Eupedia Forums
Site NavigationEupedia Top > Eupedia Forum & Japan Forum
Results 1 to 17 of 17

Thread: Y Chromosome Sequences Reveal a Short Beringian Standstill, Rapid Expansion, and earl

  1. #1
    Advisor Achievements:
    Three FriendsVeteran25000 Experience Points
    bicicleur's Avatar
    Join Date
    27-01-13
    Location
    Zwevegem, Belgium
    Posts
    5,281
    Points
    43,263
    Level
    64
    Points: 43,263, Level: 64
    Level completed: 25%, Points required for next Level: 987
    Overall activity: 41.0%


    Country: Belgium - Flanders



    5 out of 5 members found this post helpful.

    Y Chromosome Sequences Reveal a Short Beringian Standstill, Rapid Expansion, and earl

    https://www.cell.com/current-biology...gg2cetTqTWGgJM

    Highlights

    We sequenced 20 Native American Y chromosomes chosen for their genetic diversity

    A Beringian Standstill of <4,600 years led to both Siberian and American Y-lineages

    Y-lineage split times rule out occupation of the Americas before 19,500 years ago

    Present-day male population structure in South America arose before 12,000 years ago


  2. #2
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1000 Experience Points1 year registered
    Joey37's Avatar
    Join Date
    11-06-18
    Location
    Coventry, Rhode Island
    Posts
    273
    Points
    2,942
    Level
    15
    Points: 2,942, Level: 15
    Level completed: 64%, Points required for next Level: 108
    Overall activity: 25.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1a-YP445
    MtDNA haplogroup
    J1c2b

    Ethnic group
    Celto-Germanic
    Country: USA - Rhode Island



    Wow, they really got down to South America fast, only 7,500 years between general American occupation and South American male population structure was complete.

  3. #3
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered
    Tutkun Arnaut's Avatar
    Join Date
    31-03-18
    Posts
    278

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    I2a2a(m223)(L801)

    Country: Albania



    Quote Originally Posted by Joey37 View Post
    Wow, they really got down to South America fast, only 7,500 years between general American occupation and South American male population structure was complete.
    7500 years is not fast. They were hunter gathers, so any extra child would put pressure on their food security. To release that pressure they needed to move to new territories. American Indians are known for Geronticide, which meant they killed their elders to preserve food. It was practiced by Inuit's until lately. Infanticide was used by African hunter gathers.

  4. #4
    Satyavrata Achievements:
    Three FriendsRecommendation First ClassVeteran50000 Experience PointsTagger First Class
    Maciamo's Avatar
    Join Date
    17-07-02
    Location
    Lothier
    Posts
    8,692
    Points
    689,607
    Level
    100
    Points: 689,607, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 10.0%


    Ethnic group
    Italo-celto-germanic
    Country: Belgium - Brussels



    2 out of 2 members found this post helpful.
    It was already known that Q1a-L54 was found among ancient Hunnic and Alanic genomes (L330 branch), but also in modern Scandinavia and in places settled by the Vikings (L804 branch). The Scandinavian branch was estimated to have split from the main Amerindian branch (M3) 15 kya by Yfull and 17 kya by this paper. I did not have much information on the Z780 branch, which split before that. It turns out that it was also Amerindian, including Clovis/Anzick. In other words, the Scandinavian L804 branch emerged from the same founding population as those who would become the Native Americans. It's just that this branch went back west from Bering and crossed all Siberia until Scandinavia. That explains why some Northern Europeans have traces of Beringian and Amerindian-like autosomal DNA (e.g. in Harappa World K=16).

    My book selection---Follow me on Facebook and Twitter --- My profile on Academia.edu and on ResearchGate ----Check Wa-pedia's Japan Guide
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    "What is the use of living, if it be not to strive for noble causes and to make this muddled world a better place for those who will live in it after we are gone?", Winston Churchill.

  5. #5
    Enfant Terrible Achievements:
    1 year registered500 Experience Points
    Wonomyro's Avatar
    Join Date
    06-08-17
    Posts
    462
    Points
    890
    Level
    7
    Points: 890, Level: 7
    Level completed: 70%, Points required for next Level: 60
    Overall activity: 35.0%


    Country: Croatia



    Quote Originally Posted by Maciamo View Post
    In other words, the Scandinavian L804 branch emerged from the same founding population as those who would become the Native Americans. It's just that this branch went back west from Bering and crossed all Siberia until Scandinavia. That explains why some Northern Europeans have traces of Beringian and Amerindian-like autosomal DNA (e.g. in Harappa World K=16).
    Could it be that they arrived from Greenland or Iceland?

    Greenland has been politically and culturally associated with Europe (specifically Norway and Denmark, the colonial powers, as well as the nearby island of Iceland) for more than a millennium.[9] The majority of its residents are Inuit, whose ancestors began migrating from the Canadian mainland in the 13th century, gradually settling across the island.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inuit
    Neopisivo

  6. #6
    Advisor Achievements:
    Three FriendsVeteran25000 Experience Points
    bicicleur's Avatar
    Join Date
    27-01-13
    Location
    Zwevegem, Belgium
    Posts
    5,281
    Points
    43,263
    Level
    64
    Points: 43,263, Level: 64
    Level completed: 25%, Points required for next Level: 987
    Overall activity: 41.0%


    Country: Belgium - Flanders



    Quote Originally Posted by Wonomyro View Post
    Could it be that they arrived from Greenland or Iceland?



    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inuit
    If so, you'd expect some traces of it in Iceland.
    And a more recent TMRCA.

    https://www.yfull.com/tree/Q-L804/

  7. #7
    Enfant Terrible Achievements:
    1 year registered500 Experience Points
    Wonomyro's Avatar
    Join Date
    06-08-17
    Posts
    462
    Points
    890
    Level
    7
    Points: 890, Level: 7
    Level completed: 70%, Points required for next Level: 60
    Overall activity: 35.0%


    Country: Croatia



    Quote Originally Posted by bicicleur View Post
    If so, you'd expect some traces of it in Iceland.
    And a more recent TMRCA.
    https://www.yfull.com/tree/Q-L804/
    I actually found two Icelanders in the tree.

    Ok. Iceland was probably uninhabited before the first Norse people arrived. However, the Greenlanders have a long history of contacts with Europeans.

    Today, most Greenlanders are bilingual speakers of Kalaallisut and Danish and most trace their lineage to the first Inuit that came to Greenland. The vast majority of ethnic Greenlanders reside in Greenland or elsewhere in Danish Realm, primarily Denmark proper (approximately 20,000 Greenlanders reside in Denmark proper). A small minority reside in other countries, mostly elsewhere in Scandinavia and North America. There are some Greenlanders who are multiracial, mostly due to Danish colonists and other Europeans marrying into Inuit families.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greenlandic_Inuit

  8. #8
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1000 Experience Points1 year registered

    Join Date
    30-09-16
    Posts
    174
    Points
    4,368
    Level
    19
    Points: 4,368, Level: 19
    Level completed: 30%, Points required for next Level: 282
    Overall activity: 4.0%


    Country: Canada



    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    One of the new ancient DNA samples from Lovelock Cave, Nevada, is on the Q-YP4004 branch (sister to Q-L54 under Q1a2a-L53). Q-Z780 and Q-M930 only share one SNP (M1107) that Q-L330 lacks, effectively a trifurcation of Q-L54.

    The new South American C-MPB373 sample is basal to the C-F4032/F1699 clade containing almost all known C2b-L1373; it seems to be at about the same position as YF's C2b* sample from Liaoning (ELT50074), possibly the same branch. North American C-P39 was already known to be within C-F3918 and roughly sister to North Asian C-F1756/B78 and Koryak C-B77, its position isn't nailed down any tighter. (The only other C-F3918 sample in this paper, Kazakh2, is ERS2478519 on YF tree.)

    So now both Amerindian Y hgs, Q1a2a-L53 and C2b-L1373, have intertwined American and Eurasian branches and no clean ancient split. Also worth noting is that all of the samples here are South American, and there may be additional Q branches (besides Arctic Q1a1a-NWT01) to be found in North America.

  9. #9
    Advisor Achievements:
    Three FriendsVeteran25000 Experience Points
    bicicleur's Avatar
    Join Date
    27-01-13
    Location
    Zwevegem, Belgium
    Posts
    5,281
    Points
    43,263
    Level
    64
    Points: 43,263, Level: 64
    Level completed: 25%, Points required for next Level: 987
    Overall activity: 41.0%


    Country: Belgium - Flanders



    In 2015 a new layer was found at Mesa Verde, Chili, dating human activity to 18.5 ka :

    Monte Verde Level I (MV-I)
    Monte Verde I is located under an outwash plain.[1] In 2013, Dillehay and his team returned to perform another excavation at Monte Verde.[1] In 2015, Monte Verde I was re-dated to around 18,500 to 14,500 BP.[1] Charcoal remains, charred animal bone fragments and several lithic artefacts, about 34% of which was derived from non-local sources, were discovered.[1]

    https://journals.plos.org/plosone/ar...l.pone.0141923

    This predates TRMCA for Q-Z780.
    Maybe they were the newly discovered C2-MBP373 ?

    Remains the question how they got there, the icefree corridors were supposed not to be open yet that early after LGM.

  10. #10
    Advisor Achievements:
    Three FriendsVeteran25000 Experience Points
    bicicleur's Avatar
    Join Date
    27-01-13
    Location
    Zwevegem, Belgium
    Posts
    5,281
    Points
    43,263
    Level
    64
    Points: 43,263, Level: 64
    Level completed: 25%, Points required for next Level: 987
    Overall activity: 41.0%


    Country: Belgium - Flanders



    Posth 2018
    Lapa do Santo, Brasil 9.6 ka, Y-DNA C2b, mtDNA C1d1
    CP19 9850 Brazil_LapaDoSanto_9600BP_related Brazil Lapa do Santo Brazil -19,4771833 -44,0380556 M C1d1 C2b 482320

  11. #11
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered1000 Experience Points

    Join Date
    27-02-18
    Posts
    12
    Points
    1,080
    Level
    8
    Points: 1,080, Level: 8
    Level completed: 65%, Points required for next Level: 70
    Overall activity: 0%


    Country: United States



    Quote Originally Posted by Maciamo View Post
    The Scandinavian branch was estimated to have split from the main Amerindian branch (M3) 15 kya by Yfull and 17 kya by this paper...It's just that this branch went back west from Bering and crossed all Siberia until Scandinavia. .
    It's much more likely this branch came to Europe from Greenland and not Siberia. So far all samples in YFull are from Iceland, Scandinavia and the British Isles. No sample from Eastern Europe.

  12. #12
    Banned Achievements:
    3 months registered1000 Experience PointsTagger Second Class

    Join Date
    22-07-18
    Posts
    377
    Points
    2,436
    Level
    13
    Points: 2,436, Level: 13
    Level completed: 96%, Points required for next Level: 14
    Overall activity: 12.0%


    Country: Romania



    deleted. wrong posted.

  13. #13
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1000 Experience Points1 year registered

    Join Date
    29-04-18
    Posts
    52
    Points
    1,684
    Level
    11
    Points: 1,684, Level: 11
    Level completed: 45%, Points required for next Level: 166
    Overall activity: 2.0%


    Country: Norway



    Quote Originally Posted by thejkhan View Post
    It's much more likely this branch came to Europe from Greenland and not Siberia. So far all samples in YFull are from Iceland, Scandinavia and the British Isles. No sample from Eastern Europe.
    Are any of the Scandinavian samples older than the 10th century?

  14. #14
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered1000 Experience Points

    Join Date
    27-02-18
    Posts
    12
    Points
    1,080
    Level
    8
    Points: 1,080, Level: 8
    Level completed: 65%, Points required for next Level: 70
    Overall activity: 0%


    Country: United States



    Quote Originally Posted by Gnarl View Post
    Are any of the Scandinavian samples older than the 10th century?
    No Q-L804 aDNA in the Yfull tree. All samples from living people.

  15. #15
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered5000 Experience Points
    I1a3_Young's Avatar
    Join Date
    03-05-17
    Location
    Arkansas
    Posts
    517
    Points
    7,957
    Level
    26
    Points: 7,957, Level: 26
    Level completed: 68%, Points required for next Level: 193
    Overall activity: 5.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    I1 Z63*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H5b1

    Ethnic group
    Basically British
    Country: USA - Arkansas



    Quote Originally Posted by thejkhan View Post
    It's much more likely this branch came to Europe from Greenland and not Siberia. So far all samples in YFull are from Iceland, Scandinavia and the British Isles. No sample from Eastern Europe.
    Are you saying that some population moved from Greenland to Europe carrying Q1A? What a bizarre thing to put forward if so.

    As for the post about aDNA not being on YFull, that is false. They have added older samples if they pass quality standards. SZ45 from the Lombard study in Hungary made it.

    Sent from my SM-G935V using Eupedia Forum mobile app
    Administrator of the Young Family Project
    Genetic genealogy enthusiast

  16. #16
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered1000 Experience Points

    Join Date
    27-02-18
    Posts
    12
    Points
    1,080
    Level
    8
    Points: 1,080, Level: 8
    Level completed: 65%, Points required for next Level: 70
    Overall activity: 0%


    Country: United States



    Quote Originally Posted by I1a3_Young View Post
    Are you saying that some population moved from Greenland to Europe carrying Q1A? What a bizarre thing to put forward if so.

    As for the post about aDNA not being on YFull, that is false. They have added older samples if they pass quality standards. SZ45 from the Lombard study in Hungary made it.

    Sent from my SM-G935V using Eupedia Forum mobile app

    Context. We were discussing branch Q-L804 only.

    There is no aDNA for this branch on Yfull.

    Yes, I am saying there may have possibly been population movement from Greenland to Europe -- the distribution of Q-L804 points to that possibility.

    So far no Q-L804 has been reported from Eastern Europe or Sibera. Majority of Q-L804 are from Iceland, Scandinavia and British Isles. Rarely from continental Europe.

    That's as far as I know. Correct me if I'm wrong about the distribution.

    Sibling clade Q-M3 is entirely Native American.

  17. #17
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1000 Experience Points1 year registered

    Join Date
    29-04-18
    Posts
    52
    Points
    1,684
    Level
    11
    Points: 1,684, Level: 11
    Level completed: 45%, Points required for next Level: 166
    Overall activity: 2.0%


    Country: Norway



    I do remember there was some Native American DNA got into the Icelandic gene pool. C1, most likly entered around the year 1000. So it is not that far-fetched. I don't think it'd be much of a population movement though, more likely one or a couple of individuals that got into the genepool.

    Interestingly, the C1 in Iceland turned out to be C1e -a new variant and not one of the Native American ones.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •