/suppl/20...#nameddest=SF1


    Table 3.

    Y-haplogroups inferred from Y-STR haplotypes and NRY-SNPs typing results for the male specimens

    Y-STRs
    Y-SNPs
    Name Cavity No. of samples DYS456 DYS389I DYS390 DYS389II DYS458 DYS19 DYS385 DYS393 DYS391 DYS439 DYS635 DYS392 GATA-H4 DYS437 DYS438 DYS448 Y-E1b1b1-M35.1 Y- E1b1b1a1b -V13 Y-G2-M287 Y-G2a-P15 Haplogroups
    Ave01 II 3 15 12 (23) (29) 18 15 (14/14) 13 10 11 (21) 12 16 10 G G T G2a
    Ave02 I 4 15 12 23 18 15 14/14 13 10 11 21 (11) 12 16 10 22 G G T G2a
    Ave03 III 3 15 12 23 29 18 15 14/14 13 10 11 21 11 12 16 10 (22) G G T G2a
    Ave05 I 1 15 12 (23) 29 (18) (15) (14/14) 13 (10) 11 12 16 22 G T G2a
    Ave06 II 1 15 12 18 (15) 13 (10) (11) 12 (16) G G2a 99.6%
    Ave07 II 1 16 13 24 (31) 16 13 16/19 13 (10) 11 22 11 10 (14) 10 20 C A C E1b1b1a1b

    Dashes denote that alleles could not be clearly amplified for the locus in question. Consensus Y-STR profiles were built after two amplifications from each DNA extract. Alleles in parentheses were observed just once. For the sample for which the Y haplogroup could not be confirmed by the typing of SNP, the determination of the haplogroup was obtained solely from the haplotype. The percentage of probability is shown in the last column. SNPs in bold are variants at concerned positions.



    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3215063/





    also

    Abstract

    Detailed population data were obtained on the distribution of novel biallelic markers that finely dissect the human Y-chromosome haplogroup E-M78. Among 6,501 Y chromosomes sampled in 81 human populations worldwide, we found 517 E-M78 chromosomes and assigned them to 10 subhaplogroups. Eleven microsatellite loci were used to further evaluate subhaplogroup internal diversification. The geographic and quantitative analyses of haplogroup and microsatellite diversity is strongly suggestive of a northeastern African origin of E-M78, with a corridor for bidirectional migrations between northeastern and eastern Africa (at least 2 episodes between 23.9-17.3 ky and 18.0-5.9 ky ago), trans-Mediterranean migrations directly from northern Africa to Europe (mainly in the last 13.0 ky), and flow from northeastern Africa to western Asia between 20.0 and 6.8 ky ago. A single clade within E-M78 (E-V13) highlights a range expansion in the Bronze Age of southeastern Europe, which is also detected by haplogroup J-M12. Phylogeography pattern of molecular radiation and coalescence estimates for both haplogroups are similar and reveal that the genetic landscape of this region is, to a large extent, the consequence of a recent population growth in situ rather than the result of a mere flow of western Asian migrants in the early Neolithic. Our results not only provide a refinement of previous evolutionary hypotheses but also well-defined time frames for past human movements both in northern/eastern Africa and western Eurasia.

    from
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17351267




    Any new genetic papper
    signed by a genetist is always welcomed,

    early theories are made to collapse by new theories
    until the theory can not be collapsed and become a law

    M-78 HAS AND HAS NOT V-13


    AS FOR ALEXANDER THE GREAT

    Firasat has found imported E-M78 in Wider Afganistan Pakistan etc
    but not V-13

    so Yes Alexander spread Balkanic genes in Asia
    AND IS RECOGNED IN MANY TRIBES BUT IN SMALL % to be considered AS A HIGH OR A SERIOUS CONTRIBUTION


    ΟΘΕΝ ΑΙΔΩΣ OY EINAI
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    Hybris (abuse, opprombium) is born
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    Quote Originally Posted by eastara View Post
    According to the Chuvashia DNA project, the V13 there obviously has a founder effect as their haplotypes are very close to each other. It is already known the subbranch and it is E-BY400, which is under the big branch Z5018->S2979. The Chuvash completely lack either basal V13 branches or great variability of haplotypes to ever presume V13 originated there.
    Eastara, I don't immediatly find a BY400 marker, can you check which group they are exactly?

  14. #64
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    Could you please tell me if you know the subgroup of Kazakhs?

  15. #65
    axualonso
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    I know two guys from Albania, one of them is J2 and the other one is E-V13. E-V13 one has %3 ancestral altaic aytosomal and %2 east asian autosomal but J2 one has zero for these two. How can we explain this stuation, E-V13 one has a Turk ancestry in his history am i right?

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    Quote Originally Posted by rafc View Post
    Eastara, I don't immediatly find a BY400 marker, can you check which group they are exactly?
    Sorry, i mistyped it, look for BY5400 on the FTDNA tree.

