MyTrueAncestry Mytrueancestry.com

[Carlos]

Salento/Carlos: In regards to post 2894-2897 discussion, what could be going on with Carlos and Otzi is that Otzi is in the outlier samples. Just a guess on my part. Carlos, from me just looking at your Chroma analysis, you have "lots of matches from other parts of Europe" so maybe Otzi as Salento noted being more EEF from Italian peninsula might not make your top 100 matches. Did you try clicking on the top outlier option and seeing if Otzi's Kit number or reference sample shows up?

@Palermo @Salento

Right now my outliers are these.

137. Post-Reconquista Granada
147. Scythian Southern Moldova
188. North Roman Warrior
194. Roman Outlier Lombard Grave
209. Medieval Taifa of Valencia
214. Post-Roman Era Barcelona
216. Hungary Late Avar Szekkutas-Kapolnadulo
219. Late-Roman Era Montefrio Granada
222. Hispano-Roman Taifa of Valencia
224. Frankish-Gallic Lombard Grave
225. Bell Beaker Haunstetten Germany
233. Celtic Briton Gladiator York
236. Kornice Bronze Age Poland
238. Iberian Taifa of Valencia
239. Copper Age Iberia
241. Thuringii Tribe
242. Central Roman
244. Swiss Germanic
249. Medieval Denmark Odense

I have enough hunter but I have more farmer, really hunter life only that was not life

 

[Palermo Trapani]

@Palermo @Salento

Right now my outliers are these.

137. Post-Reconquista Granada
147. Scythian Southern Moldova
188. North Roman Warrior
194. Roman Outlier Lombard Grave
209. Medieval Taifa of Valencia
214. Post-Roman Era Barcelona
216. Hungary Late Avar Szekkutas-Kapolnadulo
219. Late-Roman Era Montefrio Granada
222. Hispano-Roman Taifa of Valencia
224. Frankish-Gallic Lombard Grave
225. Bell Beaker Haunstetten Germany
233. Celtic Briton Gladiator York
236. Kornice Bronze Age Poland
238. Iberian Taifa of Valencia
239. Copper Age Iberia
241. Thuringii Tribe
242. Central Roman
244. Swiss Germanic
249. Medieval Denmark Odense

I have enough hunter but I have more farmer, really hunter life only that was not life

Carlos: So you have Zeus option with Lighting bolts? How many matches does your level give you. I have Zeus so I get top 100 and then top outlier analysis gives me top ones but only up to 150, and I don't see all 50 outliers . So you could have Otzi in some of your non "unique outliers" to you as MTA calls it. They show me 15 top outliers but the first one they show me is my #108 from 468 BC Ancient Lebanon SFI-42 (so some Phoenician type ancestry there) and then 113 ( Roman R70) and then 121 (Bronze Age Anatolia from 2650 BC, I2499), etc. So MTA shows 15 top outliers and then they kind of tease you with "5 hidden outliers" For example, number 146 for me is Minoan I0074, which they label as hidden (but we all know who I0074 is), my number 149 match is Medieval Sardinia sample I12221. So of my top 50 outliers (matches 101 to 150), I know who 15 are and can figure out who 5 are, but there are still top 30 outliers that I don't have an idea who they are. I hope this makes sense, if you need me to clarify anything, please ask.

Sorry I can't post images but I hit my quota. I posted lots of stuff in two recent threads regarding Genetic structure of Italians and Sicilians-Pre Greek. So the "Force is no longer with me", need Obi One to help out!!

 

[Salento]

@PT https://imgur.com/

upload your images ... and then get a link ...

Easy with the PC, get the ‘BBCode’ link, copy and paste.

 

[Palermo Trapani]

@PT https://imgur.com/

upload your images ... and then get a link ...

Easy with the PC, get the ‘BBCode’ link.

Ok, imgur. Thanks Salento

 

[Palermo Trapani]

Thanks Salento

Salento: I think this will work. So MTA top outliers or (unique ones), 30 of them are still hidden so need to upgrade or buy a lightning bolt to see them. Anyway, thanks for the imgur suggestion.

 

[Duarte]

Hi folks. Nice @PT. Hello@Salento. Good afternoon.
Love you buddies. I prefer Ötzi, of course. He is a very charming EEF and much more real than an artistic representing.

But I like the WHG, also. Love their tanned skin. :grin:

I am going to the beach, after pandemic. I want to be equal to the artistic representation of this viril WHG.

I'm ready to start a virtual work meeting now at 3:30 pm with my coworkers (my community or my tribe. I don't really know what that means, lol, ).

Cheers

 

[Palermo Trapani]

Hello Duarte: That is La Brana WHG, or forensic artist rendition of him, correct? Personally I think that rendition of WHG is much more accurate than others I have seen. Facial and Hair phenotypes are all European/ Eurasian just with dark tan. So help my memory, La Brana did not have SLC24A5 AA and SLC45A2 GG (I think those are correct) but did have the allele for OCA2 for blue eyes?

 

[Duarte]

Hello Duarte: That is La Brana WHG, or forensic artist rendition of him, correct? Personally I think that rendition of WHG is much more accurate than others I have seen. Facial and Hair phenotypes are all European/ Eurasian just with dark tan. So help my memory, La Brana did not have SLC24A5 AA and SLC45A2 GG (I think those are correct) but did have the allele for OCA2 for blue eyes?

Yes. You’re right. The artistic representation is of La Brana. I have no deep matches with him. But I have many deep matches with Louschbour in the Gedmatch Deep Dive, which has a similar fenotype to LaBrana.

Cheers

 

[Palermo Trapani]

Duarte: Ok thanks!

 

[Duarte]

Duarte: Ok thanks!

PS: As for blue eyes, I have many doubts about these artistic representations. This phenotype is not dominant among modern Europeans, even among those more loaded with WHG. The phenotypic composition of the color of the eyes is much more complex than that indicate by a single gene. My older brother has solid amber eyes (beautiful eyes). My late sister did have light brown eyes, with deposits of the pigment eumelanin (yellow) on the outside of the iris. We are uterine brothers with very different eye colors.

 

[Palermo Trapani]

Duarte: Well I agree I think it is hard to predict phenotypes that far back. There was a thread about Alleles for Skin Pigmentation and eyes base on a pre-print article by Ian Mathieson who was been involved in several papers on ancient ancestry from West Eurasia. I think that rendition was based on the findings from the paper by Olade et al. 2014 "Derived immune and ancestral pigmentation alleles in a 7,000-year-old Mesolithic European" which suggested darker pigment and blue eyes. You are correct, this phenotype is no longer in Europe as the authors state "The genotypic combination leading to a predictedphenotype of dark skin and non-brown eyes is unique and no longer present in contemporary European populations." (page 227).

 

[Carlos]

Carlos: So you have Zeus option with Lighting bolts? How many matches does your level give you. I have Zeus so I get top 100 and then top outlier analysis gives me top ones but only up to 150, and I don't see all 50 outliers . So you could have Otzi in some of your non "unique outliers" to you as MTA calls it. They show me 15 top outliers but the first one they show me is my #108 from 468 BC Ancient Lebanon SFI-42 (so some Phoenician type ancestry there) and then 113 ( Roman R70) and then 121 (Bronze Age Anatolia from 2650 BC, I2499), etc. So MTA shows 15 top outliers and then they kind of tease you with "5 hidden outliers" For example, number 146 for me is Minoan I0074, which they label as hidden (but we all know who I0074 is), my number 149 match is Medieval Sardinia sample I12221. So of my top 50 outliers (matches 101 to 150), I know who 15 are and can figure out who 5 are, but there are still top 30 outliers that I don't have an idea who they are. I hope this makes sense, if you need me to clarify anything, please ask.

Sorry I can't post images but I hit my quota. I posted lots of stuff in two recent threads regarding Genetic structure of Italians and Sicilians-Pre Greek. So the "Force is no longer with me", need Obi One to help out!!

bolt V and bolt Vl 25 more samples each. It is too much not going to stop I would never wait for an offer, we'll see.

 

[ratchet_fan]

Hello Duarte: That is La Brana WHG, or forensic artist rendition of him, correct? Personally I think that rendition of WHG is much more accurate than others I have seen. Facial and Hair phenotypes are all European/ Eurasian just with dark tan. So help my memory, La Brana did not have SLC24A5 AA and SLC45A2 GG (I think those are correct) but did have the allele for OCA2 for blue eyes?

I made a thread abut this but many Northern Europeans have features that for a lack of a better words are "less sharp" than La Brana. Do you think this is a later northern adaptation or related to ENA in steppe and such?

 

[Palermo Trapani]

bolt V and bolt Vl 25 more samples each. It is too much not going to stop I would never wait for an offer, we'll see.

Carlos:

I will probably get around to buying some bolts. But it looks like they are $49 dollars per bolt (5 Bolt Levels), unless the cost per bolt decreases as you buy a new Bolt. Still, I doubt that the total cost of the 5 Bolts will be less than upgrading to Olympus which is $149 dollars (incremental cost above what I have already paid for Zeus) From what I gathered reading the Olympus description, the Olympus level seems to allow you to take the ancient samples and make a Kit for them and do I guess autosomal type one to one comparison similar to one to one GEDMATCH comparisons. I doubt you can take the KIT you created for an ancient sample and download it and run it on various Dodecad, MDLP, Eurogenes Calculators. But maybe you can.

 

[Palermo Trapani]

I made a thread abut this but many Northern Europeans have features that for a lack of a better words are "less sharp" than La Brana. Do you think this is a later northern adaptation or related to ENA in steppe and such?

Hey ratchet_fan: Well to be honest, that is a question that I haven't given much thought to. There is some evidence of Ancient Asian admixture into Northern Europe/Scandanavia, or maybe some parts of it, I think the extant research has documented that. But I have tried to stay in my own Lane so to speak here at Eupedia. So in that context, I tend to only drop in and post on forums dealing with Italian DNA broadly defined (Ancient Rome, Mesolithic Italy, Ancient Sicily, and modern Italian DNA studies) and Ancient Greece (since I have based on MTA 6 DNA matches from the samples used by Lazaridis et al 2017 paper). If I venture from the "Lanes" noted above, I will post on Iberian forums as I have gotten to know Carlos and Duarte well here and I will maybe post on archaic DNA forums.

So I would rather not speculate on what happened in Northern Europe before reading much more on it. But my general understanding (and that is all it is) is that it seems that since Northern Europeans have more ANE/EHG/Steppe type ancestry, which is pretty well established across numerous studies, some ancient Asian admixture is there? . It seems way way way back, American Indian/South American Indians also have some ancient ANE type ancestry from ancient Siberia, which I guess your "ENA" is referring to in Steppe, since some ancient Asian admixture was in Russia during Mesolithic period, which of course, predates the Steppe migration, some may have arrived via Steppe and is part of the ancestry of some modern Northern Europeans (maybe Estonia and Finland, perhaps others?) Just from reading some of your posts, you seem much more in tune to what happened North of the Alps and more so in Scandinavia that I do. So again, nothing I wrote in my 2nd paragraph is meant to be a definitive statement by me as I said, not my Lane that I drive in here.

This is a recent paper that I briefly read and it documents in one Steppe site dating to about 1,700 BC, the ancestry was 25% East Asian from some Siberian Hunter Gatherers. I think this paper is the first one to use Western Siberian Hunter Gather (WSHG) and Eastern Siberian Hunter Gather (ESHG). There is a thread about this paper. However, as I noted, I stay in my own Lane so I did not comment on the paper in the thread, but as I noted, I did read over the paper.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6822619/


Cheers

 

[Duarte]

PS: As for blue eyes, I have many doubts about these artistic representations. This phenotype is not dominant among modern Europeans, even among those more loaded with WHG. The phenotypic composition of the color of the eyes is much more complex than that indicate by a single gene. My older brother has solid amber eyes (beautiful eyes). My late sister did have light brown eyes, with deposits of the pigment eumelanin (yellow) on the outside of the iris. We are uterine brothers with very different eye colors.

Excuse me dear friends. I made a little bit error in this post (and maybe a great mistake because we are talking about genetics). My siblings and I are blood brothers (children of the same father and mother) and not uterine brothers (children of the same mother and different father). Sorry.:grin:
When I posted I was worried about the work meeting I was going to participate in. I didn't focused to what I was writing.:startled:

 

[Palermo Trapani]

Excuse me dear friends. I made a little bit error in this post (and maybe a great mistake because we are talking about genetics). My siblings and I are blood brothers (children of the same father and mother) and not uterine brothers (children of the same mother and different father). Sorry.:grin:
When I posted I was worried about the work meeting I was going to participate in. I didn't focused to what I was writing.:startled:

Ok, I hope your Mother didn't read that post before you edited it :grin:, LOL.

