Here are the Iron age samples vs all of the other samples I composed, up until the Iron Age:


Distance to:R1016_Iron_Age_Castel_di_Decima
7.35068024I3151_Trypillia
8.76047373I2520_Balkans_BronzeAge
9.09492716I1979_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
9.45085710I2175_Balkans_BronzeAge
9.68979876I2176_Balkans_BronzeAge
10.22361971I2110_Trypillia
10.55012322I2215_Malak_Preslavets
10.69418534Bul10_Balkans_BronzeAge
11.07581148I2111_Trypillia
11.10573726I0706_Balkans_Neolithic
11.73281296I9123_Bronze_Age_Armenoi_Crete
11.86617040I1926_Trypillia
11.93298370I1113_Malak_Preslavets
11.95698122I4331_Balkans_BronzeAge
12.09002895I1295_Malak_Preslavets
12.25331384I1297_Malak_Preslavets
12.57254549I2478_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
13.06662925Bul6_Balkans_BronzeAge
14.70167337ANI160_Varna_Outlier
15.60879880I4088_Balkans_Chalcolithic
15.69832794I2425_Balkans_Chalcolithic
15.99142270I2440_Globular_Amphora
16.00827286I2431_Balkans_Chalcolithic
16.41852003ANI159_ANI181_Varna
17.61280784I2430_Balkans_Chalcolithic


Distance to:R1_Iron_Age_Protovillanovan_Martinsicuro
3.98938592I4331_Balkans_BronzeAge
9.18398606I2165_Balkans_BronzeAge
10.69891583I2176_Balkans_BronzeAge
12.18047208I1979_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
12.27822056I2520_Balkans_BronzeAge
12.32561560Bul6_Balkans_BronzeAge
12.78267186I9123_Bronze_Age_Armenoi_Crete
14.57795253I1113_Malak_Preslavets
15.27564401I2175_Balkans_BronzeAge
15.91312980I2215_Malak_Preslavets
16.52904111Bul10_Balkans_BronzeAge
16.88675813I2181_Balkans_Chalcolithic_outlier
17.72015801I2111_Trypillia
17.85182624I2478_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
17.88307300I3151_Trypillia
19.51211931Bul4_Yamnaya_Bulgaria
19.52825133I0706_Balkans_Neolithic
20.81853981I9033_Bronze_Age_Mycenaean_Peristeria_Tryfilia_Peloponnese
21.26791480ANI159_ANI181_Varna
21.48199246I1295_Malak_Preslavets
21.48879475I1297_Malak_Preslavets
22.59939380ANI163_Varna_Outlier
22.90999345I9041_Bronze_Age_Mycenaean_Galatas_Apatheia_Peloponnese
22.98291974I2110_Trypillia
23.52690800I2431_Balkans_Chalcolithic


Distance to:R1015_Iron_Age_Veio_Grotta_Gramiccia
5.90466765I2520_Balkans_BronzeAge
7.39762124I2176_Balkans_BronzeAge
7.71334558I1979_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
8.13312363I2175_Balkans_BronzeAge
8.35159266I2215_Malak_Preslavets
8.37548805I2111_Trypillia
8.72612743I3151_Trypillia
9.37365457I2110_Trypillia
9.76218725I1113_Malak_Preslavets
9.95499874Bul10_Balkans_BronzeAge
10.52312216I1297_Malak_Preslavets
10.72228520I1926_Trypillia
11.05433851I0706_Balkans_Neolithic
11.10513395Bul6_Balkans_BronzeAge
11.40769915I4331_Balkans_BronzeAge
11.85190702I9123_Bronze_Age_Armenoi_Crete
11.99557418I1295_Malak_Preslavets
12.39624540I2478_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
14.56524631ANI160_Varna_Outlier
14.83928570I4088_Balkans_Chalcolithic
15.12514463I2440_Globular_Amphora
15.68691174I2431_Balkans_Chalcolithic
15.79446739ANI159_ANI181_Varna
15.87163823I2425_Balkans_Chalcolithic
17.14077595I2430_Balkans_Chalcolithic


Distance to:R473_Iron_Age_Civitavecchia
5.23807216I2520_Balkans_BronzeAge
7.33017053I1979_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
7.88686249I1113_Malak_Preslavets
8.15739542I2111_Trypillia
8.17621551I2176_Balkans_BronzeAge
8.33299466I2215_Malak_Preslavets
8.84239786I1297_Malak_Preslavets
9.36587423I2175_Balkans_BronzeAge
9.83392089I3151_Trypillia
10.07499380Bul10_Balkans_BronzeAge
10.18056482I2110_Trypillia
10.61650131Bul6_Balkans_BronzeAge
10.62080505I1926_Trypillia
11.21283639I4331_Balkans_BronzeAge
11.59367931I2478_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
12.06694245I0706_Balkans_Neolithic
12.55335015I9123_Bronze_Age_Armenoi_Crete
13.34862165I1295_Malak_Preslavets
14.53531217I2440_Globular_Amphora
14.89616394ANI160_Varna_Outlier
15.12287340I4088_Balkans_Chalcolithic
16.46113909ANI159_ANI181_Varna
16.75412487I2431_Balkans_Chalcolithic
16.95964327I2181_Balkans_Chalcolithic_outlier
17.28357023I2425_Balkans_Chalcolithic


Distance to:R474_Iron_Age_Civitavecchia
5.74122809I4331_Balkans_BronzeAge
9.65161126I2520_Balkans_BronzeAge
10.61332653I2176_Balkans_BronzeAge
10.90744700I1113_Malak_Preslavets
11.18787737I2215_Malak_Preslavets
11.81452496I2478_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
12.33373423I9123_Bronze_Age_Armenoi_Crete
12.54336877I2165_Balkans_BronzeAge
12.68957840I1979_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
13.05530161Bul6_Balkans_BronzeAge
14.00343886I2111_Trypillia
14.45190299I2181_Balkans_Chalcolithic_outlier
14.92140074I2175_Balkans_BronzeAge
16.12808730I3151_Trypillia
16.50133328I1297_Malak_Preslavets
16.56924561Bul10_Balkans_BronzeAge
19.25042597I0706_Balkans_Neolithic
19.48904564I2110_Trypillia
19.91931977I1926_Trypillia
20.60890342I1295_Malak_Preslavets
21.63774711ANI159_ANI181_Varna
22.12422428Bul4_Yamnaya_Bulgaria
22.31793673ANI163_Varna_Outlier
22.36372286I4088_Balkans_Chalcolithic
22.86688654I2440_Globular_Amphora


Distance to:R475_Iron_Age_Civitavecchia
13.09405590I2175_Balkans_BronzeAge
13.33166531I9123_Bronze_Age_Armenoi_Crete
13.49426545I2176_Balkans_BronzeAge
13.88860684Bul6_Balkans_BronzeAge
14.05401010ANI159_ANI181_Varna
14.09213965I2111_Trypillia
15.26023263I4089_Balkans_Chalcolithic
15.28873441I2431_Balkans_Chalcolithic
15.28887177I2424_Balkans_Chalcolithic
15.61965429I9033_Bronze_Age_Mycenaean_Peristeria_Tryfilia_Peloponnese
15.83670736I2520_Balkans_BronzeAge
15.90954116I9010_Bronze_Age_Mycenaean_Galatas_Apatheia_Peloponnese
15.92678247I2430_Balkans_Chalcolithic
16.11320576I4088_Balkans_Chalcolithic
16.53829495Bul10_Balkans_BronzeAge
16.77566690I1295_Malak_Preslavets
17.01953290I1979_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
17.11525051I2427_Balkans_Chalcolithic
17.52946092I2423_Balkans_Chalcolithic
17.60192035I2426_Balkans_Chalcolithic
17.62203734I0706_Balkans_Neolithic
17.96744556I1109_Malak_Preslavets
18.63348330I2509_Balkans_Chalcolithic
18.71979701ASH068_Iron_Age1
18.78957158I9041_Bronze_Age_Mycenaean_Galatas_Apatheia_Peloponnese


Distance to:R437_Iron_Age_Palestrina_Selicata
7.64113866I9041_Bronze_Age_Mycenaean_Galatas_Apatheia_Peloponnese
9.80721673I9010_Bronze_Age_Mycenaean_Galatas_Apatheia_Peloponnese
10.52248070I9033_Bronze_Age_Mycenaean_Peristeria_Tryfilia_Peloponnese
10.75826194ASH068_Iron_Age1
12.08184175I9123_Bronze_Age_Armenoi_Crete
13.31058977I9006_Bronze_Age_Mycenaean_Agia_Kyriaki_Salamis
14.03341726I2495_Bronze_Age_Anatolian_Harmanӧren-GӧndürleHӧyük_Isparta
14.17018701ANI159_ANI181_Varna
14.77072781I0679_Krepost_Neolithic
14.92823164I2499_Bronze_Age_Anatolian_Harmanӧren-GӧndürleHӧyük_Isparta
15.25588411Bul6_Balkans_BronzeAge
15.46300747I2427_Balkans_Chalcolithic
15.54781014I9005_Bronze_Age_Minoan_Hagios_Charalambos_Cave_Lasithi_Crete
15.85167499I2424_Balkans_Chalcolithic
16.55914551I2175_Balkans_BronzeAge
16.59398084I9131_Bronze_Age_Minoan_Moni_Odigitria_Heraklion_Crete
16.69271697Bul10_Balkans_BronzeAge
17.21921020I2430_Balkans_Chalcolithic
17.50940319I3709_Peloponnese_Neolithic
17.54941879I1979_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
17.57468634I2431_Balkans_Chalcolithic
17.63260616I0071_Bronze_Age_Minoan_Hagios_Charalambos_Cave_Lasithi_Crete
17.64726608I0074_Bronze_Age_Minoan_Hagios_Charalambos_Cave_Lasithi_Crete
17.68089364I2176_Balkans_BronzeAge
17.88896028I9129_Bronze_Age_Minoan_Moni_Odigitria_Heraklion_Crete


