On line calculator from Genetic Geneology Tools blog

**Wheal** · 30-07-18, 06:12

I used FTDNA build 37 for all 5 of mine.

**Regio X** · 30-07-18, 14:53

Too much calculations. I've done it little by little.:)

There is indeed a relevant difference using FTDNA and 23andMe (v4) data.

My results (with FTDNA and 23andMe data, respectively), father's (23andMe) and mother's (23andMe)

Ajvide 58	1.98	0.54	0.36	0.36
Altai Neanderthal	0.12	0.11	0.12	0.05
Australian Aboriginal	2.63	1.15	1.45	1.38
Bot 15	3.51	1.88	1.46	1.88
Bot 17	2.79	1.38	1.36	1.56
BR1	5.93	1.93	1.44	2.01
BR2	21.49	22.17	22.79	22.40
Clovis Anzick-1	11.81	11.10	10.79	11.47
CO1	6.80	2.48	2.70	2.92
Denisova	0.07	0.00	0.06	0.08
Gökhem2	2.20	1.06	1.52	0.54
Hinxton-1	0.75	0.45	0.35	0.17
Hinxton-2	1.15	0.29	0.28	0.54
Hinxton-3	1.48	0.53	0.25	0.87
Hinxton-4	1.87	1.14	1.19	1.41
Hinxton-5	0.99	0.17	0.29	0.02
IR1	6.26	2.74	2.65	2.96
KO1	6.74	2.63	2.97	2.99
Kostenki 14	6.14	5.01	5.42	5.14
La Braña Arintero	6.60	3.38	3.36	3.66
Linearbandkeramik	20.86	21.75	22.04	23.12
Loschbour	15.47	15.31	15.83	16.00
Mal'ta	3.64	2.01	2.33	2.03
Motala12	7.08	5.04	4.85	5.13
NE1	22.00	22.35	22.86	22.32
NE5	5.31	2.03	2.93	2.45
NE6	6.61	3.39	2.69	3.50
NE7	6.54	2.78	2.95	3.76
Paleo-Eskimo	3.06	1.57	1.73	1.74
RISE00	4.16	2.09	1.70	1.67
RISE150	9.74	5.10	6.93	5.95
RISE174	9.32	6.15	6.09	6.64
RISE395	8.68	5.89	7.11	6.33
RISE479	5.57	3.34	2.59	4.24
RISE493	13.78	13.50	14.07	15.33
RISE495	10.26	9.83	8.76	9.84
RISE496	8.76	5.87	6.38	5.99
RISE497	9.94	9.86	10.00	9.30
RISE499	5.08	3.14	3.11	2.73
RISE500	7.82	3.57	4.88	4.30
RISE502	4.93	2.12	2.18	3.21
RISE503	4.42	2.01	2.21	2.84
RISE504	5.25	2.39	2.73	3.33
RISE505	13.35	12.28	13.38	13.39
RISE509	5.00	2.43	2.78	2.29
RISE511	9.52	8.50	7.89	9.49
RISE523	7.32	5.74	6.64	7.41
RISE548	4.89	2.67	2.33	2.69
RISE552	9.21	5.44	5.23	5.57
RISE569	5.50	2.42	3.16	3.23
RISE577	5.97	2.63	3.27	2.71
RISE601	2.38	0.67	0.92	1.07
RISE602	2.75	0.97	1.18	1.13
RISE94	5.20	1.66	2.02	1.78
RISE97	3.19	1.37	1.90	1.89
RISE98	14.40	12.19	12.67	13.39
Ust-Ishim	16.08	16.80	17.31	16.86
Vi33.16 Neanderthal	0.15	0.07	0.09	0.03
Vi33.25 Neanderthal	0.06	0.17	0.16	0.00
Vi33.26 Neanderthal	0.30	0.06	0.11	0.02

**Regio X** · 30-07-18, 15:25

Originally Posted by Stuvanè

I used my last raw data downloaded about a year ago, but I did my 23andme test in the summer of 2014

Which company, if I may ask?

**Stuvanè** · 30-07-18, 16:27

Originally Posted by Regio X

Which company, if I may ask?

Always 23andMe

**Regio X** · 30-07-18, 18:37

Originally Posted by Stuvanè

Always 23andMe

Curiously, you got more %s than us in virtually all cases, with 23andMe data.
I still have to look the other results people posted.
Thanks.

**Salento** · 30-07-18, 19:09

What settings should we use? If any.

**Regio X** · 30-07-18, 19:29

Originally Posted by Salento

What settings should we use? If any.

I was just thinking about it.
I used the default. Later I'll check them.

**Pax Augusta** · 30-07-18, 19:29

Originally Posted by Jovialis

Yeah I think so as well. I did use V5 of 23andme for the runs.

A friend of mine has tested with V3 and V5 and has quite different results. I start to think that V5 is much less accurate.

**Regio X** · 30-07-18, 19:50

Originally Posted by Regio X

I was just thinking about it.
I used the default. Later I'll check them.

As I said, I used the default (option "Compound Segments"), which are: Segment Base-pairs 1000000, Segment SNPs 150, Gap to Break Segment 100000, Allowed Errors 5, and Match No-calls checked.

@Stuvane'
What about you? Did you use "Total Shared DNA" instead? When I use this one, the %s also get much higher.

For example, here are our Total Shared DNA with BR2, LBK, NE1, Ust-Ishim and Loschbour, as reference:
BR2 35.60 / 29.67 / 31.06 / 31.43
LBK 35.44 / 30.00 / 30.70 / 30.69
NE1 35.32 / 29.99 / 31.32 / 30.79
Ust-Ishim 30.46 / 25.34 / 26.19 / 26.45
Louschbour 31.06 / 24.68 / 25.66 / 25.74

**IronSide** · 30-07-18, 21:54

I share more with Clovis than with the LBK, and more with Ust-Ishim than with Loschbour .. a likely story.

**Jovialis** · 30-07-18, 22:16

Originally Posted by Pax Augusta

A friend of mine has tested with V3 and V5 and has quite different results. I start to think that V5 is much less accurate.

I find the inaccuracy of their other features like the timeline to be disconcerting, as well.

I wish they didn't move over to the GSA illumina chip that they're currently using. Other companies are utilize this chip as well for genotyping.

V3 has 967,000 SNPs tested, while V5 has 630,132.

**Salento** · 31-07-18, 04:08

23 v4 chip
Ancient DNA - Compound Segments

**Stuvanè** · 31-07-18, 07:26

Originally Posted by Regio X

As I said, I used the default (option "Compound Segments"), which are: Segment Base-pairs 1000000, Segment SNPs 150, Gap to Break Segment 100000, Allowed Errors 5, and Match No-calls checked.

@Stuvane'
What about you? Did you use "Total Shared DNA" instead? When I use this one, the %s also get much higher.

For example, here are our Total Shared DNA with BR2, LBK, NE1, Ust-Ishim and Loschbour, as reference:
BR2 35.60 / 29.67 / 31.06 / 31.43
LBK 35.44 / 30.00 / 30.70 / 30.69
NE1 35.32 / 29.99 / 31.32 / 30.79
Ust-Ishim 30.46 / 25.34 / 26.19 / 26.45
Louschbour 31.06 / 24.68 / 25.66 / 25.74

@Regio X
Yes, I used the Total Shared DNA (it has been activated in this way, by default). I' ll use the Compound Segments mode later, as soon as possible
PS: there's a typo in my Ayvide 58 record: the right value is 2.10

**Salento** · 31-07-18, 18:31

From Helix: How new and ancient DNA is passed down.

Scientists have found a time machine—it’s your DNA

....The first concept demonstrated here is known as recombination....

....The second concept demonstrated is linkage disequilibrium (LD)....

...DNA sequencing of people around the world has shown us that about 2-6% of the DNA in people of non-African heritage comes from Neanderthals or Denisovans. We know this because researchers have compared the DNA sequence of ancient Neanderthal and Denisovan remains with those of Homo sapiens. In this data, they found patterns where DNA sequences were commonly found together, and that these patterns made a genetic signature unique to each population. Portions of these sequences from Neanderthals and Denisovans can be found in the genomes of many modern-day humans. Knowing the statistical probability of these sequences breaking up by recombination when they coexist with other sequences, scientist can infer that these sequences were initially in other populations and they can calculate how much time the Neanderthal’s sequences have spent in Homo sapiens populations....

https://www.helix.com/blog/linkage-d...ent=blogdigest

**Angela** · 31-07-18, 21:11

OK I redid some of the important ones with total dna. This is 23andme v3

Altai Neanderthal 2.68

Clovis: 24.63

Ust'Isham: 14.42

Kostenki: 16.58

La Brana: 13.58

Loschbour: 28.84

Motala: 16.21

Ajvide: 6.58

Mal'ta: 10.47

KO1: 13.35

LBK: 34.11

NE1: 33.50

Gok2: 6.68

BR1 11.60

BR2: 34.40

IR1: 13.38

Hinxton 4: 9.24

Rise 493: 26.59 (Russia, 3214 yo, Q/C4) Anyone know he specific culture?