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    0 out of 2 members found this post helpful.
    Hey guys. You will read it. Because you told is tale. I am bored of you. you ignorant. You must learn history after you will think and write.
    Read it then learn.

    Bulgars:
    http://www.wikizero.org/index.php?q=...lraS9CdWxnYXJz

    Scythians
    http://www.wikizero.org/index.php?q=...25pYW5fQXZhcnM

    Atilla of Huns
    http://www.wikizero.org/index.php?q=...bGFfdGhlX0h1bg

    Pannonian Avars
    http://www.wikizero.org/index.php?q=...S9TY3l0aGlhbnM

    EV 13 is Turkic hablogroup.
    Please dont write tale.

    Your origin is not Alexander...
    Your origins Turk :)
    You are our children :)

    Dont forget !
    Balkan or Balcan is Turkish word :)

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    1 out of 2 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by EREN48 View Post
    Hey guys. You will read it. Because you told is tale. I am bored of you. you ignorant. You must learn history after you will think and write.
    Read it then learn.

    Bulgars:
    http://www.wikizero.org/index.php?q=...lraS9CdWxnYXJz

    Scythians
    http://www.wikizero.org/index.php?q=...25pYW5fQXZhcnM

    Atilla of Huns
    http://www.wikizero.org/index.php?q=...bGFfdGhlX0h1bg

    Pannonian Avars
    http://www.wikizero.org/index.php?q=...S9TY3l0aGlhbnM

    EV 13 is Turkic hablogroup.
    Please dont write tale.

    Your origin is not Alexander...
    Your origins Turk :)
    You are our children :)

    Dont forget !
    Balkan or Balcan is Turkish word :)
    Didn't you come across the Catalonian E sample of 5,000 BC yet? He's related to the E-V13 from Albania, Bosnia, Greece, etc. So yeah, you are one of "our chidren", unwanted one though.

    Besides that, we are not and don't want to be related to you, don't look like you, and we consider it a tragedy the fact that millions of Albanians either settled there early or were expelled by the Greeks and Serbs to Turkey. Our country lost so many good people as one of our nation's father said that "The best among us were unfairly resettled in Turkey" as the Turks aimed to take specifically Albanians from the mountainous regions to use them as soldiers.

    Trying not to be offensive (or at least directly), kindly note that according to the Albanian perception of ideal beauty you are very very unattractive and it's kind of a curse for anyone to look like you. Again, this is not an insult, it's simply a matter of taste and reality.

    So please stop and bring your ideas of being our fathers elsewhere before you make us puke. Even your best looking celebrities are mostly Albanians or from the Balkans, or Circassians, filling your TV series full of actors with European features as if you're fooling anyone.

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    There are hardly any E's in the Turkic ftdna project,
    https://www.familytreedna.com/public...ction=yresults
    let alone E-V13. I know its a small sample but if E-V13 is so evident as its being claimed I am sure one would get more then this.

    This is different to the balkan samples who although also have a tiny sample its already indicative as to what the dna says about geographical distributions.https://www.familytreedna.com/public...frame=yresults

    As things stand when one amalgamates it into history the strong indications are that E-V13 radiates from Balkans to Asia (also attributed to the very low percentages found in North Africa) mainly through Greek colonization (well known and documented part of history). The oldest EV-13 sample found so far is in northern Spain (7000ybp), however that does not mean it originated there.

  20. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zanatis View Post
    Didn't you come across the Catalonian E sample of 5,000 BC yet? He's related to the E-V13 from Albania, Bosnia, Greece, etc. So yeah, you are one of "our chidren", unwanted one though.

    Besides that, we are not and don't want to be related to you, don't look like you, and we consider it a tragedy the fact that millions of Albanians either settled there early or were expelled by the Greeks and Serbs to Turkey. Our country lost so many good people as one of our nation's father said that "The best among us were unfairly resettled in Turkey" as the Turks aimed to take specifically Albanians from the mountainous regions to use them as soldiers.

    Trying not to be offensive (or at least directly), kindly note that according to the Albanian perception of ideal beauty you are very very unattractive and it's kind of a curse for anyone to look like you. Again, this is not an insult, it's simply a matter of taste and reality.

    So please stop and bring your ideas of being our fathers elsewhere before you make us puke. Even your best looking celebrities are mostly Albanians or from the Balkans, or Circassians, filling your TV series full of actors with European features as if you're fooling anyone.
    hey hey hey dont be racist dear albanian brother. many turkish people also stayed there because of serbs, greeks and also albanians. during ottoman periods albania was the strongest and most developed country in Europe. Other europeans was discussing if the world is smooth or spherical but Albanians was dealing with technological developments of Ottoman army. Albanians was the commanders of all balkans. One albanian prof said that if you were still in Ottoman Imperia, most probably Albania was powerful than Germany. Yes you are one of the most beatiful and handsome country in the world. All Turks know this and proud of Albanian beauty in Turkey. But history is history. Now we are two different country and we have good relationship. I guess Eren is wrote such kind of a thing because somebody wrote similar thing before. Anyway, you wrote like swaring to Turks but i still answering you with 'jeton shqiptari!'