Distance to:R435_Iron_Age_Palestrina_Colombella
2.14441134I2478_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
6.97894691I1113_Malak_Preslavets
7.11525825I2215_Malak_Preslavets
9.01150931I1297_Malak_Preslavets
11.23877217I2181_Balkans_Chalcolithic_outlier
12.23966911I2520_Balkans_BronzeAge
13.58203961I4331_Balkans_BronzeAge
14.33947349I3151_Trypillia
14.91302116I2111_Trypillia
15.69331705I2440_Globular_Amphora
15.79126974I2176_Balkans_BronzeAge
16.52166154I1979_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
16.61040638I2403_Globular_Amphora
16.70247886I1926_Trypillia
16.79514513Bul8_Balkans_BronzeAge
17.15141977I2110_Trypillia
18.74883196I2175_Balkans_BronzeAge
18.78495142I2433_Globular_Amphora
18.87954978Bul6_Balkans_BronzeAge
19.18714674I2165_Balkans_BronzeAge
19.26961338I2441_Globular_Amphora
19.51294186I9123_Bronze_Age_Armenoi_Crete
19.89261672Bul10_Balkans_BronzeAge
20.68005319I2434_Globular_Amphora
21.55101854I0706_Balkans_Neolithic


Distance to:R851_Iron_Age_Ardea
7.12745396I3151_Trypillia
8.31362737I2215_Malak_Preslavets
8.94475265I1113_Malak_Preslavets
9.73866521I1297_Malak_Preslavets
10.11018299I2520_Balkans_BronzeAge
10.14648708I2478_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
11.57587146I1979_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
11.68067207I2110_Trypillia
11.81369967I2176_Balkans_BronzeAge
12.75417971I4331_Balkans_BronzeAge
12.96713538I2175_Balkans_BronzeAge
13.14383886I1926_Trypillia
13.18246183I2111_Trypillia
14.07380901Bul10_Balkans_BronzeAge
14.47627369I0706_Balkans_Neolithic
14.86646226I2440_Globular_Amphora
15.59638740I1295_Malak_Preslavets
15.78815062Bul6_Balkans_BronzeAge
15.94750451I2181_Balkans_Chalcolithic_outlier
16.54377224I9123_Bronze_Age_Armenoi_Crete
17.91801607ANI160_Varna_Outlier
18.25397217I2433_Globular_Amphora
18.68158184I2441_Globular_Amphora
18.77697526I2425_Balkans_Chalcolithic
19.37577611I4088_Balkans_Chalcolithic


Distance to:R850_Iron_Age_Ardea
9.70182457I2495_Bronze_Age_Anatolian_Harmanӧren-GӧndürleHӧyük_Isparta
10.36232599ASH067_Iron_Age1
11.27515410I2499_Bronze_Age_Anatolian_Harmanӧren-GӧndürleHӧyük_Isparta
11.91529269I2683_Bronze_Age_Anatolian_Harmanӧren-GӧndürleHӧyük_Isparta
16.20714966ASH066_Iron_Age1
16.78097137I0679_Krepost_Neolithic
17.50239984ASH034_Late_Bronze_Age
17.83166846I9041_Bronze_Age_Mycenaean_Galatas_Apatheia_Peloponnese
17.89449636ASH029_Late_Bronze_Age
18.04525422I9131_Bronze_Age_Minoan_Moni_Odigitria_Heraklion_Crete
18.45507518I9006_Bronze_Age_Mycenaean_Agia_Kyriaki_Salamis
19.90462509I9010_Bronze_Age_Mycenaean_Galatas_Apatheia_Peloponnese
20.20018812I9005_Bronze_Age_Minoan_Hagios_Charalambos_Cave_Lasithi_Crete
20.34773206ASH033_Late_Bronze_Age
20.65300220I0073_Bronze_Age_Minoan_Hagios_Charalambos_Cave_Lasithi_Crete
20.92920448ASH068_Iron_Age1
21.11986032ASH008_Iron_Age2
21.14818668I0071_Bronze_Age_Minoan_Hagios_Charalambos_Cave_Lasithi_Crete
21.43323587I0070_Bronze_Age_Minoan_Hagios_Charalambos_Cave_Lasithi_Crete
22.19379192I0074_Bronze_Age_Minoan_Hagios_Charalambos_Cave_Lasithi_Crete
22.37594691ASH087_Iron_Age2
22.54875606I9033_Bronze_Age_Mycenaean_Peristeria_Tryfilia_Peloponnese
23.36968977I3709_Peloponnese_Neolithic
24.84876858KFH2_KfarHaHoresh_PPNB
25.05676356I4930_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Sicily
Distance to:R1021_Iron_Age_Boville_Ernica
6.69770856I3151_Trypillia
9.72555911I2215_Malak_Preslavets
9.81126393I2520_Balkans_BronzeAge
10.30931133I1979_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
10.38576911I2176_Balkans_BronzeAge
10.45481229I1113_Malak_Preslavets
11.41484998I4331_Balkans_BronzeAge
11.43899034I2175_Balkans_BronzeAge
12.04413965I2478_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
12.20604768I2110_Trypillia
12.28929209I1297_Malak_Preslavets
12.79157535Bul10_Balkans_BronzeAge
13.04577326I0706_Balkans_Neolithic
13.42683879I2111_Trypillia
14.22975755I1926_Trypillia
14.38184967I1295_Malak_Preslavets
14.64225392Bul6_Balkans_BronzeAge
14.87163407I9123_Bronze_Age_Armenoi_Crete
17.02191529I2181_Balkans_Chalcolithic_outlier
17.12151862I2440_Globular_Amphora
17.40549339ANI160_Varna_Outlier
18.13532189I2425_Balkans_Chalcolithic
18.77317235I2431_Balkans_Chalcolithic
18.86425191I4088_Balkans_Chalcolithic
19.09591579ANI159_ANI181_Varna

Did you include these, Jovialis? I ask because of a discussion I'm having with Ygorcs about whether there was a British Bronze Age or Iberian or North Alpine pull in these samples.

Just for the heck of it I added them. (If some are post Iron Age, please let me know and I'll remove them.)

NorthAlpineBronzeAgeFrench_AITI_120,7.59,0.73,0.40,0.00,39.57,31.32,1.80,0.00,0.00,0.00,17.73,0.86
NorthAlpineBronzeAgeSpanishGalicia_AITI_72,4.56,0.00,0.00,0.00,42.85,31.92,0.69,0.89,2.30,0.31,16.30,0.19
NorthAlpineBronzeAgeFrench_AITI_119,9.54,1.40,0.00,0.27,43.57,32.66,0.11,0.14,0.20,0.00,11.08,1.01
NorthAlpineBronzeAgeFrench_AITI_78,10.50,0.54,0.54,0.00,39.10,37.12,0.00,0.35,2.04,0.00,9.53,0.28
NorthAlpineSouthDutch_AITI_50,10.70,0.00,0.00,0.00,35.87,44.30,2.23,0.13,0.00,0.00,4.95,1.82
NorthAlpineSouthDutch_AITI_2,5.63,0.00,0.00,0.00,40.44,41.78,1.83,0.00,1.04,0.00,8.28,0.99
CuevadelaPalomaSpain_I3239,0.00,0.00,2.63,2.34,44.59,28.94,2.32,0.66,0.00,0.00,18.51,0.00
IberianSettlementCataloniaSpain_I3496,5.38,0.21,0.75,0.00,53.63,28.85,1.92,1.72,5.92,0.00,1.63,0.00
CuevadelaPalomaSpain_I3243,8.87,0.00,2.93,4.86,36.62,38.06,0.00,0.00,0.00,0.00,8.67,0.00
ElSotilloBasqueCountry_I1977,2.96,0.00,2.41,0.00,52.45,25.53,0.60,0.00,3.19,0.00,12.86,0.00
IberiaBronzeAge_ATP9,0.89,0.00,1.25,0.00,58.14,21.43,0.49,0.00,4.69,0.00,11.18,1.93
BellBeakerFranceI1388,0.00,0.00,2.30,0.00,59.39,21.76,0.81,0.00,7.46,0.00,8.28,0.00
IlergetesTribeCatalan_I3320,4.64,0.00,4.88,1.09,52.24,25.19,0.00,0.00,3.67,0.00,7.44,0.86
IlercavonesCatalan_I3321,3.80,0.00,4.55,0.00,55.48,25.14,0.00,0.83,2.20,0.32,7.68,0.00
BellBeakerSouthernFrance_I3874,5.77,0.32,0.81,0.47,39.46,40.05,1.07,0.56,0.80,0.00,10.47,0.22
IberianElArgarBronzeAge_I8136,0.00,0.00,4.83,0.00,61.85,21.67,1.21,0.00,3.88,0.00,6.07,0.49
BronzeAgeSpainCogotas_I12208,1.39,0.00,5.31,0.43,54.53,22.97,1.16,0.00,3.96,0.94,8.35,0.95
Bavaria_BB_II5524,2.95,0.00,1.28,1.77,41.61,28.76,0.00,0.00,3.52,0.00,20.12,0.00
BronzeAgeEngland_I2462,8.52,1.12,1.18,0.00,45.45,33.73,0.00,0.00,2.08,0.00,6.90,1.02
BronzeAgeOuterHebrides_I2655,9.88,0.61,0.00,0.39,37.20,45.77,0.76,0.00,0.29,0.00,4.27,0.82
NeolithicScotland_I2634,0.00,0.00,6.63,1.42,60.56,11.65,0.00,0.21,7.56,0.00,11.96,0.00


Same samples:

R473 Etruscan
Distance to:R473_Iron_Age_Civitavecchia
5.23807216I2520_Balkans_BronzeAge
7.33017053I1979_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
7.88686249I1113_Malak_Preslavets
8.15739542I2111_Trypillia
8.17621551I2176_Balkans_BronzeAge
8.33299466I2215_Malak_Preslavets
8.84239786I1297_Malak_Preslavets
9.36587423I2175_Balkans_BronzeAge
9.46015856Bavaria_BB_II5524
9.83392089I3151_Trypillia
10.07499380Bul10_Balkans_BronzeAge
10.18056482I2110_Trypillia
10.61650131Bul6_Balkans_BronzeAge
10.62080505I1926_Trypillia
10.62551175ElSotilloBasqueCountry_I1977
10.84815192CuevadelaPalomaSpain_I3239
11.21283639I4331_Balkans_BronzeAge
11.59367931I2478_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
12.06694245I0706_Balkans_Neolithic
12.55335015I9123_Bronze_Age_Armenoi_Crete
12.55979299NorthAlpineBronzeAgeSpanishGalicia_AITI_72
13.34862165I1295_Malak_Preslavets
14.53531217I2440_Globular_Amphora
14.54483757IberiaBronzeAge_ATP9

Bavaria BB did show up, but at a further distance than the Balkan samples. Same for the Spanish samples which show up.

