Scientists discover genomic ancestry of Stone Age North Africans from Morocco

[Angela]

So the only argument is geography?
I doubt it.
Yes, I stick with the theory of BA coming from Gujarat, India or the Indus delta into SW Asia during LGM, along with HG G and H2.

Me too. I don't think the authors are saying that BE comes from North Africa. They're just saying they're also BE derived, but I think the implication is that it came from the Near East.

The question is how did it get there. I still think likely from near India by way of Mesopotamia.

 

[Ygorcs]

on the other hand there was a very severe bottleneck some 2.3 ka, as the big majority is E-M81 with TRMCA only 2.3 ka
https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-M81/

Yes, there were certainly lots of events of partial population replacement since then, but what I meant is that it was apparently mostly between related groups of people, so that the transformations didn't cause a wholesale change of the genetic makeup that would be totally unrecognizable earlier. Also, in the case of the wide expansion of the E-M81 subclades in the last milennia, I think that does not necessarily imply a big genetic bottleneck or some kind of significant population replacement. It could've come without an equally transformative change in the autosomal DNA of the population, like, for example, Basques still being closely related to Neolithic Iberians even though they came to have an overwhelming majority of R1b. If I had to guess, the expansion of E-M81 involved people who were autosomally similar to other North Africans, so it was again a situation of internal dynamics, one wave replacing the other within the same broad group of genetic structures.

 

[bicicleur 2]

Me too. I don't think the authors are saying that BE comes from North Africa. They're just saying they're also BE derived, but I think the implication is that it came from the Near East.
The question is how did it get there. I still think likely from near India by way of Mesopotamia.

yes, and I would say that BE went further from the Zagros Mts or Mesopoamia into the Levant and the Nile delta
and that E1b1b1-M35 expanded further from there, carrying some BE
but that is of course, speculating even further

is there any mention how much BE these Ibero-Maurisians had?

did 4.5 ka Ethiopian highland Mota HG carry BE?

 

[bicicleur 2]

Yes, there were certainly lots of events of partial population replacement since then, but what I meant is that it was apparently mostly between related groups of people, so that the transformations didn't cause a wholesale change of the genetic makeup that would be totally unrecognizable earlier. Also, in the case of the wide expansion of the E-M81 subclades in the last milennia, I think that does not necessarily imply a big genetic bottleneck or some kind of significant population replacement. It could've come without an equally transformative change in the autosomal DNA of the population, like, for example, Basques still being closely related to Neolithic Iberians even though they came to have an overwhelming majority of R1b. If I had to guess, the expansion of E-M81 involved people who were autosomally similar to other North Africans, so it was again a situation of internal dynamics, one wave replacing the other within the same broad group of genetic structures.

some claim Berber people live in the Atlas since at least 10 ka, but I doubt that
some of the Sea Peoples invading the Nile delta 3.2 ka would have been Berber, but coming from Cyrenaica
maybe E-L19-M81 stayed in Cyrenaica all that time till they appeared in Morroco 7.3 ka

 

[Angela]

Yes, there were certainly lots of events of partial population replacement since then, but what I meant is that it was apparently mostly between related groups of people, so that the transformations didn't cause a wholesale change of the genetic makeup that would be totally unrecognizable earlier. Also, in the case of the wide expansion of the E-M81 subclades in the last milennia, I think that does not necessarily imply a big genetic bottleneck or some kind of significant population replacement. It could've come without an equally transformative change in the autosomal DNA of the population, like, for example, Basques still being closely related to Neolithic Iberians even though they came to have an overwhelming majority of R1b. If I had to guess, the expansion of E-M81 involved people who were autosomally similar to other North Africans, so it was again a situation of internal dynamics, one wave replacing the other within the same broad group of genetic structures.

I think we're finding out that populations weren't static since the Bronze Age and there were changes, just that, as you say it was caused by movements of people who weren't drastically different, like WHG versus the farmers, or the steppe people versus MN Europeans.

That's true in Britain as well, where you have migration of Anglo-Saxons and Danes in the Middle Ages, and also a more "southern" shift as well, although I'm not sure how it happened. Perhaps it was hundreds of years of migrations from France starting with the Norman conquest?

So, the same thing was going on in North Africa.

@Bicicleur,
There's a lot of discussion about Mota etc. in the Supplement, but I haven't come to grips with it yet.

 

[IronSide]

is there any mention how much BE these Ibero-Maurisians had?

A two-way admixture model, comprising Natufian and a sub-Saharan African population, does not significantly deviate from our data (χ2 p ≥ 0.128) with 63.5% Natufian and 36.5% sub-Saharan African ancestry on average (table S8).

44.8% of Natufian ancestry is BE, so Ibero-Maurisians have 63.5 * 0.448 = 28.448% BE.

 

[FIREYWOTAN]

The opportunity to add a piece of research that seems to be pertinent to the ongoing discussions was today's focus since around 2:30 A.M. eastern standard time. I hope this can open up further dialogues. Thanks for sharing the greatest discovery's and point's of entry.
On the origin of Iberomaurusian: new data based on ancient mitochondrial DNA and phylogenetic analysis of Afalou and Taforalt populations

The Western North African population was characterized by the genetic structure of TAF and AFA specimens contains only North African and Eurasian maternal lineages. These finding demonstrate the presence of these haplotypes in North Africa from at least 20,000 YBP. The very low contribution of a Sub-Saharan African haplotype in the Iberomaurusian samples is confirmed. We also highlighted the existence of genetic flows between Southern and Northern coast of the Mediterranean.presence of Iberomaurusian civilization at the Epipaleolithic period (around 20,000 years before present (YBP) to 10,000 YBP). The origin of this population is still not clear: they may come from Europe, Near East, sub-Saharan Africa or they could have evolved in situ in North Africa.

 

[bicicleur 2]

this is what Ted Kendall says :

https://www.facebook.com/groups/yful...8200650209778/

detailed SNPs show that these Tarofalt samples are not an extinct bracnh, but they are ancestral to todays subclades of E-M78

there is this sample, probably E-L618
Epicardial Spain Avellaner cave, Catalonia [Ave 07] M 5000 BC E1b1b1a1b1a M35.1, V13, Ei in STR table U5 Lacan 2011b
his ancestors could have gotten from Tarofalt to Iberia and mixed with incoming Cardial Ware people

but there are also these samples :

Impresso pottery Croatia Zemunica Cave [I3948] M 5600-5470 BCE E1b1b1a1b1 (E-L618) N1a1 Mathieson 2017 769991

Sopot (proto Lengyel) Hungary Bicske-Galagonyás [BICS 4] 5000-4800 BC E1b1b1a1 M78 H39 Szécsényi-Nagy 2015 thesis

how could they have gotten there?

 

[bicicleur 2]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berbers#Origins

Uniparental DNA analysis has established ties between Berbers and other Afroasiatic speakers in Africa. Most of these populations belong to the E1b1b paternal haplogroup, with Berber speakers having among the highest frequencies of this lineage.[54] Additionally, genomic analysis has found that Berber and other Maghreb communities are defined by a shared ancestral component. This Maghrebi element peaks among Tunisian Berbers.[55] It is related to the Coptic/Ethio-Somali, having diverged from these and other West Eurasian-affiliated components prior to the Holocene.[56]

about Ethio-Somali :