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    Quote Originally Posted by axualonso View Post
    hey hey hey dont be racist dear albanian brother. many turkish people also stayed there because of serbs, greeks and also albanians. during ottoman periods albania was the strongest and most developed country in Europe. Other europeans was discussing if the world is smooth or spherical but Albanians was dealing with technological developments of Ottoman army. Albanians was the commanders of all balkans. One albanian prof said that if you were still in Ottoman Imperia, most probably Albania was powerful than Germany. Yes you are one of the most beatiful and handsome country in the world. All Turks know this and proud of Albanian beauty in Turkey. But history is history. Now we are two different country and we have good relationship. I guess Eren is wrote such kind of a thing because somebody wrote similar thing before. Anyway, you wrote like swaring to Turks but i still answering you with 'jeton shqiptari!'
    I'm going to warn you once and once only. If you continue to try to disrupt and provoke other posters you're going to get banned like your buddy. Are we clear?

  22. #72
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    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    I'm going to warn you once and once only. If you continue to try to disrupt and provoke other posters you're going to get banned like your buddy. Are we clear?
    Could you please tell me where is the provacation in my post? Dont be ridiculous man! Ok go ahead ban me asap.

  23. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by axualonso View Post
    Could you please tell me where is the provacation in my post? Dont be ridiculous man! Ok go ahead ban me asap.
    Sorry i wrote man. Correct sentence is Dont be ridiculous sister...

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    2 out of 2 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by axualonso View Post
    hey hey hey dont be racist dear albanian brother. many turkish people also stayed there because of serbs, greeks and also albanians. during ottoman periods albania was the strongest and most developed country in Europe. Other europeans was discussing if the world is smooth or spherical but Albanians was dealing with technological developments of Ottoman army. Albanians was the commanders of all balkans. One albanian prof said that if you were still in Ottoman Imperia, most probably Albania was powerful than Germany. Yes you are one of the most beatiful and handsome country in the world. All Turks know this and proud of Albanian beauty in Turkey. But history is history. Now we are two different country and we have good relationship. I guess Eren is wrote such kind of a thing because somebody wrote similar thing before. Anyway, you wrote like swaring to Turks but i still answering you with 'jeton shqiptari!'
    I appreciate your kind words and the fact that you're trying to be polite. But let's get back to the things you wrote.

    Albania was the most developed country of Europe? Sorry to disappoint you and your school books, but Albania was the shythole of Europe. Most of our population massacred and what remained either fled to Italy and Greece (mostly women and children as you managed to kill our men), while the rest of us who survived went up in the mountains and lived like savages for 500 bloody years.

    We were once doing great for the European standards and that was mostly when we were under the influence of Venice, but the Ottomans burned to the ground all we had, cities, ports, churches. We could have had historical cities like Split and Kotor with Venice style buildings, but all was gone. All we have now is some Ottoman style underdeveloped towns that looked like shyt.

    The Ottomans needed our ancestors as soldiers and did their best to keep us wild and uncivilized, on top of strategically forcing conversion. They could have done the same with Bulgarians and Greeks for instance, but no, they kept them Christian to collect more tax from them and to work as farmers, merchants, etc., while our ancestors were getting paid to do your dirty work by conquering others.

    Every invader did that to us, like the best troops in the Roman Empire came from Illyricum, then the Byzantines (Albanians were given a type of autonomy with reduced taxes), then Venice, Naples, Spain, Holy Roman Empire, England, and France used the Albanian Stratioti as mercenaries, but that was nothing like what the Ottomans did.

    They crippled our nation and we're still suffering the consequences of that backward shytty Empire that exploited us like no other.

    You try to "buy" us with kind words like Albanians commanding the Balkans but we didn't command shyt. Greeks, Serbs, Bulgarians, all were allowed to keep their religion, you respected their clergy and the Sultan gave them a place in his Divan as his council, while our ancestors were simple soldiers, Janissaries, and sometimes commanders. But screw that as those were personal achievements and not favours from the mighty Ottoman Empire as they were used against Albanians for 500 years. We didn't fight and killed Turks, we fought and killed each other and other fellow Balkanites recruited by the Ottomans.

    That Albanian prof that said we would be more powerful than Germany is a big retarded joke who should leave Albania if he really exists and join your nation asap. How come Turkey isn't more powerful than Germany then?

