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Thread: Suliotet

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    Suliotet



    I always have a genuine interest for the history of Suliotes, who they were, what was their ethnicity, where did they end up after Suli fall.


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    Last edited by blevins13; 02-05-19 at 22:40.

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    Suliotet

    In here we can also discuss this huge movie of the Greek Cinematography:
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eC9WIetv2ic


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    we have discuss it before 2-3 years,
    you can search for it in the forum search.
    ΟΘΕΝ ΑΙΔΩΣ OY EINAI
    ΑΤΗ ΛΑΜΒΑΝΕΙΝ ΑΥΤΟΙΣ
    ΥΒΡΙΣ ΓΕΝΝΑΤΑΙ
    ΝΕΜΕΣΙΣ ΚΑΙ ΤΙΣΗ ΑΚΟΛΟΥΘΟΥΣΙ ΔΕ

    When there is no shame
    Divine blindness conquers them
    Hybris (abuse, opprombium) is born
    Nemesis and punishment follows.

    Εχε υπομονη Ηρωα
    Η τιμωρια δεν αργει.

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    1 out of 2 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by blevins13 View Post
    I always have a genuine interest for the history of Suliotes, who they were, what was their ethnicity, where did they and up after Suli fall.


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    They were Albanians, Orthodox Chams.
    After the fall of Suli they founded new villages in Greece (in Peloponnese if i am not wrong) and in Albania.
    17 Dec.
    Paget to the Council.

    Now the Council's letters seem to imply (words quoted) that the King will keep no strangers save the Albanoys.

    Cales, 17 Dec. 1545. Signed.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post
    we have discuss it before 2-3 years,
    you can search for it in the forum search.
    I searched did not find it.....do you have the full version of the movie ......post it if you have it.


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    Quote Originally Posted by LABERIA View Post
    They were Albanians, Orthodox Chams.
    After the fall of Suli they founded new villages in Greece (in Peloponnese if i am not wrong) and in Albania.
    you mean Bulgaria,

    and no were not albanian Orthodox chams,
    they were a confederation of Albanians, Serbs, Greeks, etc,
    AND NONE of them was local,
    they all came from elsewhere,
    Souliotes had nothing to do with Chams,
    Chams call them Greket

    In Fact Laberia can you tell us who was their enemy, and why?
    And why were pulled out from their land?

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    1 out of 2 members found this post helpful.
    Termi Sul is considered Albanian, which can be idiomatically interpreted as 'watchpost', 'lookout' or 'mountain summit'.In a study by scholar Petros Fourikis examining the onomastics of Souli, most of the toponyms and micro-toponyms such as: Kiafa, Koungi, Bira, Goura, Mourga, Feriza, Stret(h)eza, Dembes, Vreku i Vetetimese, Sen i Prempte and so on were found to be derived from the Albanian language.


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    1 out of 2 members found this post helpful.

    Suliotet

    Quote Originally Posted by blevins13 View Post
    In here we can also discuss this huge movie of the Greek Cinematography:
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eC9WIetv2ic


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    The movie is shameful Greek propaganda, the Albanian Lab are dressed up as Turks, while The Albanian Suliotes are shown as Greeks. They spoke Albanian with each others and is Albanian fighting Albanians. I don’t know what Greeks want in this Albanian blood feud. This is how the Albanian Labs dressed at that time.

    IMG_3242.jpg

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    1 out of 3 members found this post helpful.
    Edward Lear
    For companions he relied instead on friends and correspondents, and especially, during later life, on his Albanian Souliote chef, Giorgis, a faithful friend and, as Lear complained, a thoroughly unsatisfactory chef.[15]
    After a long decline in his health, Lear died at his villa in 1888 of heart disease, from which he had suffered since at least 1870. Lear's funeral was said to be a sad, lonely affair by the wife of Dr. Hassall, Lear's physician, none of Lear's many lifelong friends being able to attend.[17]
    Lear is buried in the Cemetery Foce in San Remo. On his headstone are inscribed these lines about Mount Tomohrit (in Albania) from Tennyson's poem To E.L. [Edward Lear], On His Travels in Greece:
    all things fair.With such a pencil, such a pen.You shadow'd forth to distant men,I read and felt that I was there.[18] The centenary of his death was marked in Britain with a set of Royal Mail stamps in 1988 and an exhibition at the Royal Academy. Lear's birthplace area is now marked with a plaque at Bowman's Mews, Islington, in London, and his bicentenary during 2012 was celebrated with a variety of events, exhibitions and lectures in venues across the world including an International Owl and Pussycat Day on his birth anniversary.[19]


    The graves of Lear and his faithful friend, the Albanian Souliote chef Giorgio Cocali(Gjergj Kokalli, Alb) in San Remo, Italy.

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    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by blevins13 View Post
    The movie is shameful Greek propaganda, the Albanian Lab are dressed up as Turks, while The Albanian Suliotes are shown as Greeks. They spoke Albanian with each others and is Albanian fighting Albanians. I don’t know what Greeks want in this Albanian blood feud. This is how the Albanian Labs dressed at that time.

    IMG_3242.jpg

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    There are different reasons but the most important, filling the gaps of their history, too many blank pages.

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    Castle of Gjon Boçari

    The Castle of Gjon Boçari (Albanian: Kalaja e Gjon Boçarit) is a castle of the 16th and 17th century in Tragjas, Albania.

    Architecture

    The castle was built by the Boçari family, one of the principal Albanian families of Tragjas, Vlorë, southwestern Albania in the 16th and expanded in the 17th century. Modern members of the family include Markos Botsaris, Katerina Botsari Kito Bocari, Gëzim and Ismail Boçari. The fortification features arrowslits for artillery openings in the walls. The northern and eastern corners of the castle feature large towers.[1] The stone walls form a rectangle surrounding the courtyard and have a width of 1.25 metres (4.1 ft) and a height of 5.5 metres (18 ft).[2]


    View of an defensive tower at Gjon Boçari castle.

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    Souliotes were a confederation of Arvanites and other Greek people, and their whole confederation was divided in Souli proper (made up of 13 villages) and Parasouli (made up of some 50-66 villages). They were also bilingual into Greek and Arvanitika, and even their Arvanitika dialect as preserved in the Arvanitika-Greek dictionary of Marko Botsaris, shows that it was essentially heavily influenced by Greek. For example.





















    And keep in mind that the Arvanitika dialect only had some 2500-3000 words, not more than that.

    As for the question of where they went after their expulsion from Souli. The vast majority went to Messenia in Peloponnesus, a few others in the Ionian islands, and some in the small city of Lechovo in the region of Florina. None went to Albania as it is written above by a member, absolutely none. All the descendants of the Souliotes call themselves proud Greeks, not Albanians.

    Furthermore, the Labs did dress as it was shown in the movie, and keep in mind that the movie presents an Ottoman army. And the image you show is not representative of Labs but of Souliotes and other Epirotes. This image specifically shows a Souliot not a Lab.

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    The most funny is this thread is member Laberia,

    as a typical Greek he admires and post proudly about Souliotes,

    while his true believes are the ones,of those against Souliotes, of the batlles of 1759 with Turk-Albanian Maxout aga of Arta
    and 1772 the other Turk-Albanian Souleiman Tzapari with his 40 aga.

    How much hypocrisy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post
    The most funny is this thread is member Laberia,

    as a typical Greek he admires and post proudly about Souliotes,

    while his true believes are the ones,of those against Souliotes, of the batlles of 1759 with Turk-Albanian Maxout aga of Arta
    and 1772 the other Turk-Albanian Souleiman Tzapari with his 40 aga.

    How much hypocrisy.
    Greeks are proud of Christian Albanians (Suliotes) fighting against Musliman Albanians, this is funny and strange.
    I was wandering what Greek rayahs were doing meanwhile besides being proud of Christian Albanians.
    IMG_3250.jpg


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    Quote Originally Posted by blevins13 View Post
    Greeks are proud of Christian Albanians (Suliotes) fighting against Musliman Albanians, this is funny and strange.
    I was wandering what Greek rayahs were doing meanwhile besides being proud of Christian Albanians.
    IMG_3250.jpg

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    We are not proud of Christian Albanians. We are proud of OUR ancestors, the Arvanites, the same way we are proud of OUR other ancestors such as the Maniots, the Agrafiots, the Sfakiots, the Sarakatsani, the Vlachs, the Klephts, and the Armatoloi. Do you understand what i am writing to you? Arvanites descendants are the modern Greek people, not the modern Albanian people. Therefore why shouldn't we be proud of OUR own ancestors?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Demetrios View Post
    We are not proud of Christian Albanians. We are proud of OUR ancestors, the Arvanites, the same way we are proud of OUR other ancestors such as the Maniots, the Agrafiots, the Sfakiots, the Sarakatsani, the Vlachs, the Klephts, and the Armatoloi. Do you understand what i am writing to you? Arvanites descendants are the modern Greek people, not the modern Albanian people. Therefore why shouldn't we be proud of OUR own ancestors?
    Do understand English, he is an Albanian Christian of Suli born in Corfu, if you are proud of him that is fine.




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    1 out of 3 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Demetrios View Post
    Souliotes were a confederation of Arvanites and other Greek people, and their whole confederation was divided in Souli proper (made up of 13 villages) and Parasouli (made up of some 50-66 villages). They were also bilingual into Greek and Arvanitika, and even their Arvanitika dialect as preserved in the Arvanitika-Greek dictionary of Marko Botsaris, shows that it was essentially heavily influenced by Greek. For example.
    Absolutely not true. Suliotes were Albanians. First of all does not existed greek nation back in that period. There were no Greeks in Athens let alone in Epir.

    The making of Greece - Eleni Arveler

    Maria Efthimiou - The Arvanites of Greece

    History of the community and the language

    The first Christian Albanian migrations to what is today Greek territory took place as early as the XI-XII centuries (Trudgill, 1975:5; Banfi, 1994:19), although the main ones most often mentioned in the bibliography happened in the XIV-XV centuries, when Albanians were invited to settle in depopulated areas by their Byzantine, Catalan or Florentine rulers (Tsitsipis, 1994:1; Trudgill, 1975:5; Nakratzas, 1992:20-24 & 78-90; Banfi, 1994:19). According to some authors, they were also fleeing forced Islamization by the Turks in what is today Albania (Katsanis, 1994:1). So, some have estimated that, when the Ottomans conquered the whole Greek territory in the XV century, some 45% of it was populated by Albanians (Trudgill, 1975:6). Another wave of Muslim Albanian migrations took place during the Ottoman period, mainly in the XVIII century (Trudgill, 1975:6; Banfi, 1994:19). All these Albanians are the ancestors of modern-day Arvanites in Central and Southern Greece.

    *


















    Please save our time and don`t post every garbage of greek propaganda here.

    And keep in mind that the Arvanitika dialect only had some 2500-3000 words, not more than that.
    This is not true and very ofensive. You confuse Albanians with your fake nation. It was you who invented an artificiale language, katharevousa because the language teached by church to the mixed byzantines population of Greece was a poor language.
    As for the question of where they went after their expulsion from Souli. The vast majority went to Messenia in Peloponnesus, a few others in the Ionian islands, and some in the small city of Lechovo in the region of Florina. None went to Albania as it is written above by a member, absolutely none. All the descendants of the Souliotes call themselves proud Greeks, not Albanians.
    It`s not true that none of the suliotes went in Albania. Members of Xhavella clan formed villages in Albania and still live here. There are plenty of people of suliote ancestry who live in Albania. Here you have another one of them:

    Gjergji & Zhani Suljoti - Dashuria eshte magji

    Second, we know how works this suliotes arvanites are proud Greeks, we know it from your sources:
    One reason for such a slow movement is the apparent hostility of the Greek state to such ‘revivals’ among Arvanites, Vlachs, and Macedonians, which is indicated by police disruption of festivals (in Macedonia), and harassment of musicians who play and sing songs in minority languages; as well as by the tolerance -by the state and particularly its judiciary- of public calls, printed in the press, to use violence against those musicians; likewise, human and minority rights activists have been the object of similar threats (Stohos, 20/7/1994 and in previous issues, where even the European Union’s Euromosaic project -to report on the status of the linguistic minorities in the EU- was attacked). Such hostile environment makes even the scholars’ work look suspicious: for example, Arvanites have reacted with incredulity and suspicion to scholars’ assertions that their language can be written (Tsitsipis, 1983:296-7; Trudgill, 1983:129; Williams, 1992:88). Moreover, the EBLUL’s first visit to the community was violently attacked by some community members (Williams, 1992:88) as well as in state-sponsored publications (Lazarou et al., 1993:191-193).
    Likewise, Arvanitika has never been included in the educational curricula of the modern Greek state. On the contrary, its use has been strongly discouraged at schools (and in the army) through physical punishment, humiliation, or, in recent years, simple incitation of the Arvanitika users (Williams, 1992:86; Trudgill, 1983:130-1). Such attitudes have led many Arvanite (as well as Vlach, and Macedonian) parents to discourage their children from learning their mother tongue so as to avoid similar discrimination and suffering (Trudgill, 1983:130).*

    Furthermore, the Labs did dress as it was shown in the movie, and keep in mind that the movie presents an Ottoman army. And the image you show is not representative of Labs but of Souliotes and other Epirotes. This image specifically shows a Souliot not a Lab.
    This is the dress of the Lab:

    Shpata jon gris ferman - Grupi i Vranishtit

    This is an real fustanella, not the ugly copy that you have apropriate from us.
    The most ridiculous part in this movie of Greek propaganda is that both parties communicate with each other in...Greek. This is really funny. They spoke in Albanian in real life.

    Source: *Report

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    2 out of 3 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Demetrios View Post
    We are not proud of Christian Albanians. We are proud of OUR ancestors, the Arvanites, the same way we are proud of OUR other ancestors such as the Maniots, the Agrafiots, the Sfakiots, the Sarakatsani, the Vlachs, the Klephts, and the Armatoloi. Do you understand what i am writing to you? Arvanites descendants are the modern Greek people, not the modern Albanian people. Therefore why shouldn't we be proud of OUR own ancestors?
    Sorry to destroy your dreams. You are proud of what nationalist popaganda in your country feed you.
    Things were a little different back. Inform yourself:
    https://www.eupedia.com/forum/thread...277#post576277
    Arvanites are descendants of Albanians who were assimilated after the creation of the Greek state. And we know how works the assimilation, just read my previous post.

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    1 out of 2 members found this post helpful.
    You are both idiots really. Arvanites were medieval Albanians who migrated in Greece during the 14th century AD. Why would i argue that? The problem i have with these idiotic threads is that you try to make them something that they aren't. Souliots have been in Greece for centuries, they have mixed with other Greeks, and they proudly call themselves Greeks because they are after all. They were even bilingual from the very beginning in Greek and Arvanite. How i know, because i am a ******* Arvanite of Corinth idiots. Arvanites have absolutely no different blood from the rest of the Greeks. Not even Albanians have different blood, but have been under sever propaganda and they only now begin to realize it. Genetic studies don't lie. And last but not least, i am an Arvanite you are not Arvanites in the sense that you are not descendants of them, which you aren't. It's really that simple.

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    1 out of 2 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Demetrios View Post
    You are both idiots really. Arvanites were medieval Albanians who migrated in Greece during the 14th century AD. Why would i argue that? The problem i have with these idiotic threads is that you try to make them something that they aren't. Souliots have been in Greece for centuries, they have mixed with other Greeks, and they proudly call themselves Greeks because they are after all. They were even bilingual from the very beginning in Greek and Arvanite. How i know, because i am a ******* Arvanite of Corinth idiots. Arvanites have absolutely no different blood from the rest of the Greeks. Not even Albanians have different blood, but have been under sever propaganda and they only now begin to realize it. Genetic studies don't lie. And last but not least, i am an Arvanite you are not Arvanites in the sense that you are not descendants of them, which you aren't. It's really that simple.
    You are an uneducated person who offend others instead defending in civilised manner your arguments.
    I don`t care what you are today or if you really are an Arvanite or not. You have nothing to do with those people who were called Arvanites or Albanians until the creation of modern Greece. Meanwhile we have the same blood with them and we continue to speak the same language.
    Here is a documentary in three parts prepared by an television from Kosova with Arvanites in Greece:

    Film Dokumentar per ARVANITET (part 1)


    Film Dokumentar per ARVANITET (part 2)


    Do you understand anything? ZERO. There is even an interesting story told by one of the Arvanites about how the Albanian language saved the life of his father and other Greek soldiers during the greek-italian war during the WWII exactly in Albania.

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    0 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    Arveler is a Byzantine baboon head without any respect for national identity. She doesn't believe in any nation, she despises nations and above all her own. Second, Arvanites were medieval Albanians who migrated in Greece during the 14th century AD. Why would i argue that? You are simply so far up your ass you don't know how to read. I say again that you are not descendants of Arvanites, i on the other hand am a real descendant of Corinthian Arvanites and i call myself a proud Greek because i am based on actual genetic studies which prove it. I suggest you do a DNA test in order to wake up, because you have been sleeping for a while. Furthermore, Athens was a small village 200 years and was indeed inhabited by Arvanites. Epirus on the other hand wasn't, except its coastal region, namely Thesprotia, which in any case also had Greeks along with Albanians. And don't forget Northern Epirus which has Greeks up to this day, therefore your whole argument of no Greeks in Epirus is pretty pathetic considering we also have actual ethnographic maps from the period.

    Ethnic composition map of the Balkans by the German-English cartographer Ernst Georg Ravenstein of 1870


    Third, the level of ridiculousness with you is that you speak of Arvanite language as if you know anything about it. Idiot, i personally know people who speak Arvanitika, there are no more than 2500-3000 words. Arvanitika is a very simple language used for the day to day needs, nothing special about it and doesn't even require to be special and evolved because it is for day to day needs, even though today is not being spoken that much as it happens with all the dialects in Greece, whether it is Greek, Vlach, or Arvanitika. The same happens in Cyprus, there is not a grand plan for the extinction of a dialect, it is simply no more useful in the larger community that we are all a part of nowadays. People move in cities, they won't be speaking a local dialect there, they will be speaking the common tongue, which is not Katharevousa, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katharevousa, idiot, but formal Demotic, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demotic_Greek.

    Fourth, you write that the dictionary of Markos Botsaris is propaganda. How much more are you going to embarrass yourself. This is an actual historical manuscript idiot, no propaganda and has already been published, the problem is you don't understand much, but that's not the Greeks problem. More about it here, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Markos...tic_dictionary, and if you want the actual dictionary ask me for a copy and stop the nonsense with me.

    Fifth, who are you trying to fool idiot. These are not descendants of actual Souliotes, they simply have a last name that is etymologically related with the name Souliotes, since after all the word Souli originates from the Albanian word for stronghold or watchpost, namely Sul. These are not descendants of Souliotes. I have already written where the descendants of Souliotes went. You don't even know their hitory idiot. The vast majority of Souliotes went to Messenia in Peloponnesus, a few to the Ionian islands, and a few to the small city of Lechovo in Florina.

    Sixth, no this is not the dress of the Labs, but of the Tosks and the Chams, which is after all similar to other Greeks from further south. Labs originally wore black pants not fustanella.

    Seventh, fustanella is was not an original Albanian dress? If it was Albanian, why do the genuine Albanians, namely the Ghegs, not wear fustanella but tirk? When did fustanella appear in Albania and when in Greece, do you know? I know. Fustanella is a Greek-style garment, of an ancient Greek origin. It comes from the Greek chiton, the chitonio, and the exomis.


    There are also depictions in Greece that show fustanella exactly as it has evolved in our days since 400 BCE, as it appears at the Nympholyptos Cave in Athens.


    Even in the Greek-Buddhist art of Gandara we meet it.


    There are more recent examples. See here, from Corinth between 1100-1200 AD, fustanellas worn by Greek soldiers.


    When? 2-3 centuries before the Arvanites's descent in southern Greece. When does Fustanella appear in Albania? It was only in the 14th century as a reference to a Venetian document that recorded a list of things seized by a sailor, namely "ei guarnacionem, tunicam, mantellum, maçam, de ferro, fustanum, camisiam abstulerunt". We can find variants of fustanella in all the Balkans, namely Greeks, Vlachs, Albanians, Bulgarians, FYROMIANS, Romanians, etc. This pan-Balkan clothing influence could have only been from a great cultural and administrative power, and the only ones who had it from ancient times until the end of Byzantium were the Greeks. The information I've shared above speaks for themselves. Fustanella is a Greek garment that we find in its most original form, only in Greece, and comes from ancient Greek garments. If you disagree, show me actual examples of fustanella older than the dates that i have shown you otherwise you might as well stop typing nonsense without proof.

    Eighth, you should better inform yourself more about your own past because you seem to think many false things from the beginning of your State, which didn't happen as a result of any major revolution, but mostly because Italy and Austro-Hungary wanted a puppet State in the region. Listen to your own historians and leave the baboon head wanna be historians of Greece such as Arveler for the garbage that she deserves absent any real evidence.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zFVNdk4uetk

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    Quote Originally Posted by LABERIA View Post
    You are an uneducated person who offend others instead defending in civilised manner your arguments.
    I don`t care what you are today or if you really are an Arvanite or not. You have nothing to do with those people who were called Arvanites or Albanians until the creation of modern Greece. Meanwhile we have the same blood with them and we continue to speak the same language.
    Here is a documentary in three parts prepared by an television from Kosova with Arvanites in Greece:

    Film Dokumentar per ARVANITET (part 1)


    Film Dokumentar per ARVANITET (part 2)


    Do you understand anything? ZERO. There is even an interesting story told by one of the Arvanites about how the Albanian language saved the life of his father and other Greek soldiers during the greek-italian war during the WWII exactly in Albania.
    I am not going to watch a Kosovar documentary about my ancestors, i already know them firsthand, not through propagandist tv productions. I also know, and so you do, that the descendants of actual Arvanites live in Greece, not Albania. You also know that Albanians have Greek DNA, therefore it is really a joke to be speaking of Arvanites and their blood, which have even settled in Greece since the 14th century AD. You embarrass yourself. Go test your DNA and let me see your results.

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    Suliotet

    Quote Originally Posted by Demetrios View Post
    We are not proud of Christian Albanians. We are proud of OUR ancestors, the Arvanites, the same way we are proud of OUR other ancestors such as the Maniots, the Agrafiots, the Sfakiots, the Sarakatsani, the Vlachs, the Klephts, and the Armatoloi. Do you understand what i am writing to you? Arvanites descendants are the modern Greek people, not the modern Albanian people. Therefore why shouldn't we be proud of OUR own ancestors?
    If YOUR Glorious Ancestors are Albanians aka Arvanites in Greece, prove it, show DNA matches with Albanians....or you are just another liar, see this



    IMG_3253.jpg

    IMG_3254.jpg


    Sent from my iPhone using Eupedia Forum

  24. #24
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    @ Laberia

    Read carefully the names of the 13 villages

    there are Arvanites, Greeks, Aromani, even Slavs among them

    They resist Turk-Albanization and Labs,

    they followed the system of Greek Armatoloi instead the Turk-Albanian Ottoman army
    they had a coalition and a confederation,

    and if one of Suliotes went to Albania, wonder about that, what he is now? he kneeled?
    Tell us how many went to Othons Athens,
    How many to Makedonia, Fyrom, Thrace, Even Bulgaria,


    @ Laberia

    Dedicated to you and your Nickname
    a song of Souli of Despo Botsi

    Αχός βαρύς ακούεται, πολλά τουφέκια πέφτουν.Μήνα σε γάμο ρίχνονται, μήνα σε χαροκόπι;Ουδέ σε γάμο ρίχνονται ουδέ σε χαροκόπι.η Δέσπω κάνει πόλεμο με νύφες και μ' αγγόνια.Αρβανιτιά την πλάκωσε στού Δημουλά τον πύργο:"Γιώργαινα, ρίξε τ’ άρματα, δεν είναι εδώ τὸ Σούλι.εδώ είσαι σκλάβα του πασά, σκλάβα των Αρβανίτων"."Το Σούλι κι αν προσκύνησε, κι αν τούρκεψεν η Κιάφα,η Δέσπω αφέντες Λιάπηδες δεν έκαμε, δεν κάνει".Δαυλί στο χέριν άρπαξε, κόρες και νύφες κράζει:"Σκλάβες Τούρκων μη ζήσωμε, παιδιά μ’, μαζί μου ελάτε".και τα φυσέκια ανάψανε, κι όλοι φωτιά γενήκαν.

    SOULIOTES FOUGHT THE LABERIAN INTRUDERS, and Ottoman Rulers
    who wanted to expell them from their land?


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    0 out of 2 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Demetrios View Post
    I am not going to watch a Kosovar documentary about my ancestors, i already know them firsthand, not through propagandist tv productions. I also know, and so you do, that the descendants of actual Arvanites live in Greece, not Albania. You also know that Albanians have Greek DNA, therefore it is really a joke to be speaking of Arvanites and their blood, which have even settled in Greece since the 14th century AD. You embarrass yourself. Go test your DNA and let me see your results.
    People in the documentary are Arvanites, among them is even Vangelis Liapis. Liapis mean Lab, inhabitant of Laberia region like Ieronymos II Archbishop of Athens and All Greece . His name is Ioannis Liapis, another Lab. More about him you can learn after reading THIS.

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