Eupedia Forums
Site NavigationEupedia Top > Eupedia Forum & Japan Forum
Page 7 of 7 FirstFirst ... 567
Results 151 to 158 of 158

Thread: Interesting Maps and Graphs

  1. #151
    Princess Achievements:
    Overdrive10000 Experience PointsVeteranThree Friends
    davef's Avatar
    Join Date
    19-06-16
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    2,218
    Points
    11,238
    Level
    31
    Points: 11,238, Level: 31
    Level completed: 99%, Points required for next Level: 12
    Overall activity: 11.0%


    Ethnic group
    Italian,Irish,Jewish
    Country: USA - New York





    Wow, I would love to move in to a predominately East Asian community (and I'm not flexing my PC muscles saying this, I really mean it). Nothing against those who would feel uncomfortable, I'm not the typical PC guy who would label them as "racist". Im just someone who would never feel home sick.
    mmmmmmmmm dooouuughhhnuuuutz

  2. #152
    Advisor Achievements:
    VeteranThree Friends50000 Experience PointsRecommendation Second Class
    Awards:
    Posting Award
    Angela's Avatar
    Join Date
    02-01-11
    Posts
    15,329
    Points
    280,987
    Level
    100
    Points: 280,987, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 99.6%


    Ethnic group
    Italian
    Country: USA - New York



    1 out of 2 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by davef View Post
    Wow, I would love to move in to a predominately East Asian community (and I'm not flexing my PC muscles saying this, I really mean it). Nothing against those who would feel uncomfortable, I'm not the typical PC guy who would label them as "racist". Im just someone who would never feel home sick.
    Well, when you found out that many of the people don't speak English and you can't even read the signs on the stores or find the normal products you use, or, if you're religious, find a church, or if you're athletic find a neighborhood baseball team or any other kind of team to join, or if you like belonging to neighborhood civic associations or book clubs and on and on, you might feel differently. If you had children it would be even more difficult because they'd be the only children like them in their classrooms.


    Non si fa il proprio dovere perchè qualcuno ci dica grazie, lo si fa per principio, per se stessi, per la propria dignità. Oriana Fallaci

  3. #153
    Advisor Achievements:
    VeteranThree Friends50000 Experience PointsRecommendation Second Class
    Awards:
    Posting Award
    Angela's Avatar
    Join Date
    02-01-11
    Posts
    15,329
    Points
    280,987
    Level
    100
    Points: 280,987, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 99.6%


    Ethnic group
    Italian
    Country: USA - New York



    3 out of 4 members found this post helpful.
    @Ailchu,
    I edited my response to you so much that I am re-posting it here. I also added some data.

    I think the Dutch and Scandinavians are far closer to each other than either is to Italians. Italians are, of course, a bit heterogeneous, so let's talk about, say, Scandinavians versus Central (Lazio) to Southern Italians. I think they are very different in terms of lots of traits, both physical and psychological.

    Let's start with the trivial: physical appearance. On "average", they look very different.

    Then look at mental and physical health characteristics. All ethnic groups have members who carry genes for every kind of mental and physical illness, but the "prevalence" by ethnic group varies by specific type. Don't hold me to specifics, because I'm going by memory, but I think Scandinavians have a higher tendency to clinical depression. They also have higher statistics for suicide. Same for cancer of the colon and for alcoholism. The latter is at least true for the British Isles and the Netherlands, and perhaps Norway. Certainly it's true for Finland. I think with Italians it may be anxiety and bipolar disorders, and things like high blood pressure. In terms of violence, it's much less often suicide, but more often "crimes of passion". Which specific traits don't matter. Every group has good ones and bad ones. The point is that they differ.

    Then there are what you might call social/psychological traits. Imo there is a large difference in terms of introversion/extroversion. I remember that years ago a Finn posted a picture on either this site or another one of Finns waiting for a bus. It made a HUGE impression on me. There were perhaps 5 or 7 people as I remember it. Not ONE was talking to the others; in fact there was more than five feet between each of them. You would NEVER see that in Italy. People would start talking, complaining perhaps about the bus or the weather or talking about the news, perhaps even arguing, but at least engaging. Now, I'm sure the Finns and other Scandinavians like it that way and that's fine, but I could never live in a country like that.