    And cut the crap with the beautiful race thing. We aren't anything special and above the other Balkanites or Mediterraneans. We're all equally beautiful and human, all of us, Serbs, Greeks, Bosnians, Croatians, Bulgarians, Romanians, and the Ottoman Empire was an intruder than screwed things up in the ways that even the nasty Roman Empire would be impressed, reducing us to a bunch of backward savages that Europe still looks down on us. Our heritage in the Balkans is whatever building survived and the delicious cevapi/kebapi. So tourists come, enjoy the nature, take a few snaps of either ancient abandoned cities and eat some oriental dishes mostly and leave. No sightseeing in that part of the world.

    And 'jeton shqiptari' means the Albanian lives, which is a lie. The Albanian barely survived and we'll need a few more generations to recover from that 500 years of hell.

    So don't call us brothers and sweeten the deal with those lovely words. Human to human we can all be brothers, politically, the exact opposite. We ain't politicians who pretend all is good for the sake of trade of common interest.

    And the only sentence I got to stay on topic is that E-V13 didn't come with Turks

  25. #75
    axualonso
    Guest


    Quote Originally Posted by Zanatis View Post
    I appreciate your kind words and the fact that you're trying to be polite. But let's get back to the things you wrote.

    Albania was the most developed country of Europe? Sorry to disappoint you and your school books, but Albania was the shythole of Europe. Most of our population massacred and what remained either fled to Italy and Greece (mostly women and children as you managed to kill our men), while the rest of us who survived went up in the mountains and lived like savages for 500 bloody years.

    We were once doing great for the European standards and that was mostly when we were under the influence of Venice, but the Ottomans burned to the ground all we had, cities, ports, churches. We could have had historical cities like Split and Kotor with Venice style buildings, but all was gone. All we have now is some Ottoman style underdeveloped towns that looked like shyt.

    The Ottomans needed our ancestors as soldiers and did their best to keep us wild and uncivilized, on top of strategically forcing conversion. They could have done the same with Bulgarians and Greeks for instance, but no, they kept them Christian to collect more tax from them and to work as farmers, merchants, etc., while our ancestors were getting paid to do your dirty work by conquering others.

    Every invader did that to us, like the best troops in the Roman Empire came from Illyricum, then the Byzantines (Albanians were given a type of autonomy with reduced taxes), then Venice, Naples, Spain, Holy Roman Empire, England, and France used the Albanian Stratioti as mercenaries, but that was nothing like what the Ottomans did.

    They crippled our nation and we're still suffering the consequences of that backward shytty Empire that exploited us like no other.

    You try to "buy" us with kind words like Albanians commanding the Balkans but we didn't command shyt. Greeks, Serbs, Bulgarians, all were allowed to keep their religion, you respected their clergy and the Sultan gave them a place in his Divan as his council, while our ancestors were simple soldiers, Janissaries, and sometimes commanders. But screw that as those were personal achievements and not favours from the mighty Ottoman Empire as they were used against Albanians for 500 years. We didn't fight and killed Turks, we fought and killed each other and other fellow Balkanites recruited by the Ottomans.

    That Albanian prof that said we would be more powerful than Germany is a big retarded joke who should leave Albania if he really exists and join your nation asap. How come Turkey isn't more powerful than Germany then?

    And cut the crap with the beautiful race thing. We aren't anything special and above the other Balkanites or Mediterraneans. We're all equally beautiful and human, all of us, Serbs, Greeks, Bosnians, Croatians, Bulgarians, Romanians, and the Ottoman Empire was an intruder than screwed things up in the ways that even the nasty Roman Empire would be impressed, reducing us to a bunch of backward savages that Europe still looks down on us. Our heritage in the Balkans is whatever building survived and the delicious cevapi/kebapi. So tourists come, enjoy the nature, take a few snaps of either ancient abandoned cities and eat some oriental dishes mostly and leave. No sightseeing in that part of the world.

    And 'jeton shqiptari' means the Albanian lives, which is a lie. The Albanian barely survived and we'll need a few more generations to recover from that 500 years of hell.

    So don't call us brothers and sweeten the deal with those lovely words. Human to human we can all be brothers, politically, the exact opposite. We ain't politicians who pretend all is good for the sake of trade of common interest.

    And the only sentence I got to stay on topic is that E-V13 didn't come with Turks
    Çok eziksin. Bu kadar ezik olma! Sen arnavut değilsin olamazsın. Benim yazdıklarımda senin için değil diğer milyonlarca benim kardeşim arnavutların. Türkçe yazdım sana cevap çünkü dedene nenene sor onlar bu dili biliyor bi zahmet sana ne yazdığımı anlatırlar. Kılıç artığısın Zanatis kılıç artığı. Senin soyunu kurutmamış osmanlı askeri şu an üzüldü bu yazdıkların yüzünden. Hayde maşallah dedene nenene...

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