R474 Etruscan...This one has good hits to the German BB and North Alpine samples
Distance to:R474_Iron_Age_Civitavecchia
5.74122809I4331_Balkans_BronzeAge
6.77580991Bavaria_BB_II5524
8.72072818NorthAlpineBronzeAgeFrench_AITI_120
9.30280603NorthAlpineBronzeAgeSpanishGalicia_AITI_72
9.65161126I2520_Balkans_BronzeAge
10.61332653I2176_Balkans_BronzeAge
10.90744700I1113_Malak_Preslavets
11.18787737I2215_Malak_Preslavets
11.81452496I2478_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
11.82549788CuevadelaPalomaSpain_I3239
12.33373423I9123_Bronze_Age_Armenoi_Crete
12.54336877I2165_Balkans_BronzeAge
12.68957840I1979_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
13.05530161Bul6_Balkans_BronzeAge
13.21538876NorthAlpineBronzeAgeFrench_AITI_119
14.00343886I2111_Trypillia
14.45190299I2181_Balkans_Chalcolithic_outlier
14.92140074I2175_Balkans_BronzeAge
15.52350798ElSotilloBasqueCountry_I1977
15.70083756NorthAlpineBronzeAgeFrench_AITI_78
16.12808730I3151_Trypillia
16.32355047BronzeAgeEngland_I2462
16.50133328I1297_Malak_Preslavets
16.56924561Bul10_Balkans_BronzeAge
17.55443819BellBeakerSouthernFrance_I3874

R1015 Etruscan-more Balkan Bronze Age heavy
Distance to:R1015_Iron_Age_Veio_Grotta_Gramiccia
5.90466765I2520_Balkans_BronzeAge
7.39762124I2176_Balkans_BronzeAge
7.71334558I1979_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
8.13312363I2175_Balkans_BronzeAge
8.35159266I2215_Malak_Preslavets
8.37548805I2111_Trypillia
8.72612743I3151_Trypillia
9.37365457I2110_Trypillia
9.64178925Bavaria_BB_II5524
9.76218725I1113_Malak_Preslavets
9.95499874Bul10_Balkans_BronzeAge
10.42357424CuevadelaPalomaSpain_I3239
10.52312216I1297_Malak_Preslavets
10.70558733ElSotilloBasqueCountry_I1977
10.72228520I1926_Trypillia
11.05433851I0706_Balkans_Neolithic
11.10513395Bul6_Balkans_BronzeAge
11.40769915I4331_Balkans_BronzeAge
11.85190702I9123_Bronze_Age_Armenoi_Crete
11.99557418I1295_Malak_Preslavets
12.39624540I2478_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
13.15312510NorthAlpineBronzeAgeSpanishGalicia_AITI_72
14.56524631ANI160_Varna_Outlier
14.83928570I4088_Balkans_Chalcolithic
14.89781192IberiaBronzeAge_ATP9

R1016 Roman-the only upper class sample-again, closer to Bronze Age Balkans
Distance to:R1016_Iron_Age_Castel_di_Decima
7.35068024I3151_Trypillia
8.76047373I2520_Balkans_BronzeAge
9.09492716I1979_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
9.45085710I2175_Balkans_BronzeAge
9.68979876I2176_Balkans_BronzeAge
10.22361971I2110_Trypillia
10.45816906Bavaria_BB_II5524
10.55012322I2215_Malak_Preslavets
10.69418534Bul10_Balkans_BronzeAge
10.99995000CuevadelaPalomaSpain_I3239
11.07581148I2111_Trypillia
11.10573726I0706_Balkans_Neolithic
11.18283506ElSotilloBasqueCountry_I1977
11.73281296I9123_Bronze_Age_Armenoi_Crete
11.86617040I1926_Trypillia
11.93298370I1113_Malak_Preslavets
11.95698122I4331_Balkans_BronzeAge
12.09002895I1295_Malak_Preslavets
12.25331384I1297_Malak_Preslavets
12.57254549I2478_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
13.06662925Bul6_Balkans_BronzeAge
13.48874716NorthAlpineBronzeAgeSpanishGalicia_AITI_72
14.70167337ANI160_Varna_Outlier
14.73282050NorthAlpineBronzeAgeFrench_AITI_120
15.32862681IberiaBronzeAge_ATP9

Boville Ernica-Bavarian BB and a Spanish sample show up relatively early
Distance to:R1021_Iron_Age_Boville_Ernica
6.69770856I3151_Trypillia
7.95362182CuevadelaPalomaSpain_I3239
8.44269507Bavaria_BB_II5524
9.72555911I2215_Malak_Preslavets
9.81126393I2520_Balkans_BronzeAge
10.30931133I1979_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
10.38576911I2176_Balkans_BronzeAge
10.45481229I1113_Malak_Preslavets
10.87415284ElSotilloBasqueCountry_I1977
11.41484998I4331_Balkans_BronzeAge
11.43899034I2175_Balkans_BronzeAge
11.56217540NorthAlpineBronzeAgeSpanishGalicia_AITI_72
12.04413965I2478_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
12.20604768I2110_Trypillia
12.28929209I1297_Malak_Preslavets
12.79157535Bul10_Balkans_BronzeAge
13.04577326I0706_Balkans_Neolithic
13.36867982NorthAlpineBronzeAgeFrench_AITI_120
13.42683879I2111_Trypillia
14.22975755I1926_Trypillia
14.38184967I1295_Malak_Preslavets
14.64225392Bul6_Balkans_BronzeAge
14.87163407I9123_Bronze_Age_Armenoi_Crete
16.00559902IberiaBronzeAge_ATP9
16.21570535IlergetesTribeCatalan_I3320

Distance to:R851_Iron_Age_Ardea
7.12745396I3151_Trypillia
7.74215732CuevadelaPalomaSpain_I3239
8.31362737I2215_Malak_Preslavets
8.37911093ElSotilloBasqueCountry_I1977
8.94475265I1113_Malak_Preslavets
8.99763302Bavaria_BB_II5524
9.73866521I1297_Malak_Preslavets
10.11018299I2520_Balkans_BronzeAge
10.14648708I2478_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
10.83610631NorthAlpineBronzeAgeSpanishGalicia_AITI_72
11.57587146I1979_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
11.68067207I2110_Trypillia
11.81369967I2176_Balkans_BronzeAge
12.75417971I4331_Balkans_BronzeAge
12.96713538I2175_Balkans_BronzeAge
13.14383886I1926_Trypillia
13.18246183I2111_Trypillia
13.56668346IberiaBronzeAge_ATP9
13.62619169NorthAlpineBronzeAgeFrench_AITI_120
13.98647919BronzeAgeSpainCogotas_I12208
14.07380901Bul10_Balkans_BronzeAge
14.10845137IlergetesTribeCatalan_I3320
14.47627369I0706_Balkans_Neolithic
14.57562692IlercavonesCatalan_I3321
14.86646226I2440_Globular_Amphora

Distance to:R435_Iron_Age_Palestrina_Colombella
2.14441134I2478_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
6.60470287NorthAlpineBronzeAgeSpanishGalicia_AITI_72
6.79479212ElSotilloBasqueCountry_I1977
6.97894691I1113_Malak_Preslavets
7.11525825I2215_Malak_Preslavets
8.59178678NorthAlpineBronzeAgeFrench_AITI_119
9.01150931I1297_Malak_Preslavets
9.15171569Bavaria_BB_II5524
9.40140947CuevadelaPalomaSpain_I3239
9.51282292BronzeAgeEngland_I2462
9.63494162IlergetesTribeCatalan_I3320
10.53571070NorthAlpineBronzeAgeFrench_AITI_120
11.23877217I2181_Balkans_Chalcolithic_outlier
11.64855356IlercavonesCatalan_I3321
12.15553783BronzeAgeSpainCogotas_I12208
12.23966911I2520_Balkans_BronzeAge
13.58203961I4331_Balkans_BronzeAge
13.76760691NorthAlpineBronzeAgeFrench_AITI_78
13.82287597IberianSettlementCataloniaSpain_I3496
13.98864540IberiaBronzeAge_ATP9
14.33947349I3151_Trypillia
14.60477319BellBeakerSouthernFrance_I3874
14.91302116I2111_Trypillia
15.69331705I2440_Globular_Amphora
15.79126974I2176_Balkans_BronzeAge

From what I can see there's a mixture of Balkan Bronze Age and North Alpine/German BB/Iberian Bronze Age, with some samples leaning more one way than the other.

I would need more Etruscan samples to say whether they lean more "eastern" than "western" Bronze Age compared to the Latins, or vice versa.

Ed. switched eastern and western.
 
