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Thread: New regions at 23andme?

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    1 members found this post helpful.
    They need to update there website and data based on the infomation within there database since the "dots" are not fully accurate as a IT guy I bet there database is a bit unorganised or maybe they don't understand SQL. When my test pops up i will show mine here (since they updated it I should get high Iberian admixture but with some italo-celt possbily)

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    New regions at 23andme?

    AdeoF, it seems that the query prioritize DNA Matches, and not Ancestry %.
    Last edited by Salento; 05-04-18 at 07:10.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdeoF View Post
    They need to update there website and data based on the infomation within there database since the "dots" are not fully accurate as a IT guy I bet there database is a bit unorganised or maybe they don't understand SQL. When my test pops up i will show mine here (since they updated it I should get high Iberian admixture but with some italo-celt possbily)
    Up vote from me bc u said a developers developers developers developers developers term!

    SELECT *
    FROM members
    WHERE knows_SQL
    ORDER BY awesomeness DESC

    Anyway i personally think it's likely that these issues have less to do with the database design than the code itself (bad databases allow for things like anomalies with writing, deletion etc). I would expect all the mathy algorithmically stuff to be written in something like python, and that code should handle anything that wouldn't look right to the user.

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    Me too only a black dot in my main italian component PSX_20180405_081015.jpg

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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    We haven't seen Sile's screenshot with five dots for Italian.
    If he does have them, it's because he got a lot of his relatives tested at 23andme.
    There is more diversity between any two Italians than between whole regions in Europe.
    Read Ralph and Coop.

    italian matches of note
    Zanatta - 0.37% from Ponzano Veneto -treviso province
    Folger - 0.28% from Musano - treviso province
    Miotto - 0.27% from falze - treviso province
    Bison - 0.24% from trentino province
    Negrin - 0.23% from spresiano - treviso province
    Martin - 0.22% from Loria - treviso province
    Del Ben - 0.21% from liedolo - treviso province
    Biasion - 0.21%
    Pellizzer - 0.28%
    Sibillin - 0.27% from Asolo - treviso province
    Hintz - 0.22% from Piobino Dese - Padau province ...married a relative from Morgano Veneto circa 1900
    Bet - 0.27% from Trentino Province
    Toigo - 0.26 % from Fanzaso - trentino province
    Pivetta - 0.21 % from one` - treviso province
    Bolzan - 0.20% from fonte Alto - treviso province ...married into my maternal line circa 1780
    and many more

    red surnames are relatives via registry records
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salento View Post
    If you get 30.8 Italian and I get 58.6, than the “dots” results are completely “Out of Whack” lol :)
    LOL.....i agree with the rubbish that 23andme present

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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    I only have about 600, and my closest is a group of matches who are supposedly 4th cousins. Some of them, weirdly, are Danish and some are "colonial" Americans, primarily British descent. The Italian ones all come from my area,but not related genealogically. I don't have any matches from south of Rome, and a huge majority of the samples at 23andme are from Southern Italy/Sicily. We're just very heterogeneous.
    Italy has also sent a good bunch of genes abroad during the roman empire and to america in the 1900's. So theres also a chance that many of the people that you share dna with has not declared themselves as Italian on 23andme(due to not knowing they have italian/roman ancestry), and that it is skewing the results by putting those matches in some "broadly southern european" or "broadly european" category(and those categories don't have dots at all).
    But yes heterogeneity among italians can probably also make you less matchable between each other.

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    Are you sure about that? I dont see how Italian Americans would refuse to declare themselves as Italian on 23andme and I also don't see how they would be unaware of their heritage, especially since Italians are relatively new to this nation :).

    Same concept applies to other "newcomers" like Jewish Americans, Greek Americans, Polish Americans, etc.

    Just my 2 cents

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    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stuvanè View Post
    Me too only a black dot in my main italian component PSX_20180405_081015.jpg

    Inviato dal mio SM-J730F utilizzando Tapatalk
    Is the rest generally Southern European?

