Eupedia Forums
Site NavigationEupedia Top > Eupedia Forum & Japan Forum
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 37

Thread: Swedish Egalitarianism is a relatively new phenomenon?

  1. #1
    Advisor Achievements:
    VeteranThree Friends50000 Experience PointsRecommendation Second Class
    Awards:
    Posting Award
    Angela's Avatar
    Join Date
    02-01-11
    Posts
    14,990
    Points
    258,923
    Level
    100
    Points: 258,923, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 99.6%


    Ethnic group
    Italian
    Country: USA - New York



    2 out of 3 members found this post helpful.

    Swedish Egalitarianism is a relatively new phenomenon?



    There's always been a lot of talk to the effect that Swedish egalitarianism is perhaps a product of longstanding cultural development.

    If this study is correct, that's not the case.

    See:
    https://academic.oup.com/past/advanc...gtz010/5498958

    "Abstract

    During the twentieth century, Sweden became known as a country with an unusually egalitarian distribution of income and wealth, an encompassing welfare state, and an exceptionally strong social democracy. It is commonplace among historians and social scientists to consider these equal outcomes of the twentieth century as the logical end result of a much longer historical trajectory of egalitarianism, from early modern free peasant farmers or from a peculiar Swedish political culture that was egalitarian and consensus-oriented. This article questions the Swedish interpretation of Sonderweg. In 1900, Sweden had some of the most unequal voting laws in western Europe, and more severe economic inequality than the United States. This throws the purported continuity from early modern equality to social democratic equality into question. The roots of twentieth-century Swedish egalitarianism lie in exceptionally well-organized popular movements after 1870, with a strong egalitarian counter-hegemonic culture and unusually broad popular participation in politics."


    Non si fa il proprio dovere perchè qualcuno ci dica grazie, lo si fa per principio, per se stessi, per la propria dignità. Oriana Fallaci

  2. #2
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered1000 Experience Points
    ToBeOrNotToBe's Avatar
    Join Date
    31-12-16
    Posts
    1,116


    Country: United Kingdom



    0 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    I've always thought that Swedes look feminine, and so they act that way: submissive. It sounds too simple to be true, but the more I think about it it does seem to be the case that we can tell a lot about people from their faces. AI can exploit this too, so it's definitely a measurable phenomenon. In nations with low sexual dimorphism, lighter pigmentation etc. political correctness has taken root more strongly. Italians on the whole, in comparison as a good Western European example, are too tribalistic and masculine to be blinded by cognitive dissonances like political correctness. They have a mental boldness about them. And God forbid anybody mentions the Caucasus, they're like Italians but to such an extreme that it turns from charming to scary (though the mafia is hardly charming I suppose).

  3. #3
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered5000 Experience Points
    hrvclv's Avatar
    Join Date
    14-03-17
    Location
    Auvergne, France
    Posts
    403
    Points
    8,766
    Level
    28
    Points: 8,766, Level: 28
    Level completed: 3%, Points required for next Level: 584
    Overall activity: 0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b-U152-DF103
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H1bm

    Ethnic group
    Arvern
    Country: France



    Quote Originally Posted by ToBeOrNotToBe View Post
    I've always thought that Swedes look feminine, and so they act that way: submissive. It sounds too simple to be true, but the more I think about it it does seem to be the case that we can tell a lot about people from their faces. AI can exploit this too, so it's definitely a measurable phenomenon. In nations with low sexual dimorphism, lighter pigmentation etc. political correctness has taken root more strongly. Italians on the whole, in comparison as a good Western European example, are too tribalistic and masculine to be blinded by cognitive dissonances like political correctness. They have a mental boldness about them. And God forbid anybody mentions the Caucasus, they're like Italians but to such an extreme that it turns from charming to scary (though the mafia is hardly charming I suppose).
    I doubt the place of women in any given society says anything about how virile its men are. The ancient Celts had women warriors. The Scythians also had their own Amazons. I doubt the men in those cultures were effeminate sissies.
    It is therefore worth while to search out the bounds between opinion and knowledge; and examine by what measures, in things whereof we have no certain knowledge, we ought to regulate our assent and moderate our persuasion. (John Locke)