    I could go on and on, but you must know what I'm talking about.

    Now, if Italians want to marry Scandinavians and vice versa and so the differences disappear, or, as here, all these Irish and Italian people intermarry and so the specific "ethnic" traits get diluted, I'm not going to tell them they shouldn't do it, but I didn't do it myself. It didn't feel "comfortable". I didn't feel as if I fit with their families or they with mine. Now, for Italian Americans it's different. It's different for my children, but as they get older even they seem to be gravitating toward possible "mates" who are at least partially Italian. It becomes clear as they interact with the partner's family and how the partner lives and inter-reacts with others that the differences are large.

    Whether we like it or not marriages or partnerships, or whatever you want to call them, between people of similar backgrounds are less stressful, and less often end in divorce. Now, those are averages, statistics, there are always individual cases where it makes no difference. One of my closest friends, an Irish guy from graduate school, married an Italian girl, and honestly, they have one of the most perfect relationships I've ever seen. We're talking about relative risks here. Of course, he joined HER world much more than she did his, partly perhaps because he was an only child, and son of only children. I have to say this if I'm going to be honest. Anecdotally, when the wife is Italian and the husband is something else, especially, say, Jewish, the marriages seem to have fewer problems than when the husband is Italian and the wife is, say, Irish or German. The Italian husband, Jewish wife also seems to work better. Greek/Italian marriages also seem to really work out, but the Greeks are much less likely to "marry out" than Italians. That may partly be a religious thing. Both Italians and the Irish and a lot of the Germans are Roman Catholics, and that used to really matter, and still matters to some extent today, while Greeks are Orthodox. Like Jews, if they do intermarry they usually demand conversion of the non Orthodox partner. That would have been fine with me even years ago when I was a religious girl. I like Greeks, get on with them, understand their families, and even back then, I was taught in theology class that the differences between Roman Catholicism and Orthodoxy were more political and technical than spiritual, and if, for example, I were in some place in the Midwest where there was no R.C. church, to go to an Orthodox Greek one for Sunday services.

    Also, if you're implying that there might be a time in Europe where there would be no actual "Italians", or Spaniards, or Germans or Irish, i.e. just an intermarried mass, it might be inevitable, but no, I personally wouldn't want that. To be clear, it's nothing to do with superiority or inferiority. I love my people, our history, our accomplishments, and I even find some of our many faults acceptable or even in some cases endearing. So, no, I don't want them to disappear.

    Even in countries like the U.S., there is less intermarriage than Europeans sometimes imagine, at least across "racial" lines. I've posted recent data on other threads showing that 90% of "white" Americans marry white Americans. It's just the way it is, and I think it will stay that way for a long time, regardless of what "Hollywood" would prefer. There are also still Irish or mostly Irish descent people who would prefer their children marry people of Irish descent. It's just the way it is.

    I see it happening in my own community, which is white and Christian, and has been for decades. In recent years a lot of Chinese people are moving in, and while no one is broadcasting it, people are moving further out on the island. It's not that they're not considered highly intelligent, hardworking, law abiding, all those things, but the "culture" is very different. It happened in parts of Queens, a borough of New York City. Whole areas like Flushing used to be Jewish, Italian, Irish. It is now completely, and I mean completely East Asian. I don't think a young European descent family would feel comfortable buying a house there nowadays. These old established communities are very sports oriented, church oriented, civic association oriented, summer life revolving around tennis and swimming and golf at country clubs or local community pool and tennis clubs. The School Association is very important, with parents being very involved in being class mothers, all that stuff. That's just not part of the culture of a lot of these very nice East Asian people, so there are some stresses.