Rise 395: Russia 16.84

U2e1	3540 years

Rise 150: 15.58 (This is in Poland. Anyone know the culture?)

U5a1b1

3469 years

Rise 98: Sweden 23.57 (I don't know what culture this one is)

R-M405

K1b1a

3736 years

**IronSide** · 31-07-18, 21:48

Originally Posted by Angela

OK I redid some of the important ones with total dna. This is 23andme v3

Altai Neanderthal 2.68

Clovis: 24.63

Ust'Isham: 14.42

Kostenki: 16.58

La Brana: 13.58

Loschbour: 28.84

Motala: 16.21

Ajvide: 6.58

Mal'ta: 10.47

KO1: 13.35

LBK: 34.11

NE1: 33.50

Gok2: 6.68

BR1 11.60

BR2: 34.40

IR1: 13.38

Hinxton 4: 9.24

Rise 493: 26.59 (Russia, 3214 yo, Q/C4) Anyone know he specific culture?

Rise 395: Russia 16.84

U2e1	3540 years

Rise 150: 15.58 (This is in Poland. Anyone know the culture?)

U5a1b1

3469 years

Rise 98: Sweden 23.57 (I don't know what culture this one is)

R-M405

K1b1a

3736 years

So you also share more with Clovis than most things, maybe you have alot of ANE ancestry ? but Malt'a is 10.4 and Clovis is 24.6

Again West Eurasians should not share more ancestry with Ust-Ishim than everything, Ust-Ishim descends from a branch of humans that are not West nor East Eurasians, he shared equally with Han and European HG.

This calculator might as well classify me as Gorilla.

**Angela** · 31-07-18, 22:36

Originally Posted by IronSide

So you also share more with Clovis than most things, maybe you have alot of ANE ancestry ? but Malt'a is 10.4 and Clovis is 24.6

Again West Eurasians should not share more ancestry with Ust-Ishim than everything, Ust-Ishim descends from a branch of humans that are not West nor East Eurasians, he shared equally with Han and European HG.

This calculator might as well classify me as Gorilla.

The only one whose numbers are also from 23andme, v3 version, is, I think, Stuvane, who also happens to be from Italy, and he gets around 16%, so it appears I'm odd in this regard, perhaps, for Europeans? I don't know. Do northern Europeans get high percents too?

I don't know how to explain it.

I did get relatively high scores for Karasuk-E Scythia on the K12 ancient calculator on gene plaza. I speculated at the time perhaps it had something to do with Sarmatian and Alan settlements near my father's birthplace. Isolated communities can preserve some ancient signals which get diluted elsewhere.

I also consistently get .1% Native American and .1% East Asian on 23andme, and they're quite conservative with that sort of thing. On other calculators it showed up as Native American and Korean.

**Salento** · 31-07-18, 23:10

23 v4 chip Total Shared Dna

Linearbandkeramik	32.34
NE1	31.70
BR2	31.01
Ust-Ishim	26.94
Loschbour	25.22
RISE493	22.39
RISE505	21.20
Clovis Anzick-1	20.68
RISE98	20.14
RISE497	18.61
RISE495	16.58
RISE511	15.92
RISE496	13.09
RISE523	12.49
RISE552	11.85
Kostenki 14	11.83
Motala12	11.24
RISE395	11.23
RISE174	11.17
RISE150	10.39
RISE500	9.60
La Braña Arintero	8.56
RISE479	8.56
NE7	8.23
NE6	8.21
Paleo-Eskimo	8.05
RISE499	8.04
IR1	7.82
CO1	7.79
RISE577	7.74
KO1	7.64
RISE504	7.60
RISE569	7.40
RISE548	7.35
RISE502	7.30
RISE509	7.16
NE5	7.13
RISE503	6.75
BR1	6.74
Mal'ta	6.29
RISE94	6.11
Bot 15	6.07
Bot 17	5.76
RISE00	5.68
RISE97	5.12
Australian Aboriginal	5.10
RISE602	4.81
Hinxton-4	4.75
RISE601	3.91
Gökhem2	3.56
Hinxton-3	2.93
Ajvide 58	2.90
Hinxton-2	2.44
Hinxton-5	2.23
Altai Neanderthal	1.73
Hinxton-1	1.71
Denisova	1.29
Vi33.25 Neanderthal	0.93
Vi33.26 Neanderthal	0.73
Vi33.16 Neanderthal	0.48