  4. #4
    Regular Member Achievements:
    5000 Experience PointsVeteran
    berun's Avatar
    Join Date
    24-11-15
    Posts
    1,084
    Points
    8,674
    Level
    27
    Points: 8,674, Level: 27
    Level completed: 88%, Points required for next Level: 76
    Overall activity: 0%


    Country: Spain - Catalonia



    @ToBeOrNotToBe, I think that Swedes have not changed so much phenotypicaly since the Viking age, when they were perfoming very "macho" actions like raping, burning churches, robbing, killing with no cause, taking slaves, and so on.
    "What I've seen so far after my entire career chasing Indoeuropeans is that our solutions look tissue thin and our problems still look monumental" J.P.Mallory

    "The ultimate homeland of the group [PIE] that also spread Anatolian languages is less clear." D. Reich

  5. #5
    Advisor Achievements:
    VeteranThree Friends50000 Experience PointsRecommendation Second Class
    Awards:
    Posting Award
    Angela's Avatar
    Join Date
    02-01-11
    Posts
    14,990
    Points
    258,923
    Level
    100
    Points: 258,923, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 99.6%


    Ethnic group
    Italian
    Country: USA - New York



    1 out of 2 members found this post helpful.
    Maybe all their anti-social types died in foreign lands. Half joking. :)

    Nice people, the Swedes, from the few I've met.

  6. #6
    Regular Member Achievements:
    Veteran5000 Experience PointsRecommendation Second Class

    Join Date
    18-08-15
    Posts
    1,374
    Points
    5,955
    Level
    22
    Points: 5,955, Level: 22
    Level completed: 81%, Points required for next Level: 95
    Overall activity: 4.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R-L2
    MtDNA haplogroup
    J1c5a

    Ethnic group
    Swiss
    Country: Switzerland



    I always believe any country social system is tied to the government in place, and especially to the extent of what this government accept and dont accept. Sweden is known for having a very feminist government, and the equality shown in media is not relative to sweden, but relative to the swede governement pressure towards it. America is a very good country to analyze those kind of systems, very conservative states have very different opinions on social subjects than very liberal states.

    A political system of a country is not relative or equal to how the majority of the people of the said country are seeing things.

  7. #7
    Advisor Achievements:
    VeteranThree Friends50000 Experience PointsRecommendation Second Class
    Awards:
    Posting Award
    Angela's Avatar
    Join Date
    02-01-11
    Posts
    14,990
    Points
    258,923
    Level
    100
    Points: 258,923, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 99.6%


    Ethnic group
    Italian
    Country: USA - New York



    1 out of 2 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by halfalp View Post
    I always believe any country social system is tied to the government in place, and especially to the extent of what this government accept and dont accept. Sweden is known for having a very feminist government, and the equality shown in media is not relative to sweden, but relative to the swede governement pressure towards it. America is a very good country to analyze those kind of systems, very conservative states have very different opinions on social subjects than very liberal states.

    A political system of a country is not relative or equal to how the majority of the people of the said country are seeing things.
    You've just proved the very opposite of what you set out to prove. Conservative states pass conservative laws; liberal states pass liberal laws. Conservative states send conservative representatives to the national legislature, and liberal districts send liberals. Usually that results, as it did this election cycle, in a liberal House of Representatives, because it is based on proportional representation by population.

    What keeps the U.S. from swinging too far to the left, or right for that matter is that the founders in their wisdom provided for two legislative bodies. The Senate is not based on population density. Each state gets two senators: tiny in size and population Rhode Island gets the same number as huge California. That way, every part of the country has some say: rural as well as urban, conservative areas as well as liberal areas. The tension between Senate and House keeps us from swinging too far in either direction.