    I have some personal experience of the Italian/Swiss German marital mix. My first cousin married a Swiss German. He's a very nice guy, and she seems happy enough, but to my eyes she has totally changed her "personality" or traits, as much as one can do fighting genetics, and the way they "live", if you know what I mean, is completely Swiss German. I would NEVER, EVER, have done that. Of course, I may be biased here, to be honest, because Switzerland was the only place in my whole life where I was ever treated badly, indeed harassed, because I'm Italian. I was a teenager, and yet I've never been back. If my cousin wants to see me she can come to Italy when I'm there every year. I hold REALLY, REALLY intense grudges, and never forget insults.

    Some data. I got some of it wrong. Bi-polar and schizophrenia rates seem to be the same for every country. The major differences are in alcohol/drug disorders, depression, and anxiety. I knew Italy would be lower in the alcohol and drug disorders, but I thought it might be higher in the anxiety disorders, instead a country like the Netherlands has more of it. Go figure. I absolutely don't get the low anxiety in some eastern countries. Maybe they consider it normal and don't get treated for it.


  4. #154
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered1000 Experience Points

    Join Date
    18-03-17
    Posts
    275
    Points
    1,831
    Level
    11
    Points: 1,831, Level: 11
    Level completed: 94%, Points required for next Level: 19
    Overall activity: 11.0%


    Ethnic group
    swiss,italian
    Country: Germany



    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    Also, if you're implying that there might be a time in Europe where there would be no actual "Italians", or Spaniards, or Germans or Irish, i.e. just an intermarried mass, it might be inevitable, but no, I personally wouldn't want that. To be clear, it's nothing to do with superiority or inferiority. I love my people, our history, our accomplishments, and I even find some of our many faults acceptable or even in some cases endearing. So, no, I don't want them to disappear.


    the question shouldn't be if you want this or not. it will happen eventually and there are propably not many people who really want this but most just don't care. so the question should rather be if you mind that it happens.
    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    Even in countries like the U.S., there is less intermarriage than Europeans sometimes imagine, at least across "racial" lines. I've posted recent data on other threads showing that 90% of "white" Americans marry white Americans. It's just the way it is, and I think it will stay that way for a long time, regardless of what "Hollywood" would prefer.
    still, 10% marry outside their race which is quite much and enough so that it propably doesn't stay like this for that long. also the "white" category for example already became more inclusive in the past and it will certainly become more inclusive in the future.
    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    In recent years a lot of Chinese people are moving in, and while no one is broadcasting it, people are moving further out on the island. It's not that they're not considered highly intelligent, hardworking, law abiding, all those things, but the "culture" is very different. It happened in parts of Queens, a borough of New York City. Whole areas like Flushing used to be Jewish, Italian, Irish. It is now completely, and I mean completely East Asian.
    this might be caused by placing too many migrants in the same place without giving the process of assimilation enough time. it would be different if the migrants were distributed better so they can't create bubbles with their own culture. here i think america and europe have a different mindset.
    also when i google Flushing NYC it doesn't seem to be that extreme. only 65% of the inhabitants are of east asian origin according to wiki.
    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    I have some personal experience of the Italian/Swiss German marital mix. My first cousin married a Swiss German. He's a very nice guy, and she seems happy enough, but to my eyes she has totally changed her "personality" or traits, as much as one can do fighting genetics, and the way they "live", if you know what I mean, is completely Swiss German. I would NEVER, EVER, have done that. Of course, I may be biased here, to be honest, because Switzerland was the only place in my whole life where I was ever treated badly, indeed harassed, because I'm Italian. I was a teenager, and yet I've never been back. If my cousin wants to see me she can come to Italy when I'm there every year. I hold REALLY, REALLY intense grudges, and never forget insults.
    you have to understand switzerland took in a lot of italians in the past. especially after 1945. in 1963 there was even an "anti-italians" political party. i guess you were in switzerland around this time? in the end these migrants really had a significant impact on the swiss culture. as an italian you will probably not face racism in switzerland anymore. or only very very rarely. it's almost impossible since today really many people in switzerland have italian roots and italians have become a part of the swiss society.