    Also, is this the lowest probability setting?

    If so, there must not be very many people from the Romagna in the data base.


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    I get 3 stars for Italian, like my mother, while my father gets 2. No stars for all others.
    I get 1037 DNA relatives; mother, 1052; father, 1088.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    Is the rest generally Southern European?

    Also, is this the lowest probability setting?

    If so, there must not be very many people from the Romagna in the data base.
    Yes, Angela. This the speculative setting. "Broadly" southern, northwestern components everywherePSX_20180405_162122.jpg

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sile View Post
    LOL.....i agree with the rubbish that 23andme present
    After looking at more samples I feel the dot system should not have been used until they had a more complete database. It doesn’t make sense for a person to only get one dot for Italy when they score 70% Italian while another person gets 3 dots for Switzerland while only scoring 7% French and German.

    In regards to my own sample and my own paper trail which is Wallonia Belgium and French Canadian I only received two dots for Belgium which matches part of my paper trail. In my opinion my British Isles, Iberian, Sardinian, and Italian percentages should be assigned to “Broadly” categories because they don’t match my paper trail at all, I received zero dots for them, and any type of influence is thousands of years old with the Romans or Iron Age and not really relevant to genealogy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mwauthy View Post
    After looking at more samples I feel the dot system should not have been used until they had a more complete database. It doesn’t make sense for a person to only get one dot for Italy when they score 70% Italian while another person gets 3 dots for Switzerland while only scoring 7% French and German.

    In regards to my own sample and my own paper trail which is Wallonia Belgium and French Canadian I only received two dots for Belgium which matches part of my paper trail. In my opinion my British Isles, Iberian, Sardinian, and Italian percentages should be assigned to “Broadly” categories because they don’t match my paper trail at all, I received zero dots for them, and any type of influence is thousands of years old with the Romans or Iron Age and not really relevant to genealogy.
    I agree, someone who's British should score high dots in the British and Irish category, a result that doesn't oppose common sense expectations

    Anyway, jovialis, do you mind sharing your dot scores with us? I find Salento's Balkan scores intriguing and wondering if you score similarly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by davef View Post
    Are you sure about that? I dont see how Italian Americans would refuse to declare themselves as Italian on 23andme and I also don't see how they would be unaware of their heritage, especially since Italians are relatively new to this nation :).

    Same concept applies to other "newcomers" like Jewish Americans, Greek Americans, Polish Americans, etc.

    Just my 2 cents
    I think most declare themselves as having Italian heritage..
    But there are also a lot of peolple who don't know that they have it.
    Say, if their heritage has been mostly german or irish on the paternal side, but with some of them marrying Italian descent women in america. With time such heritage would be forgotten, althought the genetic traces will still be there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stuvanè View Post
    Yes, Angela. This the speculative setting. "Broadly" southern, northwestern components everywherePSX_20180405_162122.jpg

    Inviato dal mio SM-J730F utilizzando Tapatalk
    About 25-27% "Northern" European seems to be consistent for samples at approximately our latitude, but to the east there's Balkan, and to the west little or none, its place being taken by Iberian.

    Adding in that broadly "Southern European" brings you to about 70%, which is close to my 72%.

    As I said, not many people from the Romagna in the data base, whereas there is the large Tuscan contingent from around Firenze, some of whose IBS alleles I undoubtedly share, so they can label them.

    The problem with all this is that while we understand it, most people buying the analysis don't.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    As I said, not many people from the Romagna in the data base, whereas there is the large Tuscan contingent from around Firenze, some of whose IBS alleles I undoubtedly share, so they can label them.

    The problem with all this is that while we understand it, most people buying the analysis don't.
    In hindsight you are correct. When initially announced I thought the dots had the potential to further refine and further specify the initial large regions into more accurate countries of origin. So if someone scored 50% “French and German” they could see if that 50% was more French or even Swiss. I see now that this is not the case and it’s a bit disappointing. The dots are just another version of dna relatives and are completely dependent on a biased customer database. Pretty pointless in my opinion.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ernekar View Post
    I think most declare themselves as having Italian heritage..
    But there are also a lot of peolple who don't know that they have it.
    Say, if their heritage has been mostly german or irish on the paternal side, but with some of them marrying Italian descent women in america. With time such heritage would be forgotten, althought the genetic traces will still be there.
    The bulk of Italian immigration to the U.S. was from 1890-1920, so most people are aware of it. For someone who is 60, that could be a grandparent, and they would probably pass down the information. Some vague story might be all they know, however. Italian-Americans as a group have, on average, a higher rate of identification with a European nation than some other "ethnicities", even if they are only 1/4 Italian. After that it dies away.

    So, it can happen, but it's not very common. Something odd like an adoption or a non-parental event would probably need to have taken place.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mwauthy View Post
    After looking at more samples I feel the dot system should not have been used until they had a more complete database. It doesn’t make sense for a person to only get one dot for Italy when they score 70% Italian while another person gets 3 dots for Switzerland while only scoring 7% French and German.
    In regards to my own sample and my own paper trail which is Wallonia Belgium and French Canadian I only received two dots for Belgium which matches part of my paper trail. In my opinion my British Isles, Iberian, Sardinian, and Italian percentages should be assigned to “Broadly” categories because they don’t match my paper trail at all, I received zero dots for them, and any type of influence is thousands of years old with the Romans or Iron Age and not really relevant to genealogy.
    i believe the dot system represents a family and close relatives lack of migration to other countries within a small time frame...maybe 400 years with a combination of DNA relatives and where they state their origins ( again in a small time frame ) via grandparents and maybe also great grandparents
    .
    example..........I have close relatives who migrated to SW france pre WW1 and I still chat with the descendents today...........yet I get no french dot ..........2 appear in my recent surname post on this thread

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    New regions at 23andme?

    Deleted ———-
    Last edited by Salento; 06-04-18 at 03:02.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Salento View Post
    Result of a mix Italian American with South Puglia Ancestry.
    (Got his Permission) Thank you.

    Attachment 9967
    Attachment 9968
    Wow! Surprised someone got a dot with only 3.5%.

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    New regions at 23andme?

    Quote Originally Posted by mwauthy View Post
    Wow! Surprised someone got a dot with only 3.5%.
    He’s a mix Italian American, I’m sure he’s got tons of DNA Relatives.
    Last edited by Salento; 06-04-18 at 01:19. Reason: Spelling

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    Quote Originally Posted by Salento View Post
    He’s a mix Italian America, I’m sure he’s got tons of DNA Relatives.
    Looks like it mate but the person has only two dots, I think he needs more. Since he is a mix I was thinking of his Germanic admixture would be higher but oddly no

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    Quote Originally Posted by davef View Post
    Up vote from me bc u said a developers developers developers developers developers term!

    SELECT *
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    ORDER BY awesomeness DESC

    Anyway i personally think it's likely that these issues have less to do with the database design than the code itself (bad databases allow for things like anomalies with writing, deletion etc). I would expect all the mathy algorithmically stuff to be written in something like python, and that code should handle anything that wouldn't look right to the user
    You know it mate, in uni since I'm doing management as one of my modules. Human errors account around 30% to 60% of technological stuff at work. Maybe there database is one of them

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    Quote Originally Posted by AdeoF View Post
    Looks like it mate but the person has only two dots, I think he needs more. Since he is a mix I was thinking of his Germanic admixture would be higher but oddly no
    I guess so. I’ll delete it the Pic later, can’t prove anything after all because is half S.Pugliese.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Salento View Post
    I guess so. I’ll delete it the Pic later, can’t prove anything after all because is half S.Pugliese.

    Do you have Albania and Macedonia In the section "Ancestors birthplaces" ?

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