    Most countries don't have this, and so people get a government which they "directly" put in place. The laws are passed by their representatives. If you're in the minority, of course, and don't support the majority viewpoint, you're out of luck. That's democracy.

    Btw, the Upper Midwest has a heavy concentration of Scandinavian Americans. Ever watch the movie Fargo? It's a good representation of accent, attitudes, etc.

  8. #8
    Moderator Achievements:
    1 year registeredTagger Second ClassThree Friends25000 Experience Points
    Awards:
    Community Award

    Join Date
    21-10-16
    Posts
    1,723
    Points
    26,307
    Level
    49
    Points: 26,307, Level: 49
    Level completed: 76%, Points required for next Level: 243
    Overall activity: 39.0%


    Ethnic group
    Multiracial Brazilian
    Country: Brazil



    Quote Originally Posted by ToBeOrNotToBe View Post
    I've always thought that Swedes look feminine, and so they act that way: submissive. It sounds too simple to be true, but the more I think about it it does seem to be the case that we can tell a lot about people from their faces. AI can exploit this too, so it's definitely a measurable phenomenon. In nations with low sexual dimorphism, lighter pigmentation etc. political correctness has taken root more strongly. Italians on the whole, in comparison as a good Western European example, are too tribalistic and masculine to be blinded by cognitive dissonances like political correctness. They have a mental boldness about them. And God forbid anybody mentions the Caucasus, they're like Italians but to such an extreme that it turns from charming to scary (though the mafia is hardly charming I suppose).
    Right, that's why the Swedes were such charmingly submissive, harmless and pacifist creatures throughout the Middle Ages (unless you're implying some major genetic change happened in the last centuries there). Your hypothesis reminded me of Lombroso for a moment.

  9. #9
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered1000 Experience Points
    ToBeOrNotToBe's Avatar
    Join Date
    31-12-16
    Posts
    1,116


    Country: United Kingdom



    Quote Originally Posted by Ygorcs View Post
    Right, that's why the Swedes were such charmingly submissive, harmless and pacifist creatures throughout the Middle Ages (unless you're implying some major genetic change happened in the last centuries there). Your hypothesis reminded me of Lombroso for a moment.
    Well, the correlation certainly exists today - light skin and low sexual dimorphism (i.e. a more feminine-looking population) clearly predicts susceptibility to political correctness amongst European nations. As for the whole Viking thing, the vast majority were Danes or Western Norwegians.

    All I'll say regarding the question of causation is that AI is predicting a lot based on facial appearance (though this research is stunted due to political correctness!), so there's clearly something to it - plus, it's pretty obvious that you can tell a lot about a person based on their appearance, or the basics at least.

  10. #10
    Advisor Achievements:
    Three FriendsVeteran25000 Experience Points
    bicicleur's Avatar
    Join Date
    27-01-13
    Location
    Zwevegem, Belgium
    Posts
    5,281
    Points
    43,263
    Level
    64
    Points: 43,263, Level: 64
    Level completed: 25%, Points required for next Level: 987
    Overall activity: 41.0%


    Country: Belgium - Flanders



    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by ToBeOrNotToBe View Post
    Well, the correlation certainly exists today - light skin and low sexual dimorphism (i.e. a more feminine-looking population) clearly predicts susceptibility to political correctness amongst European nations. As for the whole Viking thing, the vast majority were Danes or Western Norwegians.

    All I'll say regarding the question of causation is that AI is predicting a lot based on facial appearance (though this research is stunted due to political correctness!), so there's clearly something to it - plus, it's pretty obvious that you can tell a lot about a person based on their appearance, or the basics at least.
    you simply associate masculinity with darker people
    you are wrong and biassed

  11. #11
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered1000 Experience Points
    ToBeOrNotToBe's Avatar
    Join Date
    31-12-16
    Posts
    1,116


    Country: United Kingdom



    Quote Originally Posted by bicicleur View Post
    you simply associate masculinity with darker people
    you are wrong and biassed
    Within Europe at least, it's definitely true.