Link for Compound Segments results.
https://www.eupedia.com/forum/thread...l=1#post550408

**Stuvanè** · 31-07-18, 23:44

@Regio X, Angela, Salento: Here are my compound segments results (I suppose my 23and me is the v4 chip)

Linearbandkeramik	23.11
BR2	22.49
NE1	22.44
Ust-Ishim	18.37
Loschbour	17.01
RISE493	15.46
RISE505	13.52
RISE98	13.35
Clovis Anzick-1	11.59
RISE511	10.05
RISE497	9.57
RISE495	9.37
RISE552	7.33
RISE523	6.53
RISE496	6.36
RISE174	6.17
Kostenki14	6.04
RISE395	6.34
RISE150	5.52
Motala 12	5.39
RISE500	5.23
NE6	4.22
RISE479	4.01
NE7	4.38
La Braña Arintero	4.06
NE5	3.50
KO1	3.47
RISE569	3.45
CO1	3.29
RISE503	3.21
BR1	3.09
RISE499	3.08
RISE577	3.38
IR1	3.36
RISE502	3.09
RISE509	2.24
RISE94	2.22
Palaeo-Eskimo	2.21
RISE504	2.12
RISE548	2.08
Bot 17	2.05
Mal'ta	2.03
RISE00	2.16
Bot 15	2.09
RISE97	1.53
RISE602	1.44
Australian Aboriginal	1.38
Hinxton-4	1.14
RISE601	1.12
Gökhem2	1.06
Ajvide 58	1.04
Hinxton-3	1.02
Altaj Neanderthal	0.36
Hinxton-2	0.36
Hinxton-1	0.27
Vi33.25 Neanderthal	0.21
Denisova	0.19
Vi33.26 Neanderthal	0.16
Vi33.16 Neanderthal	0.11
Hinxton-5	0.02

**Regio X** · 01-08-18, 00:46

Originally Posted by Angela

The only one whose numbers are also from 23andme, v3 version, is, I think, Stuvane, who also happens to be from Italy, and he gets around 16%, so it appears I'm odd in this regard, perhaps, for Europeans? I don't know. Do northern Europeans get high percents too?

I don't know how to explain it.

I did get relatively high scores for Karasuk-E Scythia on the K12 ancient calculator on gene plaza. I speculated at the time perhaps it had something to do with Sarmatian and Alan settlements near my father's birthplace. Isolated communities can preserve some ancient signals which get diluted elsewhere.

I also consistently get .1% Native American and .1% East Asian on 23andme, and they're quite conservative with that sort of thing. On other calculators it showed up as Native American and Korean.

If he tested at the end of 2014, then it's v4 (~570k SNPs), not v3 (>900k SNPs). Possibly the Compound Segments option corrects in part the differences. If true, this would be a better option for comparison between different data, at least in the cases %s are higher, generally. I say this based on the differences of my own results using FTDNA and 23andMe v4 data. Notice how these higher %s are similar with Compound Segments and how they are different with Total Shared DNA. However, not sure if it's also true for other combinations of data. We would need more examples. :)

**Wheal** · 01-08-18, 00:50

I resorted from high to low. The first column is most probably Netherland, 2nd is NW European, 3rd is Central Europe, 4th is NE Europe and 5th is NW Mexico.