    also why hate switzerland because of your personal "anti-italian" experience in the past? america also had its "anti-italianism". or france. or why not hate for example italy where racism is more and more accepted? for football fans who make monkey sounds against black football players? or black italians are refused at hospitals because they are not veterinary offices? or when black politicians are compared to orang utans by other politicians and are target of flying bananas? or for having a deputy prime minister who defends all of this?
    and note that the relative immigrant population in italy is rather small compared to those in other european countries and SSA africans make up only 0.74% of the italian population.

    the fact that it was a personal experience of racism shouldn't matter if we look at it rationally. but i understand it's something different if you experience something bad against you personally. that's how we humans work. so you probably are indeed biased here.
    Last edited by Ailchu; 25-07-19 at 01:09.

  5. #155
    Advisor Achievements:
    VeteranThree Friends50000 Experience PointsRecommendation Second Class
    Awards:
    Posting Award
    Angela's Avatar
    Join Date
    02-01-11
    Posts
    15,329
    Points
    280,987
    Level
    100
    Points: 280,987, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 99.6%


    Ethnic group
    Italian
    Country: USA - New York



    5 out of 6 members found this post helpful.
    @Ailchu,
    Yes, I would mind if Italians disappear as a specific ethnicity. It goes without saying there's nothing I can or would want to do to prevent it. What will happen will happen. Obviously, people make the choices which feel comfortable for them personally. I would never dream of telling anyone whom to marry. I don't even tell my own children that. So long as they love the person and that person loves them back and treats them well, then so be it. If they're happy, I'm happy.

    Yes, 10% intermarriage is a substantial number, but a good chunk of that is with Hispanics who might have some admixture, but who are, to American eyes, "white". Marco Rubio is a Hispanic, for example. Intermarriage with black Americans is much less common. I'm just reporting on the reality of the situation. It's unfortunate that such bias still exists, but it serves no purpose to lie about it.

    You're right: it's not optimal for a country to have "ethnic" enclaves. However, the American government has no power or ethical right to tell migrants where to buy a home. If they're looking for neighborhoods with good school systems, safety on the streets, substantial and nice homes, and they can meet the asking price, then they have the right to buy there, and it would be racist not to sell to them. Once a few people with money to invest, some directly from Hong Kong or Southeast Asia, move to an area and like it, then family, friends, former neighbors, feel more comfortable moving in. Then small businesses open up to cater to them. That's how it happens. There's nothing wrong with any of that, but it can drastically change the character of a neighborhood.

    I don't care what Wiki says. I'm in Queens all the time, some of my Jewish friends still have parents in a few small enclaves in Flushing, and I'm telling you that you can walk blocks and blocks and blocks in Flushing and never hear English spoken or see store signs in English. Like I said, more power to them for their entrepreneurial mind set, but not every American would feel comfortable living there now.

    This has always been the way it worked in the urban landscape of America. English and Dutch areas of New York became Irish, then Italian, maybe some mixed Irish and Italian neighborhoods, and the Jewish neighborhoods were usually separated, partly because if they were Orthodox they had to live within walking distance from a synagogue, partly because, like the other migrants, they felt more comfortable with people similar to them and stores catering to them, and partly, frankly, because communities like mine had what were called "restrictive covenants" prohibiting the sale of a house to Jews and blacks. They've long been declared unconstitutional, but it's still in the deeds. Then certain areas of inner New York became Hispanic with all the migration from Puerto Rico, or black from migrants from the south, and now East Asian and Indian. It's just the way it has worked out. Now it has spilled into certain suburban neighborhoods on the island that are still relatively close to the city for commuting. Like I said, if people can meet the asking price, they can live wherever they want, and that's the way it should be.

    I'm not that old. :) I wasn't in Switzerland until quite a bit later, although I heard it was much worse in the 60s. Look Ailchu, I was a young girl, but I knew enough to know the reputation of the ugly "American" tourist, so I chose, out of politeness, not to ask for help in English, but in Italian, which I thought and in fact "is" a "national" language in Switzerland. I was quite "developed" for my age, so that pig of a man made a sexual remark about me, and insulted Italians in horrible language as well, just because of that. I've never forgotten it. I still could find that goddam post office in Basel today if I had to. I never, ever, was treated like that because of my ethnicity anywhere else in the world, certainly not in the U.S. My family and I were met with open arms. I told my aunt and her family they were crazy to remain there, and in fact I heard many Italians did leave. I would starve in my home country before I would put up with that crap. I know there are some racist Americans, but if one of them said something like that to a young Hispanic girl, people would rush to her defense. No one said a word. So, once I started working and making money, I chose not to spend any of it there. That's my right, and I don't have to answer to you or anyone else for it.

    When I was growing up here many of the parents of my Jewish friends wouldn't buy German products. I totally understood. Some of the people running those companies in the 70s and 80s had been working there in the 40s.

    Every village in my area has a memorial to people tortured and executed during the German occupation. Germany has always refused to let Italy extradite them for trial, so they died comfortably of old age, SS men who butchered old men and women and babies. My mother had an older cousin burned alive in a church with her priest. Another one, a young man, died in a concentration camp for union activity in La Spezia. So, yeah, I take it personally and seriously; I hold a grudge; I have a long memory for injury. I don't blame young Germans for that, but as I said, I understood the reasoning of my friends' parents, and had I been in a position to buy German products when the older generation was still running things, I wouldn't have bought them either. That's my right. If you think that's weird, go ahead; that's your right.

    I don't know if it really comes across, but I have some "Libertarian" leanings politically: I don't want anyone telling me what I can or cannot do unless I'm creating a major disturbance of public order, and that applies most of all to the government.

  6. #156
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered1000 Experience Points
    italouruguayan's Avatar
    Join Date
    21-04-17
    Location
    Montevideo, Uruguay
    Posts
    124
    Points
    4,622
    Level
    19
    Points: 4,622, Level: 19
    Level completed: 93%, Points required for next Level: 28
    Overall activity: 15.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1B U106 L44
    MtDNA haplogroup
    A2

    Ethnic group
    Mixed , mostly Italian
    Country: Uruguay



    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    Frequency maps of surnames in the Italian regions. What do the Italian forum members think?italianismo_cognomi.jpg

    Sent from my SM-G930F using Eupedia Forum mobile app

  7. #157
    Regular Member Achievements:
    Three Friends1 year registered25000 Experience Points
    Awards:
    Community Award
    Salento's Avatar
    Join Date
    30-05-17
    Posts
    2,705
    Points
    28,730
    Level
    52
    Points: 28,730, Level: 52
    Level completed: 8%, Points required for next Level: 1,020
    Overall activity: 99.2%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    T1a2 -Z19945
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H12a

    Ethnic group
    Italian
    Country: United States



    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by italouruguayan View Post
    Frequency maps of surnames in the Italian regions. What do the Italian forum members think?italianismo_cognomi.jpg

    Sent from my SM-G930F using Eupedia Forum mobile app
    Many are the most popular Surnames, and they match the Territory. imo

  8. #158
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered1000 Experience Points
    italouruguayan's Avatar
    Join Date
    21-04-17
    Location
    Montevideo, Uruguay
    Posts
    124
    Points
    4,622
    Level
    19
    Points: 4,622, Level: 19
    Level completed: 93%, Points required for next Level: 28
    Overall activity: 15.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1B U106 L44
    MtDNA haplogroup
    A2

    Ethnic group
    Mixed , mostly Italian
    Country: Uruguay



    The number of " Uruguayan surnames" in Liguria surprises me: Calcagno, Bruzzone, Zunino, Canepa, Parodi, Traverso, Repetto, Poggi....italianismo_cognomi-01.jpg

    Sent from my SM-G930F using Eupedia Forum mobile app

Page 7 of 7 FirstFirst ... 567

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •