Is there any linguistic evidence to prove Goths came from Scandinavia?

For what it's worth, there was a Gaulish god called Esus, Hesus, Haesus, Aesus, or Aisus - all spellings indifferently used by Lucan (1st century AD), who reported its existence, among others.

See also :

aisus represents the Gaulish divine name Aisus, recorded as Aisu-, Esu-, Esus, Aesu-, Aesus, Haesus, Hesus in inscriptions and in Latin manuscripts. The form in the present text is a masculine u-stem and stands in the vocative case; the vocative of u-stems was identical with the nominative. It is a widespread stem in religious terms and is attested in the languages of ancient Italy, e.g. Umbr. esono- 'divinus, sacer', esunu (neuter) 'sacrificium', Oscan Marruc. aisos (nom. pl.) 'dii', Paelig. aisis (dat. pl.) 'diis', Messap. aisa, which perhaps are loanwords from Etruscan, cf. Etr. aesar 'deus', aisuna 'divine'. Venetic aisu- 'god' also belongs here. Further, there is an interesting correspondence of these words in Old Norse, eir, f., which occurs as the name of a goddess of medicine, and derives from *aisa via *aizō.

From : "A Gaulish Incantation in Marcellus of Bordeaux" by Gustav Must, Language, Vol. 36, No. 2, Part 1. (Apr.-Jun., 1960), pp. 193-197.
 
For what it's worth, there was a Gaulish god called Esus, Hesus, Haesus, Aesus, or Aisus - all spellings indifferently used by Lucan (1st century AD), who reported its existence, among others.

See also :

Isus/Insus was the chief god of the Elamites, Susa, capital of Elamite and Persian empires, named after this god.
 
Are gods names of supposed same origins the better criteria to appreciate ethnies proximities?
 
Are gods names of supposed same origins the better criteria to appreciate ethnies proximities?

And that's even assuming that those god and tribal names are actually true cognates and not just sound-alikes, because mere similarities of sounds in some words are never a very scientifically reliable evidence of actual phylogenetic relationship between languages, particularly not in words that are unstable, easily replaced and easily transferred to other peoples.
 
I think there is rather a resemblance between Ancient West Germanic languages and Gothic.
Gothic, if you read a little ,is not having some typical sounds for North Germanic languages.
Goths and a part of Visigoths actually settled on the land of Romania and this is said in multiple historic sources.
Also, Romania was named more than 200 years Gothia, or the country of the Goths.
So we can clearly conclude that Romanians should have a lot if not most paternal lines from the Goths.
 
Btw, who were the Germanii that Cyrus defeated? :grin:
 
Ancient DNA from Goths and other Eastern Germans shows R1b-U106 and I1.

Not only this, but we've found I1-L1237 in Wielbark era in Poland (Wielbark being the cultural complex that the Goths, Gepids and Rugii were in), and mtDNA study of the same cultural complex showed a connection between the Jutland Iron Age and the Wielbark, especially among the males in the ancient samples.

For example mention some words from other languages in the north of Europe in Gothic, like from Finno-Ugric or Balto-Slavic, ...
Not specific words, but an interesting read anyway:
https://indo-european.eu/2018/06/pre-germanic-born-out-of-a-proto-finnic-substrate-in-scandinavia/

If anyone's interested, this is a very good paper about the Germanic ethnogenesis with an eastern focus:

https://www.academia.edu/37471966/I..._in_southern_and_central_Poland_300_BC_10_AD_


The (likely) Gothic split can be seen in the gradual colonization of the Polish plain.

Good read.

The similarity between the names of Guti (modern Gotvand) and Goth can be a coincidence but what about the names of almost all other people who lived in the centeral and western Iran before the arrival of Iranian tribes in the 1st millennium BC? Such as Suedin (modern Suteh), Alman (modern Uraman), Asgard (modern Asgerd), Germani (modern Kerman), Semnonen (modern Semnan), Saksen (modern Saqqez), Danes (modern Danian), ...

Search these words in Google Books.

rrlh_suedin.jpg


zjeu_almanguti.jpg

This is a leap, similar sounding or looking words do not necessarily equate a connection, this is a leap.

I believe the original land of Germanic people was Asgard (Asagarta in Old Persian and Sagartia in ancient Greek sources), as you read about Asgard: https://pagan.wikia.org/wiki/Asgard In the Prologue Snorri offers his own de-paganized interpretation of Asgard. As-gard, he conjectures, is the home of the Aesir (singular Ás) in As-ia, making an etymological connection between the three "As-"; that is, the Aesir were "men of Asia", not gods, but the speakers of the original Germanic language, who moved from Asia to the north and intermarried with the peoples already there. This interpretation of the 13th century foreshadows 20th century views of Indo-European migration from the east.
This sounds an awful lot like Thor Heyerdahl's stuff, which is unfortunate because well... y'know...

Odin came from Asia (Scythia) and conquered Northern Europe.

This again sounds like Heyerdahl stuff... which is unfortunate... because well... I won't go into it here.


I asked about it in this thread: https://www.eupedia.com/forum/threads/37186-Where-was-Germania According to Herodotus, the Germanii were neighbor of Danes and people of Asgard.

Germanii and Germani are coincidences at best. Many names that Herodotus 1.125 mentioned cannot be identified, any that are identifiable ones are from parts of the Persian Empire, distances apart. His Germanioi were a reference to the inhabitants of Karmania/Carmania, a name of an Achaemenid satrapy. This has absolutely nothing to do with the Germani of the Gallic Wars. Again mentions of Asgard, and all sounds very much like Thor Heyerdahl... hardly credible.
 
Is there any linguistic evidence to prove Goths came from Scandinavia

I didnt get any replies on my question about ways to assess an IRS design without software so Im guessing that means thats not a viable option. Is there any reasonably priced software - lets say 150 or less? Or is it all way more than that?
 
Sorry to say, but the examples you give don't prove much. The words and sounds you mention were all over Europe (as IE cognates) in proto-historic times.

SOAP : Old English sape "soap, salve" (originally a reddish hair dye used by Germanic warriors to give a frightening appearance), from Proto-Germanic *saipon "dripping thing, resin", from PIE *soi-bon-, from root *seib- "to pour out, drip, trickle" (source also of Latin sebum "tallow, suet, grease").

BURG : Old English burg, burh "a dwelling or dwellings within a fortified enclosure," from Proto-Germanic *burgs "hill fort, fortress", from PIE root *bhergh- "high," with derivatives referring to hills, hill forts, and fortified elevations. Cp. : Sanskrit b'rhant "high," brmhati "strengthens, elevates;" Avestan brzant- "high," Old Persian bard- "be high;" Greek Pergamos, name of the citadel of Troy; Old Church Slavonic bregu "mountain, height;" Old Irish brigh "mountain;" Welsh bera "stack, pyramid;" Old Gaulish brigas "hill".

FORK : Old English forca, force "pitchfork, forked instrument, forked weapon," from a Germanic borrowing of Latin furca "two-pronged fork; pitchfork; fork used in cooking,".

The velar sound in German "acht" was not specific to Germanic in pre-Roman days. See, eg, Old Gaulish ordinal numbers:
- 6th suexos (modern Welsh chweched, Breton c'hwec'hved)
- 7th sextametos (Old Irish sechtmad)
- 8th oxtumetos (OIr ochtmad)

Even modern Romanian surely have some borrowing from Gothic, that were not identified.
Your post just showed me that how Romanians are calling the Soap:
Săpun is a borrowing from Gothic or even a remnant from ancient Dacian (which might have been a part East Germanic language also).
ă is the Schwa sound, so is not a pure a sound.
I understand Albanian have a few Gothic borrowings also.
But, what is known is that 400 words, or so, from Spanish, are of Germanic origins.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Spanish_words_of_Germanic_origin
The Spanish words of Germanic origins are suggesting that the Gothic tribes were not speaking a language derived from Old Norse, because these words are rather related to West Germanic.
Romanians also have crap for carp (the fish).
What is more fun is that both Romanians and Spaniards are using Franc to tell to some coins, used as money.
Maybe this is not because of the Goths but because during Holy Roman Empire that currency was used in Romania and Spain.
In fact, even the cardinal points in Romanian are cognate to Germanic:
Est, Vest, Sud, Nord.
Surely are not coming from Latin.
Romanian have 1.5% of the words cognate to West Germanic, which is weird.

One of the most weird cognates between Romanian and Scandinavian is:
To suck - English
Suge - Romanian
Suga - Swedish
Sjuga - Icelandic
Suge - Norwegian
:)
 
There are also some weird cognates between South Slavic languages and Scandinavian, which cannot be attributed to Latin and are not found in other Slavic languages.
For example:
English: Chair
Bulgarian,SerboCroatian: stol,stolica
Swedish: stol
Norwegian: stol
Icelandic: stoll
Gothic has also for chair stol.
So, there are words in Gothic common to Scandinavian.
 
A strange word that is found in Romanian and is a direct cognate to Scandinavian and Gothic(see that were more Gothic tribes and most settled in Romania) is gard:
Romanian: gard - meaning, in English, fence
Old Saxon: gardo
Gothic: gard
Norwegian Bokmål: gard
Norwegian: gjerde
Icelandic: girðing

Swedish have another word, Danish have another word.

Surely you could find more words of early Gothic origins in the Romanian that was spoken around 1800 AD, after which Romanian got a lot more Romance borrowings.
Romanian got Slavic borrowings, after the Slavic migration from 600-700 AD and is possible that some or more words that were taken from Gothic were lost, being replaced with Slavic words.
This, in addition to the Romanization process through which Romanian passed due to the influence of Eastern Roman Empire/Byzantine Empire.
 
A strange word that is found in Romanian and is a direct cognate to Scandinavian and Gothic(see that were more Gothic tribes and most settled in Romania) is gard:
Romanian: gard - meaning, in English, fence
Old Saxon: gardo
Gothic: gard
Norwegian Bokmål: gard
Norwegian: gjerde
Icelandic: girðing

These words also exist in albanian:

Gardh = fence
Stol = bench
 
It survives in English as "yard" (not the measurement). It also survived in English through Anglo-Norman in the form of "garden". Stool still survives in English though with a slightly different meaning, however the object generally called a "stool" is still a seat, but not a chair. Stool still retains the original "chair" meaning in certain dialects of English (notably in Scotland).
 
it seems to me a pan-germanic word by origin, whose meaning was firstly centered around "enclosed place", "enclose village", "fortified place", subsequent drifted meanings and derived words being "village", "town", "fortress", "garden" and so on, according to diminishing or magnifying evolutions (germ- ‘gard-’, ‘gaard-’, ‘gart-’, ‘yard’). Seemignly linked to Welsh 'garth' and Breton 'garzh', to Latin 'hort-', and more closely to Slavics 'grad', 'hrad', 'gorod' ("town") but also 'gradina' (bulg. "garden"); maybe the root here under :
g̑herdh-, and gherdh-
IE g̑hesto-
to gird, enclose, encompass

the balancing between significations alike "town", "village", "fortress" "fence" and "garden" are very common among IE languages ; see 'town', 'tuin', 'zaun' (English: "town", Dutch: "garden", German: "fence") .
 
I think there is rather a resemblance between Ancient West Germanic languages and Gothic.
Gothic, if you read a little ,is not having some typical sounds for North Germanic languages.
Goths and a part of Visigoths actually settled on the land of Romania and this is said in multiple historic sources.
Also, Romania was named more than 200 years Gothia, or the country of the Goths.
So we can clearly conclude that Romanians should have a lot if not most paternal lines from the Goths.

The reason for that is simple: Goths are supposed to have migrated south of Scandinavia before Proto-Norse (aka the earliest forms of North Germanic language) were formed, and Proto-Germanic had just started to diverge into distinct languages. Similarities between Ancient West Germanic and Gothic may simply indicate they shared later innovations or they simply missed later innovations that took place in North Germanic areas.
 
A strange word that is found in Romanian and is a direct cognate to Scandinavian and Gothic(see that were more Gothic tribes and most settled in Romania) is gard:
Romanian: gard - meaning, in English, fence
Old Saxon: gardo
Gothic: gard
Norwegian Bokmål: gard
Norwegian: gjerde
Icelandic: girðing

Swedish have another word, Danish have another word.

Surely you could find more words of early Gothic origins in the Romanian that was spoken around 1800 AD, after which Romanian got a lot more Romance borrowings.
Romanian got Slavic borrowings, after the Slavic migration from 600-700 AD and is possible that some or more words that were taken from Gothic were lost, being replaced with Slavic words.
This, in addition to the Romanization process through which Romanian passed due to the influence of Eastern Roman Empire/Byzantine Empire.

In Bulgarian

Ograda /Ограда/- Fence
Ograjdam/Ограждам/ - Fence in
Gradina /Градина/ - The garden
Grad /Град/ - Town
Gradya/Gradej //Градя/Градеж//- I'm building
Sgrada /Сграда/ - Building
Ograzhden /Огра̀жден /- A mountain is enclosed in southwestern Bulgaria and northern Macedonia
 

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