Linearbandkermik	11.490%	23.400%	24.750%	24.620%	10.370%
BR2	12.120%	23.950%	24.340%	25.080%	10.960%
NE1	11.900%	22.950%	24.290%	25.000%	10.540%
Loschbour	9.970%	21.410%	21.750%	22.050%	9.130%
Ust-Ishim	9.910%	20.670%	21.130%	21.320%	11.120%
RISE493	7.910%	17.480%	18.380%	18.690%	8.990%
RISE505	7.630%	16.840%	17.450%	18.320%	7.620%
Clovis Anzick-1	7.410%	15.890%	16.570%	17.080%	11.750%
RISE98	6.860%	15.670%	16.450%	17.910%	6.970%
RISE497	7.130%	14.890%	15.300%	15.730%	8.700%
RISE511	6.560%	13.390%	14.610%	14.750%	6.180%
RISE495	6.470%	13.790%	14.180%	14.930%	7.200%
RISE496	4.770%	11.350%	11.800%	11.780%	4.720%
RISE395	4.570%	10.360%	11.780%	11.010%	3.900%
RISE523	5.370%	10.820%	11.120%	11.710%	5.240%
Rise150	3.510%	9.920%	10.850%	10.780%	3.810%
RISE552	4.450%	10.470%	10.620%	11.130%	4.500%
RISE174	3.500%	9.620%	10.560%	10.980%	3.280%
Motala 12	4.880%	9.660%	10.360%	11.090%	4.210%
La Brana Arintero	3.380%	8.620%	9.740%	9.630%	3.060%
RISE500	4.270%	9.050%	9.540%	10.290%	3.840%
Kostenki14	4.440%	9.090%	9.150%	10.390%	3.870%
RISE479	3.720%	8.460%	8.400%	8.350%	2.910%
KO1	3.210%	8.220%	8.360%	8.500%	3.260%
RISE569	3.060%	6.930%	7.910%	7.690%	2.630%
NE6	6.780%	6.780%	7.870%	7.570%	2.770%
NE7	3.680%	7.280%	7.580%	7.800%	2.710%
RISE499	3.370%	7.180%	7.530%	8.540%	2.860%
RISE577	2.720%	7.070%	7.430%	7.960%	2.580%
CO1	3.310%	6.300%	7.400%	7.600%	2.870%
RISE504	2.890%	6.840%	7.250%	7.400%	3.630%
IR1	2.910%	6.610%	7.230%	8.080%	2.890%
RISE548	3.110%	6.800%	7.230%	7.200%	2.970%
Palaeo-Eskimo	2.760%	6.810%	7.220%	7.550%	3.510%
RISE502	2.930%	6.790%	7.050%	8.080%	2.810%
NE5	2.800%	6.270%	6.940%	7.350%	2.900%
RISE503	3.230%	6.380%	6.770%	6.970%	2.760%
RISE94	2.340%	5.690%	6.710%	6.880%	2.200%
Mal'ta	4.210%	5.500%	6.660%	6.420%	2.920%
BR1	2.630%	5.860%	6.650%	7.120%	2.900%
RISE97	2.780%	6.150%	6.500%	6.630%	2.210%
Bot15	2.360%	5.520%	6.480%	6.510%	3.580%
RISE509	2.940%	6.630%	6.150%	6.810%	2.610%
Rise00	2.540%	6.690%	6.130%	6.420%	2.080%
Bot17	2.300%	5.270%	5.430%	5.690%	2.930%
Australian Aboriginal	1.260%	4.710%	5.360%	5.400%	2.130%
Hinxton-4	2.010%	4.810%	4.960%	5.520%	1.810%
RISE601	1.540%	3.510%	4.370%	4.770%	1.930%
RISE602	1.690%	3.980%	4.340%	4.680%	1.940%
Gokhem2	1.600%	3.540%	3.880%	3.740%	1.140%
Hinxton-3	1.410%	3.220%	3.810%	3.590%	0.950%
Ajivide 58	1.220%	3.230%	3.160%	3.170%	1.180%
Hinxton-2	1.040%	2.520%	2.870%	2.770%	0.930%
Hinxton-1	0.600%	1.810%	2.340%	2.490%	0.670%
Hinxton-5	1.020%	2.390%	2.310%	2.640%	0.700%
Altai Neanderthal	0.400%	1.000%	1.170%	1.080%	0.560%
Vi33.26 Neanderthal	0.310%	0.920%	0.860%	0.820%	0.390%
Denisova	0.240%	0.750%	0.830%	0.770%	0.400%
Vi33.25 Neanderthal	0.170%	0.980%	0.680%	1.010%	0.320%
Vi33.16 Neanderthal	0.170%	0.580%	0.480%	0.630%	0.320%

**Salento** · 01-08-18, 01:08

@Wheal
Did you use Compound Segments or Total Shared DNA?

**Wheal** · 01-08-18, 16:19

I used the default option. I'm going to do 5 full siblings, just haven't had the time.

**Salento** · 01-08-18, 21:50

Thanks for sharing Wheal, RegioX, Pax, Stuvanè, Angela, Jovialis, IronSide, Davef, ... :)

“Patience is the Virtue of the Strong”

**Sile** · 01-08-18, 22:37

i get 19.45 % with LBK
.
20.31% with BR2
.
14.52% with Lochbour
.
13.98% with Ust-ishim
.
all others are under 10 %

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