Last edited:
@Angela,

The PCA for these samples are interesting as well; https://vahaduo.github.io/custompca/

a6mRgrm.png


Here are the coordinates I used for the Ancient Samples + Modern West Eurasian:

Code:
R850_Iron_Age_Ardea,7.30,0,4.52,1.08,21.26,10.54,0,0.43,14.77,0,40.10,0
R851_Iron_Age_Ardea,1.59,0,1.39,0,49.28,24.97,0,0.14,1.93,0,20.26,0.45
R435_Iron_Age_Palestrina_Colombella,4.84,0.64,0.65,0,47.12,28.54,0.15,0,4.13,0,13.40,0.53
R437_Iron_Age_Palestrina_Selicata,6.45,0,3.03,0,33.19,11.94,0,0,11.63,0,33.74,0.02
R475_Iron_Age_Civitavecchia,0,0,13.01,0,38.12,12.14,0.37,1.98,11.26,0,22.70,0.42
R474_Iron_Age_Civitavecchia,7.18,0.17,2.38,0,39.08,25.74,0,0,5.98,0,18.84,0.66
R473_Iron_Age_Civitavecchia,1.01,0,0.68,0.15,47.26,22.79,0,0.21,7.39,0.21,20.17,0.34
R1015_Iron_Age_Veio_Grotta_Gramiccia,1.56,0.19,2.85,0,47.15,21.66,0,0,5.46,0,20.85,0
R1_Iron_Age_Protovillanovan_Martinsicuro,5.02,1.78,1.33,0,35.08,26.46,0,0,5.43,0,24.50,0.40
R1016_Iron_Age_Castel_di_Decima,3.86,0.98,1.53,0.19,47.23,20.37,1.43,0,3.31,0,21.10,0
R1021_Iron_Age_Boville_Ernica,2.11,0,1.96,0.60,47.70,24.04,0,0,1.33,0,22.26,0
Sicilian,4.50,0.00,4.10,0.00,30.03,11.91,0.10,0.70,11.91,0.00,36.54,0.20
S_Italian_Sicilian,5.50,0.10,2.50,0.00,29.90,11.80,0.50,0.70,12.50,0.00,36.50,0.00
C_Italian,4.80,0.00,2.30,0.00,34.83,17.12,0.10,0.00,8.71,0.00,32.13,0.00
O_Italian,6.21,0.00,1.10,0.00,33.53,21.82,0.00,0.20,7.81,0.00,28.53,0.80
Tuscan,4.80,0.00,0.00,0.00,37.86,18.68,0.50,0.00,7.19,0.50,30.47,0.00
TSI30,5.01,0.00,0.80,0.00,38.78,19.34,0.10,0.00,7.31,0.00,28.66,0.00
North_Italian,4.50,0.00,0.70,0.00,44.04,22.02,0.00,0.00,5.81,0.00,22.92,0.00
N_Italian,5.69,0.00,0.90,0.00,41.16,23.68,0.20,0.00,5.59,0.00,22.78,0.00
Swiss_Italian,3.9175,0.0825,1.1025,0,39.8525,28.55,0.185,0.0625,5.7975,0,20.45,0
Italy_Aosta_Valley,5.817,0.055,1.62,0.1424,40.6528,29.9942,0.2457,0.052857,4.298,0.03,16.98,0.111
Italy_Trentino,4.792,0.216,0.726,0.044,38.714,29.792,0,0,5.468,0.02,20.222,0
Italy_FriuliVG,5.44,0.278,1.174,0.014,34.924,29.32,0.076,0,7.032,0,21.72,0.022
Italy_Veneto,5.443,0.0427,1.433,0.17818,36.93,27.16,0.062,0,5.728,0.15,22.83,0.03
Italy_Lombardy,4.749,0.123,1.119,0.039,39.628,25.077,0.166,0.013,6.41,0.026,22.618,0.0266
Italy_Piedmont,5.92,0.132,1.729,0.085,37.82,26.0195,0.035,0.035,6.7275,0.02395,21.37,0.1
Italy_Liguria,5.1,0.05,2.014,0.0922,37.89,23.225,0.2477,0.053,7.89,0.048,23.39,0
Italy_Emilia,6.13,0,1.15,0.1801,37.614,22.757,0.14,0.107,7.396,0.25,24.22,0.055
Italy_Romagna,6.08,0,1.87,0.13,34.66,20.98,0.1,0,8.99,0,27.19,0
Italy_Tuscany,6.12,0.049,1.21,0.139,36.889,21.811,0.157,0.055,8.206,0,25.364,0
Italy_Lazio,6.725,0,2.67,0.0525,31.7,19.8175,0.2575,0.07,9.785,0.1725,28.747,0
Italy_Marche,6.421,0.082,2.38,0.048,32.91,18.72,0.294,0.267,9.802,0,29.042,0.034
France_Corsica,4.812,0,2.998,0,39.95,17.762,0.09,0,8.306,0.064,25.994,0.024
Italy_Abruzzo,7.586,0.0283,3.225,0.0383,29.12,16.1,0,0.0783,10.91,0.316,32.598,0
Italy_Campania,7.065,0.086,2.818,0.085,28.905,13.727,0.111,0.334,12.32,0.02,34.342,0.111
Italy_Apulia,7.382,0.32,2.812,0.336,26.188,17.186,0.274,0.266,11.314,0.412,33.356,0.154
Italy_Sicily,7.313,0.482,4.594,0.101,27.216,13.451,0.249,0.653,12.095,0.047,33.163,0.635
Italy_Calabria,7.006,0.1308,4.1825,0.0759,27.005,11.44083,0.2616,0.5983,13.52416,0.22,35.4525,0.0975
ANI152_Varna,0,0,0,7.78,44.92,3.01,0,0,11.36,0,32.93,0
ANI153_Varna,2.13,0,0,0,51.89,5.96,5.65,3.03,10.35,0,20.99,0
ANI159_ANI181_Varna,0,0,3.07,0,44.93,10.49,0,0,12.13,0,29.38,0
ANI160_Varna_Outlier,0,0,0,0,52.83,10.79,0,0,10.03,0,26.35,0
ANI163_Varna_Outlier,8.64,0,2.63,0,29.14,44.17,0.62,0,0.66,0,13.52,0.02
I0633_Balkans_Neolithic,0,0,3.48,0,48.68,0,0,0,12.28,0,35.57,0
I0634_Balkans_Neolithic,0,0,3.04,0,51.34,0,0,0,13.43,0.25,31.76,0.17
I0676_Balkans_Neolithic,0,0,4.22,0,51.96,0,0,0,11.72,0,32.09,0
I0679_Krepost_Neolithic,4.98,0,2.66,0.27,34.26,1.16,0,0,13.05,0,43.56,0.06
I0698_Balkans_Neolithic,0,0,4.76,0,52.43,0,0,0,13.38,0,29.43,0
I0706_Balkans_Neolithic,0,0,1.22,0.90,48.64,14.14,0,0,6.76,0,28.32,0.02
I0785_Balkans_Chalcolithic,0,0,3.23,0,49.57,0,0,0,17.01,0,30.19,0
I1109_Malak_Preslavets,0,0.07,2.03,0,50.22,7.11,0,0,12.90,0.10,27.56,0
I1113_Malak_Preslavets,0,0,0.20,0,45.55,29.58,0,0,7.27,0,16.75,0.66
I1131_Balkans_Neolithic,0,0,2.38,0.10,55.06,0,0,0,12.85,0,29.57,0.04
I1295_Malak_Preslavets,0,0,3.14,0,49.84,12.28,0,0,6.83,0.03,27.49,0.39
I1296_Malak_Preslavets,0,0,7.53,0,56.78,8.14,2.34,1.97,5.09,0,17.29,0.87
I1297_Malak_Preslavets,0,0,0,0,52.70,25.39,0,0,8.05,0,13.87,0
I1298_Balkans_Neolithic,0,0,5.68,1.17,60.20,1.94,0,0,5.84,0,25.18,0
I1926_Trypillia,0,0,2.41,0,54.57,16.20,0,0,9.41,0,17.41,0
I2110_Trypillia,0,0,3.57,0.44,54.23,16.16,0,1.34,6.95,0,20.31,0
I2111_Trypillia,0,0,5.24,0,46.15,18.81,0,0,12.04,0,17.76,0
I2163_Balkans_BronzeAge,21.63,1.00,0,1.01,17.80,51.39,1.00,0,0,0,5.18,0.99
I2165_Balkans_BronzeAge,4.00,0,2.29,0,31.35,34.24,0.17,0,4.66,0,22.50,0.79
I2175_Balkans_BronzeAge,0,0.24,3.96,0.15,44.81,16.75,0,0,8.23,0,25.87,0
I2176_Balkans_BronzeAge,0,0.13,4.71,0,41.53,21.46,0,0,8.26,0,23.91,0
I2181_Balkans_Chalcolithic_outlier,1.19,0,0,0,41.79,37.57,0,0,4.43,0.31,14.71,0
I2215_Malak_Preslavets,0,1.10,4.90,0,46.06,26.49,0,0.33,5.15,0,14.83,1.15
I2216_Malak_Preslavets,0,0,3.02,0,51.29,1.02,0,0,11.44,0,33.22,0
I2318_Peloponnese_Neolithic,0,0,1.09,0,44.62,0,0,0,13.77,0,40.52,0
I2403_Globular_Amphora,0,0.83,2.31,0,59.88,25.84,0,0,6.36,0,4.78,0
I2405_Globular_Amphora,0,0,0,0,69.86,17.08,0,0,4.81,0,8.25,0
I2423_Balkans_Chalcolithic,0,0,3.23,0,48.97,5.31,0,0,13.48,0,28.88,0.13
I2424_Balkans_Chalcolithic,0,0,3.73,0,45.99,6.95,0,0,13.64,0,29.69,0
I2425_Balkans_Chalcolithic,0,0,4.44,0,54.61,8.79,0,0,6.31,0,25.84,0
I2426_Balkans_Chalcolithic,0,0,3.32,0,47.06,8.21,0,0,21.64,0,19.77,0
I2427_Balkans_Chalcolithic,0,0,3.93,0,44.78,4.58,0,0,14.21,0,32.50,0
I2430_Balkans_Chalcolithic,0,0,2.70,0,47.75,8.28,0,0,12.82,0,28.45,0
I2431_Balkans_Chalcolithic,0,0,4.01,0,48.30,9.01,0,0,10.16,0,28.52,0
I2433_Globular_Amphora,0,0,4.98,0,61.34,19.23,0,0,5.45,0,9.00,0
I2434_Globular_Amphora,0,0,0.42,0,64.12,19.13,0,0,7.08,0,9.25,0
I2440_Globular_Amphora,0,0,1.32,0,58.65,19.93,0,0,7.59,0,11.71,0.80
I2441_Globular_Amphora,0,0,3.56,0,61.46,18.19,0,0,7.23,0.06,9.34,0.16
I2509_Balkans_Chalcolithic,0,0,6.02,0,47.70,1.62,0,0,12.45,0,32.20,0
I2510_Balkans_BronzeAge,0,0,2.52,0,51.52,1.22,0,0,13.30,0,31.44,0
I2519_Balkans_Chalcolithic,0,0,3.96,0.24,45.47,0.39,0,0,14.22,0,35.72,0
I2520_Balkans_BronzeAge,0,0,3.13,0.78,43.29,22.62,0.71,0,9.26,0.28,19.92,0
I2521_Balkans_Neolithic,0,0,5.12,0,47.12,0,0,0,13.49,0.10,34.16,0
