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Thread: Inequality in Bronze Age Europe

  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by elghund View Post
    Sort of like your response. That post wasn't meant to be more than a simplified illustration of how the genetic contribution of original inhabitants diminishes or even perishes following successive migrations of later populations, each with reproductive advantages to the current, native populations they are subsuming. What do you want, an essay?
    Not an essay, of course. But this "mathematic" approach of yours was very theorical. But thanks, I think I catched your reasoning. Was it necessary to us under this naked form? No problem. I see you have some kind of humor (a bit acid?).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    So how come the farmer mtDna survived but the farmer yDna didn't?

    It won't wash, friend.

    Plus, it didn't just happen in Europe, it happened all over the world: Africa, Near East (not lots of G2a there except in the strongholds of the mountains is there?), China, Japan, you name it.
    I thought scenarios in which IE tribes inter-marrying with farmer tribes on equal bases(ydna, mtdna equally transmitted) then one tribe gets purely accidental reproductive advantage due to many social aspects like higher social standing, hierarchy which encourages population growth as in Amish, Hutterites finally result in skewed ydna\mtdna in the population who then become dominant, let's see today R1b lineage is not utterly dominant they just make 51% of the population. My doubts arose because early R1b subclades were so rare in BA only in later times they expanded several centuries after initial settlement.

  3. #28
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    2 out of 2 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by nornosh View Post
    I thought scenarios in which IE tribes inter-marrying with farmer tribes on equal bases(ydna, mtdna equally transmitted) then one tribe gets purely accidental reproductive advantage due to many social aspects like higher social standing, hierarchy which encourages population growth as in Amish, Hutterites finally result in skewed ydna\mtdna in the population who then become dominant, let's see today R1b lineage is not utterly dominant they just make 51% of the population. My doubts arose because early R1b subclades were so rare in BA only in later times they expanded several centuries after initial settlement.
    I doubt that is an explanation for world wide instances where, after a mass migration, the yDna of the invaders just happens to be the one which survives, while the local mtDna does survive. It's happened too many times, in too many places, in too many eras. It can't be coincidental, although all my job training probably does incline me to view "coincidences" as an explanation for human behavior more than skeptically.

    Personally, I don't like it, and would prefer that wasn't the case, particularly, perhaps, because I carry both the invader ydna and mtdna, while my autosomal dna is much more local.

    However, facts are facts, and those are facts which are very difficult to explain away in a PC manner.


    Non si fa il proprio dovere perchè qualcuno ci dica grazie, lo si fa per principio, per se stessi, per la propria dignità. Oriana Fallaci

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    And whether yDNA strains were eliminated at the start (ethnic cleansing) or relegated to the sidelines and weeded out over time (due to privilege), the result is the same. Ultimately the information transmitted via yDNA is very limited (paternal lineage, mostly) - language and cultural transmission is much more powerful.
    "I think Marija's 'kurgan hypothesis' has been magnificently vindicated by recent work." --Lord Colin Renfrew, 4/18/2018.

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