  12. #12
    Advisor Achievements:
    VeteranThree Friends50000 Experience PointsRecommendation Second Class
    Awards:
    Posting Award
    Angela's Avatar
    Join Date
    02-01-11
    Posts
    14,990
    Points
    258,923
    Level
    100
    Points: 258,923, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 99.6%


    Ethnic group
    Italian
    Country: USA - New York



    0 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    If you look at what people choose for "masculinity" when presented with two very similar faces, it's almost never about pigmentation. It's how "rugged" the faces are: squarer, stronger jaw; stronger, more prominent nose, stronger forehead bone etc. The "softer" the facial features, the less "masculinity" people see.

    Just saying.

    Is the "preference", if that's what you want, hard wired, or culture?

    There are also subtleties to it.

    I don't think anyone would deny Arnold Schwarzenegger has a masculine face, but I think and have always thought he's ugly. Too, too much.




  13. #13
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered1000 Experience Points
    ToBeOrNotToBe's Avatar
    Join Date
    31-12-16
    Posts
    1,116


    Country: United Kingdom



    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    If you look at what people choose for "masculinity" when presented with two very similar faces, it's almost never about pigmentation. It's how "rugged" the faces are: squarer, stronger jaw; stronger, more prominent nose, stronger forehead bone etc. The "softer" the facial features, the less "masculinity" people see.

    Just saying.

    Is the "preference", if that's what you want, hard wired, or culture?

    There are also subtleties to it.

    I don't think anyone would deny Arnold Schwarzenegger has a masculine face, but I think and have always thought he's ugly. Too, too much.



    I mostly agree, but with special emphasis on the nose. I guess this is getting into the realm of phrenology and the like, but to me a prominent yet well-sculpted nose signifies social dominance. So an intrapigmentational example below to emphasise that it isn't just about how "gracile" you are:





    And is it a coincidence that the toughest, most masculine and hypertribalistic people on Earth by some margin in my view (there are many, many more primitive peoples but that shouldn't be mistaken for masculinity) - those from around the Dinaric and especially (Northern) Caucasus mountain ranges - have this "nasal signifier" in abundance?

  14. #14
    Moderator Achievements:
    1 year registeredTagger Second ClassThree Friends25000 Experience Points
    Awards:
    Community Award

    Join Date
    21-10-16
    Posts
    1,723
    Points
    26,307
    Level
    49
    Points: 26,307, Level: 49
    Level completed: 76%, Points required for next Level: 243
    Overall activity: 39.0%


    Ethnic group
    Multiracial Brazilian
    Country: Brazil



    Quote Originally Posted by ToBeOrNotToBe View Post
    Well, the correlation certainly exists today - light skin and low sexual dimorphism (i.e. a more feminine-looking population) clearly predicts susceptibility to political correctness amongst European nations. As for the whole Viking thing, the vast majority were Danes or Western Norwegians.

    All I'll say regarding the question of causation is that AI is predicting a lot based on facial appearance (though this research is stunted due to political correctness!), so there's clearly something to it - plus, it's pretty obvious that you can tell a lot about a person based on their appearance, or the basics at least.
    Spaniards are among the peoples with most progressive ("politically correct" for some) views in Europe - and yet they are not the lightest skinned. Since skin color and sexual dimorphism didn't change at all in the last 1000 years in Europe (or do you dispute that?), and that correlation only works "today", then isn't it obvious that there is little or nothing related to genetically determined phenotype, and instead to changing sociocultural and political trends? North Russians instead are very "badass" not just for European standards (in Brazil when some video is bizarre in a tough and hardcore way some young people joke that it's "like Russia"), yet they are certainly much more lighter-skinned on average than the quite self-restrained and "calm" Portuguese people (of today).

    Besides, I think someone should already have told you that correlation means nothing if there is not even a shred of a rational explanation for that correlation being related to some causation, and if there is no control of may other factors that may in fact be much more relevant, with the correlated facts being only incidentally linked to each other. By believing too much in random correlations you may miss the big picture and the really significant patterns.