I2526_Balkans_Neolithic,0,0,4.07,0,51.63,0,0,0,11.52,0,32.78,0
I2532_Balkans_Neolithic,0,0,2.40,0,50.58,0,0,0,12.65,0.10,34.28,0
I2533_Balkans_Neolithic,0,0,3.27,0,52.14,0,0,0,12.35,0.08,32.16,0
I4167_Balkans_Neolithic,0,0,0,0,59.00,0,0,0,10.63,2.65,26.89,0.83
I4168_Balkans_Neolithic,0,0,1.41,0,54.81,1.57,0,0,13.72,0,28.48,0
I4331_Balkans_BronzeAge,4.65,0,0.65,0,38.24,27.11,0,0,5.98,0,23.37,0
Abhkasians,17.20,0.90,0.00,0.60,0.00,11.10,0.00,0.00,0.00,0.20,70.00,0.00
Adygei,17.18,2.40,0.00,0.30,1.90,20.18,0.20,0.00,0.00,1.30,56.54,0.00
Albanian_Kosovo,5.18,0.14,0.62,0.17,29.47,27.1,0.23,0.01,8.13,0.26,28.69,0
Albanian_North,4.49,0,1.15,0.03,29.7,28.3,0.21,0.05,7.34,0.12,28.6,0
Andalucia,7.19,0.00,5.09,0.00,52.55,18.08,0.00,0.60,3.20,0.10,12.89,0.30
Aragon,6.31,0.10,3.40,0.00,56.16,21.82,0.40,0.00,3.00,0.00,8.81,0.00
Argyll,13.10,0.00,0.00,0.00,41.20,45.20,0.00,0.00,0.00,0.00,0.50,0.00
Armenian_East,18.78,0.24,0.62,0.08,10.82,5.54,0.48,0.02,14.21,0.13,49.01,0
Armenian_West,17.23,0.05,0.79,0.11,12.26,3.33,0.39,0.1,16.05,0.08,49.54,0
Ashkenazi,2.10,0.50,4.70,0.00,25.90,13.00,0.90,0.20,13.90,0.50,38.30,0.00
Ashkenazy_Jews,2.80,0.60,4.20,0.00,25.13,13.21,1.30,0.40,12.81,0.50,39.04,0.00
Assyrian,18.30,0.00,0.00,0.00,9.60,0.90,0.10,0.00,18.90,0.00,52.20,0.00
Avar_Dagestan,25.18,2.76,0,0,6.09,25.32,1.19,0,2.06,0.28,37.13,0
Baleares,5.50,0.00,3.70,0.00,49.40,22.50,0.20,0.00,4.40,0.00,14.20,0.10
Balkars,15.80,3.90,0.00,0.10,0.80,19.40,0.10,0.00,0.00,3.30,56.60,0.00
Bashkir,10.27,23.64,0.15,1.07,8,30.73,1.87,0.01,0.49,16.51,7.24,0.01
Bedouin,5.00,0.00,4.90,0.00,8.20,0.40,0.00,5.30,43.30,0.00,30.80,2.10
Belorussian,0.00,0.30,0.00,0.00,16.12,67.87,0.50,0.00,1.90,0.00,13.31,0.00
Bosnian,4.81,0.53,0.39,0.12,25.91,42.79,0.74,0.03,4.67,0.07,19.92,0.01
British,11.30,0.00,0.00,0.00,43.50,43.60,0.00,0.00,0.30,0.00,1.30,0.00
British_Isles,9.50,0.00,0.00,0.00,42.50,45.70,0.10,0.00,0.00,0.00,2.20,0.00
Bulgarian,3.30,0.30,0.50,0.00,23.70,34.80,0.50,0.00,6.40,0.40,30.10,0.00
Bulgarians,1.50,0.90,0.30,0.00,25.03,34.93,0.30,0.00,5.71,0.60,30.73,0.00
Canarias,5.00,0.30,11.80,0.60,46.70,17.60,0.10,2.80,3.70,0.00,11.20,0.20
Cantabria,5.70,0.10,3.10,0.00,54.80,23.50,0.30,0.30,3.00,0.00,8.90,0.30
Castilla_La_Mancha,6.80,0.40,3.50,0.00,54.30,21.10,0.00,0.60,4.50,0.00,8.80,0.00
Castilla_Y_Leon,5.40,0.00,6.10,0.00,51.20,22.30,0.40,0.60,4.00,0.00,10.00,0.00
Cataluna,7.30,0.00,2.40,0.00,52.10,25.20,0.30,0.00,3.50,0.00,9.20,0.00
CEU30,10.60,0.00,0.00,0.00,41.40,44.70,0.00,0.00,0.00,0.00,3.30,0.00
Chechens,21.80,2.60,0.00,0.70,0.00,23.00,0.00,0.00,0.00,0.60,51.30,0.00
Chuvashs,4.50,20.02,0.00,0.00,6.71,52.75,1.00,0.00,0.70,4.10,10.21,0.00
Circassian,19.16,3.23,0,0.66,5.2,17.08,0.5,0.04,3.75,2.3,48.03,0.07
Cornwall,11.40,0.00,0.00,0.00,43.80,42.80,0.00,0.00,0.00,0.00,2.00,0.00
Cypriots,5.81,0.00,2.10,0.00,20.52,4.50,0.00,0.00,17.72,0.00,49.35,0.00
Druze,8.91,0.10,2.90,0.00,12.51,0.90,0.70,1.10,23.12,0.00,49.55,0.20
Dutch,9.90,0.00,0.00,0.00,39.10,45.60,0.00,0.00,0.60,0.00,4.80,0.00
English,10.62,0.00,0.00,0.00,41.58,44.59,0.00,0.00,0.10,0.00,3.11,0.00
Extremadura,6.91,0.00,6.01,0.00,48.25,22.12,0.30,1.00,4.30,0.00,10.71,0.40
FIN30,0.90,7.20,0.00,0.10,14.10,73.50,0.70,0.00,2.20,0.00,1.30,0.00
Finnish,0.30,6.70,0.00,0.00,13.40,75.50,0.20,0.00,2.60,0.00,1.30,0.00
French,7.91,0.00,0.20,0.00,44.44,36.54,0.00,0.00,2.50,0.00,8.41,0.00
French_Basque,9.80,0.00,0.00,0.00,73.10,17.10,0.00,0.00,0.00,0.00,0.00,0.00
French,8.08,0.00,0.60,0.00,43.81,36.83,0.10,0.00,2.69,0.00,7.88,0.00
Galicia,5.09,0.00,5.00,0.00,48.25,23.38,0.70,0.90,5.39,0.00,11.09,0.20
Georgia_Jews,16.92,0.00,0.70,0.40,7.41,3.60,0.00,0.00,18.82,0.00,52.15,0.00
Georgian_Adjara,19.54,0.59,0,0,7.8,4.1,0.54,0.05,8.46,0.31,58.62,0
Georgian_Gurian,18.73,0.31,0.02,0.34,4.51,10.73,0.17,0.12,6.12,0,58.94,0
Georgian_Imereti,19.33,0.33,0,0.11,5.3,7.93,0.47,0,6.83,0.1,59.61,0
Georgian_Mingrelian,18.78,0.69,0.15,0.13,4.16,9.36,0.24,0.05,5.1,0.36,60.98,0
Georgian_Svan,20.22,1.36,0,0.33,2.71,11.49,0.15,0,4.27,0.67,58.82,0
Georgian_Turkey,19.82,0.44,0,0.02,6.6,5.2,0.35,0.03,8.32,0.39,58.77,0
German,7.30,0.00,0.00,0.00,33.00,48.20,0.00,0.00,1.70,0.00,9.80,0.00
Greek,3.30,0.30,0.60,0.00,28.00,20.20,0.10,0.00,10.10,0.00,37.40,0.00
Greek_Cappadocia,11.66,0.41,0.6,0,18.85,6.27,0.13,0,14.23,0.1,47.73,0.02
Greek_Crete,8.02,0.02,2.63,0.2,23.4,12.24,0.17,0.23,14.43,0.17,38.45,0.04
Greek_Pontus,14.93,0.01,0.41,0.06,12.38,4.19,0.13,0.02,12.78,0.1,54.94,0
Hungarians,4.10,0.70,0.00,0.00,27.00,48.40,0.30,0.00,3.00,0.30,16.20,0.00
Iranian,28.80,2.10,0.00,0.60,5.60,6.00,3.60,0.10,12.40,0.50,40.30,0.00
Iran_Central_East,27.96,1.89,0.38,0.41,5.35,8.62,8.65,0.55,12.57,0.81,33.71,0.24
Iranian_Jews,18.80,0.40,1.80,0.40,6.80,0.00,0.00,0.00,22.50,0.00,49.30,0.00
Iranians,30.90,1.00,0.90,0.30,5.90,4.20,4.20,0.90,14.20,0.30,36.70,0.50
Iraq_Jews,16.80,0.00,1.60,0.10,8.90,0.00,0.10,0.00,24.70,0.00,47.80,0.00
Irish,11.91,0.00,0.00,0.00,42.74,45.15,0.00,0.00,0.00,0.00,0.20,0.00
Jordanians,9.60,0.00,5.50,0.00,10.80,0.90,0.20,4.90,27.90,0.10,38.00,2.10
Kent,10.49,0.00,0.00,0.00,41.86,43.86,0.00,0.00,0.20,0.00,3.60,0.00
Kumyks,20.00,3.90,0.00,0.50,3.10,18.80,0.40,0.00,3.30,3.70,46.30,0.00
Kurd,28.70,1.50,0.90,0.40,5.90,5.70,1.10,0.40,14.00,1.00,40.40,0.00
Kurds,28.20,0.60,0.00,0.60,6.30,6.70,0.80,0.10,14.30,0.20,42.20,0.00
Kurd_Kurmanji,24.19,1.39,1.15,0.18,8.64,7.09,2.59,0.26,13.97,0.62,39.81,0.1
Kurd_Sorani,24.26,0.4,1.22,0.48,7.29,6.28,3.79,0.94,16,0.5,38.62,0.24
Lebanese,10.80,0.20,4.70,0.60,11.80,3.70,0.00,2.40,23.50,0.00,41.30,1.00
Lezgins,27.80,1.70,0.00,0.00,0.30,23.80,0.00,0.00,0.80,0.00,45.60,0.00
Lithuanian,0.00,0.00,0.00,0.00,13.90,73.70,0.70,0.00,1.60,0.00,10.10,0.00
Lithuanians,0.00,0.00,0.00,0.00,13.71,77.18,0.10,0.00,1.00,0.00,8.01,0.00
Mixed_Germanic,10.70,0.00,0.00,0.00,38.40,44.10,0.00,0.00,0.50,0.00,6.30,0.00
Mixed_Slav,0.90,1.50,0.00,0.10,16.58,64.34,0.70,0.00,2.20,0.40,13.29,0.00
Mordovians,4.00,5.90,0.00,0.70,10.90,63.80,0.90,0.00,0.60,0.90,12.30,0.00
Morocco_Jews,5.41,0.00,9.51,0.00,27.33,4.30,0.50,1.10,17.02,0.00,34.03,0.80
Murcia,5.50,0.00,6.00,0.00,50.60,19.60,0.00,0.20,5.90,0.60,11.20,0.40
Nogais,12.87,11.38,0.00,0.50,4.49,21.26,0.70,0.00,0.10,11.48,37.23,0.00
North_Ossetians,16.50,3.90,0.00,0.20,0.00,19.20,0.00,0.00,0.00,3.50,56.70,0.00
Norwegian,8.20,1.00,0.00,0.00,36.00,54.70,0.00,0.00,0.00,0.00,0.10,0.00
Nusayri_Turkey,12.48,0.49,3.15,0.39,16.16,2.82,0.58,1.16,19.46,0.1,42.95,0.25
Orcadian,12.00,0.00,0.00,0.00,42.40,45.60,0.00,0.00,0.00,0.00,0.00,0.00
Orkney,11.80,0.00,0.00,0.00,41.80,46.40,0.00,0.00,0.00,0.00,0.00,0.00
Pais_Vasco,9.10,0.00,0.00,0.00,67.30,22.40,0.00,0.00,1.20,0.00,0.00,0.00
Palestinian,6.81,0.00,5.41,0.10,10.91,0.30,0.60,5.21,30.43,0.00,38.24,2.00
Polish,0.50,0.10,0.00,0.00,20.88,63.24,0.90,0.00,2.30,0.00,12.09,0.00
Portuguese,6.01,0.00,7.71,0.00,47.55,22.32,0.90,0.10,5.01,0.00,9.71,0.70
Romanians,3.00,0.30,0.00,0.00,24.60,36.00,1.50,0.00,5.90,0.30,28.40,0.00
Russian,2.00,7.30,0.00,0.10,12.10,65.40,1.10,0.00,2.00,0.80,9.20,0.00
Russian_B,0.20,2.70,0.10,0.40,13.11,66.57,0.80,0.00,0.60,1.20,14.31,0.00
Russian,1.80,3.00,0.00,0.00,14.11,66.47,0.40,0.00,1.40,1.10,11.71,0.00
Sardinian,0.00,0.00,2.60,0.00,70.57,0.00,0.10,0.00,5.81,0.00,20.92,0.00
Saudis,3.60,0.00,1.40,0.00,2.60,0.90,0.30,2.60,67.77,0.00,20.52,0.30
Sephardic_Jews,5.69,0.20,6.19,0.00,26.47,6.09,0.40,0.70,16.18,0.00,38.06,0.00
Spaniards,6.50,0.00,3.00,0.00,53.00,23.00,0.00,0.00,3.60,0.00,10.80,0.10
Spanish,6.21,0.00,5.11,0.00,52.55,22.72,0.20,0.00,4.00,0.00,8.81,0.40
Swedish,7.70,0.60,0.00,0.00,32.90,56.80,0.00,0.00,0.80,0.00,1.20,0.00
Syrians,11.41,0.20,1.50,0.00,11.61,2.70,1.30,2.90,27.93,0.00,38.64,1.80
Turkmens,28.03,6.61,0.00,1.70,4.70,10.31,5.41,0.00,6.81,7.71,28.73,0.00
Turkmen_Iraq,22.27,0.67,1.16,1.07,8.73,5.64,2.04,1.15,16.7,1.85,38.58,0.15
Turkmen_Iran,24.24,7.38,0.60,1.82,4.86,11.74,5.99,0.06,7.48,7.61,28.14,0.08
Turkmen_Uzbekistan,19.54,13.24,0.18,2.04,6.54,12.86,5.08,0.05,6.49,13.96,19.93,0.07
Turk_Ahiska,19.35,0.34,0.42,0.23,7.75,8.24,0.40,0,9.56,0.46,53.16,0.03
Turk_Anatolia,14.62,5.01,0.96,0.61,12.83,10.75,1.35,0.2,10.92,4.87,37.71,0.09
Turk_Northwest,12.88,6.48,1.14,0.79,14.39,14.21,1.13,0.17,9.59,5.55,33.5,0.11
Turk_Southwest,13.7,6.04,1.17,0.56,13.69,12.02,1.33,0.34,10.1,5.8,35.08,0.09
Turk_West_BlackSea,13.21,4.61,0.72,0.81,14.4,12.92,1.24,0.06,10.47,4.49,36.98,0.03
Turk_Central_West,14.48,4.37,0.96,0.53,13.53,10.75,1.35,0.16,11.57,4.52,37.65,0.08
Turk_Central_East,15.68,3.8,0.89,0.55,12.23,9.33,1.45,0.16,11.66,3.91,40.18,0.08
Turk_South,15.42,5.44,1.11,0.51,11.29,10.08,1.6,0.28,11.37,5.1,37.52,0.23
Turk_Central_Black_Sea,14.81,5.86,0.58,0.81,11.54,9.37,1.09,0.12,10.34,5.63,39.78,0.02
Turk_East_Black_Sea,15.19,0.80,0.39,0.13,11.01,5.28,0.30,0,11.25,1.17,54.42,0
Turk_Southeast,18.06,3.07,0.72,0.29,10.83,8.49,2.18,0.88,13.65,3.48,38.12,0.16
Turk_East,18.08,1.73,0.78,0.60,10.65,7.55,1.17,0.08,12.17,1.35,45.75,0.04
Ukranians,0.30,0.80,0.00,0.00,16.30,62.10,0.90,0.00,3.00,0.20,16.40,0.00
Valencia,6.81,0.00,3.00,0.00,55.46,22.22,0.00,0.00,2.40,0.00,9.91,0.20
Yemen_Jews,0.20,0.00,3.10,0.00,4.20,0.00,0.00,4.70,53.85,0.00,33.93,0.00
Yemenese,5.89,0.70,3.30,0.50,3.70,1.10,2.40,9.39,36.56,0.00,27.67,8.79
NorthAlpineBronzeAgeFrench_AITI_120,7.59,0.73,0.40,0.00,39.57,31.32,1.80,0.00,0.00,0.00,17.73,0.86
NorthAlpineBronzeAgeSpanishGalicia_AITI_72,4.56,0.00,0.00,0.00,42.85,31.92,0.69,0.89,2.30,0.31,16.30 ,0.19
NorthAlpineBronzeAgeFrench_AITI_119,9.54,1.40,0.00,0.27,43.57,32.66,0.11,0.14,0.20,0.00,11.08,1.01
NorthAlpineBronzeAgeFrench_AITI_78,10.50,0.54,0.54,0.00,39.10,37.12,0.00,0.35,2.04,0.00,9.53,0.28
NorthAlpineSouthDutch_AITI_50,10.70,0.00,0.00,0.00,35.87,44.30,2.23,0.13,0.00,0.00,4.95,1.82
NorthAlpineSouthDutch_AITI_2,5.63,0.00,0.00,0.00,40.44,41.78,1.83,0.00,1.04,0.00,8.28,0.99
CuevadelaPalomaSpain_I3239,0.00,0.00,2.63,2.34,44.59,28.94,2.32,0.66,0.00,0.00,18.51,0.00
IberianSettlementCataloniaSpain_I3496,5.38,0.21,0.75,0.00,53.63,28.85,1.92,1.72,5.92,0.00,1.63,0.00
CuevadelaPalomaSpain_I3243,8.87,0.00,2.93,4.86,36.62,38.06,0.00,0.00,0.00,0.00,8.67,0.00
ElSotilloBasqueCountry_I1977,2.96,0.00,2.41,0.00,52.45,25.53,0.60,0.00,3.19,0.00,12.86,0.00
IberiaBronzeAge_ATP9,0.89,0.00,1.25,0.00,58.14,21.43,0.49,0.00,4.69,0.00,11.18,1.93
BellBeakerFranceI1388,0.00,0.00,2.30,0.00,59.39,21.76,0.81,0.00,7.46,0.00,8.28,0.00
IlergetesTribeCatalan_I3320,4.64,0.00,4.88,1.09,52.24,25.19,0.00,0.00,3.67,0.00,7.44,0.86
IlercavonesCatalan_I3321,3.80,0.00,4.55,0.00,55.48,25.14,0.00,0.83,2.20,0.32,7.68,0.00
BellBeakerSouthernFrance_I3874,5.77,0.32,0.81,0.47,39.46,40.05,1.07,0.56,0.80,0.00,10.47,0.22
IberianElArgarBronzeAge_I8136,0.00,0.00,4.83,0.00,61.85,21.67,1.21,0.00,3.88,0.00,6.07,0.49
BronzeAgeSpainCogotas_I12208,1.39,0.00,5.31,0.43,54.53,22.97,1.16,0.00,3.96,0.94,8.35,0.95
Bavaria_BB_II5524,2.95,0.00,1.28,1.77,41.61,28.76,0.00,0.00,3.52,0.00,20.12,0.00
BronzeAgeEngland_I2462,8.52,1.12,1.18,0.00,45.45,33.73,0.00,0.00,2.08,0.00,6.90,1.02
BronzeAgeOuterHebrides_I2655,9.88,0.61,0.00,0.39,37.20,45.77,0.76,0.00,0.29,0.00,4.27,0.82
NeolithicScotland_I2634,0.00,0.00,6.63,1.42,60.56,11.65,0.00,0.21,7.56,0.00,11.96,0.00
I2937_Greece_Neolithic_Diros_Alepotrypa_Cave,0,0,2.55,1.31,44.77,0,0,0,12.74,0,36.69,1.95
I0071_Bronze_Age_Minoan_Hagios_Charalambos_Cave_Lasithi_Crete,0.49,0,3.07,0,37.80,0.67,0,0,13.01,0,44.93,0.03
I0070_Bronze_Age_Minoan_Hagios_Charalambos_Cave_Lasithi_Crete,0,0,1.28,0.51,37.14,0,0,0,15.36,0,45.71,0
I0073_Bronze_Age_Minoan_Hagios_Charalambos_Cave_Lasithi_Crete,0,0,3.39,0.38,35.55,0,0,0,13.26,0,47.43,0
I0074_Bronze_Age_Minoan_Hagios_Charalambos_Cave_Lasithi_Crete,0.41,0,4.34,0,39.06,0,0,0,12.70,0,43.49,0
I9005_Bronze_Age_Minoan_Hagios_Charalambos_Cave_Lasithi_Crete,1.52,0,5.68,0,37.33,0,0,0,16.14,0,39.25,0.08
I9006_Bronze_Age_Mycenaean_Agia_Kyriaki_Salamis,4.14,0,1.89,0,36.48,4.77,0,0,8.08,1.19,43.45,0
I9123_Bronze_Age_Armenoi_Crete,6.11,0,2.47,0,40.07,15.84,0,0,9.79,0.87,24.86,0
I9127_Bronze_Age_Minoan_Moni_Odigitria_Heraklion_Crete,0,0,0,0,40.48,0,0,0,4.75,0,54.78,0
I9128_Bronze_Age_Minoan_Moni_Odigitria_Heraklion_Crete,3.72,0.51,3.62,0,53.24,0,0,0,14.12,2.88,21.92,0
I9129_Bronze_Age_Minoan_Moni_Odigitria_Heraklion_Crete,0,0,6.66,0,43.44,0,0,0,11.86,0,37.93,0
I9130_Bronze_Age_Minoan_Moni_Odigitria_Heraklion_Crete,1.10,0,0,0,43.10,0,0,0,17.55,0,38.25,0
I9131_Bronze_Age_Minoan_Moni_Odigitria_Heraklion_Crete,4.59,0,0,0,33.89,0,0,0,19.71,0,41.08,0.73
I9010_Bronze_Age_Mycenaean_Galatas_Apatheia_Peloponnese,0,0,3.52,1.43,38.53,7.73,0,0.65,13.96,0,34.19,0
I9033_Bronze_Age_Mycenaean_Peristeria_Tryfilia_Peloponnese,1.33,1.22,3.40,0,40.19,9.10,0.52,0,7.58,0.48,33.22,2.96
I9041_Bronze_Age_Mycenaean_Galatas_Apatheia_Peloponnese,2.87,0,2.57,0,37.48,8.67,0,0.36,10.29,0,37.52,0.24
I2495_Bronze_Age_Anatolian_Harmanӧren-GӧndürleHӧyük_Isparta,6.79,0,1.92,1.07,27.17,4.07,0,0,14.65,0,42.98,1.35
I2499_Bronze_Age_Anatolian_Harmanӧren-GӧndürleHӧyük_Isparta,9.21,0,0.11,0.47,27.71,4.33,0,0.81,12.84,0,44.53,0
I2683_Bronze_Age_Anatolian_Harmanӧren-GӧndürleHӧyük_Isparta,9.16,0.07,1.74,0.67,24.77,1.32,0,0,14.88,0,45.56,1.81
 