 

[Salento]

@Salento.
When I started here at Eupedia I believed to to have a bastard ancestral (one or more then one). 600,000 Portuguese arrived in the Captaincy of Minas Gerais in the middle of the 18th century, the largest European immigration to the Americas in colonial times. They arrived to organize the administration and definitively submit the Captaincy of Minas Gerais to the control of the Portuguese Crown. It was the gold rush. A few adventurers from other European countries also came. There weren't many, but they were there. Colonial America: I believe in all possibilities. But I believe that my autosomal DNA and my yDNA attest quite conclusively to a predominant ancestry of the northwest and northeast of the Iberian Peninsula. The possibility of a bastard ancestor in colonial Portuguese America, until proven otherwise, is ruled out.
It will be? :grin:

Excuse me dear friends. I made a little bit error in this post (and maybe a great mistake because we are talking about genetics). My siblings and I are blood brothers (children of the same father and mother) and not uterine brothers (children of the same mother and different father). Sorry.:grin:
When I posted I was worried about the work meeting I was going to participate in. I didn't focused to what I was writing.:startled:

I believe you :grin:

 

[Duarte]

I believe you :grin:

Thank you. I feel better now :grin:

 

[ratchet_fan]

Hey ratchet_fan: Well to be honest, that is a question that I haven't given much thought to. There is some evidence of Ancient Asian admixture into Northern Europe/Scandanavia, or maybe some parts of it, I think the extant research has documented that. But I have tried to stay in my own Lane so to speak here at Eupedia. So in that context, I tend to only drop in and post on forums dealing with Italian DNA broadly defined (Ancient Rome, Mesolithic Italy, Ancient Sicily, and modern Italian DNA studies) and Ancient Greece (since I have based on MTA 6 DNA matches from the samples used by Lazaridis et al 2017 paper). If I venture from the "Lanes" noted above, I will post on Iberian forums as I have gotten to know Carlos and Duarte well here and I will maybe post on archaic DNA forums.

So I would rather not speculate on what happened in Northern Europe before reading much more on it. But my general understanding (and that is all it is) is that it seems that since Northern Europeans have more ANE/EHG/Steppe type ancestry, which is pretty well established across numerous studies, some ancient Asian admixture is there? . It seems way way way back, American Indian/South American Indians also have some ancient ANE type ancestry from ancient Siberia, which I guess your "ENA" is referring to in Steppe, since some ancient Asian admixture was in Russia during Mesolithic period, which of course, predates the Steppe migration, some may have arrived via Steppe and is part of the ancestry of some modern Northern Europeans (maybe Estonia and Finland, perhaps others?) Just from reading some of your posts, you seem much more in tune to what happened North of the Alps and more so in Scandinavia that I do. So again, nothing I wrote in my 2nd paragraph is meant to be a definitive statement by me as I said, not my Lane that I drive in here.

This is a recent paper that I briefly read and it documents in one Steppe site dating to about 1,700 BC, the ancestry was 25% East Asian from some Siberian Hunter Gatherers. I think this paper is the first one to use Western Siberian Hunter Gather (WSHG) and Eastern Siberian Hunter Gather (ESHG). There is a thread about this paper. However, as I noted, I stay in my own Lane so I did not comment on the paper in the thread, but as I noted, I did read over the paper.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6822619/


Cheers

Well the ENA applies to Southern and Central Europeans too if the models are correct (and we're not missing some sort of archaic ghost population),

If the models are correct (and IF is the key word here because I think people are fitting whatever fits their agenda tbh)

1. Anatolia_N is ~5% East Eurasian.
2. Southern Europeans have additional Caucasus/Iran related ancestry. If it is more CHG like then there is significant ENA from the ANE in CHG. If it is Iran_N like then there is even more ENA from the ANE in Iran_N in addition to the 20-30% ENA/AASI that Iran_N has.
3. There is ENA in the WHG that all Europeans have.
4. There is obviously ENA in steppe component which every European has (even Sardinians).

I saw a model that showed the French as 20% East Eurasian. Obviously we can expect lower but significantly different from 0 in places like Sardinia, Sicily, Southern Italy, and Greece. And slightly higher in places like the Uk, Germanosphere and Slavs. Finns and Estonians are outliers because they have actual ENA ancestry from the Iron Age onwards.