  15. #15
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered1000 Experience Points
    ToBeOrNotToBe's Avatar
    Join Date
    31-12-16
    Posts
    1,116


    Country: United Kingdom



    Quote Originally Posted by Ygorcs View Post
    Spaniards are among the peoples with most progressive ("politically correct" for some) views in Europe - and yet they are not the lightest skinned. Since skin color and sexual dimorphism didn't change at all in the last 1000 years in Europe (or do you dispute that?), and that correlation only works "today", then isn't it obvious that there is little or nothing related to genetically determined phenotype, and instead to changing sociocultural and political trends?

    Besides, I think someone should already have told you that correlation means nothing if there is not even a shred of a rational explanation for that correlation being related to some causation, and if there is no control of may other factors that may in fact be much more relevant, with the correlated facts being only incidentally linked to each other. By believing too much in random correlations you may miss the big picture and the really significant patterns.
    Spaniards aren't that politically correct compared to Northern Europe, but I don't see how that contradicts what I'm saying. So, compare Spain to Italy then - why is it that the Italians are much more resistive? Conditions are similar, yet Italian culture is more self-preservationist and conservative. The main pro-masculine phenotypic difference is with the nose. How many Furio Giunta's are there in Spain?





    Best show ever btw ^^

  16. #16
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered1000 Experience Points
    shissem@san.rr.com's Avatar
    Join Date
    07-05-17
    Location
    San Diego, California
    Posts
    124
    Points
    3,386
    Level
    16
    Points: 3,386, Level: 16
    Level completed: 84%, Points required for next Level: 64
    Overall activity: 4.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    G2a-Z726
    MtDNA haplogroup
    K1a4a1h

    Ethnic group
    English/German
    Country: USA - California



    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    I think we've lost the thread here.

    The issue is, IMHO, how did the Swedes of Viking legend and Gustavus Adolphus (the 30 years war for cryin' out loud!) become the nation they are today?

    One easy theory is that wars, and the Swedes decreasing success over time (vs Peter the Great, etc), pushed them in this direction. The Germans and the history of the 20th century inform here as do the Japanese. The latter are proving to be less pacific, but only because they aren't surrounded by an alliance that allows them to ignore reality.

    Now discuss, and without commentary about skin tones and the shape of peoples' noses fer cryin' out loud . . .

  17. #17
    Moderator Achievements:
    1 year registeredTagger Second ClassThree Friends25000 Experience Points
    Awards:
    Community Award

    Join Date
    21-10-16
    Posts
    1,723
    Points
    26,307
    Level
    49
    Points: 26,307, Level: 49
    Level completed: 76%, Points required for next Level: 243
    Overall activity: 39.0%


    Ethnic group
    Multiracial Brazilian
    Country: Brazil



    Quote Originally Posted by ToBeOrNotToBe View Post
    Spaniards aren't that politically correct compared to Northern Europe, but I don't see how that contradicts what I'm saying. So, compare Spain to Italy then - why is it that the Italians are much more resistive? Conditions are similar, yet Italian culture is more self-preservationist and conservative. The main pro-masculine phenotypic difference is with the nose. How many Furio Giunta's are there in Spain?





    Best show ever btw ^^
    Oh, I see, in the absence of other correlations then the "major" difference is the frequency of a certain type of nose. Yeah, that makes sense...

  18. #18
    Moderator Achievements:
    1 year registeredTagger Second ClassThree Friends25000 Experience Points
    Awards:
    Community Award

    Join Date
    21-10-16
    Posts
    1,723
    Points
    26,307
    Level
    49
    Points: 26,307, Level: 49
    Level completed: 76%, Points required for next Level: 243
    Overall activity: 39.0%


    Ethnic group
    Multiracial Brazilian
    Country: Brazil



    Quote Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
    I think we've lost the thread here.

    The issue is, IMHO, how did the Swedes of Viking legend and Gustavus Adolphus (the 30 years war for cryin' out loud!) become the nation they are today?