mine
using post #37 data

Distance to:Torziok12b
4.40054542I4331_Balkans_BronzeAge
4.65249395R474_Iron_Age_Civitavecchia
4.86300319R1_Iron_Age_Protovillanovan_Martinsicuro
8.58770051I2165_Balkans_BronzeAge
12.18056238I2520_Balkans_BronzeAge
12.18654996I2176_Balkans_BronzeAge
12.96636032I1113_Malak_Preslavets
13.93040559Bul6_Balkans_BronzeAge
14.00105710R435_Iron_Age_Palestrina_Colombella
14.03935540I9123_Bronze_Age_Armenoi_Crete
14.07171987R473_Iron_Age_Civitavecchia
14.15126496I1979_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
14.20135205R1015_Iron_Age_Veio_Grotta_Gramiccia
14.36145536I2181_Balkans_Chalcolithic_outlier
14.41937585R1021_Iron_Age_Boville_Ernica
14.47601119I2215_Malak_Preslavets
14.47632550R1016_Iron_Age_Castel_di_Decima
15.02331189I2478_Bronze_Age_Beaker_Northern_Italy
15.48482160R851_Iron_Age_Ardea
17.08603816I2175_Balkans_BronzeAge
17.30221951I2111_Trypillia
18.23009051Bul4_Yamnaya_Bulgaria
18.43855743Bul10_Balkans_BronzeAge
18.51940334I3151_Trypillia
19.88195161ANI163_Varna_Outlier


A very clear gap of the top 3 from the others
 
mine

using data from post # 41

Distance to:Torziok12b
7.89459942Bavaria_BB_II5524
8.87062568NorthAlpineBronzeAgeFrench_AITI_120
10.55301379NorthAlpineBronzeAgeSpanishGalicia_AITI_72
13.52289540CuevadelaPalomaSpain_I3239
15.06901457NorthAlpineBronzeAgeFrench_AITI_119
15.97685201NorthAlpineBronzeAgeFrench_AITI_78
17.33912339BellBeakerSouthernFrance_I3874
17.88934599CuevadelaPalomaSpain_I3243
18.57029887BronzeAgeEngland_I2462
19.37494258ElSotilloBasqueCountry_I1977
20.13756440NorthAlpineSouthDutch_AITI_2
22.04581366IlergetesTribeCatalan_I3320
24.12289369NorthAlpineSouthDutch_AITI_50
24.25831198BronzeAgeSpainCogotas_I12208
24.66223834IlercavonesCatalan_I3321
25.34179354BronzeAgeOuterHebrides_I2655
26.10284276IberiaBronzeAge_ATP9
26.46820923IberianSettlementCataloniaSpain_I3496
28.42436631BellBeakerFranceI1388
31.73002994IberianElArgarBronzeAge_I8136
32.26507245NeolithicScotland_I2634
 
My first question would be why you find the analysis provided by the authors unsatisfactory? Certainly made sense to me, especially as their models have the benefit of using populations much more proximate in time and space, and they don't mix modern and ancient samples, which I think is always a bad idea.

OmXLLk4.png


G67I6Me.png


XcttQqn.png

Now, as to how and from where this "additional" ancestry from the Near East got into some members of Latin tribes I think we're going to have to wait and see the make-up of Bronze and Iron Age Southern Italians, and, hopefully, some Greeks from the Classical Era as well. It may well be that this type of ancestry was, as I have maintained for almost seven years now, perhaps already present there even before the time of the Greek colonization of the first millennium BC.

If we want to play around with possibilities, I would think the Sicilian Beaker would be a good place to start, since there's no genetic "Beaker" in them at all, apparently.

I agree, the study's modeling makes more sense. It doesn't make much sense to model it with modern populations, that have no real merit for even being in a viable equation.

Also, the Italian neolithic samples show Eastern influences that were not present in other Neolithic European populations, like LBK. I believe the southern half of the peninsula may have retained, and/or had it re-enforced (Greek colonization). We know now, due to this study that J2, and Iran_Neo was in Italy, even before Steppe-like ancestry, as far back as the Neolithic.

Here is a random Neolithic sample from the study, R8. Already showing close to 30% "Caucasian" in the Neolithic:

y3KZTlk.png


Here's another random sample, R10 showing more of the same.

kAw1iWu.png


All this elusive Levantine, that is popular with Eurogenes-type analysis is not found in the study. Because it is not a viable modeling.

Also, Modern Levant? Come on people, we know how mixed this part of the world is with overlapping populations that are in Europe. The influence of Anatolians since the neolithic, and copper age, the influence of Greeks and Sea peoples. At the very least, use samples roughly from the same era.

Also, modern Iberians are not a good proxy to model Ancient Romans with. During the Iron Age, Iberians were similar to the Basque, and were pulled to their current position due to eastern Mediterranean and North African sources during the Imperial and Medieval era. The Latin samples as we see, are still pretty close to where the modern Italian populations are, North to South.

We assembled genome-wide data from 271 ancient Iberians, of whom 176 are from the largely unsampled period after 2000 BCE, thereby providing a high-resolution time transect of the Iberian Peninsula. We document high genetic substructure between northwestern and southeastern hunter-gatherers before the spread of farming. We reveal sporadic contacts between Iberia and North Africa by ~2500 BCE and, by ~2000 BCE, the replacement of 40% of Iberia’s ancestry and nearly 100% of its Y-chromosomes by people with Steppe ancestry. We show that, in the Iron Age, Steppe ancestry had spread not only into Indo-European–speaking regions but also into non-Indo-European–speaking ones, and we reveal that present-day Basques are best described as a typical Iron Age population without the admixture events that later affected the rest of Iberia. Additionally, we document how, beginning at least in the Roman period, the ancestry of the peninsula was transformed by gene flow from North Africa and the eastern Mediterranean.

https://science.sciencemag.org/content/363/6432/1230
 
Here is a modeling of the Dodecad K12b populations with ADC 1x, with the latest version of all of the samples I've composed. R437 has a strong presence from South to Center. While Northern_Italian have a stronger affinity to R1016. While N_Italian gets a strong affinity with one of the Balkan Bronze Age samples. O_Italian gets a lot of Protovillanovan, and Tuscan, and TSI seem to get the Armenoi_Crete sample; I think Angela is right that this person probably originally came from Italy.

XDuYpzR.png
 
Here is a modeling of the Dodecad K12b populations with ADC 1x, with the latest version of all of the samples I've composed. R437 has a strong presence from South to Center. While Northern_Italian have a stronger affinity to R1016. While N_Italian gets a strong affinity with one of the Balkan Bronze Age samples. O_Italian gets a lot of Protovillanovan, and Tuscan, and TSI seem to get the Armenoi_Crete sample; I think Angela is right that this person probably originally came from Italy.

XDuYpzR.png

Fascinating stuff, Jovialis. Great work. :)

Some things stand out right away: the Tuscans get the worst fit. I don't know why.

I also don't know why they differ that much. TSI is, I think, northwest of Florence, and the sample to which I'm always closest of the Tuscan samples. "Tuscan" must be more "southern", given the percentage of R437. Amazing that there's that much variation in one province.

The Crete Armenoi post Minoan sample is fascinating. She was a definite outlier for Crete, and at the time the paper came out I remember that the speculation was that she was a "foreign" bride. She's not Mycenaean like, however, so, why not Italy? :) That probably explains my almost life long fascination with ancient Crete! I'm joking, of course. Given all the "TSI" like samples popping up all over the Balkans, and in Pannonia as well, she could also have been from those places.

The differences between the two North Italian samples are also very interesting. I went back and checked my runs from Dodecad, and North_Italian is the Bergamo HGDP sample. N_Italian was a small group of non Bergamo Northern Italians. The most vocal members of that group were also Lombards, but from further south than Bergamo. I don't know about the rest. The Bergamo sample is slightly more northwestern than the volunteer sample.

I also think it's interesting that there's so little matching to the 11979 Parma Beaker sample, although I get a decent hit on it. I know that isn't the most steppe admixed one, and I think it may even be the least steppe admixed one. I'd have to check.

Did you include those Northwest Alpine Beaker samples? I wonder how that would change things? If there were indeed two streams into Italy, one more Balkan Bronze Age like, and one more Northern Alpine Bronze Age one, maybe we'd see them show up as well.

I was always in between the TSI or Florentine like Tuscans and the North Italians.
 
Here is a modeling of the Dodecad K12b populations with ADC 1x, with the latest version of all of the samples I've composed. R437 has a strong presence from South to Center. While Northern_Italian have a stronger affinity to R1016. While N_Italian gets a strong affinity with one of the Balkan Bronze Age samples. O_Italian gets a lot of Protovillanovan, and Tuscan, and TSI seem to get the Armenoi_Crete sample; I think Angela is right that this person probably originally came from Italy.

XDuYpzR.png

your conclusion then reads that
North_Italian should represent = NorthWest Italy plus lombardy and
N_Italian should be = NorthEast Italy

for the others.......my guess is
O_Italian = Adriatic Italians, inc modern croatia and coastal slovenian lands

TSI = northern Tuscany .................Florence, Pisa and Lucca areas
Tuscan = southern Tuscany .................sienna area
 
Here is a modeling of the Dodecad K12b populations with ADC 1x, with the latest version of all of the samples I've composed. R437 has a strong presence from South to Center. While Northern_Italian have a stronger affinity to R1016. While N_Italian gets a strong affinity with one of the Balkan Bronze Age samples. O_Italian gets a lot of Protovillanovan, and Tuscan, and TSI seem to get the Armenoi_Crete sample; I think Angela is right that this person probably originally came from Italy.


It can't prove a provenance, it's not based on IBD or ROH segments, it's based on the results on K12b and Crete Armenoi is a low quality sample. At most it suggests a similarity, assuming that K12b is accurate with ancient samples.


We don't even know archaeologically who this woman, labeled as Crete Armenoi, was.




Some things stand out right away: the Tuscans get the worst fit. I don't know why.


I also don't know why they differ that much. TSI is, I think, northwest of Florence, and the sample to which I'm always closest of the Tuscan samples. "Tuscan" must be more "southern", given the percentage of R437. Amazing that there's that much variation in one province.


The Crete Armenoi post Minoan sample is fascinating. She was a definite outlier for Crete, and at the time the paper came out I remember that the speculation was that she was a "foreign" bride. She's not Mycenaean like, however, so, why not Italy? :) That probably explains my almost life long fascination with ancient Crete! I'm joking, of course. Given all the "TSI" like samples popping up all over the Balkans, and in Pannonia as well, she could also have been from those places.



It is not known where TSI comes from precisely (some Italian users think it comes from Sesto Fiorentino, in Italian newspapers when TSI was collected there was talk of genetic analysis in Antella and other places around Bagno a Ripoli, then southeast of Florence), and the average in K12b is called TSI30 and is based on 21 individuals.




The differences between the two North Italian samples are also very interesting. I went back and checked my runs from Dodecad, and North_Italian is the Bergamo HGDP sample. N_Italian was a small group of non Bergamo Northern Italians. The most vocal members of that group were also Lombards, but from further south than Bergamo. I don't know about the rest. The Bergamo sample is slightly more northwestern than the volunteer sample..




In N_Italian_D there are very likely also northern eastern Italians.

 
your conclusion then reads that
North_Italian should represent = NorthWest Italy plus lombardy and
N_Italian should be = NorthEast Italy

for the others.......my guess is
O_Italian = Adriatic Italians, inc modern croatia and coastal slovenian lands

TSI = northern Tuscany .................Florence, Pisa and Lucca areas
Tuscan = southern Tuscany .................sienna area

I guess you didn't see my post. How could N_Italian be North East Italy when I just related that two of the five members of that group were Lombards? If the other three were from Northeast Italy, I don't know, but probably at least one was from Friuli-A. Squecco. Perhaps you're another one if you volunteered your data to Dienekes. I don't know about the 5th one.

So, all we could say is mixed North Italian.
 
As for Crete Armenoi, as I mentioned upthread we indeed don't know her provenance. To repeat, given how many "TSI like" samples pop up all over, she could have been from Italy, the Balkans etc.
Then there's the fact that it's a low quality sample to consider.

I think that to get a clearer picture of affinities, both the Northern Alpine, German Bavarian samples and the Balkan samples should be included in analyses. To use just one or the other may skew the analysis.
 
I guess you didn't see my post. How could N_Italian be North East Italy when I just related that two of the five members of that group were Lombards. If the other three were from Northeast Italy, I don't know, but probably at least one was from Friuli-A. Squecco. Perhaps you're another one if you volunteered your data to Dienekes. I don't know about the 5th one.

I will speak with Adriano as I have known him for many years ...............he is related via my wife's line somewhere and we are still looking, maybe from Villach southern Austria near italy............last chat December 2019

As for lombards ...........are they all Bergamo based ...........my guess would be Brescia or Cremona ones are different

I tried many years ago ( 6) with Dienekes ...........he was more or appeared to be more interested in O_Italians that came via Vienna lands and beyond
 
I will speak with Adriano as I have known him for many years ...............he is related via my wife's line somewhere and we are still looking, maybe from Villach southern Austria near italy............last chat December 2019

As for lombards ...........are they all Bergamo based ...........my guess would be Brescia or Cremona ones are different

I tried many years ago ( 6) with Dienekes ...........he was more or appeared to be more interested in O_Italians that came via Vienna lands and beyond

I only remember one of the surnames. It appears to be from just northwest of Milano.
http://www.gens.info/italia/it/turi...cognomi&cognome=Bolgeri&x=9&y=11#.XjMI-WhKhPY
 
Recently I discovered that one of my great-great-grandparents has this last name apparently of North-Italia:
http://www.gens.info/italia/it/turi...t=cognomi&cognome=salina&x=0&y=0#.XjMWf2hKjIU

Do you know of any website where you could find information?

Cognomix sometimes has information. In this case, Salina does appear. It's sort of a mixed bag, however. There are Lombard, Campanian, Sicilian branches etc. I don't know if all the Lombard Salina's actually have all their ancestry from Lombardia or some are of Southern Italian ancestry who moved north in the great migration which began in the 1950s.

At any rate there's a branch in Messina, one in Campania which might be traced to the Gens Sallia, as are the ones in Lombardia, and which can be found in Varese, Pavia, and Milano.

https://www.cognomix.it/origine-cognome/salina.php
 
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Here is a modeling of the Dodecad K12b populations with ADC 1x, with the latest version of all of the samples I've composed. R437 has a strong presence from South to Center. While Northern_Italian have a stronger affinity to R1016. While N_Italian gets a strong affinity with one of the Balkan Bronze Age samples. O_Italian gets a lot of Protovillanovan, and Tuscan, and TSI seem to get the Armenoi_Crete sample; I think Angela is right that this person probably originally came from Italy.

XDuYpzR.png

I have found the results of genetic ancestry models in Vahaduo far less reliable and plausible than using nMonte.R software directly. I'd recommend a bit of caution using it. Maybe that's because unlike nMonte2 it doesn't show a restricted mode in which it'd try to achieve only the best fit at the same as using a more moderate number of reference populations instead of using all possible reference samples to have the best fit possible.
 
I have found the results of genetic ancestry models in Vahaduo far less reliable and plausible than using nMonte.R software directly. I'd recommend a bit of caution using it. Maybe that's because unlike nMonte2 it doesn't show a restricted mode in which it'd try to achieve only the best fit at the same as using a more moderate number of reference populations instead of using all possible reference samples to have the best fit possible.

I'll let Jovialis speak for himself if he chooses and when he has time, but could you be a bit more specific? In particular, how do you know it's more reliable? What's the objective standard as to whether a certain result is "better" than others?

I'm not trying to be provocative at all. I think we need objective criteria. Present company excepted, of course, it has too often seemed to me that the "modeling" has tended to support the creator's "intuition" or "hypothesis" if "bias" is too negatively loaded a word. It may all even be unconscious.

As to "best fits", I often think that in trying to get really low fits, people throw anything into the hopper, which may not only result in "over-fits", but in historically implausible scenarios.

In terms of using more "moderate" numbers of reference populations, I'm not sure that's such a good idea. Whenever someone is choosing the samples some bias can creep in, or it may just be a case that they don't know of, or have thought of other possibly good sources. If we are interested in exploring the source of the steppe admixture in Italy, and we use only South German steppe admixed samples, and not Balkan steppe admixed samples as well, some important clues might be missed.

Or, take the case of the Parma Beaker samples. If the analysis only used the most steppe admixed sample it might skew the analysis one way; if the one with very little steppe is used it skews it another. Instead, it might be the third which is the better fit. Now, when the samples from a certain site are very homogeneous it wouldn't matter, but in some cases that isn't the situation.

This is why, imo, so much of the modeling has been really wrong, mostly, it's true, when using modern samples, but also even when using ancient samples.

My instinct has always been that the more samples (within reason) the better, and the less human "interference" the better.
 

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