http://journals.plos.org/plosgenetic...type=printable

Early Back-to-Africa Migration into the Horn of Africa

Genetic studies have identified substantial non-African admixture in the Horn of Africa (HOA). In the most recent genomic
studies, this non-African ancestry has been attributed to admixture with Middle Eastern populations during the last few
thousand years. However, mitochondrial and Y chromosome data are suggestive of earlier episodes of admixture. To
investigate this further, we generated new genome-wide SNP data for a Yemeni population sample and merged these new
data with published genome-wide genetic data from the HOA and a broad selection of surrounding populations. We used
multidimensional scaling and ADMIXTURE methods in an exploratory data analysis to develop hypotheses on admixture
and population structure in HOA populations. These analyses suggested that there might be distinct, differentiated African
and non-African ancestries in the HOA. After partitioning the SNP data into African and non-African origin chromosome
segments, we found support for a distinct African (Ethiopic) ancestry and a distinct non-African (Ethio-Somali) ancestry in
HOA populations. The African Ethiopic ancestry is tightly restricted to HOA populations and likely represents an
autochthonous HOA population. The non-African ancestry in the HOA, which is primarily attributed to a novel Ethio-Somali
inferred ancestry component, is significantly differentiated from all neighboring non-African ancestries in North Africa, the
Levant, and Arabia. The Ethio-Somali ancestry is found in all admixed HOA ethnic groups, shows little inter-individual
variance within these ethnic groups, is estimated to have diverged from all other non-African ancestries by at least 23 ka,
and does not carry the unique Arabian lactase persistence allele that arose about 4 ka. Taking into account published
mitochondrial, Y chromosome, paleoclimate, and archaeological data, we find that the time of the Ethio-Somali back-toAfrica
migration is most likely pre-agricultural.

so there would have been a large late paleolithical dispersal of Natufian-like E1b1b1 all over North Africa of which Berber is a remnant

 

[Angela]

this is what Ted Kendall says :

https://www.facebook.com/groups/yful...8200650209778/

detailed SNPs show that these Tarofalt samples are not an extinct bracnh, but they are ancestral to todays subclades of E-M78

there is this sample, probably E-L618
Epicardial Spain Avellaner cave, Catalonia [Ave 07] M 5000 BC E1b1b1a1b1a M35.1, V13, Ei in STR table U5 Lacan 2011b
his ancestors could have gotten from Tarofalt to Iberia and mixed with incoming Cardial Ware people

but there are also these samples :

Impresso pottery Croatia Zemunica Cave [I3948] M 5600-5470 BCE E1b1b1a1b1 (E-L618) N1a1 Mathieson 2017 769991

Sopot (proto Lengyel) Hungary Bicske-Galagonyás [BICS 4] 5000-4800 BC E1b1b1a1 M78 H39 Szécsényi-Nagy 2015 thesis

how could they have gotten there?

According to the latest paper on the Iberian Neolithic there's no trace of them autosomally or uniparentally in the far southern area, at least not yet.

I find it a little hard to believe it made it from northwest Africa through Gibraltar and all the way to Croatia.

The other possibility is that it went from somewhere in the Levant in both directions along the Med.

"so there would have been a large late paleolithical dispersal of Natufian-like E1b1b1 all over North Africa of which Berber is a remnant".

Yes, that makes sense to me.

 

[bicicleur 2]

According to the latest paper on the Iberian Neolithic there's no trace of them autosomally or uniparentally in the far southern area, at least not yet.
I find it a little hard to believe it made it from northwest Africa through Gibraltar and all the way to Croatia.
The other possibility is that it went from somewhere in the Levant in both directions along the Med.
Yes, that makes sense to me.

Indeed, a split up of E-M78 into the Levant and into the Atlas Mts is another option.
And it is a little bit less hard to believe then Iberomaurisians getting all the way upto Cardial ware Croatia.
But it is quite a coincidence that the age estimated on Y-DNA SNP mutations almost exactly matches the calibrated carbon date age of these samples.
It has to be explained one way or another.

Whatever, these E1b1b1 must have wandered along a lot, in contrast to those who are supposed to have stayed in the Levant for so long (14.5 ka Natufians till 8 ka when farmers and herders started to move into Northern Africa)

Also don't forget the PPNB Levant sample :

I1710 Levant PPNB E1b1b1a1-CTS675 calls PPNB Jordan Ain Ghazal [I1710 / AG 83_6] M 7733-7526 calBCE (8580±60 BP) E1b1b1 (xE1b1b1b1a1, E1b1b1a1b1, E1b1b1a1b2, E1b1b1b2a1c) M5041+ (CTS5819-, L618-, CTS5479-, V23-) T1a2 129614 Lazaridis 2016

According to Genetiker, 3 SNPs were identified as E-M78, and he was positive for 2 of them and negative for the 3rd.

https://genetiker.wordpress.com/y-snp-calls-for-i1710/

 

[bicicleur 2]

Also don't forget the PPNB Levant sample :
I1710 Levant PPNB E1b1b1a1-CTS675 calls PPNB Jordan Ain Ghazal [I1710 / AG 83_6] M 7733-7526 calBCE (8580±60 BP) E1b1b1 (xE1b1b1b1a1, E1b1b1a1b1, E1b1b1a1b2, E1b1b1b2a1c) M5041+ (CTS5819-, L618-, CTS5479-, V23-) T1a2 129614 Lazaridis 2016
According to Genetiker, 3 SNPs were identified as E-M78, and he was positive for 2 of them and negative for the 3rd.
https://genetiker.wordpress.com/y-snp-calls-for-i1710/

Iberomausians were allready in Tarofalt since 22.5 ka

'Taforalt (or Grotte des Pigeons) is a cave in northern Oujda, Morocco, and the oldest known cemetery in the world. It contained at least 35 Iberomaurusian human skeletons dated to the Epipaleolithic between 15,100 and 14,000 years ago. There is archaeological evidence for Iberomaurusian occupation at the site between 22,500 and 12,500 years ago, as well as evidence for Aterian occupation as old as 85,000 years.[1][2]'

According to YFull, that was after the split of E-M35, but before E-L539 split, so the earliest Iberomaurisians were likely E-L539, while it's brotherclade, E-Z827 -> Z830 has been identified in Natufian Raqefet Cave.

It is still a complicated story, but most parsimonious seems to me that the PPNB Levant (Ain Ghazal) 9.5 ka E-M78 sample would be a backmigration of an Iberomaurisian into the Levant.

 

[Angela]

Iberomausians were allready in Tarofalt since 22.5 ka

'Taforalt (or Grotte des Pigeons) is a cave in northern Oujda, Morocco, and the oldest known cemetery in the world. It contained at least 35 Iberomaurusian human skeletons dated to the Epipaleolithic between 15,100 and 14,000 years ago. There is archaeological evidence for Iberomaurusian occupation at the site between 22,500 and 12,500 years ago, as well as evidence for Aterian occupation as old as 85,000 years.[1][2]'

According to YFull, that was after the split of E-M35, but before E-L539 split, so the earliest Iberomaurisians were likely E-L539, while it's brotherclade, E-Z827 -> Z830 has been identified in Natufian Raqefet Cave.

It is still a complicated story, but most parsimonious seems to me that the PPNB Levant (Ain Ghazal) 9.5 ka E-M78 sample would be a backmigration of an Iberomaurisian into the Levant.

Would it then have traveled from there into Europe with the Neolithic?

Isn't there some feeling that the age estimations can be from 10-20% off?

 

[bicicleur 2]

Would it then have traveled from there into Europe with the Neolithic?
Isn't there some feeling that the age estimations can be from 10-20% off?

that looks like neolithic Levant in origin, doesn't it?

in my experience YFull TMRCA estimates are quite accurate
TMRCA for E-M78 is 13.4 ka, maybe that is when the backmigration arrived in the Levant

there is a brotherclade of E-M78, it is E-V1039
anything known about this clade?

https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-L539/

 

[Angela]

that looks like neolithic Levant in origin, doesn't it?

in my experience YFull TMRCA estimates are quite accurate
TMRCA for E-M78 is 13.4 ka, maybe that is when the backmigration arrived in the Levant

there is a brotherclade of E-M78, it is E-V1039
anything known about this clade?

https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-L539/

If E-M78 had a source in the Maghreb or western North Africa somewhere and then headed to the Levant, you would think it would have brought some SSA with it, since that was up to 1/3 of its ancestry. Yet, formal stats etc. find no SSA in the Natufians.

 

[IronSide]

What do you think of this opinion from Maciamo https://www.eupedia.com/genetics/funnelbeaker_culture.shtml

The Dodecad K12 calculator revealed a considerable amount of African admixture, which came as a big surprise since no African admixture is found in Scandinavia today. The two Funnelbeaker samples from Sweden tested below, display about 6% and 11% of African admixture respectively. How it got there is still a matter for debate, but the most likely explanation is that it came with Megalithic people from Iberia, who in turn inherited North African admixture from South Levantine Neolithic farmers who reached Iberia via North Africa. Remnants of this African DNA were found in every prehistoric sample in Scandinavia from the Chalcolithic until the Late Iron Age, as well as among the Anglo-Saxons.

The Funnelbeaker culture indeed marks the arrival of Megalithic structures in Scandinavia from western Europe. Megaliths seem to have originated in the Near East. The oldest ones in Europe were found in Sicily and southern Portugal and date from c. 7000 BCE. The Atlantic Megalithic culture really started with the advent of farming and would have spread from Iberia to France, the British Isles and the Low Countries before reaching Scandinavia. Considering the high Northwest African admixture in Funnelbeaker, there is a good chance that Iberian Megalithic people inherited genes from Northwest Africans, probably from the North African Neolithic route that brought R1b-V88, E-M78, J1 and T1a to Iberia. R1b-V88 and E-M78 (V13) have both been found in Early Neolithic Iberia, and are both found throughout western Europe today. The two samples below also carried about 3% of Southwest Asian admixture, which is perfectly consistent with a Neolithic dispersal from the southern Levant across North Africa until Iberia.

There are some outdated concepts but intriguing none the less.

 

[bicicleur 2]

If E-M78 had a source in the Maghreb or western North Africa somewhere and then headed to the Levant, you would think it would have brought some SSA with it, since that was up to 1/3 of its ancestry. Yet, formal stats etc. find no SSA in the Natufians.

and how about the Levant PPNB samples?

 

[Angela]

and how about the Levant PPNB samples?

Sorry, could you explain what you mean?

 

[bicicleur 2]

If E-M78 had a source in the Maghreb or western North Africa somewhere and then headed to the Levant, you would think it would have brought some SSA with it, since that was up to 1/3 of its ancestry. Yet, formal stats etc. find no SSA in the Natufians.

I wanted to know whether the Levant PPNB also lacked SSA.

I'm not familiar with Treemix, but this is what Davidski commented in Eurogenes :

One of the biggest surprises in the new Lazaridis et al. preprint is that the Natufians don't show any Sub-Saharan African admixture when poked and prodded directly with formal statistics. However, TreeMix, which runs on formal statistics, doesn't have much trouble finding Sub-Saharan or related ancestry in both the Natufians and Neolithic farmers from the Levant. So what's going on?

see : http://eurogenes.blogspot.be/2016/06/the-natufian-puzzle.html

Also have a look at this, I think it is interesting :

Natufian, Levant N and Iran N cluster together, but they are not at the extreme right of Eurasians.
And what about Mota? It looks like some intermediate position to me.
All older African samples are at the right hand side of the line Yoruba - South Africa, even the old Malawi 8-6.1 ka.

 

[bicicleur 2]

and watch this :

is E-V1515 African or Natufian in origin?
E-Z830 has 2 subclades with TMRCA 19.2 ka : E-V1515 and PF1962
are both Natufian or only PF1962 ?

the Ethio-Somali is supposed to be pre-agricultural, even late paleolithic :