    One easy theory is that wars, and the Swedes decreasing success over time (vs Peter the Great, etc), pushed them in this direction. The Germans and the history of the 20th century inform here as do the Japanese. The latter are proving to be less pacific, but only because they aren't surrounded by an alliance that allows them to ignore reality.
    Ah now THAT was what I was looking for to talk about! Thanks for some reality check to get the thread back on its trail. :-D

  19. #19
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered1000 Experience Points
    shissem@san.rr.com's Avatar
    Join Date
    07-05-17
    Location
    San Diego, California
    Posts
    124
    Points
    3,386
    Level
    16
    Points: 3,386, Level: 16
    Level completed: 84%, Points required for next Level: 64
    Overall activity: 4.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    G2a-Z726
    MtDNA haplogroup
    K1a4a1h

    Ethnic group
    English/German
    Country: USA - California



    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ygorcs View Post
    Ah now THAT was what I was looking for to talk about! Thanks for some reality check to get the thread back on its trail. :-D
    Thanks. Too many discussions here devolve into ethnic discussions when it is not relevant. Is this a European thing? I am "this close" to dumping this site and moving on . . .

    Whatever, I think that nations or tribes or individuals, full of p&v, decide to enter the arena of dominance. They try military or economic means and succeed or fail. If they fail, and especially if they fail spectacularly, they decide to move to a different course. This is basic behavioral psychology, given enough negative reinforcement, a subject will change its behavior.

    Maybe this new behavior is what we should all aspire to, but the reward structure of today's world says a try for dominance is worth the gamble (see China).

  20. #20
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered1000 Experience Points
    shissem@san.rr.com's Avatar
    Join Date
    07-05-17
    Location
    San Diego, California
    Posts
    124
    Points
    3,386
    Level
    16
    Points: 3,386, Level: 16
    Level completed: 84%, Points required for next Level: 64
    Overall activity: 4.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    G2a-Z726
    MtDNA haplogroup
    K1a4a1h

    Ethnic group
    English/German
    Country: USA - California



    I hate it when I kill a discussion. I guess nobody wants to talk about Gustavus Adolphus . . .

  21. #21
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered
    Tutkun Arnaut's Avatar
    Join Date
    31-03-18
    Posts
    278

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    I2a2a(m223)(L801)

    Country: Albania



    0 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by ToBeOrNotToBe View Post
    I've always thought that Swedes look feminine, and so they act that way: submissive. It sounds too simple to be true, but the more I think about it it does seem to be the case that we can tell a lot about people from their faces. AI can exploit this too, so it's definitely a measurable phenomenon. In nations with low sexual dimorphism, lighter pigmentation etc. political correctness has taken root more strongly. Italians on the whole, in comparison as a good Western European example, are too tribalistic and masculine to be blinded by cognitive dissonances like political correctness. They have a mental boldness about them. And God forbid anybody mentions the Caucasus, they're like Italians but to such an extreme that it turns from charming to scary (though the mafia is hardly charming I suppose).
    I don't pretend I know Swedish, but I don't agree with many things they do, like opening their country to everybody.
    I have worked with a Swedish American as a waiter. He had no facial hair and looked 24 years old. He was 45. Young girls were approaching him and he was honest, was immediately telling them he was 45.
    As a society they are the cream of Europe, open minded, hard working, honest. South Europe has some of the worst people, lazy, sneaky

  22. #22
    Advisor Achievements:
    VeteranThree Friends50000 Experience PointsRecommendation Second Class
    Awards:
    Posting Award
    Angela's Avatar
    Join Date
    02-01-11
    Posts
    14,990
    Points
    258,923
    Level
    100
    Points: 258,923, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 99.6%


    Ethnic group
    Italian
    Country: USA - New York



    0 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tutkun Arnaut View Post
    I don't pretend I know Swedish, but I don't agree with many things they do, like opening their country to everybody.
    I have worked with a Swedish American as a waiter. He had no facial hair and looked 24 years old. He was 45. Young girls were approaching him and he was honest, was immediately telling them he was 45.
    As a society they are the cream of Europe, open minded, hard working, honest. South Europe has some of the worst people, lazy, sneaky
    You now have four infraction points, so I guess getting banned once was a pleasant experience for you and you want to try it again, you t-roll.

    Keep a civil tongue in your head and your obnoxious, stupid, racist opinions to yourself or this stay will be even shorter.

  23. #23
    Regular Member Achievements:
    250 Experience Points

    Join Date
    18-06-19
    Posts
    27
    Points
    300
    Level
    3
    Points: 300, Level: 3
    Level completed: 50%, Points required for next Level: 50
    Overall activity: 84.0%


    Country: Denmark



    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    Reasons you should consider instead of noses and facial hair would be:

    Sweden has
    A high degree of education and literacy in the population from 1800 and up.
    A very high degree of religious (Luteran) internalisation in culture and moral.
    A strong socialist movement around 1900 and up.
    An effective rule of law.
    A short distance from the citizen to the government

  24. #24
    Advisor Achievements:
    VeteranThree Friends50000 Experience PointsRecommendation Second Class
    Awards:
    Posting Award
    Angela's Avatar
    Join Date
    02-01-11
    Posts
    14,990
    Points
    258,923
    Level
    100
    Points: 258,923, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 99.6%


    Ethnic group
    Italian
    Country: USA - New York



    0 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jensen View Post
    Reasons you should consider instead of noses and facial hair would be:

    Sweden has
    A high degree of education and literacy in the population from 1800 and up.
    A very high degree of religious (Luteran) internalisation in culture and moral.
    A strong socialist movement around 1900 and up.
    An effective rule of law.
    A short distance from the citizen to the government
    Thank you for interjecting some reason into the discussion. Unfortunately, we occasionally get some comments from the "anthrotards" from quasi-racist web sites make an appearance.

    Assuming you're actually from Denmark, I don't know if you're aware that the Scandinavian immigrants to the American midwest, places like Minnesota, their rather recently acquired socialist "ideology". It has marked the politics of those areas almost to the present day.

  25. #25
    Elite member Achievements:
    Tagger Second ClassThree FriendsVeteran10000 Experience Points

    Join Date
    23-02-15
    Location
    Groningen
    Posts
    655
    Points
    10,412
    Level
    30
    Points: 10,412, Level: 30
    Level completed: 77%, Points required for next Level: 138
    Overall activity: 6.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    E1b1b/ E-V22

    Ethnic group
    North Sea Germanic
    Country: Netherlands



    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    There's always been a lot of talk to the effect that Swedish egalitarianism is perhaps a product of longstanding cultural development.

    If this study is correct, that's not the case.

    See:
    https://academic.oup.com/past/advanc...gtz010/5498958

    "Abstract

    During the twentieth century, Sweden became known as a country with an unusually egalitarian distribution of income and wealth, an encompassing welfare state, and an exceptionally strong social democracy. It is commonplace among historians and social scientists to consider these equal outcomes of the twentieth century as the logical end result of a much longer historical trajectory of egalitarianism, from early modern free peasant farmers or from a peculiar Swedish political culture that was egalitarian and consensus-oriented. This article questions the Swedish interpretation of Sonderweg. In 1900, Sweden had some of the most unequal voting laws in western Europe, and more severe economic inequality than the United States. This throws the purported continuity from early modern equality to social democratic equality into question. The roots of twentieth-century Swedish egalitarianism lie in exceptionally well-organized popular movements after 1870, with a strong egalitarian counter-hegemonic culture and unusually broad popular participation in politics."
    The egalitarian tendency has certainly older roots. Free yeoman farmers was certainly a thing. The reformation another, not only in Sweden but also elsewhere. It broke down the roman-catholic hierarchy, the strongest were pietist movement 'nothing between god and the individual'. This enhanced also things like individual responsibility, the need to be literate etc. I guess that's the reason the popular movements could be successful because the road was already paved.....,

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •